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Liquid Cooled X1900 XTX Card Reviewed

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 8 years ago | from the big-barrel-of-oil-so-much-more-fun dept.

126

An anonymous reader writes "TrustedReview's Andrew Miller has posted a review of the new liquid cooled Radeon X1900 XTX card. There have been a few reviews floating around based on engineering samples of this product, but it sounds like the actual card turned out to be quite a sight to behold." From the review: "If you are seriously considering buying an X1900 XTX, then it is well worth paying the extra money for this card as the noise reduction is dramatic. The extra performance is just an added bonus. However, the 7950 GX2 is simultaneously faster and quieter for the same money. The X1900 XTX on the other hand has the option of HDR and FSAA as well as the possibility of running in Crossfire (assuming you can get hold of a similarly cooled master card).

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FIRST POST! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654395)

SEXUAL, BABY !! :D

But. . . (2, Insightful)

kimvette (919543) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654396)

Is there a usable Linux driver to accompany that card when it's released? Yeah I know I know, the core gaming market is Windows, but some Linux users DO want fast video cards.

Re:But. . . (1)

thegamerformelyknown (868463) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654427)

One wonders what FPS this card in Crossfire, overclocked, would get in glxgears ;)

Re:But. . . (1)

baldass_newbie (136609) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654443)

Sadly, the world may never know.
Besides, I don't know any self-respecting Linux geek who has ATI on the short list for their next card.

Unless they like playing Armagetron Advanced in flatland.

Re:But. . . (1)

angelwalkwithme (984267) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655526)

In Ubuntu 6.06, the tortured process to install fglrx drivers for my ATI Radeon X200M

Step 1: Go to synaptic and select the drivers

That's it!

Re:But. . . (1)

baldass_newbie (136609) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656062)

My story [ubuntuforums.org] with Ubuntu 6.06 and an ATI Radeon 9200.
I could care less if later ATI cards work better. In fact, I'm typing this on a VAIO I just converted for a friend and the mobility Radeon 9700 is freaking sweet.
However, if a company fails to support their product adequately, it makes me very wary in the future. "Some of the time" don't cut it.
Glad it works for you.

Re:But. . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15656557)

I could care less if later ATI cards work better.

So, why don't you?

Re:But. . . (3, Insightful)

mattmacf (901678) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654440)

I don't mean to sound trollish (ok, maybe just a bit), but given ATI's track record, I doubt there's a reliable Windows driver for this card. And in all seriousness, what would you need to run in Linux that requires such a high end video card. Personally, I think it's just a bit overkill for Tux Racer.

Re:But. . . (1)

SaDan (81097) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654446)

One word:

BZFlag!

---

http://www.burningserver.com/ [burningserver.com] , for all your blank web page needs!

Re:But. . . (1)

kevlarman (983297) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654488)

doom 3 perhaps?

Re:But. . . (3, Informative)

Mike Savior (802573) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654504)

Doom 3, Unreal Tournament, CS (via wine), games that run in cedega.. there might not be a slew of games for Linux and I know I'm missing some, but there are great ports out there that the troll community just likes to ignore for their own sake.

Re:But. . . (1)

pdbaby (609052) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655205)

My 7800gt can play doom3 at very high settings at a very high framerate - there's nothing out for linux that should need this card to perform well!

Re:But. . . (1)

instanto (513362) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655245)

"Great Ports".
You named 2 linux versions and 1 emulated one...
(Oh Yea, Americas Army also has a Linux version)

Sure, Linux is great and all that, but dont try to advertise it as a gaming OS, since it is not, and usually requires a bunch of extra modules and trying to find a driver that works, as well as getting it to work in X11 and whatnot.

Re:But. . . (1)

Mike Savior (802573) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655874)

I don't use my distro to play games. I looked into it, but I don't play games. How would I know what else is out there? That and the commercial games come with everything they need packaged in, I think.

Re:But. . . (0, Flamebait)

July 21, 2006 (968634) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656184)

"I don't use my distro to play games. I looked into it, but I don't play games. How would I know what else is out there? That and the commercial games come with everything they need packaged in, I think."
Here's a thought - if you don't know what the fuck you're talking about and the only information you have is from second-hand sources, don't reply. Choose not to pipe in with your comment.

