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Airport To Tag Passengers With RFID

kdawson posted about 8 years ago | from the say-baaaaa dept.


denebian devil writes "A new technology is to be trialled in Debrecen Airport in Hungary that will involve tagging all passengers with high-powered RFID tags. From the Register article: 'People will be told to wear radio tags round their necks when they get to the airport. The tag would notify a computer system of their identity and whereabouts. The system would then track their activities in the airport using a network of high definition cameras. "[The tags] have got a long range, of 10m to 20m," said Dr. Paul Brennan of University College London's antennas and radar group which developed the tags, "and the system has been designed so the tag can be located to within a meter, and it can locate thousands of tags in one area at a given time."' The system is being touted for 'Improving airport efficiency, security and passenger flow by enhanced passenger monitoring.' BBC is also reporting this story, and brings up such hurdles to the project as 'finding a way of ensuring the tags cannot be switched between passengers or removed without notification.' As for any mention of the 'hurdle' of people's rights, the article vaguely and briefly states that 'The issue of infringement of civil liberties will also be key,' but doesn't bother to go into any pesky details."

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Dog collars. (4, Insightful)

teh loon (974951) | about 8 years ago | (#16435099)

From the desciption, it sounds like the passengers will end up wearing dog collars. Anyone reminded of Battle Royale? It's one thing to be security conscious, but another thing to be paranoid.

Re:Dog collars. (3, Interesting)

Rachel Lucid (964267) | about 8 years ago | (#16435157)

With or without exploding goodness?

... shouldn't 'non-switchy-ness' be enforced via having to turn in 'your' tags at the flight gate? After all, what would be the point of enforcing non-switching anyway when you basically ensure that each person has to get one and turn one in, except to infringe on their rights?

... like we're not doing that to BEGIN with...

Re:Dog collars. (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435257)

or RFID pills. Open up!

Re:Dog collars. (2, Funny)

Walt Dismal (534799) | about 8 years ago | (#16435731)

Dog collar? Oh, whew! I thought you said 'RFID suppository". I am SO relieved.

Re:Dog collars. (5, Funny)

aplusjimages (939458) | about 8 years ago | (#16435337)

FBI: "What's all the dots?"
Airport Security: "Those are all the passangers and people in the airport."
FBI: "Well how do we find the terrorist in that sea of dots?"
Airport Security: "Well, they will be the . . . suspicious . . . dots."
FBI: "Whats a suspicious dot look like?"
Airport Security: "You'll have to talk to my supervisor. I just watch the dots."

Re:Dog collars. (4, Interesting)

wannabgeek (323414) | about 8 years ago | (#16435819)

you got modded funny, but you should be modded insightful. If a guy wants to go to some restricted area to do any mischief, he would not be wearing his dog collar. He would conveniently slip it onto someone else or make an accomplice carry two tags (one inside and one his own) while he slips into the secure area. I am not really sure what they are planning to accomplish by watching the dots.

Re:Dog collars. (2, Funny)

kimvette (919543) | about 8 years ago | (#16435861)

Aren't the good dots blue or green, and the bad dots red?

Or am I thinking lightsabres?

Re:Dog collars. (-1, Redundant)

TubeSteak (669689) | about 8 years ago | (#16435865)

FBI: "Whats a suspicious dot look like?"
Airport Security: "You'll have to talk to my supervisor. I just watch the dots."

Cue Nextel Commercial []

FBI: "Can you talk to the dots?"
FBI: "Can the dots talk back?"
Airport Security: "We don't agitate the dots"
Supervisor: "Who's agitating my dots?"
Supervisor: (Eyeballs the FBI Agent) "You agitating my dots?"

Yeah, real funny... (4, Funny)

Lactoso (853587) | about 8 years ago | (#16435915)

Let's see how funny it is once the terrorists roll out their new plot......"The PacMan Initiative"

Re:Dog collars. (1)

nEJC76 (904161) | about 8 years ago | (#16435591)

Wow! My very own Bling-Bling!
But Battle Royale? Nah! My first thought was Running Man []

Luggage? (5, Insightful)

Richard Allen (213475) | about 8 years ago | (#16435111)

Perhaps they should invest some of this energy into tracking luggage?

