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Firefox Usage Climbing

CmdrTaco posted more than 8 years ago | from the hey-thats-nothing dept.

443

kbox writes "According to the Amsterdam analytics firm onestat The Firefox browser has jumped from a global market share of 8.7% to a whopping 13% since April 2005. The national usage of Firefox make some interesting reading, too, with Firefox making up 16% in the USA, 24% in Australia and a huge 39% in Germany." Unsurprisingly, on Slashdot we skew the averages somewhat, with Firefox weighing in at 65% of our traffic... but sadly 18% of our Firefox users need to upgrade to the latest version ;) Go do that now.

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Firefox is yet another OSS victory! (5, Insightful)

hackstraw (262471) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704698)


Netscape was good, or at lest the best of the day. It ran on every obscure platform under the sun. It was like java before even java. Runs and is able to be debugged and crashed everywhere.

I've heard from Netscape developers that the highlight was when they realized they were _the_ browser for the web, and they were seeing web addresses (complete with the http:/// [http] part on them) on the side of trucks and all that. I also heard that the secretary is quite wealthy now due to stock options, the whole nine yards.

Well, they stagnated. And IE came and IMNSHO, ruined the web experience in the late 90s to early 00s. And during that time Netscape released their code into the Mozilla project. It then got worse. AOL bought Netscape, and Netscape is just a memory.

But then, guess what happened?

Because of the open code and open standards, we got the web back! My browser of choice is Safari. I really like it. It does almost 100% of what I think a browser should do. And it too is based on open standards and OSS (KHTML), and Apple has given patches back to the KHTML people.

And then Mozilla grew into Firefox, and things are getting better on the web again. I recently ran into two websites that required IE. One was for my taxes, and I told them that sure this time I can use IE on the Mac, but IE on the Mac is dead and if they want my business, they need to support standards. At work, there is one system that requires IE _on windows_, and we had to get a new computer, with windows just to view one website, and I had a word or two with them. And guess what? They told me that they are now targeting Firefox as the target browser, and for that to be cross platform.

Hey, as sucky as IE was, it did help the scene a little bit. It focused the other guys to care about security and for standards compliance, and today I have a number of good choices for browsing the web on a number of platforms, and its getting better every day.

Thank you Mozilla team, and thank you Microsoft.

One problem... (5, Insightful)

Mr. Underbridge (666784) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704801)

...One could also say that MS has gone *six years* without updating their browser, and Firefox is only at 16%. I mean, I'm as happy as anyone. I'm using it now. But I really see that market share getting cut in half within 2 years of IE7 coming out. MS just won't put up with this, and when you can put your product on every PC that's sold, and the competition can't, you don't have to be great to win.

Re:One problem... (5, Interesting)

fishdan (569872) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704962)

...and the competition can't...

That's not true any more -- OEM manufacturers can build firefox (or any other software they want) into their windows builds without fearing retribution from MSFT. That's what the anti-trust thing was all about.

And the last time I was at MicroCenter (a large computer chain) in Boston, a local entrepeneur (kid had to be 14) was distributing for free a CD with FireFox, Open Office, SpyBot, Gimp and Trillian (I told him Trillian wasn't open) on it -- as well as html document that had a link in it to his Amazon donation page, where he was asking for $2.50 which seemed pretty reasonable to me. I asked him about his traffic, and he said he passes out about 200 CD's a day on Saturday and Sunday. Obviously he must have access to a multiple image burner to crank out volume like that (or he was pulling my leg), but seems like a good way to make a bit of $$$ for a kid, and at the same time help spread the love

Re:One problem... (3, Funny)

weeb0 (741451) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704993)

Would'nt be possible to use the spyware knowledge to install incognito firefox on every internet explorer user's computer on our own website ????

Since the microsoft loving dumb users don't even know how to install software, it would be helping them to know a beautiful world ? And show them there is other software company than microsoft

Thank you ... Microsoft? (4, Insightful)

QuaintRealist (905302) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704857)

It's easy to forget that not too long ago I was waiting for the latest upgrade to IE, downloading and installing it manually, because it was the best browser out there. I appreciate the efforts of the developers, too.

But I can't thank Microsoft. Because they quit trying to be the best and tried instead to lock out and eliminate competition, through means familiar enough to everybody here that I'm not going to repeat them.

And I don't think I'm just saying "what have they done for me lately" - Microsoft's war on the competition went some way towards undoing the good things that came from their competition with Netscape.

I agree with you, otherwise (for whatever that's worth). Just a thought

Re:Thank you ... Microsoft? (1)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704974)

Because they quit trying to be the best and tried instead to lock out and eliminate competition

Another thought: you can't quit doing something you never started doing in the first place.

Safari Adventure Club (5, Interesting)

fishdan (569872) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704862)

Safari pisses me off though because lack of design mode [google.com] is a major flaw, but one that is obviously fixable. I'm an ardent mac supporter, but the long and slow response to this makes me feel like Apple is sticking it to us (the mac faithful) because they can -- they know they've got a captive audience.