Universities (2, Interesting)

sowth (748135) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654599)

I imaging plenty of universities use 3D acceleration in Linux for their work, among other places. Then again, they probably use one of the BSDs or Unix...

Re:But. . . (1)

postmortem (906676) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654642)

And you want to shell out $400+ for 2D card?

Re:But. . . (2, Insightful)

SlashdotOgre (739181) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654467)

I'd be happy if ATI released an Xorg 7.1 compatible driver; I've had to mask Xorg 7.1 in Gentoo since I run Xgl and need the proprietary driver. To be fair, ATI tends to be relatively quick in supporting their latest cards with their Linux drivers. For example when I got my Dell D610 with the mobile X300 in Feb. 2005 (the D610 was one of the first machines with the new PCIe vid cards on a laptop), there was a compatible binary driver within a month. Unfortunately, the driver had a bug and hung on systems with >732MB of RAM, and this bug took 3 months to be fixed -- but initial support was quite fast for the card. I hope with the increase in popularity of Xgl, and with Xorg breaking the ABI for both nVidia & ATI's proprietary drivers, we may see more of an effort fo Linux support by the vid card makers.

Re:But. . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654503)

Why, so you can check your mail and run a terminal at 300fps?

Re:But. . . (1)

kikibun (965761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655945)

Maybe in the future gaming companies will release games for linux along with windows/mac. If they can make a game that runs under mac and windows (two completely different architecures) then they can definely make that game for linux; all that is needed is good drivers for linux. Then the gaming companies can use the video card's chip for rendering and what ever else they may need it for. Anayway, all I am saying is that once the drivers are out for fancy cards, it will make supporting linux in a game a more considerable option. Cheers,

Just ignore ATI (4, Interesting)

idonthack (883680) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654605)

Any time I look at buying a card, ATI gets completely ignored because Nvidia's Linux support is so much better.

Re:Just ignore ATI (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654690)

Just in case any ATI employees are reading, "me too."

(you probably lose $500/yr from me alone)

And even if you're not a Linux guy (-1)

Inoshiro (71693) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654787)

The ATI driver support isn't much rosier on Windows. ATI cards need a hotfix to get Oblivion working!

(Disclaimer: I'm a Linux guy; I bought a GeForce 6800 based entirely on nVidia's Linux support -- the fact that it runs WoW @ 1600x900 4xFSAA and other settings maxed at an average of 50fps is a nice bonus!)

Re:And even if you're not a Linux guy (1)

Kagura (843695) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654820)

What are you talking about? Maybe it's a but harsh to mod the parent uninformative, but he's certainly misinformed. There is no hotfix required on "ATI cards" to get Oblivion working. It works out of the box just fine on seemingly every card. I even googled to double-check.

Perhaps you were referring to the "Chuck hotfix patch", which adds the ability to do AA and HDR simultaneous. It's currently hardware-incapable for nVidia to do both at the same time. In any case, it's hardly a required hotfix, and the parent is just plain wrong on this one.

Re:And even if you're not a Linux guy (1)

Macthorpe (960048) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655517)

How wrong can you be?

I just finished Oblivion and guess what? ATI Radeon 9800XT.

But then again, since when did anyone commenting on /. actually do any research at all...

Re:Just ignore ATI (1)

Troglodyt (898143) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655278)

Neither Nvidia nor ATI have drivers for ppclinux.
Nvidia does not have good Linux support.

Re:But. . . (4, Interesting)

mcpkaaos (449561) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654633)

Is there a usable Linux driver

As long as you plan on staying with Xorg 6.8.x, you should be fine. Anything greater and you might be one of the many, many people (myself included) who suffer hard lock-ups when X shuts down or you switch VTs while X is running. I have tried many combinations of kernels and versions of fglrx against a couple versions of Xorg (6.8.2 and modular), and only 6.8.2 was stable. YMMV, but this has been a fairly common issue for a number of folks. Although this makes it sound like Xorg is the problem, I don't believe it is. IIRC, someone over at the Gentoo forums traced it to a call made within the driver.

I've since given up on running modular X with my ATI card and chose to mask it until my next upgrade (which will be NVidia, no doubt). It's been a month or two, so this may have been fixed (though I doubt it). If anyone has an update on that, please do tell.

Good luck. :)

Re:But. . . (1)

Short Circuit (52384) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654838)

I wondered what was causing that. I get that on my desktop system.