Re:Luggage? (1)

Swingblade (1013039) | about 8 years ago | (#16435167)

Good point

Re:Luggage? (4, Funny)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about 8 years ago | (#16435185)

Perhaps they should invest some of this energy into tracking luggage?

Thats the idea. Passengers and luggage will be merged. You bring along an extra suitcase and they seal you inside at the check in counter.

Re:Luggage? (2)

MrNaz (730548) | about 8 years ago | (#16435367)

There's no point. Luggage doesn't have any rights to trample on.

Re:Luggage? (1)

no-body (127863) | about 8 years ago | (#16435659)

There's no point. Luggage doesn't have any rights to trample on.

BS - luggage is owned by "somebody" and that "somebody" has a right to privacy.

Luggage tracking on airports is pretty sophisticated, luggage tag numbers are linked to a ticket record, luggage can be immediatley linked to an individual with a wireless barcode scanner.

And - if spooks want to search (and bug) the luggage of a human, all they need to do to go to TSA and have them to pull the luggage. You can bet that this is happening.

So - there, you twerp!

And - what are the TSA love notes you find in your luggage tell you - do you feel any safer with the habeas corpus dismantled by your government, in the great country of the USA?

Re:Luggage? (1, Funny)

MrNaz (730548) | about 8 years ago | (#16435791)

Look up. See that? That speck against the clear blue sky? It's my point. It was part joke, part political snide remark and it flew so far over your head it crashed into Hubble. But I'm sure you're ok with that, you don't sound like the scientific type.

Wouldn't this be a little late? (3, Interesting)

Robaato (958471) | about 8 years ago | (#16435113)

Okay, so they can keep close tabs on you in the airport. Yet, if you were intent on doing mischief, wouldn't you have done all your preparation before you even got there?

Re:Wouldn't this be a little late? (4, Insightful)

DrXym (126579) | about 8 years ago | (#16435355)

Okay, so they can keep close tabs on you in the airport. Yet, if you were intent on doing mischief, wouldn't you have done all your preparation before you even got there?

I'd be interested to know exactly what problem tagging everyone is supposed to solve. Airports are already compartmentalised and people must show their boarding card / passport to move from one area to the next . So what difference would an RFID tag make? It might actually weaken the system since humans will be less attentive than they are now. I suppose it might have marginal benefits such as when you're trying to locate a person exactly but it hardly appears to warrant the expense of the system.

Besides, a bad person who is intent on blowing themselves up on the plane makes every effort to abide by the same rules as other passengers. How does this system do anything at all to detect them? And terrorists who just want to kill a bunch of people at the airport can do that easily too - there are enough densely packed queues in airports to easily facilitate mass murder whether the terrorist has a valid passport, ticket, id or RFID or not. I'm surprised that it doesn't happen all the time. The queues are out the door on some days of the year.

Will it work both ways? (1)

LiquidCoooled (634315) | about 8 years ago | (#16435117)

This news started to come out a few days ago when the EU started negotiating about the flight data given to the Americans.

What I wonder is will American travellers to Europe be forced to wear these, and will security teams be able to zap anyone acting suspiciously.

Could we even vote to have folks we don't like zapped?

Well, it does say "Tag" (4, Funny)

Nova Express (100383) | about 8 years ago | (#16435135)

Don't worry, after they've stapled this to your ear, they'll let you go so you can go back to mingling with the rest of the herd.

Just count yourself fortunate that they've given up on their branding idea...

Re:Well, it does say "Tag" (1)

pipingguy (566974) | about 8 years ago | (#16435347)

Just count yourself fortunate that they've given up on their branding idea

[Whiney Homer voice] Does it go in the butt?