I've taken the Writely path now -- we (my company) no longer support Safari on our web applications -- we just can't. And I don't see us ever going back to that when we can code to one standard -- Firefox -- and have it work everywhere.

So I agree with you -- thanks Mozilla, and thanks OSS for having projects in which the developers are responsive to the customers needs. If I need something I can sponser someone to make an extension or tweak. We've done that several times with Thunderbird, we have some custom work we paid for in a few other OSS projects that went back to the community.

So I'm in the weird position of being a mac lover and an apple hater. Which is weird, but I think some people will know what I'm saying. Apple has contributed back where they've been required, but with the promotion of DRMs, ITunes, etc, they're not really an ally of Open Source, except in that they see OSS as an ally of convenience against MSFT. If there were now Microsoft, Apple would be doing exactly the same things MSFT has done.

Help me ! - with my work situation and IE (2, Interesting)

fantomas (94850) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704933)

"At work, there is one system that requires IE _on windows_, and we had to get a new computer, with windows just to view one website, and I had a word or two with them. And guess what? They told me that they are now targeting Firefox as the target browser, and for that to be cross platform."



Some advice please? my university work place has an expenses system which required me to use IE if I want to claim for travel expenses etc. Doesn't work on Firefox or other browsers. I have to keep IE on my computer solely for this purpose. Can you (or any other slashdotters) advise on some well chosen arguments that I could use in an email to try and persuade the management (and I guess the central organisation techies) to modify the system so I can use firefox instead? cheers in advance...

Re:Firefox is yet another OSS victory! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704943)

Thanks for the history brush-up.
 

Re:Firefox is yet another OSS victory! (1)

slashflood (697891) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704944)

and they were seeing web addresses (complete with the http:/// [http] part on them) on the side of trucks and all that.
Good old times!

Stagnating (5, Informative)

Otis2222222 (581406) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705026)

Well, they stagnated. And IE came and IMNSHO, ruined the web experience in the late 90s to early 00s. And during that time Netscape released their code into the Mozilla project. It then got worse. AOL bought Netscape, and Netscape is just a memory.

Yeah, Netscape definitely stagnated back around version 4 or 5 - when the browser was a bloated mess and was in danger of collapsing under its own weight. When IE 4 came out it was quite simply a better browser. It rendered pages faster and had a much better user interface. I think it's a bit of an exaggeration to say that IE "ruined the web experience in the late 90s". They were the best game in town back then.

I made the move to Firefox a few years ago when pop-ups were a huge problem, and discovered that Firefox was about a LOT more than just blocking popups. IE had started to stagnate bigtime. IE5 and IE6 offered no meaningful improvements (although a pop up blocker appeared way late in the game). People knew that IE sucked but the word hadn't spread about Firefox yet. The momentum is clearly shifting towards Firefox now.

I just hope that they don't start to stagnate or bloat up with unneeded features too much. Fortunately they let extensions take care of any "bloat" that a user may want, which I think is good. Just keep a small core set of features and let people add enhancements on as they see fit. So far the history of web browsing has shown that through many generations of innovation come long periods of stagnation. From Mosaic to Netscape to IE to Firefox to ???

What about Opera, Safari and Konq. (3, Interesting)

baadger (764884) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704701)

Would Taco like to furnish us with those stats? :P

Re:What about Opera, Safari and Konq. (1)

eipgam (945201) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704730)

Don't forget Epiphany!

Re:What about Opera, Safari and Konq. (2, Interesting)

Homology (639438) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704743)

> Would Taco like to furnish us with those stats? :P

Please include the OS as well. My guess is that Windows is dominating,
contrary to what the posts indicate ;-)

Here are some (5, Interesting)

linvir (970218) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704749)

These are my percentages for June, with spiders and wget-type things stripped out. Nearly two thirds of my hits are referrals from Slashdot.
Firefox - 69
MSIE - 10
Konq - 5
Opera - 4
Safari - 3
Mozilla - 3
Camino - .4
Galeon - .3
Epiphany - .1
Links - 0
Firebird - 0
Omniweb - 0
Dillo - 0
WebCollage - 0
K-Meleon - 0
Multizilla - 0
Lynx - 0
Shiira - 0
Motorola - 0
w3m - 0
GetRight - 0

OS/Distro/versions? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704832)

Just for the heck of it, since you are pulling stats anyways - what OS percentage (if possible including versions/distros). And if you have stats for that too, combinations?

Just curious. Thank you!

Re:OS/Distro/versions? (3, Informative)

linvir (970218) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704842)

Full browser stats [linuxvirus.net]
Full OS stats [linuxvirus.net]

Re:OS/Distro/versions? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704879)

Wow, thanks for making me have to do a killall -9 firefox-bin

I was stuck in an infinite loop of firefox asking me for the username and password for your site.