Xorg 7.0.22, kernel 2.6.16.20, on Debian etch. But that machine uses integrated Intel video, not a Radeon system. Sounds like an Xorg problem, to me. I wonder if I can downgrade Xorg.

OTOH, my laptop has the same Xorg, kernel and Debian dist, but uses the open source Radeon driver with no problems.

Re:But. . . (1)

ardin,mcallister (924615) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655316)

Are you sure its an intel graphics chip? I've seen alot of integrated video that uses ATI drivers...

A short-lived driver perhaps (1)

vandan (151516) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655163)

There may very well be, however it won't last long.
ATI have a new policy of pulling support for their products even while they're still selling new in the stores. They recently dropped support of the R200 ( see http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33856 854 [rage3d.com] ).

This may be marked as a troll, and maybe this wouldn't be out of line, but I still warn you:

Do not buy ATI products if you use or intend to use Linux . Otherwise you will be sorry.

Yes but (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654398)

does it run on linux? how well?

But... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654416)

Does it run Linux?

That's great ATI, but... (1)

SaDan (81097) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654435)

...how are the latest Linux drivers coming along?

Oh, well. Looks like a neat card, too bad it's still slower than the top of the line nVidia board. Expensive as all hell too!

Maybe once they get the liquid cooling thing down we'll see a good bump in clock speed.

---

http://www.burningserver.com/ [burningserver.com] , for all your blank web page needs!

Re:That's great ATI, but... (1)

Korin43 (881732) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654589)

Which game exactly do you need this for in Linux? Frozen Bubble doesn't exactly need a powerhouse graphics card..

Re:That's great ATI, but... (1)

SaDan (81097) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654807)

Anything that runs in OpenGL comes to mind.

Besides games, think of all the killer screen savers!

Re:That's great ATI, but... (1)

rxrx (968596) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654592)

I'll stick with my en7900gt until the price comes down. Never buy the latest unless you enjoy getting raped.

No HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 - crap! (1)

pookemon (909195) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654436)

The X1900 XTX on the other hand has the option of HDR and FSAA as well as the possibility of running in Crossfire (assuming you can get hold of a similarly cooled master card)

What a completely pointless statement. Not only does the GX2 have HDR and FSAA (as have all cards since the 7xxx and Xxx series - perhaps even the 6xxx series) but you can (probably) run a GX2 in SLI mode. Recently a friend was upgrading and we looked into Crossfire. The motherboards are hard to get (here in Oz), and they're expensive (~$290 for a crossfire versus ~$160 for SLI). But at least ATI have moved away from the "Master" and "Slave" cards...

Re:No HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 - crap! (4, Informative)

imboboage0 (876812) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654516)

I believe it was in reference to running both HDR and AA at the same time. I don't know if this has been resolved since last I checked, but that was the advantage to having ATI as far as I could tell.

That's correct (1)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655127)

nVidia implemented their pipline in such a way that one part does both, or maybe only one of them can be on at the same time, so they are mutually exclusive. Arguable how much difference it makes since, in general, HDR uses power to the point you've not got enough left over for AA without too much framerate loss. However, in an SLI configuration you do, and that might be one of the only reasons to spend such an amazing amount of money.

Re:No HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 - crap! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15656537)

Incorrect. See nVidia's tech demo "Geoforms" for simultaneous HDR and FSAA (I can't remember if it's Geforce7 exclusive or if it works on Geforce6's as well)

No *simultaneous* HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654532)

It's not a pointless statement. AFAIK, no current Nvidia card is capable of doing "true" (floating-point) HDR and FSAA simultaneously. Say what you want about ATI - their latest-gen cards have at least that single advantage over Nvidia's current offerings.

Re:No *simultaneous* HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 (1)

WilyCoder (736280) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654582)

It is literally a hardware limitation that both HDR and FSAA cannot be run simultaneously on nVidia 7xxx class hardware.

Re:No HDR/FSAA on 7950 GX2 - crap! (1)

spyrochaete (707033) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655826)

NVidia is not "officially" supporting SLI for the 7950. This card has 2 GPUs so it is effectively an SLI card on one board. This has huge advantages over traditional SLI since it requires less power and cooling and affords greater speed due to the shortened data paths. Also, of course, it's far less expensive than a pair of 7900GTXes.