Re:Well, it does say "Tag" (1)

sdpuppy (898535) | about 8 years ago | (#16435395)

Just count yourself fortunate that they've given up on their branding idea...


and I was sooooo counting on collecting tattoos of my trips to show my grand kids

"And this is when I went to Kansas and I got this one - ooh I remember this that pretty stewdardess gave that one twice, after I pinched her....."

Why. (4, Insightful)

ColaMan (37550) | about 8 years ago | (#16435137)

What the hell's this for? Forensics after the fact?

"Yes, and as you can see that the terrorist loitered a lot near the toilets. Of course, quite a few people do that as well while waiting for relatives to finish their business, so we can't use that as a reliable indicator of evil intent. But I'm sure, in time, we'll find something that will show us for certain. Please, we need more funds for research."

Re:Why. (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | about 8 years ago | (#16435903)

Someone thinks they can (or knows how to) identify suspicious patterns of movement.

Remember how experts have been saying racial profiling is a bad idea? Well this is one of the alternatives, tracking your movements for suspicious behavior.

Relying on technology is easier than training lots and lots of people in how to recognize suspicious/anxious behavior

the script on the monitoring side (2, Funny)

merdaccia (695940) | about 8 years ago | (#16435151)

%country_trust_level("Albania" => 5, "Andorra" => 6 ... )


if ($country_trust_level{$RFID->citizenship} < 5) {


would you trust someone from Andorra? (3, Funny)

krell (896769) | about 8 years ago | (#16435177)

"%country_trust_level("Albania" => 5, "Andorra" => 6 ... )"

Andorra? Their twitchy antennea and their smurfy complexion always make me so nervous.

Information overload (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435173)

Great, the system can track everyone at all times, but how can anyone make any sense of this information? And what exactly is it meant to prevent anyway? Would tracking the 9/11 bombers have helped? Would it have stopped the shoe-bomber getting on the plane? If something happens we'll know exactly where the perpitrators were AFTER the event, but that won't really help. This is about as useful as knowing what colour all passengers underwear is. It's all about the appearance of doing something rather than actually doing something.

Re:Information overload (1)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | about 8 years ago | (#16435265)

I suppose the idea is to employ some kind of machine learning, where the system learns to distinguish normal from suspicious patterns. The suspicious patterns would then lead to an investigation; hopefully, this investigation will prevent bad things from happening.

Re:Information overload (1)

dangitman (862676) | about 8 years ago | (#16435679)

And I'm sure the terrorists wouldn't make any effort at all to avoid "suspicious" patterns. It's thinking like this that helps, not hinders them.

Re:Information overload (2, Insightful)

Loconut1389 (455297) | about 8 years ago | (#16435439)

They already do know what color everyone's underwear is- or at least a sufficient random sampling. What do you think the 'extra' screenings are for?

Re:Information overload (1)

kimvette (919543) | about 8 years ago | (#16435891)

And even more shortsighted, if someone is going to sneak through a back door in one of the shops/vendors, wouldn't he or she simply remove the tag, leaving it in a spot (like the back of a seat) where one would like to remain stationary, or have an accomplice carry his tag while wanders off to do Bad Guy(tm) stuff? I know this will sound cliche: but if everyone is tagged, only criminals won't have tags.

Outright refusal to be tagged! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435175)

What do they do about that?

Re:Outright refusal to be tagged! (1)

Ceriel Nosforit (682174) | about 8 years ago | (#16435221)

Escort you from the premises.

From now on, I'm no longer flying.

Re:Outright refusal to be tagged! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435245)

> Escort you from the premises.

You mean escort me to the airline desk for a refund?

> From now on, I'm no longer flying.

Apparently terrorism does work.

