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IT and Divorce?

Cliff posted more than 7 years ago | from the career-hazards dept.

943

frank_tudor asks: "I am graduate student and work as a web developer. I am also getting a divorce and I have a son caught in the middle. I believe my profession had a part in it. For my graduate thesis I am writing a paper about Dads who work in the computer industry, divorce and custody. I think our industry causes a high rate of divorce but I need some help from the Slashdot community. My questions are: How many of you computer Dads have also gone through divorce and have retained either half or full custody of your children? Do you think your job had something to do with it? What were some of your hardest challenges and are your kids happy?"

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943 comments

Oh please (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426377)

IT didn't cause your divorce. Stop trying to look for external causes when they were internal. My Dad worked in IT and my parents are still married, nearly 40 years now.

Re:Oh please (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426441)

I know! My one anecdotal case is more than enough to completely invalidate yours!

yes, but.. (5, Funny)

Steve_Jobs_HNIC (513769) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426491)

His job smacked his wife around. Now seriously, who's gonna stay in a relationship like that? I mean come on...

His job was also very lazy, never did anything around the house. And it would never listen! If you're going to be in a relationship with a man, women, and a job, everyone needs respect each other and their personal space. But job just didn't know when to back off either... it would keep pressing and pressing... jesus, I'm in the bathroom. Just leave me alone!

Re:yes, but.. (4, Funny)

operagost (62405) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426731)

I hate when Job leaves the toilet seat up!!!

Re:Oh please (5, Insightful)

Ucklak (755284) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426493)

Exactly. The writing is there: good student, good employee, horrible spouse. You can't do it all. You have to choose what is important to you and don't you ever put your children second.

Re:Oh please (5, Insightful)

smilindog2000 (907665) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426631)

"don't you ever put your children second."

Actually, I think many marriage councilors recommend never putting your spouse second. Second is exactly where the kids belong. It's kind of like when the oxygen masks on an airplane pop-out. You put on your own mask before helping others. You can't help anyone if you pass out. The same is true with family. It's hard to help the kids if you're getting divorced.

I started a company in NC in 2000 with my wife. We already had a 6-month old baby, and a couple years later we had another. I worked like heck, ignoring the family, until one day my wife declared, "This isn't a marriage. You've got to either choose work or our family." I chose the family, and yes, things at work do suffer somewhat as a result. However, I'd be no good to anyone if my family broke up.

My personal goal is now to work no more than 45 hours/week on average. I'm getting there, but it's hard.

Re:Oh please (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426695)

Yes, well, marriage counselors are in the business of marriages. That doesn't make them right about putting children second. Sex, marriage, etc, the whole point of it all is reproduction of the species, aka children. They are the most important aspect, because if you raise them right, you'll benefit society.

Re:Oh please (3, Insightful)

bcat24 (914105) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426837)

Yes, but raising kids right involves a stable home life. Kids of divorced parent may turn out OK, but who knows what kind of fear and hate they'll carry with them. Happy parents == happy kids. Angry parents == angry kids. (YMMV, of course. And no, I don't know this from experience, thank God.)

Re:Oh please (0, Offtopic)

futuresheep (531366) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426833)

Posting to remove my inadvertant redundant to this poster when it should have been insightful.

Re:Oh please (1)

Veamon (733329) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426611)

It could be that you were a lousy lay, and she would rather get pounded in the ass by Joe the Plumber. Seriously, IT won't cause a divorce. Your devoting more of your life to your job than your family will. Stop being a pussy and man up.

Re:Oh please (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426715)

Let me guess, you are female.

Re:Oh please (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426793)

Idiot. No, wait - fucking moron. You presume to know what caused his divorce? Arrogant bastard. Just because your parents' marriage didn't suffer due to your father's doesn't mean the submitter's didn't.

Bias (4, Insightful)

Odin_Tiger (585113) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426383)

Aren't you worried that, in light of your personal life issues, this thesis might come across a little...I dunno...biased? Just a tad?

Re:Bias (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426527)

And?

Isn't bias the very definition of being human. At least for anyone with half a brain and more than a few years life experience is biased one way or another. The people claiming not to be biased are probably the biggest hippocrites of all and can keep their biases hidden. At least, with this guy, we know where he is coming from.

Re:Bias (1)

venicebeach (702856) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426871)

In the same way asking a community to volunteer stories of divorce will give no unbiased information as to the rate of divorce.

This is shaping up to be a great thesis...

should read: i am bitter about my divorce and.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426387)

want to blame everything except the parties involved...

I'm about to start the road to divorce (5, Funny)

also-rr (980579) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426389)

The first step? My wedding next year.

Re:I'm about to start the road to divorce (5, Funny)

Gnight (163400) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426483)

Marriage is the leading cause of divorce.

Re:I'm about to start the road to divorce (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426567)

Marriage is the only cause of divorce.