"Officially" being the operative word, NVidia is working with some high profile builders (i.e. Alienware) for dual and quad SLI solutions with the 7950. NVidia has stated that they will not provide drivers or support for enthusiasts, but we can be sure at least one party will homebrew something up.

Shocking metal nips. (3, Funny)

LordOfTheNoobs (949080) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654439)

As you can see, he was truly shocked [trustedreviews.com] .

/ probably at his sweet new ability to render metal nips [trustedreviews.com]
// i believe these figures from the article specify metal nipple rendering in the tera-nip range. [trustedreviews.com]
///totally sweet

Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

bunbuntheminilop (935594) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654442)

"If you are seriously considering buying an X1900 XTX, then it is well worth paying the extra money for this card as the noise reduction is dramatic. The extra performance is just an added bonus."

Noise is more important than better graphics. Can someone tell me WTF is going on?

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

iced_773 (857608) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654470)


I think it's for the rich nine-year-old geek who doesn't want his parents to know he's up at 3 AM playing games. He also probably has headphones for these early-morning fragfests.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654487)

Agreed. And there are plenty of people who'd prefer silence of performance (ie, many people who dont video game 24/7)

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

zenryou (986697) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654514)

I always wear circumaural headphones(I think mine are audiotechnica ath a900 or some crap like that), when I turn my comp off it sounds like a jet turning its engines off but when I'm wearing these headphones I can't hear jack crap unless I feel like taking my headphones off. Which is good, because I don't like listening to people/noise/etc anyway.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

Achromatic1978 (916097) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654669)

because I don't like listening to people/noise/etc anyway

And people wonder where the stereotype of antisocial, bedroom closeted geeks comes from ...

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

LordOfTheNoobs (949080) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654485)

I'm sorry, I really apologize but I Didn't Catch That Last Thing You Said Over The Sound Of The FUCKING JATOS [airshowjournal.com] Your're Using To Vent Your Box.

There are many people that often like to both see and hear their games. Wierd, I know.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

the_macman (874383) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654521)

Right, because the fan on my GPU inside my computer under my desk is as loud as a JATO and prevents me from hearing the 55 watt satelite speakers on either side of my monitor. I thinks it's safe to assume that anyone who puts forth the money for a top of the line GPU probably already has a decent sound system.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654538)

Yeah, that's a solution. If something's loud, make something else louder to drown it out. And go deaf in a few years.
  Why shouldn't someone take a 5 fps drop to make their machine nice and quiet? Especially if you use your pc for anything other than all gaming all the time.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654647)

My current situation right now. I am reading /., my computer is on and running as is my Linux server about 20 ft away in the same room. I also have a dehudifier in the hall way running and a room fan blowing around me to keep me cool. Although not currently on, my home AC has been cycling on and off as needed. My daughter is in her bedroom and I can hear a constant thumping from her speakers, my son is in the family playing SOCOM2 on the PS2 and he has the optical audio out and RGB cable running through our home receiver so that can be heard as well. In a few minutes, I will be firing up BF2 for some fragging and I can assure you I will not hear any of that background noise. I'm sure the environmental noise you deal with on a daily basis in your house/dorm/basement is very small compared to a single video card. Yes, every bit counts and baseline noise is relative but I can achieve the same overall reduction in background noise by telling the kids to turn thier crap down or move my PC 2-3 feet over next to my desk instead of on top and that does not cost a dime! Of course, you can't see that pretty video card if the PC is next to the desk. Water cooling is "cool" for bragging rights and a conversation starter among your inner circle of geek friends but I feel that factor way far exceeds the real need. Ego plays a much bigger role in the decision to buy something like this then real need, people do not readily admit they bought something for ego so the reason will be defended with other factors like "must have quite PC" in an attempt to justify. Would that same person go out of thier way to pay $100 more for a quiter dishwasher or bathroom exhaust fan if all others things were equal? Who knows.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654541)

Graphics performance applies when you play video games, but fan noise starts when you power on.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

deficite (977718) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654610)

Jesus christ, it's like none of you have heard of fan throttling before.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

ZachPruckowski (918562) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654583)

Both ATI and Nvidia are going to be making DX10 cards this fall. New games that will truly require a next-gen card are coming out before the holiday season. Vista is coming out sometime in 2007. All the performance from here on out is going to be geared to DX10, so it isn't worth it working on pumping up the power on DX9 cards. Obviously, DX9 users will see advancements with DX10 cards, but the point is sort of that games in two years won't run on DX9 cards, so releasing stronger DX9 cards now is silly.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

shird (566377) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654588)

They are suggesting buying this card over an equivalently powered, but air-cooled, card. Thus, even if the performance were the same, you should get this - but the performance is actually better, (because it can be clocked higher due to the cooling) so thats the added bonus.