Re:Outright refusal to be tagged! (4, Insightful)

Alchemar (720449) | about 8 years ago | (#16435741)

What makes you think that you can get a refund. Getting escorted from an airport for "security reasons" does not entitle you to a refund. It was "your choice" to act in a manor that did not allow them to put you on a plane. You will also be reported to the authoraties as having suspicious behavior, and placed on a U.S. watch list. It doesn't matter what country your are from or what country you were in when it happened, you will be placed on a U.S. watch list. You will probably be placed on several list for several other countries. You are now a suspected terrorist, you have forfieted any rights as a human being, and the rights of anyone associated with you. I hope you don't have to travel for business, they will probably let you on the plane if you don't mouth off during the now required body search anytime you want to get on a plane. Maybe it is your sister that needs to travel for business, after missing a few flights due to searches taking a little too long, she will be looking at you for a new source of income.

The idea of collars sounds horrible, but after people realize that the consequences of "their choise" to not wear one are much worse, people will start to accept them.

Stay citizen, come here citizen, fetch your papers citizen. Good citizen, here is a boarding pass for you.( Pats citizen on head )

Security? (3, Insightful)

subreality (157447) | about 8 years ago | (#16435183)

I can believe the bits about passenger flow and efficiency, but what security is this supposed to add? The security in airports is theoretically based on keeping Bad People (by whatever definition) out. Assuming some Bad Person gets in, what is tracking their movements within 1m ever going to do to indicate that they're doing something Bad?

To me, this sounds like an efficiency study that they tacked on the word "Security" in order to sidestep the civil liberties issues. We've seen this done plenty of times before, but I'm amazed at how transparent it is here.

Re:Security? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435511)

Actually, this sort of data is any AI-researcher's wet dream. My first thought would be to implement some algorithm that learns how people move through the airport, based on the set of all locations over time per person. Once the algorithm successfully predicts the movements of people, you let it analyse what everybody is doing in the airport. People whose movements don't match what the algorithm predicts are tagged as 'outliers', and security can at any time simply request the n people that deviate most from the norm, and keep an eye on them with their high def camera's.

The problem with these techniques, of course, is the normalizing effect. Everybody that does something weird, or out of the ordinary gets observed. Little charming quirks in your personality, like sitting down on the floor in some empty space instead of sitting in on a bench in the crowded waiting area, will instantly arouse suspicion. Do what everybody does, or you'll be suspected, watched and usually, gently prodded back in line. All human societies have an inherent normalizing effect. In this case the reason isn't just security, improving efficiency usually means weeding out the weirdos as well. And all technology does in these cases is amplify that effect. Just think of the whole slashdot moderation thing, it works beautifully, but it also makes the groupthink a lot stronger (and the slashdot crowd is on the whole a relatively intelligent and critical subset of society).

Of course any real terrorist will make sure that he (or she) acts as normal as possible. In fact with the amount of attention being paid to air travel, terrorists are probably just looking for less secured areas (like the the Spanish train bombings or the London subway).

Re:Security? (0, Offtopic)

malilo (799198) | about 8 years ago | (#16435925)

mod parent up

Its as simple as this... (0, Offtopic)

simonjp (970013) | about 8 years ago | (#16435189)

... yet another place I wont be going anytime soon. Much like the States.

A matter of trust (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435201)

Now all we need is trust those terrorists won't remove the tags from their necks before doing evil stuff. The perfect system.

Re:A matter of trust (3, Interesting)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | about 8 years ago | (#16435283)

You, sir! You're under arrest for performing a suicide bombing!

But...but...I'm still alive!

Tell that to the court! We have solid evidence that you were involved in the bombing; your tag was found at the explosion site!

My tag? My tag! Where's my tag? It's been stolen!

Enough of that! We have it on record: you were in the middle of the explosion when it happened. You can object all you want, but everybody knows that computers don't make mistakes. You're guilty and you know it!

The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (1, Insightful)

RobotRunAmok (595286) | about 8 years ago | (#16435203)

The right to walk through an airport and not be watched?

When you leave your home, you may be monitored. In the old days, it was by a plainsclothes detective popping stay-awake pills and eating doughnuts in his car parked across the street. In modern times, it is through camera surveillance and RFID.