Re:OS/Distro/versions? (1)

admdrew (782761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704881)

It's asking for authorization on all images in the /linuxvirus.net/awstats/icon/other/ folder... I was amused to have to click "cancel" a few dozen times. Interesting stats, nonetheless; thanks.

Re:OS/Distro/versions? (1)

linvir (970218) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704905)

Yeah, sorry about that. I didn't catch it because obviously I've had to start a session to get the stats in the first place. I've replaced it with a simplified version instead.

Re:OS/Distro/versions? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704971)

Thank you!

Some interesting stats, especially if lots of your traffic is from Slashdot.

Mac + Ubuntu together has about 11%. Surprising to see vanilla Debian so large when RH, Suse etc is not (mostly I didn't expect such good sense ;-)

Still a shitload of Windows but that is to be expected.

Re:Here are some (1)

slashflood (697891) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704966)

Do you have the operating system stats?

Re:Here are some (2, Interesting)

Ant P. (974313) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704998)

A few months ago I ran a log analyser out of curiosity. My site was getting ~90% Firefox, KHTML in second place, Opera 3rd and negligible IE users. Though that might be because IE shoves a download box in the user's face for XHTML pages...

You know the 0.1% statistical error? (1)

BlackCobra43 (596714) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704759)

The one where you had up the numbers and there's 0.1% or so left? Yeah. THAT's their stats.

Re:What about Opera, Safari and Konq. (1)

Just Some Guy (3352) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705093)

I'm kind of curious about that, too. It seems like I'm the only person in the world who uses Konqueror as their primary browser, but I'm not sure why. Firefox is nice and I use it as a backup, but I really love Konqueror for reasons too numerous to list in a short post. Since KDE is the most popular desktop for Linux, I'd think that more people would be using its flagship product.

The World Is Seeing the Light? (1)

Rhett's Dad (870139) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704705)

"Slow but sure, to win the race", says the quietly confident tortoise...

Work (3, Insightful)

bilbravo (763359) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704708)

That number might be higher (for /. users), but some may do a bit of viewing while at work. Some employers do not allow Firefox for some reason.

Re:Work (5, Funny)

T_ConX (783573) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704756)

Indeed. I'm a summer student working on an internship right now.

At the orientation, they had a woman from IT give us the rundown on how to log into our computers blahblahblah. A student asked if they had Firefox. The IT staffer said that they don't allow instant messanger software on the computers...

Ya... switch to Firefox was one of the smartest computer choices I ever made.

Re:Work (5, Informative)

The MAZZTer (911996) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704782)

And most probably don't know about USB thumb drives. Put those two together and hey! You got Portable Firefox! :)

Re:Work (1)

Carrot007 (37198) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704906)

So how exactly am I meant to use a thumb drive on NT 4?

Come on tell me!!!!!!

Only thing that makes me cry at work is the inability of ie 5.5 that we are forced to use to work on google maps. BAH!

Re:Work (2, Informative)

pla (258480) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704957)

So how exactly am I meant to use a thumb drive on NT 4?

You tell the BIOS to provide legacy support for USB drives, then NT sees it as just another HDD.

Of course, you can't hot-plug it if you do that, but assuming you shut your machines down at night, you can attach it in in the morning and take it home at night with you.

Re:Work (1)

27,000 (987534) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704893)

Any browser not using the Trident engine simply fails to work at this site. Firefox, Opera, Maxthon with Gecko. All HTTP requests time out and die. Even Lynx fails to work. Lynx!

Maxthon with Trident works. And IE. It's like a choice.

Re:Work (1)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705007)

Yeah, that's why my connection now would be logged as Firefox on Windows, instead of Firefox on Mac OS or Linux. (Luckily, even though we're "officially" supposed to be using IE, enough of us like Firefox that it's de-facto permitted.)

I'm doing my part (4, Interesting)

Mabonus (185893) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704714)

Here at my office, Firefox is the default encouraged officially sanctioned browser of choice. After all those javascript/buffer overflow/remote code execution errors we gave the heave ho to IE and made sure that everyone had a copy of FF installed. So, put me down for 0.000000000000001% of those users!

Re:I'm doing my part (1)

Akaihiryuu (786040) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704762)

Dang, that must be nice. Where I work all they have is IE and we aren't allowed to install any additional programs. On the one Windows machine I have at home, IE isn't even an option anymore (unless someone really knows what they're doing), as I've deleted the iexplore executable and all of the shortcuts. Granted, you can still get to it via Windows Explorer, but generally that's not something that someone will think of unless they know what they're doing, and if they know what they doing they aren't going to be using IE.

Portable Firefox (4, Informative)

bunratty (545641) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704898)

we aren't allowed to install any additional programs
No problem. Just run Firefox directly from a USB drive [portableapps.com] .