That said, Id personally take a hit to performance for a passively cooled card any day.

I'd never upgrade if I could. (1, Flamebait)

r00t (33219) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654636)

I have an excellent graphics card called the ATI Rage 128. I run at 1600x1024, 24bit color, which means no 3D at all.

It doesn't heat the room. It has no moving parts. (neither does the heat sink on my CPU -- damn hard drive moves though, until I replace it with solid state)

I'm completely happy with my video card. I will remain happy... until a Linux desktop requires a god-damn 3D accelerator just to display a few dozen xterm windows and a dozen Firefox windows. There is absolutely no reason I should ever need 3D acceleration. I'll only consider it because various bastards have started abusing 3D pipelines for plain old 2D compositing. I'm told that this is because wankers need see-through windows...? Any non-opaque window is a serious bug that detracts from usability, so WTF is going on?

Re:I'd never upgrade if I could. (2, Funny)

mcpkaaos (449561) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654654)

How long did it take you to be okay with overlapping windows? Sorry to bring up a sore subject.

years (1)

r00t (33219) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656593)

Prior to the mid-1990s, I just used the Linux
text console. 80x25 was OK for browsing the web
with lynx.

And yes, there were porno videos. There is a
great one out there called dirty.vt (google
will find it) that plays well at 9600 baud in an
80x24 xterm. On a Linux box with a 100 HZ clock,
the following code does a decent job of playing
it at the right speed:

#include <unistd.h>
#include <stdio.h>
#include <stdlib.h>
#include <string.h>

int main(int argc, char *argv[]){
  int buf;
  while(read(STDIN_FILENO, &buf, 1)){  /* read 1 byte from fd 0 */
    write(STDOUT_FILENO, &buf, 1);
    usleep(0);
  }
  return 0;
}

Re:I'd never upgrade if I could. (1)

jaysones (138378) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655087)

Surely you know that people use these for video games. Right?

Re:I'd never upgrade if I could. (1)

r00t (33219) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656555)

I've heard that people use these for video games. A game console would be more appropriate, or you could actually go outside to play with other humans, but OK... whatever.

What gets to me is that all the new OS software (Vista, MacOX X, X.org) is designed to run 2D stuff through the 3D pipeline. I don't want a space heater in my computer. My video card is perfectly fine for 2D. Apparently the 3D cards are not! Recent gamer cards have supposedly done such a bad job with 2D that it is actually faster to run 2D operations through the 3D pipeline. Then there are the bad jokes like see-through windows, which we all get stuck with because somebody thought it was l33t.

It's going to suck when I need a 3D card (hot, noisy, unreliable) with non-free drivers just to run my normal 2D destop apps. My three main apps: firefox, xterm, gnome-taskbar. Sometimes I run xcalc or gimp.

Re:I'd never upgrade if I could. (1)

Kjella (173770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655294)

Hey I have a similar card - on my Linux machine, think it's a nVidia something 64MB. It runs without the nvidia kernel driver too, simply because I never bothered to install it. That's great, if that's all you need. I got a feeling that every time there's a new hardware article someone have to put it down. It's like an article about sewing machines, and a comment that says "What's wrong with needle and thread?" or an article about the latest cool car and say "What's wrong with an old Ford? Gets me from A to B too." Now I might make due with those, but I don't have a problem with other people wanting something else.

Some of us actually want to have a good graphics card for games, or a 3GHz dual processor, or a terabyte of disk space for... nevermind. Now on Linux you might say it's a chicken and egg thing since many of the games I want don't run there either - but you got to start somewhere. Linux (and OS X, and Vista) hasn't started to use 3D acceleration because "wankers need see-through windows", but because damn many have the capability anyway. Maybe it's just for flash, maybe someone can find something useful about it, doesn't matter. The question is rather "Why should I not let my $200 graphics card work on creating silly compositing effects the 90% of the time I'm not using its real capabilities?"