"You" have a right to try and elude the surveillance, by sneaking out the back door (then) and wearing tin-foil underwear (now), and "They" have the right to raise the ante by hiring smarter policemen and designing more powerful scanners.

That's the game. Play, or stay home. If "They" start spying on you in your home, *then* you can call the lawyers.

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (3, Insightful)

maxume (22995) | about 8 years ago | (#16435359)

Sort of. I'd personally rather not have an obnoxious government screaming about how they are protecting me from myself. If I don't believe that the costs of a program are justified by the benefits, speaking up about it is a great idea.

In that sense, as long as I can fly a Cessna full of gas into the passenger cabin of a airliner that is about to take off, I don't think we need to worry about exactly where people are inside the airport.

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435671)

World Series would be better. Is anyone checking the blimp piloting schools?

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435707)

No need. We have our own blimp piloting school in Pakistan.

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (1)

maxume (22995) | about 8 years ago | (#16435813)

You underestimate the importance of sports, I think. No fly zones with military enforcement would quickly become the norm.

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435497)

When you leave your home, you may be monitored. /.../ That's the game. Play, or stay home.

It is truly terrifying to see how low the american people has fallen and lost all sense of privacy.

You are spoon-fed slogans like the "land of the free" but in reality you live in one of the most oppressive societies in human history where every movement you make is being tracked and registered by the authorities - and amazingly you're proud of it!

Re:The 'hurdle' of people's rights? (1)

maxume (22995) | about 8 years ago | (#16435855)

Commenting from the streets of London are we?</snark>

I honestly don't think that it is oppression. It is ignorance and incompetence. People demand things that make them *feel* safer and forget to worry about whether they *make* them safer, so that's what we get. It can only get as bad as it gets, then it starts to get better.

10m to 20m? (2, Insightful)

rholliday (754515) | about 8 years ago | (#16435207)

If their maximum range is only 20 meters, I would certainly hope they can be accurate to within 1.

You should've seen ver 1.0 (1)

Lactoso (853587) | about 8 years ago | (#16435871)

"If their maximum range is only 20 meters, I would certainly hope they can be accurate to within 1."
The first version's range was 20 meters as well, but the accuracy was only 19 meters. So on the display you just saw a big red circle that would oscillate slightly and occasionally disappear...

Easy fix... (1)

Ryz0r (849412) | about 8 years ago | (#16435211)

Time for the hungarians to wear their Tinfoil scarves!

High Powered RFID tags? (2, Interesting)

Professor_UNIX (867045) | about 8 years ago | (#16435215)

I thought RFID tags were passive devices. How do you make a "high powered" passive device? I guess you can increase the power of the scanners, but the tags themselves are the same no?

Re:High Powered RFID tags? (1)

FudRucker (866063) | about 8 years ago | (#16435249)

bigger antenna? more sensitive transponders?

Re:High Powered RFID tags? (3, Insightful)

autOmato (446950) | about 8 years ago | (#16435311)

There are active RFID devices, that have their own power supply.

See: []

Re:High Powered RFID tags? (1)

Martix (722774) | about 8 years ago | (#16435449)

Micro wave ovens for power cook your passangers

Before everyone starts jumping the gun (2, Insightful)

A beautiful mind (821714) | about 8 years ago | (#16435219)

We're talking about a small airport! Possibly a few dozen people at best on a busy day. As a hungarian I'd preferred to have a better story posted about Hungary, but heh. Domestic flight is really small, given that the country isn't so large either. It is misleading to say that this airport is a major one, I don't think it is a terrorist target at all.

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (1)

i_should_be_working (720372) | about 8 years ago | (#16435293)

And then it will be a larger airport, then all airports, then other 'high-security' areas. And at each point people will say "well, it's only a little different than before", and take each incremental assault on our liberty until we're all wearing dog collars everywhere, all the time.

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (1)

A beautiful mind (821714) | about 8 years ago | (#16435315)

Yeah ok. Please make the mistake of equating someone's stupid research project which is most likely totally unviable in a normal airport with totalitarian control.