Re:I'm doing my part (1)

Mabonus (185893) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705112)

Yeah, we still have IE installed, but scripting is disabled by default via group policy, unless someone adds the page to their trusted sites. We keep it on hand, but in a default crippled state. I actually think that was the best way to get adoption up, because when all your favorite sites stop working in IE, and since there's this OTHER browser sitting there everyone took it for a spin and stuck to it.

Re:I'm doing my part (1)

admdrew (782761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704911)

Where I'm at, the techs have insisted on firefox be installed on all new machines. There's only a few of us that need to use IE for one web app (meaning it's the homepage ;), but other than that, it's all FF goodness :)

Firefox (4, Informative)

mrak and swepe (799450) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704715)

It's 'Firefox'. Not 'FireFox'.

Thanks for reading.

Re:Firefox (3, Funny)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704776)

Semantics, shemantics.

Re:Firefox (1)

bunratty (545641) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704988)

It's syntax, not semantics.

Re:Firefox (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704826)

So, then, is it Douchebag or DoucheBag?

Re:Firefox (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704982)

You're on the internet here. You should be happy they're using letters at all.

More Data (4, Interesting)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704717)

Well, this is one firm's results and we all know how sometimes findings can be biased. If you want the full report from onestat, it is here [onestat.com] with all browsers covered.

Interestingly, Adtech [adtech.info] found similar results (~12% in Europe [adtech.info] ) while The Counter [thecounter.com] put Firefox at more around ~9-10% for those months. Net Applications [hitslink.com] placed Firefox at around 10% also. Of course, Wikipiedia [wikipedia.org] has a decent article on this with combined data at the bottom.

I guess 13% seems like kind of a stretch and 10% seems a bit more realistic. I don't know what makes any one source more reliable than the other though as none of them really talk about their strategy for attaining these statistics.

The big question shouldn't be "where is Firefox's percentage" but instead "how do we make Firefox more appealing to non-technical users?" Because it's clear that the technically savvy people have adopted Firefox but you'll never make it past 15% of the population with that attitude. I hate to say it, but introducing some functionality that Internet Explorer doesn't have might be the only way to accomplish that. And when you do that, you lose the stability and security that made it so popular in the first place. Solution? Perhaps a MySpace plug-in in light of recent news? :)

More Distribution (1)

Dekortage (697532) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704780)

The big question shouldn't be "where is Firefox's percentage" but instead "how do we make Firefox more appealing to non-technical users?"

How about taking cues from Microsoft and getting Firefox preinstalled on new computers? Or follow AOL's plots and have the installer CDs available for free with new computers (or even free for the taking) at major retailers (CompUSA, Best Buy, Wal-mart, etc.).

The hard part is not the appeal of the browser. The hard part is getting people to try it. Once Firefox has its foot in the door, people will let it in the whole way.

Re:More Distribution (2, Interesting)

Xzzy (111297) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704866)

The hard part is not the appeal of the browser. The hard part is getting people to try it. Once Firefox has its foot in the door, people will let it in the whole way.

No, the hard part is that people don't care. Valid technical reasons for doing something don't encumber the mind of most people. They just look for their bottom line, and in the realm of browsing the internet, that bottom line is getting to a web page with the least effort.

If you got Firefox installed on hard drives as they shipped from manufacturers, usage would increase dramatically. Hand out free install CD's? Not so much.

Re:More Distribution (2, Interesting)

Dannon (142147) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705028)

No, the hard part is that people don't care.

It's all a matter of timing. I've made a nice bit of pocket change cleaning spyware and viruses for my non-technical friends. A friend whose computer has just been saved from uselessness can be very open to the idea of trying Firefox...

Re:More Distribution (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15705122)

How about people who go to the effort of uninstalling Firefox? I've seen it happen many times when clients call about spyware and adware infestation one week after I've cleaned their computer. I don't understand it but some people feel lost in front of a browser if it's not IE. Under Windows, using IE, Firefox, or Opera don't feel so different to me. I really don't get it, especially when I keep telling them not to use IE if they don't know what they're doing.

Re:More Data (1)

lavaface (685630) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704824)

how do we make Firefox more appealing to non-technical users?

Having it bundled and configured as the default browser on OEM computer sales would help ;)

Re:More Data (2, Insightful)

xtracto (837672) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704868)

Yes and no.

I agree with that but in the other had, the 85% of the population that doesnt use firefox already have a computer and are using another browser. The aim would be to get marketshare from IE who is the one that has an uneven marketshare.

How to do that? well, you have to convince the people that is using them to migrate to firefox. As another person wrote one of the ways to convince them is showing the advantages Fx has compared to IE6. On that note, you should show the people what Fx can do right now, for example the ad blocking, tabbed browsing, the live bookmarks, spell checking etc. Some of these properties are achieved using extensions, but please dont just say "firefox has extensions that allow you to make things you can not do with other browsers". Just tell the people what firefox can do (including extensions).