Re:I'd never upgrade if I could. (1)

r00t (33219) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656505)

There is a certain unfairness here. Gamers are dragging business-like users into buying hardware that is more expensive, more failure-prone because of the heat and moving parts, power wasting, and noisy. The high-end performance of a few years back could be had today without any moving parts. Moving parts fail, take more energy to run, and make noise.

Even if you do have the fancy card, it will run cooler (and thus last longer and save energy) if you avoid making it render silly compositing effects all the time.

I suggest getting a game console if you wish to play games.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

wordsofwisedumb (957054) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654744)

Noise is more important than better graphics. Can someone tell me WTF is going on?

The reviewer is blind.

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (1)

houghi (78078) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654790)

I sleep in the same room as my PC stands, so noise is a very important factor. I don't like to turn my PC off and as I only HAVE one room where I can place the PC. I can't place the PC in another room as that one is too moist.

(And no, I don't live with anybody else. My studio is just two rooms. Bathroom and living/sleep/kooking area.)

Re:Extra performace not important anymore... (2, Informative)

Shook18 (878947) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654794)

http://www.silentpcreview.com/ [silentpcreview.com] A few thousand people there seem to think noise is more important than performance.

Assuming... (5, Funny)

knifeyspooney (623953) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654502)

assuming you can get hold of a similarly cooled master card

Indeed, my MasterCard will need some cooling off time after I purchase one of these babies.

Mainstream liquid cooling. (5, Insightful)

A Nun Must Cow Herd (963630) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654515)

I'd rather see such cooling techniques used to make silent mid-range cards with good performance, rather than having it only available with hideously expensive high end cards.

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (1)

CrazyJim1 (809850) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654584)

You know, there is a market that Dell hasn't got yet, and its the gaming market. If you could make a cheap system that runs a mid range card, you could make a mint. Dell is selling their gaming rigs for $2000, and you can feasably make one for 400-500$ just using pricewatch.

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (1)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654640)

The main problem is dell or anybody can't fool "the gamers". We know that 2k rig can be put together with 4 hundies so we went ahead and do it. For the average consumer, a 2k "gaming rig" sound like something they don't need and to gamers, it's a rip-off.

Alienware I believe tried to fill the gap with fancy machines but in the end, I'd trust me coolermaster case more than that big alien-head case that can't lie down on its side.

Not liquid cooling, but... (4, Informative)

Rob Simpson (533360) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654659)

Well, there are a bunch of low to mid-range cards from ASUS and Gigabyte which use big heatsinks and heatpipes for passive cooling, the fastest of which (that I am aware of, anyway) is the Asus EN7800GT Top Silent [pcstats.com] . Unlike the water-cooled card, these are actually silent, instead of just having a much quieter fan, though I suppose most people will be happy as long as their card doesn't sound like a jet engine.


Here are links to the company websites, look for "Silent-Pipe" or "Silent" in the name...
http://www.giga-byte.com/Products/VGA/Products_Lis t.aspx?VenderType=ATi&BUSType=PCI-E&BUSSpeed=16 [giga-byte.com]
http://www.giga-byte.com/Products/VGA/Products_Lis t.aspx?VenderType=NVIDIA&BUSType=PCI-E&BUSSpeed=16 [giga-byte.com]
http://usa.asus.com/products2.aspx?l1=2&l2=8 [asus.com]
http://usa.asus.com/products2.aspx?l1=2&l2=6 [asus.com]

Re:Not liquid cooling, but... (1)

Michael Woodhams (112247) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654704)

I was going to say that.

One good place to look for people's experiences with these cards is the Silent PC Review GPU forum [silentpcreview.com] .

Re:Not liquid cooling, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654710)

Just beware...I bought a gigabyte card (x850 iirc) with a big, passive heatsink, and a heatpipe to another big passive heatsink on the back side. It did fine on the desktop, but once I got into a game, it froze quite handily. I ended up having to get a 3rd (4th if you consider the psu) case fan to keep air moving past the card.... I'm not saying that all passively cooled video cards will have this problem, but big heatsink != no worries.

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (2, Informative)

Briareos (21163) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654902)

I'd rather see such cooling techniques used to make silent mid-range cards with good performance

There you go... [thermaltake.com]

It's not as if fitting a cooler to a graphics card were hard or anything.