Re:I'm about to start the road to divorce (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426791)

50% of marriages end in divorce.

The other 50% end in death.

I GOT OUT ALIVE!!!!!

Re:I'm about to start the road to divorce (1)

kalirion (728907) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426813)

And life is the leading cause of marriage. And lets not even talk about the fact that life is a 100% terminal condition.... We really need to find a cure.

Re:I'm about to start the road to divorce (1)

Rob T Firefly (844560) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426859)

Congratulations, and condolences!

I Can Relate to You (5, Funny)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426393)

It was a couple patches ago when my wife filed for divorce. I'll never forget the day because that night, my epic tier two helm piece dropped and I won it for only 150 DKP. I don't think I'll ever understand why she did it. I was by her side the entire time she was being charged with child abuse. I know she never abused our son because I was in the other room on TeamSpeak when the alleged beating occurred and I didn't hear any screams except those of my guildmates dying from Nefarion. I know I should have attended the custody hearings for our son but the only night of the week I don't raid on is Tuesdays and the judge refused to move the dates. Call me crazy, but I never saw it coming.

Yep, the only reason she left me is because I'm in the IT field. I make a lot more cash on average & my job as software developer is one of the most highly sought after in the nation. Computers are becoming more and more prolific in everyday life so I maintain a solid job. But from what I've told you, it's pretty obvious that being in the IT field is what separated me and my wife. Looking back, I miss the times she brought me a beer as I was stacking sunders.

Sorry to make light of your situation, Frank, but honestly I think that a lot of IT people know how easy it is to find pr0n online. I've heard this is a growing concern [divorcewizards.com] . Honestly, the perks of an IT job would probably be desirable for the wife, I think it's just the fact that the person is more clued in to how to use computers for pleasure and addiction. IT filed offers more money and doesn't ravage your body (at least not like construction or farm work does). Whether it be Warcraft or pr0n, these addictions pay a toll on a happy marriage. If you find a correlation, it's probably in those topics, not just IT.

About the questions with kids, I don't have any but I would think that it would be very simple to get them involved with a computer project and spend plenty of weekend time with them. Then again, that's just what I would dream of happening ... it would probably fail miserably with "I don't want to be a nerd like you, dad!"

Yeah.... Riiiight... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426399)

[Insert obvious joke here]

But what about the children... (1)

mordors9 (665662) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426405)

Frank,babe. Hate to break to you. The woman was just out for your fantastic genes. She has the kids now and is ready to move on to the area bad boy :-)

Re:But what about the children... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426797)

True. Just ask Hans Reiser...

IT causes divorce (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426411)

Like spoons made Rosie fat.

fp (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426413)

from an anonymous married coward?

Poor social skills (1, Insightful)

AEton (654737) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426425)

People who self-select a career in information technology tend to have poor social skills.

Think about it.

Married and divorced ... (1)

douggmc (571729) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426427)

Most Slashdotters can barely manage to get away from their computers and speak to a women ... how on earth do you expect them to have actually been married and then divorced :)

IT, No T, any job is the same (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426429)

My ex-wife's job had more to do with it then mine, she was screwing her service manager.

Re:IT, No T, any job is the same (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426627)

What is it with people who have a problem with their wives having sex with other men? My wife and I are in the "hotwife" lifestyle. My wife goes out on dates with several male friends and freely has sex with them as time allows. I make sure everything is going ship shape at home so she doesn't have to worry about it. In exchange, I get the satisfaction of keeping stuff at home going well, taking care of our child and knowing that my wife is very happy. I think if more IT guys adopted the hotwife lifestyle, there would be a lot less divorce and a lot more happy couples. Don't get me wrong, she allows me to have sex with her sometimes and frankly I honestly have MORE sexual pleasure when I know she's been very well taken care of by one of her friends. It's all a mental thing anyway. So what's the deal with guys getting divorced over something as trivial as a wife getting a little on the side? And in case you think I'm trolling or kidding, think again. Do a Google search for the "Your Hotwives" web site. It's a forum where we all go to talk about our wives and their exploits with other men. Don't knock it till you've tried it.

Re:IT, No T, any job is the same (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426727)

Oh, I don't know... maybe some of us are capable of satisfying our wives ourselves and would prefer not to be married to sluts?

Just a wild guess.

Re:IT, No T, any job is the same (3, Insightful)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426745)

any job is the same

There is some truth to this. Nearly any coporate job demands long hours and tough working conditions, all so you can make a few extra bucks. Having both spouses working only exasperates the difficulties in spending time together. In a good relationship, both of you should naturally have a clear idea of what each other is up to. There's no need to give each other the first degree, or hang off each other. Just spending time together, talking a lot, and doing the things that couples do can go a long way toward saving the marriage. Unfortunately, this takes a LOT of effort, isn't very easy, and requires the commitment from both sides.