And then, the chance for this mass migration posibility is almost gone, because when Microsoft releases IE7, people will see it as an update. They will update their current program and they may not buy into all the bells and whistles that firefox provides

Extensions (4, Insightful)

ZachPruckowski (918562) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705104)

We need a Windows version with some of the extensions pre-bundled. Set up the AdBlock and Spell Checking, and dispatch that version. That way it consists of Download -> Install -> Doubleclick -> Browsing!!

Re:More Data (1)

lavaface (685630) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704908)

sorry, I replied to the ""how do we make Firefox more appealing to non-technical users?" before I continued reading.

introducing some functionality that Internet Explorer doesn't have might be the only way to accomplish that.

Are you kidding? The extensions bring so much extra functionality to the table that there's no comparison. True, the potential for security vulnerabilities increases if you install extensions willy-nilly, but the most popular ones are vetted for security. Perhaps the average browsing public can't grok mouse gestures [mozilla.org] , but once you start using them it's hard to go back to mousing up to the back button or using the keyboard. The session saving capabilities of Tabmix Plus [mozilla.org] would become immediately useful once introduced to any user. And if you need IE, there's always IE Tab [mozilla.org] . ; )

I could go on, but those right there should be enough to convince anybody of all the extra functionality of Firefox.

Oh, and if you want to Myspace [mozilla.org] . . .

Re:More Data (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704939)

I hate to say it, but introducing some functionality that Internet Explorer doesn't have might be the only way to accomplish that.

Is this sarcasm??? Or do you really think firefox doesn't have any more features than IE?

Re:More Data (1)

MobyDisk (75490) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705095)

Why don't manufacturers bundle Firefox with new computers? It seems to my that it would be in their best interest to ship a more secure product to keep their tech support calls down. And since they can modify the source code, they could make a Dell branded version or fix bugs that their users are experiencing.

Upgrade? (1)

xtracto (837672) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704723)

but sadly 18% of our firefox users need to upgrade to the latest version ;) Go do that now.

Do you mean version 2? But I just remember reading a story on slashdot that was tagged "donotdownlad" and there was a highly moded comment stating that Mozilla did not wanted us to download that version...

I am running 1.5.0.4 (now that I see it, it is funny the quantity of digits in that version number, what does the .0 is suppose mean?)

Is it the latest version? according to the Help/update it is :) yay!

Re:Upgrade? (3, Interesting)

EnderGT (916132) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704745)

I think they're referring to people like me who still run 1.0.7 and need to upgrade to 1.5.0.4. I choose not to upgrade because I think the 1.5 interface is too sloppy compared to the 1.0.7 interface. A bit too much wasted whitespace in the menus, specifically - doesn't feel as clean and polished.

I do use 1.5 on my home machine, and one thing I've noticed is that managing bookmarks in 1.0.7 is easier - I can drag and drop items as necessary, whereas 1.5 makes me use a "move up" button.

Sorry, /. editors, I will NOT be upgrading any time soon.

Re:Upgrade? (0, Troll)

Homology (639438) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704818)

> I think they're referring to people like me who still run 1.0.7 and need to upgrade to 1.5.0.4. I choose not to upgrade because I think the 1.5 interface is too sloppy compared to the 1.0.7 interface.

You need to upgrade because Firefox is full of security holes, deemed critical
by the developers themselves, but patched. Firefox security record is not
exactly glorious.

People think that just because some application is open source it's secure; how wrong
they are to believe that.

Mythbusters, Firefox Edition! (4, Informative)

The MAZZTer (911996) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704819)

  • Dragging bookmarks works fine for me in 1.5
  • The interface is only as sloppy as you make it, thanks to the right click | customize menu option.
  • Extensions can be used to tweak the interface further if you wish. Stylish can be used to apply styles to the interface (although I ran into problems when trying to limit the height of the toolbars, but I probably wasn't doing it right).
  • I don't see a "move up" button anywhere anyways. But then again I'm using 2.0 at the moment.
  • If Firefox seems screwy, disable all extensions using Safe-Mode and see if the problem goes away. If it does, you have a bad extension somewhere. Not Firefox's fault. This also applies to memory usage (although a large part is still due to Firefox's memory cache... which people like to refer to as a leak, despite the fact they take no steps to limit the memory cache size using about:config) and overall load time and stability.

Re:Mythbusters, Firefox Edition! (1)

EnderGT (916132) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705005)

  • I have 1.5 installed on a machine at home, and if i remember correctly dragging does not work. I will revisit to make sure.
  • Customize menu option can't fix how the menus are painted - ie borders, padding, colors - all of the things that make up "polish"
  • I haven't tried this path, I'll investigate. If I find something that can do what I want in terms of polishing up the interface, then maybe it'll be worth a try.
  • Again, I'll have to double-check when I get home... maybe i remembered wrong (it's been known to happen from time to time).
  • Not sure where this came from, don't think I mentioned problems of this sort....