Look, I'm privacy conscious as the next slashdotter, but this is just simply not an issue here. Who would trust a security system whose creator doesn't even know that dirty bombs doesn't exist in reality.

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (2, Interesting)

MrNaz (730548) | about 8 years ago | (#16435409)

If you told a frequent flier 20 years ago about today's security procedures he would tell you that it was unlivable. Governmnets have realized that to seize control of society, you do it so slowly that nobody notices. You, my friend, don't seem to be noticing.

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (1)

A beautiful mind (821714) | about 8 years ago | (#16435443)

Because I'm not flying. Although I do travel a lot - by train. My country isn't a constant state of paranoia, like the USA seems to be...

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (1)

Lemmy Caution (8378) | about 8 years ago | (#16435821)

Having recently travelled to Hungary, I have to agree with you. The US and the UK take the prize for the most intrusive police behavior, so far, in my experience of travelling and working in over 20 countries.

Re:Before everyone starts jumping the gun (1)

Fouquet (753286) | about 8 years ago | (#16435753)

If this airport only serves a few dozen people each day, how can they possibly have passenger flow problems?

Until I read your post, I envisioned someone watching a computer screen with thousands of little dots overlaid on a floorplan of the airport, and saying something like: "Congestion at security line 6, open 2 more lines", or something like that.

If there are only a few dozen people using the airport, I don't see how anyone can interperet this as anything except 'big-(Hungarian)-brother'

Sheeple gave up their liberties long ago (2, Insightful)

Gothmolly (148874) | about 8 years ago | (#16435227)

People began screaming "Make us feel safer!" to the gubmint and airlines shortly after 9/11. The vast majority of people I know will welcome this, they'll sit there smugly thinking they're safe, indeed, they'll be safe in their cattle car all the way to the Final Destination.


Story sumbitted two days ago (2)

joe545 (871599) | about 8 years ago | (#16435229)

I submitted this same story two days ago and it was rejected. What has changed in the intervening two days to make the story publishable?

Re:Story sumbitted two days ago (5, Funny)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | about 8 years ago | (#16435307)

What makes you think anything needed to change in order for the story to be accepted from another submitter? You're not assuming the process is anything like rational or unbiased, are you?

Re:Story sumbitted two days ago (1)

Paradise Pete (33184) | about 8 years ago | (#16435429)

I submitted this same story two days ago and it was rejected. What has changed in the intervening two days to make the story publishable?

I of course didn't see your submission, but you probably failed to employ the powerful one-two punch of first verbifing the noun "trial," and then cleverly following that up with the use a double-l when doing so. Slashdot has standards, you know.

Note to self: Is it foolish to complain about the spelling of made-up words?

Re:Story sumbitted two days ago (1)

dangitman (862676) | about 8 years ago | (#16435713)

Note to self: Is it foolish to complain about the spelling of made-up words?

Not at all. It's a perfectly cromulent grievance.

I don't mind (1)

rannala (876724) | about 8 years ago | (#16435237)

My scarf is made of tinfoil!

How does this improve security? (2, Insightful)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | about 8 years ago | (#16435239)

What I don't get is how this system is supposed to improve security. I mean, this whole scare is about suicide bombers, right? So you tag everybody, and then they magically aren't going to be doing their thing? I don't see how these tags prevent people from blowing themselves up, taking a gun and shooting people, smuggling packages on planes, etc.

Worse, this system is actually going to make matters worse: it costs money, people need to be watching the system, and people need to investigate whateven "suspicious behavior" occurs. All this takes resources away from more effective measures.

At least, that's how I see it. Maybe I'm missing something. Maybe this system is dumb. Or maybe it actually rather cleverly serves a purpose _other_ than security (e.g. putting money in the pockets of the designers).