Having kids only puts more demands on your time. They need just as much of your time as your spouse does. That time, however, does NOT replace the alone time you need with your spouse! Just because you both spend time with your kid doesn't mean that you don't still need intimate time (physical, emotional, and otherwise) with each other. Just something to keep in mind.

BTW, check out my current sig for a geeky way to give your kids "daddy time". ;)

Are you serious? (4, Insightful)

nasor (690345) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426433)

Are you seriously planning to use responses here as "data" for a graduate-level academic thesis?

Re:Are you serious? (1)

bbernard (930130) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426703)

That's my question too. I hope you've got some sort of scientific data collection planned, because anything you get here on Slashdot is going to be anecdotal at best.

Other than that, I can't help you: my wife and I don't have any kids yet, and no signs of divorce just yet.

Perhaps you might want to look at this another way: People who get into may have certain personality traits that make them really good at IT, and very bad at mariage. Or not.

Re:Are you serious? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426719)

The expectations of today's academics have been lowered greatly. A B.S. (B.A. = Junior High?) is relative to a high school diploma years ago. Most master's degree programs are targeted toward the inept. The single place where the expectations are at a reasonable level is in the Ph.D. programs. Even that has gone downhill. This sort of biased research has no place in the academic world and should not sufficient to warrant any sort of graduate degree. There are always exceptions, as I've seen a B.S. Honors thesis of higher quality than any M.S. thesis and it was better than some Ph.D. thesis work. If you want to judge a school's/department's graduate program, look at the quality of the thesis papers they have approved.

I wonder... (1)

mattgoldey (753976) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426435)

if your divorce has anything to do with the fact that you're an idiot.

Shocking (1)

Tweekster (949766) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426437)

people that have trouble communication about non technical things may have trouble with relationships.

I wish this was fark, obvious tag...

Divorced geeks unite (1)

Lord Kano (13027) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426439)

I too am a divorced geek. Fortunately I had no children with the ex, and I don't know if it's the job so much that contributed to it as much as my geekness.

Even when we're not at work, we're still geeks and concerned with all manner of geekery.

LK

Lets start a club (1)

JeanBaptiste (537955) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426587)

We won't even need the 'No Girls Allowed' sign.

-recently divorced geek
--1 year old son
---half custody!

Re:Divorced geeks unite (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426783)

Then it probably was your geekiness.

Congratulations, you've failed at being a man.

Huh? (5, Funny)

gstoddart (321705) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426443)

Married? Kids? I'm still running girlfriend 5.0 since I'd heard the upgrades to wife 1.0 came with so many problems I'd stick with what already works for me. :-P

Hate to break it to you.... (1)

porcupine8 (816071) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426453)

But I seriously doubt this type of data collection is going to fly for a PhD thesis. I hope you're a Master's student, your advisor is ridiculously lenient and he/she has somehow never heard of confirmation bias.

Primary Cause (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426461)

My ex cited long working hours and "workaholism" as the primary reasons. They were not the only reasons, but she thought they were primary.
After remarrying, I've made very sure to spend less time at work and more with my family.
At least nerds can learn from experience.
Sorry about the AC reply, my wife reads Slashdot.

Re:Primary Cause (3, Funny)

Durrok (912509) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426591)

You had a wife that reads /. and you let her get away? FOOL!

A few points (5, Insightful)

ellem (147712) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426467)

1) Ask /. is now officially worthless
2) Your thesis is horribly flawed
3) Your wife is leaving you because you whine too much

I wonder... (1)

On Lawn (1073) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426471)


I wonder what the author, or others might attribute to the IT industry that is a strain on a marriage.

I've had times that I need to choose between work and home, and I may not have as much lattitude in that decision in some ways as another profession. But I'm not sure what might be an issue more or less than another career.

As for myself, I feel pretty lucky that while things in the server room are working well I'm given quite a bit of lattitude to deal with family issues. Which is good considering the critical nature of many of these issues.

Correlation = Causation? (5, Insightful)

Illserve (56215) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426477)

Surely you can't discount the fact that IT workers are drawn from a different portion of the population which makes it difficult if not impossible to prove that there is a causative factor?

It sounds like an interesting topic, but be careful with overstating the implications of your correlational results.

A more likely reason for divorce (2, Funny)

aaronwormus (716976) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426489)

Getting your advice from slashdot.

Maybe. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426495)

Due to the sometimes-long hours, on-call rotation, nightly work, and general stress, some IT people can experience this situation. I'm in IT and recently got a divorce. But I don't believe the cause was my job nor the hours worked. I'm sure that my have factored into it a small percentage, due to the time spent away from home and away from my wife causing some distancing, but definitely not a deciding factor. People sometimes grow apart or want to persue other interests that subconsiously drive these things. One may not see the exact causes.