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (1)

A Nun Must Cow Herd (963630) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655357)

That looks promising. However it's not as good as a card that comes with a nice quiet cooling solution because:

1) you're effectively paying for two coolers (the stock one and the Thermaltake)
2) a good number of people who want a quiet graphics card would still be hesitant to pull bits off of theirs (even if it's easy for someone who knows what they are doing).
3) if the card dies you have the hassle of reinstalling the stock cooler before returning it.

The ASUS EN7800GT [pcstats.com] card mentioned by Rob above is just the sort of thing I was thinking of - good performance and absolutely silent. I just wish it was available in my country! :)

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (2, Insightful)

Aceticon (140883) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655074)

From a mainstream point of view it would be even beter if there were some standardized cooling solutions for the whole PC (thus CPU, GFX and possibly HDs and power source) - maybe with things like standard CPU cooling blocks that can actually be mounted the same way as CPU fans, graphics cards with pre-assembled watercooling blocks (not a whole watercooling solution), water cooled power sources, pre-assembled tubing connections with leak-proof connectors at their endings, etc ...

As it is at the moment, each manufacturer has their own solutions, each with different sized (and hard to find) tubing; parts compatibility consists of forcing the tubing to fit into oversized connectors or looking up in specialized stores for upsizing/downsizing connectors; fiting a cooling block to a CPU mount or a graphics card usually requires (partial) disassembling of the mountings/existing-cooling on motherboard/graphics card; tubing just comes as one long tube that you have to cut into pieces and (sometimes forcibly) fit into the connectors (hardly foolproof); it's hard to find discrete components outside specialized stores (although full solutions are not that hard to find); fail-prone components such as pumps are usually buil-in on some part or other of the solution and often cannot easilly be replaced without getting a whole new assembly.

Having installed watercooling on my PC some years ago and gone through the paces of extending it to cover the GFX, extending the length of the connections to the dissipation block (by eventually finding a tubbing size which could be forced to fit) and replacing the pump with an external pump, i came to the conclusion that watercooling is still far from mainstream.
(on the upside, if i ever get a real aquarius i now know all about which pumps are best)

get ready... (1)

YesIAmAScript (886271) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656591)

For mainstream water cooling.

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/295 [hardwaresecrets.com]

All this fish tubing crap is amateur hour. Switching to nitrile or metal hoses makes the system a lot more palatable and reliable.

I expect this Intel solution will be rolled out with Woodcrest. I can't see another way they're going to get two dual-core chips into any regular case and have it quiet. Apple will probably insist on a system like this for their towers anyway, because its quiet.

Re:Mainstream liquid cooling. (1)

mkw87 (860289) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656579)

Why waste money cooling a mid range card with liquid when air is just fine [newegg.com]

DX9 is sooo passe, DX10 is where it's at man! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15654550)



If you can not wait for DX10, get a DX9. If you are going to throw away money, give it to me. If you are going to get drunk, go ahead and screw the ugly fat chick instead of yourself. If you are going to waste your time reading this topic, at least don't read this.

Pathetic. (2, Interesting)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654565)

Went and looked at the OC results and well, it's like nil. Why bother with watercooling when you can't squeeze more clocks out of it. I believe the vid fan isn't the noisest part in the box?

Re:Pathetic. (1)

r00t (33219) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654663)

Moving parts in my computer:

1. hard drive platters
2. hard drive heads
3. keys on keyboard
4. mouse
5. speaker cones, as desired
6. DVD

That's it. Not even the power switch moves, as it is a capacitative switch that just senses the presence of my finger.

I intend to fix the hard drive problem. At least I got rid of the ball bearings with the last upgrade. I think I can cram all my stuff onto a 20 GB solid state device. That will run cooler, and the failures will be sector-by-sector instead of everything at once.

Why do you put up with so much noise? Long-term exposure is harmful to you. It damages hearing and increases your stress level.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654681)

I totally understand the peacefulness of a quiet computer :) But most of the time my winamp is on and I don't notice the fans anyway. When I need to turn up the fans, I usually have my headphones on for games and if I do 4.1 for games, they're up high :).

It moggles my bind to imagine someone buying that card within the same generation just for the noise it reduced versus framerate gains that's all.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

Michael Woodhams (112247) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654723)

Well done. I'm lamenting the fact that, due to a desire to play Oblivion, I now have two fans in my system instead of one. (The system fan is undervolted Nexus 120 mm - very quite. I've replaced the heatsink on my 6600GT GPU with a Zalman VF700 and undervolted the fan, but its still the loudest thing in my system. Previous GPU used a passive Zalman heatsink.)