Thanks for the input...

Re:Upgrade? (1)

ahsile (187881) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704831)

Um... Firefox 1.5.0.4:

1) Navigate the "Bookmarks" menu
2) Select Manage Bookmarks
3) Drag bookmarks around to your hearts content
4) ?
5) Profit!

Re:Upgrade? (3, Insightful)

lspd (566786) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704863)

I think they're referring to people like me who still run 1.0.7 and need to upgrade to 1.5.0.4.

The results are probably skewed by people like me who use the version of Firefox that came with their distro. I'm using Debian Stable with Firefox 1.0.4

Re:Upgrade? (1)

InfiniteWisdom (530090) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704928)

www.backports.org is your friend.

Re:Upgrade? (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704999)

I can drag and drop my bookmarks just fine in my copy of Firefox (Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.4) Gecko/20060508 Firefox/1.5.0.4)

Re:Upgrade? (1)

d_jedi (773213) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705003)

I'm still using 1.04 (on this machine).. because upgrading has proved to be too much of a pain in the ass... I just leave whichever version of FF was originally installed.

Sorry, but downloading a completely different installer (NOT an upgrade), which doesn't uninstall the previous version, and doesn't take into account previous preferences (ie. install location, etc.).. which also breaks previous functionality (particularily extensions) is a no-go for me. Apparently, this is fixed with 1.5.. but that requires that I go through the painful process at least once more.. No thanks.

Re:Upgrade? (1)

TeknoHog (164938) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704932)

Do you mean version 2?
Or version 3 [mozilla.org] ? I'm using it right now, though it's still a little unstable.

slashdot vs digg (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704731)

mod me as a troll if you'd like, but slashdot readers have been asking for slashdot stats for years, now because slashdot's traffic has decreased (due to digg) they're giving out some webstats?
Comon slashdot, give us a full URL to webalizer!

Re:slashdot vs digg (2, Insightful)

mikeisme77 (938209) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704816)

I wasn't aware Slashdot's traffic was decreasing, just that Digg's was increasing. Personally, I look at them both. Digg I look at for more recent stories--the conversations tend to be at a very low intellectual level (high school or lower). Slashdot, while there are quite a few really dumb comments, still has quite a few "field experts" browsing and commenting on stories, which is why I read Slashdot. I spend maybe 2 min. on Digg with each visit (glance at the stories--open the ones I'm interested in and then close the Digg tab); while I spend at least 10-15 min. each time I go to Slashdot glancing through the conversations (from stories that interested me) for intelligent/interesting comments. I will say that I like the fact that I can post a blog entry to Digg and only get 10 diggs, but get 60+ readers for a blog entry that would have only gotten maybe 3 reads (MacBook and OS X Review [blogspot.com] ...

As for the web statistics, these were only posted because they're relevant to the story about increased Firefox usage. I want to try the 2.0 Beta, but last time I tried a Firefox beta I couldn't use any of my extensions and I therefore wasn't able to use Firefox in the way I like using Firefox (since without the extensions its only an okay browser). I don't know if I'll switch to Firefox 2.0 when it comes out though, as currently I'm really fond of Opera 9.

Re:slashdot vs digg (1)

PatrickThomson (712694) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705089)

the conversations tend to be at a very low intellectual level


amen to that! I quit slashdot about a month ago because of the numbers of idiots, slashbots, rhetoric spouters and trolls, only to find that everywhere else that allows user comments is so much worse.


Slashdot, you're the least unusitable, and I'll always have a place for you.

Re:slashdot vs digg (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704847)

Got any evidence that there's been any decrease in traffic? Got *any* evidence that it's due to digg?!

Get a clue, only the trolls and fanboys see any war between the sites.

TechGranny dons tinfoil hat. (1)

TechGranny (987537) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704732)

I was reading Tacos journal, and read about the new widgets being prepared.

Tim has been working on an improved control widget which hopefully will make a lot more sense then the terrible UI we kludged together to get things started. We're going to start buy giving access to the system from a random sampling of users. There are bugs in various browsers that will need to be worked out, and the UI will need to be refined, but I think everyone will be happy with how it works. It's definitely becoming very clear where the performance problems in different browsers are. It's a pain.

Hmm.......

Checks version number.... ;)

Operating systems? (5, Interesting)

Tx (96709) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704738)

I assume the majority of that growth must be on Windows, but I'm wondering if Firefox usage is growing at the same rate on different OSs, since they have different alternatives. Mac and *nix users have some pretty decent non-Firefox browsers that arent available to Windows users. Just curious, anyone got relevant stats?