That depends... (2, Insightful)

GmAz (916505) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426505)

Do you bring your work home with you? Is your hobby computers and does it take most up of your free time? Do you commute to work and end up getting home late every night? I work in an IT possition as well and though my marriage is a good one...I could probably play computer games less. Well, mainly one...World of Warcraft. I have taken it easy lately on it since I do have a 6 month old baby girl...but if computers have taken over your life, trust me...its not the IT Industry ruining your marriage...its you. People with the same fascination with cars or fishing or hunting. If those hobbies take over their lives, their personal life is affected. Doctors have the same problem. They work long hours and end up with bad personal lives.

FWIW (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426513)

My wife and I were quite happy together when we worked full time (same company, different departments). It wasn't until we retired and started actually spending time together that we got divorced.

Since other aspects are sufficiently covered ... (5, Insightful)

cascadingstylesheet (140919) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426517)

... I just want you to know that I'm sorry that you and your family are in this situation. It's painful for everybody, and I feel for you.

Grad Level Thesis: Facts Not Hunches (4, Insightful)

nick_davison (217681) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426519)

For my graduate thesis I am writing a paper about Dads who work in the computer industry, divorce and custody. I think our industry causes a high rate of divorce but I need some help from the Slashdot community.

I realize this may come across as a cheap shot but...

If you're writing a graduate level paper, shouldn't you actually do some, you know, statistical analysis to support your core hypothesis rather than go with, "I have a feeling and asked some other nerds."?

You're far more likely to get results with, "Statistics show that while divorce is at n%, n+y% of male IT workers experience divorce. This thesis looks at prime causes for that y% and performs a statistical breakdown of their effects." than "I got divorced, I work in IT, it sucked. This paper's about how I'm pretty sure IT made it happen. I asked some other nerds what they think."

Numbers. (1)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426525)

Before blaiming work you should look at all the numbers.
Devorce Rate in your country. Percentages of Dads who win custity. Then break it out by Professional Sector and Labor Sectors in buisness.

Now if the devorce rate for Web Developers is 85% and Chances to get custity is 5% and the average for the Professional Sector is 45% Then you may have a point. But if it 50% IT Professionals and 50% Professional Sector and 50% national. Then it is just your fault not work.

In my situation (1)

otacon (445694) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426537)

I am a network engineer at a large steel manufacturer. I am also currently engaged and have a 3 month old son. Now I love both of them, but I've frequently wondered if we ever did split would I be able to share custody. Work is very demanding and often more time outside of the office for research and studying. Of course I would want to see my child, and could provide finacially, but what about emotionally, honestly I don't think I could, maybe on the weekends if that. It's sad to say but some jobs make it almost impossible to be a single parent without a lot of assistence, as a male, I am not very motherly and would probably need a nanny or something, and I just wouldn't want to do that to him, he would be better off with his mother, as hard as that is to say. My advice would be to really evaluate your career and how much time you really have in a day to care for your child. Good luck.

Re:In my situation (2, Insightful)

winkydink (650484) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426753)

These are all issues you should have thought about before having unprotected sex. What will happen to your son if something tragic happens to his mom?

after two divorces (0, Flamebait)

FudRucker (866063) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426543)

after two marriages ending in divorce i no longer take love & romance serously, i refuse to let my emotions control me like that anymore, i dont care how pretty or nice or available a women makes her self she wont get more than sex and a place to spend the night from me...

Re:after two divorces (1)

Stardo (465325) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426659)

I'm surprised you give her a place eto spend the night. =P

Re:after two divorces (1)

MyLongNickName (822545) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426765)

How else do you get breakfast?

Oh grow up. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426547)

If your income is so important that you sacrifice your relationship, you don't deserve neither.

I work in IT, I have been doing it for 10 years now. TEN FUCKING YEARS.

Has this destroyed my relationships? No. It has added stress.

So I'm quitting next year. I hate what this field has done to my life. So *I* am making a change.

Grow a pair and quit blaming your problems on your job. It's you that is at fault.

Besides the obvious? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426553)

The obvious being that many geeks make poor (perhaps "premature" is a more fair word) choices in their personal lives. Before you mod me down, consider how many geek friends you know that go for girls that are TERRIBLE matches for them. Many geeks make very good choices too, of course, but it seems there's no middle ground; geeks either know themselves, or they don't, and it seems to reflect in their personal lives as well.

Re:Besides the obvious? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426645)

Before you mod me down, consider how many geek friends you know that go for girls that are TERRIBLE matches for them.

Read: Desperate.

dad or tech? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426563)

I work on the TAC of the second-largest vendor of IP-routing equipment (guess which one). While I am not married, most of my collegues are. The divorce-rate is fairly low. I think this is due to the "normal" working hours we have. Unlike previous jobs (at ISP's, being -the- tech), in my current role there is plenty of opportunity to hand of a case if it needs out-of-hours attention. This combined with the fact that most of my collegues (yes, that includes me) have lost the 24/7-drive to tech-stuff, it helps to have a normal family life.