It is good to have people like you around - it makes me feel that I'm not obsessive. :-)

Re:Pathetic. (1)

hippo (107522) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655095)

I've gone better, I run diskless so there's no disk noise. Even so it's not silent, I can hear a very quiet hiss when the system is busy. I guess it's the power supply caps or something.

Re:Pathetic. (2, Insightful)

Frogbert (589961) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654823)

Thats the point, the video card fan shouldn't be the noisiest fan in a system, unfortunately a X1900XTX fan is.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654876)

Ah thanks. Never knew it's that noisy. Thought the FX5900 lessons were learned.

Re:Pathetic. (2, Informative)

Superfarstucker (621775) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655108)

With proper water cooling i'm able to run @ 780/890 on these with only soft modifications. With hard voltage modifications these cards will do a lot more. (25-30% out of spec) Of course, from a value proposition it is all a waste of money, but it is fun to tinker. I don't think this is a good 'value proposition' either. Middle of the road is the best I suppose.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655204)

Ah that's good to hear. Good job btw. I was wondering why the OC result on the page was so bad. Sometimes we really don't need that 15fps but I can't justify my purchases, as you said the middle cards are the ones with most value, but we go ahead and get the extreme ones anyway. I can't justify my purchase if I don't OC the hell out of it. Eventhough we know it'd only last 6 months before somethings replace it.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

scumbaguk (918201) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656333)

Try using any top of the range graphics card out today on a hot day and you will see why Hint they get very hot, my x1900xt will hit late 90 degrees c on a hot day. Much like the wether we currenly have in the right now.

Re:Pathetic. (1)

bronney (638318) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656394)

Well I'm still in the 6800GT era :) but yeah I know what you're saying. 90's just nasty.

If they're smart, they'll release a Linux driver (0, Troll)

bombadier_beetle (871107) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654673)

That way they'll cover the market for homosexual high-end gamers.

Energy consumption (4, Interesting)

tsa (15680) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654688)

I always wonder what the energy consumption for water cooling is compared to air cooling. Does anyone know anything about that?

Re:Energy consumption (1)

Briareos (21163) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654896)

I always wonder what the energy consumption for water cooling is compared to air cooling.

Well, the only things that consume energy with water cooling is the pump (which, in the case of my Reserator 1+ from Zalman is a 5W aquarium pump) plus the fans (if any) you use to dissipate the heat from the radiator(s) - so it consumes probably less energy, but I guess the difference is negligible.

It's a fairly trivial difference (3, Informative)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15655111)

Water cooling pumps don't need a lot of wattage to run, neither do air cooling fans. In general water cooling probably uses slightly more power since usually the water cooling radiator is air cooled, so you've fans and a pump. However it's just not a significant amount of power next to the other draws in the system.

Rememeber all the power is needed for is moving things around, either air or water. There's not a compressor or anything.

Expensive Overkill... (1)

CampbellFromCITA (981069) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654711)

This is EXACTLY the card you need when trying to prove to a bunch of your friends that you definately have spent the most money on a computer that can't quite outperform their slightly cheaper PC's...

The real question is how can I waste even more money now that I've water cooled my 4 multicore intel's and my video card, ive got a freon injector over my 48channel sound card and my LCD monitor requires three projector screen stands just to hold it in place...

Wait there's some external storage drives shaped like lego and a USB hub that looks like a smurf villiage - that it - BRILLIANT!

Thumbs Down... (1)

HotBlackDessiato (842220) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654803)

...on this caliber of subject matter appearing on Slashdot's front page. Guys... a video card cooling review? ffs.

The Playstation 3's price is outrageous... (4, Funny)

vijayiyer (728590) | more than 8 years ago | (#15654814)

So I'll get a video card instead.

mod Up (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15655194)

you get distracted others what to Raise or lower the FreeBSD core team Distribution. As

thermaltake tidewave (1)

scumbaguk (918201) | more than 8 years ago | (#15656342)

Thermaltake tidewave
For anyone who wants this for the cheap. It's what Saphire have used in this card and you can get them for about £45.

Warter is essential, haven't found a top end card yet which dosen't get too hot on a day like today.
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