Why my Firefox is out of date... (2, Informative)

mikeisme77 (938209) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704754)

My Firefox is out of date because I switched to Opera when Beta 9 came out. I still use Firefox on occassion for testing my web site and for the ocassional page that just refuses to play nicely with Opera (or when I need to use the IE tab for one of the few pages that STILL refuses to work in anything except for IE). So I just don't bother to stay current on the latest updates. Of course then there's the version of Firefox I'm using now at work (version 1.0.7) and that's pretty out of date... but I'm not the person who originally installed Firefox (and this is a multi-user computer) so I don't know if they need the older version of Firefox for some reason...

I wonder... (1)

s31523 (926314) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704761)

If by coming out of the obscure browser category to the significant market share browser category will increase the amount of exploits used by hackers, spammers and adware people out there. It would seem that much of the IE security breaches result from, aside from it's crappiness, its ubiquitous presence on the web. I wonder if Firefox will start to see more security breaches as it gains market share... We will see!

Re:I wonder... (2, Insightful)

Jane_Dozey (759010) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704873)

Yes we will, and I hope that it does. The more people finding holes the more the devs can fix. I'm thinking though, that the sheer volume of problems won't be as bad as IE as it's not stupidly tied into the OS.

I could be wrong mind you :)

Re:I wonder... (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705024)

I think most of the security breaches in both Firefox and IE come from user stupidity. Don't install or run unknown executables. That's the end of it. Before I started running firefox, I ran IE for many years, and never had a problem with viruses, even though I visited some pretty shady sites. I think that most of the viruses you see in the wild are because of user stupidity. I realize that there are some viruses out there that don't require any user interaction, but from what i've seen, they are the extreme minority.

Re:I wonder... (1)

bunratty (545641) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705032)

But IE has so many more vulnerabilities, and more serious vulnerabilities, than other browsers that it acts like a honeypot for malware authors. But, as you say, we will see...

BBC doesn't require WMP (1)

AnotherDaveB (912424) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704773)

From the article:

It's to be expected that a coding or Linux forum would have a higher number of users using FireFox than a more general website such as BBC (which requires WMP to play media) or myspace.

Not so, the BBC offers vid/audio content in either Real format or offers a choice between Real and WMP.

Link to the One Stat statistics mentioned [onestat.com] .

Fire who? (2, Interesting)

clickclickdrone (964164) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704822)

That's pretty good numbers considering the vast majority of web users have never heard of Firefox. All my IT/tech-head friends are on Firefox and have been for some time but pretty much all the 'normal' users, mums, dads, people at work etc. have never heard of it and even when shown it simply don't understand why they would want to change from IEx. Web standards? Reliability? Safety? They just don't care. They fire up their PC and get browsing with IEx. It works for them, that's all they're interested in. They might care more if people like me didn't keep doing a free clean of their machine to remove all the muck they have downloaded every few months.

So, if you want Firefox to flourish, stop fixing friends PCs for free :-)

Re:Fire who? (2, Interesting)

Magnor (611476) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704927)

Actually, now both my parents and most of their friends are now using Firefox because I'm fixing their systems. I've found that most of the time when I'm asked to help, it's due to some form of spyware taking advantage of the lax security in IE and installing itself on their system. As part of the clean up, I install Firefox, remove most of the default IE shortcuts, set Firefox as the default browser, and set IE to not ask. Then I explain why they should use Firefox instead. While I'm sure that my words are mostly ignored, most people tend to use the most convienient browser. Since most of these people don't even know how to make a shortcut, much less how to change a browser association, they start using Firefox until it feels natural.

Re:Fire who? (3, Interesting)

ManoSinistra (983539) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704935)

Actually, a good way to get Firefox out there to the common "Joe Ordinary" is to help them fix their computer. Give them a copy of Firefox, (and Thunderbird) and tell them what it is. I've cleaned up several computers in my time and always recommended that if they didn't want their browser to be clogged up with 20-odd search toolbars (shudder) then they should really consider using this browser. All the folks I've helped out are now Firefox supporters...

So spread the word . . . help out your friends.

Re:Fire who? (4, Interesting)

The Cisco Kid (31490) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704942)

You dont need to stop fixing them - you just need to start changing the *way* you fix them - eg, you fix them by removing (or at least hiding and removing from the default) IE, and installing FireFox. When they see its 'different', just tell them its a new version. Most people don't even understand the difference between software, the OS, and the Internet anyway.

Re:Fire who? (1)

clickclickdrone (964164) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704994)

Good point. Maybe they ought to do an alternative icon for Firefox that looks like the IE one - that would keep the change-averse users happy. Once fired up, as long as it serves up web pages, I don't suppose they'll much care as long as they have their old shortcuts and moving those over is trivial.

Re:Fire who? (1)

aesiamun (862627) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705092)

So you get penetration by lying? Wow...that's great!

Re:Fire who? (4, Insightful)

dhasenan (758719) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704981)

Nah, they'll just get annoyed that their computer is slow. They don't link their behavior with the computer's state unless the relationship is clear and immediate. Programmers and techies are used to that sort of thinking, but then, they already use Firefox for the most part.