Now I'm waiting for the flames here. Yes I know we all feel we have a decent life. Yes I know we all feel it is possible to combine being a "hardcore-techie" with being a "family man". But deep down inside we all know that this is pretty much impossible. You can't tech 24/7 and dad 24/7. At work you tech, at home you dad. Itsasimple.

Your career doesn't define your divorce. (5, Insightful)

Agent Green (231202) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426569)

Not sure if any of the data you have here is going to be significant ... and since this _is_ slashdot, I doubt highly that you could use it as a reference on a graduate thesis. Personally, I've been married for 3 years and have a son, which I'm sure outcasts me in the group. But, I digress.

I have a couple friends that have been divorced, though they are from different professions. In those cases, the job wasn't the crowning gem in the divorce itself ... far from it. Here are some traits I observed which one side, the other, or both had in those cases: personality conflicts, lack of communication skills, unwillingness to communicate, unwillingness to listen, self-absorption leading to the exclusion of the other, disjoint financial strategies, unfair domestic workload balance, ho-hum disregard for the children. I never saw a particular job or anything actually interfere.

Where I'm at now in my mid-30s, most of the guys I work with are married and have been for quite some time. There are very few divorcees and the people I know are very loyal to their partners and their families. I'd have to say that here in IT, those of us who are married are a pretty fun, stable bunch.

I think you need to stop blaming your career for your divorce and do a little more soul searching.

How is this different from any other job? (1)

the_humeister (922869) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426571)

Doctors work long hours, especially surgeons, and have high divorce rates. Same with lawyers. Basically, any job in which you're working long hours and not spending time with your wife is a contributing factor for divorce. We've known this for at least several decades.

my divorce- (3, Interesting)

jmahler (192217) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426579)

I work as an IT person (net admin, specifically) and I went through a divorce with 2 kids.

I came out with a shared parenting plan and am considered the custodial or residential parent (the 2 kids live with me, and have structured times w/ their mother). My divorce, however, was not due directly to my workload. It was due to the fact that my ex is an alcoholic with violent tendencies... my long hours irritated her, sure - but that's about it. :)

Long hours suck the life out of everyone - but they are an unfortunate side-effect of what we have chosen to do for a living. This is beginning to change a bit, I've noticed - I can do my work from home when I need to be home with the kids due to a great implementation of citrix and vpns (not to toot my own horn), and my cell phone keeps me in constant contact when needed.

Asshole alert (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426597)

I know I am going to sound like a total asshole, but you really need to work on your methodology. Gathering data for a thesis on Slashdot is not going to get you anywhere.

Grab hold of an assistant professor or someone similar and make him give you the 101 on basic research.

And good luck on your thesis.

Counseling (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426603)

I know this won't be a popular post, but I have to ask you what steps you have taken toward changing the course of your marriage? When choosing to marry someone (assuming you used somewhat standard vows), you claim that you will put that person ahead of all other things - including your career, if necessary.

Obviously, I'm not saying you should stop working if your wife and son don't feel you spend enough time at home, but asking the question "I wonder if my job led to my divorce?" makes me wonder if you've had an objective conversation with your family about all of this. Perhaps you could see a counselor to at least help you understand what got you to this point and what steps could be taken to change course.

You need to work it out... (5, Insightful)

javabandit (464204) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426605)

Marriage is hard. Its a lot of work. If you aren't willing to give up on your child, then why give up on your marriage? I wish people valued marriage half as much as they valued their relationship to their children.

I've seen divorcees willing to move to other states, pay lots of money, adjust their schedules, adjust their lifestyles... all just to be with their kids. Spouses should do the same thing. Its all a matter of priority. Marriage just doesn't mean as much anymore.

These days, people divorce because they argue too much. Or because "the spice" is gone. Or because they don't like arguing about money. Or because the in-laws hate each other. Or because wife gained some weight and doesn't look good enough anymore. Get over it. Man up and deal with it and treat the marriage with the importance it deserves.

I've been married for eight years now and I have a child. Some of that married time has been REALLY hard. But I treat my marriage like my child. It would take a LOT for me to give up on my child. Same for my marriage.

Its all about priorities.

Life's Irony (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426609)

Your writing a paper about Divorce and Dad's and your surprised your getting a divorce too? If I was you, I'd write a new thesis - How to get laid like a rockstar. Then you can post to slashdot a few months later and go "Do you think the IT industry has a problem with getting real work done when the b-----ches won't back the f--- off a brother? Damn girl, I'm trying to write a paper here."

Clearly your focused on the wrong type of research.

You mean my right hand can get pregnant?! (1)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426619)

Oh shit, I better start practicing safer porn viewing!

most of the time (1)

mattboston (537016) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426621)

it has nothing to do with our careers, it has to do with woman are crazy. if you want more info read http://nomarriage.com/ [nomarriage.com]

Scapegoat? (5, Insightful)

JLavezzo (161308) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426625)

I'm married with two happy children. I know several people who have gotten divorced and have shared custody of children. None are IT professionals.