Re:How does this improve security? (1)

db32 (862117) | about 8 years ago | (#16435505)

You are confused. It doesn't make things worse because "it costs money" it makes things better because "it makes money" You are only viewing it from the end of the people getting screwed. Try again, except this time put yourself in the place of the defense contractors and security companies making money off of paranoid governments. This is PERFECT! Can you imagine the cost of a system capable of doing this? This is a big ticket project. Look in the US when 9/11 happened, guess who was the loudest voices for why we need a national ID card system...Oracle was one of em :) The big database folks, the folks that would stand to make a FORTUNE on it...

To be perfectly honest I'm not entirely sure how much of this is driven by paranoid governments wanting to watch their people, so much as greedy politicians knowing they can partner up with these folks and make huge ammounts of cash playing on the fear of terrorism. The being able to watch everyone is kind of a bonus, the cash is the real motivation.

Terrorists rare, tourists common. (4, Insightful)

geoff lane (93738) | about 8 years ago | (#16435273)

Exactly how does this increase security? Terrorists are very rare. Tourists are both very common and very stupid. The only result will be security running around fishing tags out of toilets and vending machines.

Re:Terrorists rare, tourists common. (1)

nospam007 (722110) | about 8 years ago | (#16435727)

Exactly how does this increase security? Terrorists are very rare. ...
Well, when the next guy blows a plane up with the explosives he put up his ass, they can show every move he made on the airport _before_ he boarded.
Not like the shady photos last time, this makes much better TV afterwards. People will feel so relieved.

Key phrase "2m of European funding" (1)

2phar (137027) | about 8 years ago | (#16435289)

Minor details like feasibility and civil rights don't really come into it. It's about who can come up with neat sounding proposals in order to get the penpushers to give you a hand-out from things like the 14bn 6th Framework [] fund. But don't hold your breath if you're expecting a real-world working system anytime soon.

Running late??? (1)

xenoxaos (731206) | about 8 years ago | (#16435295)

But will they hold your plane at the gate if the computer sees that you're hauling ass to get to the terminal on time? I personally would be wearing a hoodie made out of aluminum foil, but that may just be my paranoia kicking in.

Re:Running late??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435743)

No, I think they'll have security jump you for "suspicious behavior".

Evaluation (2, Funny)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | about 8 years ago | (#16435297)

After the study has been completed:

We proudly present the results of the evaluation of the ultra airport security system. During the evaluation, no acts of terrorism were committed in this airport. Clearly, the system is a great success and well worth the investment. We recommend the system to be kept in place and be installed in other airports and public places, as well.

Up Next... (1)

Herkum01 (592704) | about 8 years ago | (#16435325)

Due to a financial crunch, airlines will sell licenses to hunt their passengers for tagging. The hunting grounds will be limited to the airport terminal and parking lot. Weapons will be limited to non-lethal so they will not be considered "inhumane". Allowed weapons include:
  • paintball guns
  • bb-guns
  • tasers
  • baseball bats
  • pointy sticks
  • nightsticks
  • .22 caliber pistols
  • and very dull knives

Just make it the boarding pass already, sheesh .. (1)

torpor (458) | about 8 years ago | (#16435341)

I won't mind your property being tracked, any way you want to, while its in my posession, as long as it gets me on the plane and outta your hokey country .. so an RFIDPass would work, in my opinion.

Mature Passengers Please Note: (1)

CheeseburgerBrown (553703) | about 8 years ago | (#16435351)

When your tag begins to flash it means your LastDay has come, and it's off to the SleepShop with you.

Alternative RFID (1)

Tandoori Haggis (662404) | about 8 years ago | (#16435387)

How about tags that cannot be so easily swapped? RFID tags could be placed on the passengers forehead with glue that can only be removed after 12 hours or maybe with a glue disolving, tag removing gun.

Or how about RFID clothing. Passengers normally wear clothes, which, lets face it, could be composed of explosive or accelerant fibres, or stuff that decomposes in to toxic gas after 3 hours. So, build a load of changing rooms at each airport and exchange the passengers clothes for a type approved travel suit, with enhanced safety features, like a built in smoke hood, reflective patches and of course, RFID tags to help rescue them in an emergency.