Re:Fire who? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15705070)

Or start fixing them for money, like those of us whose IQ measures above that of a stop sign.

Re:Fire who? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15705086)

"That's pretty good numbers considering the vast majority of web users have never heard of Firefox."

And the vast majority 80%+ don't use it. So, what's the point?

Try SunriseBrowser (1)

cannuck (859025) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704841)

If your building web sites etc. - try SunriseBrowser

Amsterdam? (1)

jollyroger1210 (933226) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704846)

It IS out of Amsterdam, so they could be...uhhhh... rollin'?

IE Nostalgia (2, Funny)

End Program (963207) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704861)

Maybe Microsoft can build a widget for Firefox that pegs the CPU usage to 100% while a little Explorer icon keeps spinning in the corner deciding if you are worthy enough for it to load the page. Ah, just like old times...

Fine! (2, Interesting)

SlappyBastard (961143) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704867)

I'll make my own browser, and it will be supercool and it will support CSS 4.0 and the ACID test will totally look awesomer in CSS 4.0 because it will support 3-D web browsing!!!

Actually, I still miss Firebird. Birds are way better than Foxes. Especially when they're on fire. And 16% use in the US counts as being on fire.

50% of people will always use IE, because they're too dumb to use IE to download Firefox. Makes you wish MS would just give it up and adopt Firefox, huh? It would save a boatload of cash.

Anyhow ... my browser is gonna be better than both!!!

Stats (1)

gmerideth (107286) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704909)

Strangely enough, for no reason we could figure out, our usage stats showed an increase from 12% to 20% of visitors to our site using Firefox. We've assumed since we are getting more traffic from europe, and reading this article that europe is using Firefox at ever greater levels it looks like our assumptions were correct. I for one welcome our firefox overlords.

I prefer Mozilla, not Firefox (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704916)

Mozilla has the ability to switch the text zoom from 100% to 200% or 300% or even more IN A SINGLE STEP.This feature is essential for me, that is why I use Mozilla and not Firefox.Is there a Firefox plugin for doing that?.If the answer is yes I may switch, otherwise I'll stick with Mozilla. Unfortunately they stopped the depelopment of Mozilla to version 1.7 something. Why dont they implement this feature in Firefox? Both Netscape 4.7 and higher and Mozilla have it, but not Firefox. I switch from 100% to 2-300% and back hundreds of times everyday and Firefox is too awkward for this task.

Re:I prefer Mozilla, not Firefox (3, Insightful)

FreeBSDbigot (162899) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705066)

I don't find Ctrl+ or Ctrl- a couple of times to be all that awkward.

Are tags edited? (0, Offtopic)

LS (57954) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704934)

This story was tagged as a dupe, but after reloading the story, the "dupe" tag disappeared and was replaced with "firefox, mozilla". I assume the editors edit the tags, as they used to often say "bullshit", "stupid", etc, but now seem to be a lot more tame...

LS

Many people still don't know Firefox exists. (3, Interesting)

master_p (608214) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704936)

A friend of my father called me to fix his computer because he had spyware problems. He did not know Firefox existed...I have met many people over 40 that use the Internet and have no idea of what Firefox is.

Re:Many people still don't know Firefox exists. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15705031)

Sadly many people don't know that IE exists nor what an operating system is. All they know is that they have the internets on a computer.

Firefox Usage Climbing.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15704986)

...and as it does, so does the amount of memory it takes up.

Firefox Slashdotter Extension (4, Informative)

cyclocommuter (762131) | more than 8 years ago | (#15704990)

Another tip for Slashdot readers using Firefox... get the Firefox Slashdotter Extension [mozilla.org] . It expands hidden comments inline using AJAX, allows you to change skins, informs you via an icon on the status bar if you got mod points, displays links to Coral Cache, plus more.

Firefox Cheerleaders (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15705002)

Why is Slashdot THE premiere cheerleader for Firefox?

I have Firefox. I HATE Firefox. I don't recommend Firefox to anyone. Why? Because it's slow, it's bloated, it's miserably crash-prone, and it's every bit the dinosaur that the original Mozilla became. In every instance I try to find alternatives..from Safari on my Mac to Konqueror on my linux boxes. Especially Konqueror on my Linux box since the Linux Firefox people are hell-bent on forcing the GNOME button order idiocy on everyone (and don't tell me about the Plastikfox fix, I'm well aware of it..and it shouldn't even be necessary).

Firefox? No thanks. I've got better things to use that 130megs of free ram on.

It's all Firefox as far as I can see... (1)

dr_leviathan (653441) | more than 8 years ago | (#15705106)

I'm sure I know someone who is not using Firefox, but everyone I know well enough to know what they are using... uses Firefox. That's why I'm always suprised to find out the real numbers are as low as they are.

OTOH, I work in the tech industry in San Francisco so I'm probably in the middle of a very un-average sub-group of the population.
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