The high instance of divorce in the US is much more related to materialism, disconnectedness (also called "independence") and ideas of "self", attitudes towards relationships and the myth of satisfaction than any scapegoat, popular (homosexuality) or unpopular (IT professionals).

I always tell my single friends that finding a spouse and marriage is more about being the right person than finding the right person.

Good luck on your thesis. I hope it's well researched and well received. Obviously there's more to it than you could put in an "Ask Slashdot."

Avoid blame (1)

_prime (181525) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426637)

YOU are the one in control of the industry in which you work and how much time you put in. Saying your career was a great factor in your divorce sounds to me like you loved your job more than your partner.

Writing a paper on divorce in an industry where many have sustaining healthy relationships seems to me like a collosal attempt to avoid looking at the truth and to justify what has happened.

I'm not saying a short marriage can't be a successful one -- it just sounds like you aren't happy with what is going on and I think you have some larger questions to ask yourself. Any of us can make something else a higher priority that our marriage. Is this what you have done?

Asperger's Syndrome (2, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426639)

I wonder if there may be a relation with Asperger's Syndrome [wikipedia.org] . According to an article in Wired [wired.com] , Apserger's is disproportionally common among IT people.

Exited IT long time ago (1)

zitintheass (1005533) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426651)

I've graduated as an IT software engineer. Later I realized that there is only a few places where you can feel secure in this industry today. Most of the jobs are "dead-end job" type engagements... I build a small hotel in the hills to profit from winter sky seasons here and so far so good. Even bank manager was ok to lend me money, because he had clear understanding of the business I was about to conduct, something very rare in the IT business these days.

God /. is getting lame (1)

mkswap-notwar (764715) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426655)

Honestly. Is this advice really to be used?

On second marriage now... (1)

revlayle (964221) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426673)

...maybe might be done with second marriage in a few years. However, this time, it is no fault of my S.O. She is a fine and great person in her own right. I'm just not marriage material and increasingly finding my self with a "trapped" feeling, like I'm in some sort of obligation without understanding what I really got into (both marriages)

In my case, I enjoy my work, career (software development), and hobbies more than I care about family and traditions. Also, I am a bastard and find it increasingly difficult to live with other people; however, I don't know if that is exactly an IT-only thing. ;)
I know if this second marriage does dissolve sometime down the road (not 100% guaranteed it will, just looking that way, and mostly my fault), I'm not doing it again. As it is I have a dim view of relationships and marriage and raising families, etc.
Maybe it has to do with my work and my personality pre-disposition to such work. I do software development during the day, *sometimes* contract work in the evenings, I geek out for my hobbies, and I'd rather go out and have a few drinks more often than be trapped at home when I have time to go out. I'm not very family-oriented, and getting less as they days go by, while my wife is fairly family-oriented, and getting more as the days pass by. When will be the point of difference between us that is so far we don't care anymore? Oddly, we never really fight, we get along great most of the time.

IT and Divorce (4, Insightful)

doomicon (5310) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426677)

I've been in IT for some years now. I went through a divorce. Was my profession responsible, no. I have a wonderful son and share custody 50/50.

I worked at a startup for 1 year, during that year I rarely if ever saw my family. Did that job contribute to my divorce? No, because I decided to quit that job, and find another (That year surely didn't help my relationship, however it wasn't the catalyst to the failure of the marriage).

Divorce can be a horribly emotional experience, we often soul search to find out "what went wrong, what could've I done differently". Sometimes, you just got to sit back.. take a deep breath, and just realize it didn't work out. Regardless of whether she cheated, you cheated, you were away working all the time, she wasn't a good wife, and the myriad of other reasons, nothing can change the present situation... so...

Best advice, Keep your cool and move forward. If you feel the job's a problem start looking for a new one.

fuck equality (1, Informative)

not already in use (972294) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426687)

It's issues like these that really give me a bad taste in my mouth with it comes to women's rights and equality and such. Not that I want to bring the discussion off-topic, but in order for there to be true equality, women would infact have to give up certain rights. One of these being the fact that women are almost always given custody of children in a divorce. I went through this, not as the parent, but as the child. The issue itself is really independant of your job. By default, my mom was awarded full custody. My dad threatened to take the issue to court to fight for custody. I don't know your overall financial situation, but the thought of hiring a lawyer and going through more legal process than already required by a divorce was enough for my mom give up half custody. As far as any advise I could offer, if it is possible to live close to your ex, try and do so. I constantly moved every other week, across town. It was hard to maintain friends. It was hard to get to school on time living way outside my district, and it was held against me when I would be late so often. To be honest, it was tough not have one place to call home. But at the same time I feel like having the influence of both parents in my life was a positive thing. Hope things work out for you.

never, EVER put family second for a long time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426689)

give me a break "It's all my career choice's fault"

If you had a job that forced you to put your family second for long periods of time, you should have considered a change of career.

How much of that money went to things you NEEDED? how much went to things you WANTED?

you should have wanted a family more.

You're kidding, right? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426691)

My God, man. You get divorced because one of you married a loser... or someone that turned into one. This isn't a function of your job type, it's a function of YOU (or her).

If you work 60+ hour weeks and this has a negative effect on your marriage that's not because of your job, it's because you continued to work 60+ hour weeks, duh.

Yes, we all know there are places that expect 60 hour weeks, and guess what, if your home life is important to you then you'll find someplace else.

I work in a shop that stresses a 40 hour week and pays OT when they need to. I check with the wife to see if she minds me putting in a few more hours later in the week because it's important to her, and me, that the kids actually know who I am.

Don't blame your computer for your jacked up family life...

Probably OT but thought I'd share. (1)

Enzo1977 (112600) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426701)

This is just my biased opinion as a divorcee with no children to speak of. Although I do not work in information technology I have noticed in myself and other men, that there's this strange change that happens in the relationship. Keep in mind that my analysis fails to make any attempt at acknowledging the paradigm shift associated with modern feminist ideals.

As a bread winner in the family, husbands tend to get caught up in their career; they take a great sense of pride in accomplishment with their work, time spent, and advancements in their career. This sense of pride helps in legitimizing their efforts as the bread winner. But in the process, the husband loses sight of those goals and dreams that were once shared with their spouse to raise a child. They find a new dream to be head of the IT department, to be CFO, CEO, or whatever snazzy title, becomes a very singular narrow minded path, that tends to exclude their spouse and children. In my opinion, relationships are built on shared dreams and goals, and when those dreams and aspirations diverge, two different lives are forcibly born from a once shared sense of unity. I fail at reaching any sort of viable resolve, other than there needs to a level of acceptance by both parties that, these are the dreams we aspire to raise a happy health child, but this is the path we must take to attain those dreams. Along that path is hardship; and time spent apart, but there must be constant reinforcement that the work and time spent is for the greater good of the relationship. And what is that goal or dream that you both hold in the relationship? Sometimes it is to have a happy family with 2.5 children, other times it is a lot more simple like wanting to grow old together. So it is not just about the child, but the shared hopes and dreams. Blah, I wish I had a better conclusion.

Perhaps you should ask Hans Reiser (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16426721)

Ironically, the CAPTCHA word is "acquit"

Priorities (1)

Rob Kaper (5960) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426725)

I'm not convinced there's a big difference between IT divorces and other divorces caused by people who are often away on business or have on-duty responsibilities, or true workaholics. Depending on the situation this might be a factor in custody decisions. If you're doing well and have a nanny and are every bit the nice guy as some fathers in the open source world are, then don't worry. On the other hand, if you're up to $200K in debt, have had a restraining order and know your company is in financial trouble.. then you might consider other priorities than custody because you should darn well know you're in no position to take care of children at the moment. Just to mention something recent.

Point being, be honest with yourself and judge whether you are capable of taking care of children in combination with your job. Don't make a principle point out of it based on your best intentions but admit you can't bear unlimited responsibility and might have to set priorities sometimes. I bet it also really depends on your current relationship with your children. If you're just the guy who cuts the meat Sundays, you'd be stupid to think you will all of a sudden be. Visitation rights would be more than enough and could always be extended if indeed you would start to find it easy to shift the balance between from home to work step by step.

might have more to do with the fact (1)

bunions (970377) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426729)

that you're married, have a kid and somehow thought that you'd have plenty of time for grad school -and- work.

disclaimer: I don't know you.

Poor choice of thesis topic (1)

lsm2006 (949039) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426749)

Reconsider. You are much too personally involved with the topic to write a fair, balanced and scholarly work.

IT? Try every job... (2, Insightful)

TheFlyingGoat (161967) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426751)

Anyone that works long hours is going to have a hard time maintaining their relationship. It really has nothing to do with the industry itself, but instead is a result of people neglecting their relationship to spend more time at work or on their computer. I've gone through that myself, with my wife and I going through a separation before I realized that I needed to spend more time with her and less time on the computer. Same goes for mechanics, engineers, managerial staff, etc. Leave your work at work and spend some time with your wife.

There is a moral to this tale... (5, Insightful)

jamesbulman (103594) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426759)

I was in a relationship for eight and half years with my ex. We'd bought a house together nine months earlier and I thought things were okay. Yes, I'd been working *a lot*, like nearly every weekend for the last three months. She'd got a promotion which took her out of town a few nights a week, I didn't mind, she'd been really supportive of my career in the early days and I figured it was me returning the favour.

I came home one Sunday evening and she announced she'd met someone else and she was leaving me. She'd known him for a month and was in love with him, she still loved me but she wasn't *in love* with me. WTF?! No it's not up for discussion, I'm moving out. So I got fifteen minutes notice that my relationship was over.

I knew that we'd been distant but I'd resolved that I was going to put the effort into our relationship as soon as this project was delivered.

Have you figured out the moral yet?

even if you telecommute, remember these 4 words (5, Insightful)

fl!ptop (902193) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426761)

and in this order of importance:

1) family - you need me to work during my kid's/wife's birthday party? too bad.

2) faith - you need me to work on saturday night/sunday morning/holy day of obligation? sorry.

3) home - my pipes burst and my basement is full of water. i'm not coming in today.....(or i'll be in late)

4) work - i'm ready, lay it on me.

the key is to manage your time - you can meet a deadline *and* keep your private life if you're organized and diligent.

Couple of thoughts. (2, Insightful)

Turn-X Alphonse (789240) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426775)

Why are you so concerned about your job? If you've put so much work into your job that you've neglected your family do you really think you should get full custody of the children?

I know it's difficult but think of yourself second to your kids. Your wife is not "the enemy" she is an ally you're struggling with at the moment. If you're working so hard you can't spend time with your kids don't have them for more than weekends you won't be working.

Some times it's hard to think when you have a knife in your heart, but it's these times you need to.

Sorry for you misfortune (1)

MISplice (19058) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426781)

But as many people have said what is the primary reason your wife has filed for divorce.. if it is because you are never home and work to much expect to be hard pressed to get full custody of your child. If it is for other reason outside of work then you may have a better chance. This is really has nothing to do with the IT sector it has to do with any field of work.. if you spend more time there then with your family the majority of the time then expect to be divorced. Balance is the key and yes some IT jobs are more demanding than others but they are also the ones that are more flexible. Most web developers I know work 8 to 5 unless they are pressed by a deadline or just starting out.

Disagree (4, Insightful)

Zerbey (15536) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426817)

In my experience, people in the IT industry have a lower incidence of divorce in general. It is more likely that divorce happens because you do not prioritise what's really important (work vs. relationship). Blaming it on your job is just silly.

Simple question (1)

lawpoop (604919) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426825)

Why do you think that employment in the IT industry causes divorce? Long hours?

Personally, I feel that people who are attracted to IT, and those who succeed in IT, are people on the Autism spectrum [wikipedia.org] . People diagnosed as having Aspergers syndrome or Aspergers usually have:
  • Lack of observed desire for friendship
  • Poor ability to make friends
  • Indifferent to the feelings of others
  • Social awkwardness
  • Indiscriminate social interaction
  • Lack of eye contact
  • Brief response to questions
  • Gullibility
Sounds like an average woman's dream guy.

Couple that with easy divorce and people not willing to make sacrifices for a marriage, you have divorce.

Personally, I think the ideal of marriage of a man and a woman who are best friends and meet each other's fantasy of the perfect make is unrealistic. It creates a disillusioned, jaded populace. I spent a summer in a field study school with an Indigenous family in Ecuador. The living pattern was basically the oldest mom and dad, their children, grandchildren, and various extended family members and in-laws. Life was centered around the cooking fire, and to me, it felt like there was a big party that never ended.

Now, I'm not saying the system was perfect or a utopia, but it seems that the young couples had less stress raising young children because they had a greater support network. Children basically ran around freely and could entertain each other. Other women and grandmothers would handle children who needed more care.

In the US and Europe, people live basically isolated, lonely, stressed out lives.

My replies (4, Insightful)

killmenow (184444) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426827)

My questions are: How many of you computer Dads have also gone through divorce and have retained either half or full custody of your children?
/me raises hand (full custody).

Do you think your job had something to do with it?
No.

What were some of your hardest challenges and are your kids happy?
1. Hardest challenges: being a single father with an eighteen month old son, learning to actually be a parent, growing up, staying focused on the job because...TADA! divorce sucks...regardless of what profession you claim on your 1040.

2. Happy Kids? You don't have a teenager do you? Happy is a relative term. And, yes, my children are relatively happy.

I also must say I think your thesis premise sucks. But good luck anyway.

Just keep think it's because of "your job" (1)

Reservoir Penguin (611789) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426841)

Probaly cheating on you with someone who is a better man, like someone who knows Death Yoga and not afraid of a little BDSM.

Hmmm.... (1)

mtrupe (156137) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426843)

Blaming your career for divorce? I guess I can see blaming workaholism for divorce, or maybe if your career was pornography or rock star, but IT? Really?

My personal experience is that IT geeks have lower divorce rates, but I could be wrong. I think the divorce problem touches on a number of issues, so making a correlation here would be difficult.

Half of marriages end in divorce.... (1)

bachroxx (263916) | more than 7 years ago | (#16426851)

but then again, just think how the other 50% of marriages end!!

hint - pine box...
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