The passengers own clothes would be scanned for dangerous substances, drugs, etc before sealing in fire retardant bags for stowage on the flight.

If the passenger looks like they could be dangerous, like they might overpower someone with their hands, they could be tranquilised prior to flight.

Thinking laterally, why not combine some of these ideas?

Anethetise passengers, strip them down, scan them, pack them in fire retardant survival packs, then load them on to a cargo plane. Problem solved.

Re:Alternative RFID (1)

stevey (64018) | about 8 years ago | (#16435675)

Anethetise passengers, strip them down, scan them, pack them in fire retardant survival packs, then load them on to a cargo plane. Problem solved.

Just like the transportation we see in the commercial "airliner" in The Fifth Element [] ?

I actually thought that was very cool. Get onboard, go to sleep, and wake up when you've arrived.

Sitting idle on an 11 hour flight must be one of the dullest times I've ever spent in my life. Especially if we keep having more and more restrictions placed on us. The temporary "no food", and "no books" restrictions earlier this year made me pleased I'll not have to fly anywhere distant soon.

Re:Alternative RFID (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435715)

After 3 hours on a plane, I decompose into toxic gas, you insensitive clod.

Re:Alternative RFID (1)

rHBa (976986) | about 8 years ago | (#16435803)

This would solve the problem of passengers whose necks are thicker than their head (wrestlers, body builders, AOL customers etc). As all of the above could be considered a danger to humanity they would be safely unconcious in the back of the plane.

I am reminded of the insults... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435447)

...all the privacy advocates (including myself) got some years ago when this RFID tracking chip started taking off. I know I was accused of being a "luddite" and being "against technology" because I warned that this tech would eventually be used to tag and track humans (it will be eventually, with a permanent mandated-by-law microchip implant or multiple implants, it's coming and you know it). We were told "RFID is only good for a range of an inch or something, it isn't even possible to track humans n00b, that's a conspiracy theory" and similar pro big brother astroturfing like that.

Anyway, here ya go, up to tens of meters now and that is only what they admit to in public, just more evidence to show that you really need to pay attention to the privacy people when they give you something to look at and issue a warning. And stop with the knee jerk automatic defense of anything new just because it is new, that's just *stupid*. You need to do a cost/benefit/risk analysis. This tech was just so obviously risky. And you are going to eat it raw because you embraced it early on instead of fighting against it. You put in place nothing to counter any bad use of the tech, nothing at all.

    Just because tech is new and shiny doesn't mean it is long range good for humanity. RFID might be good for business, but if you haven't noticed, governments and large corporations (the same thing anymore, corporofascism=globalism) are existing with the notion that you are their complete business property to do with as they please. Data mining? It's their data, not yours, even if it came from your actions, because they own you, because you don't care. Do you get it yet? How do you like being cattle?

    Want another warning or two? Even if you don't here they are. Nanoparticles in the environment, and especially chimeric biological research. The latter will cause hell on earth. There are no safeguards at all of any practicality in existence for this technology. It will be..a problem eventually. And you'll wonder why humans were so short sighted.

Technology evolution has to match social evolution or it gets used maliciously and humanity suffers. Learn from history or repeat, those are your only options.

In other news, Sales of Lead Lined Bags Soar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435463)

I wonder what effect the sort of bags designed to keep film (remember that?) from being damaged by X-rays will have on these devices?

And will magnets become banned devices from hand luggage?

I made a personal decision some time ago regarding RFID tags. I will destroy and/or neutralise any that I find in anything I buy. I used to but no longer shop at ASDA(walmart in the UK) as they seem to be in the forefront of this technology.
Other people can make their own decisions about the use of this technology as I have made mine.

Buy with Cash and foil the data gatherers!

Makes it easier for the terrorist (1)

rollingcalf (605357) | about 8 years ago | (#16435467)

The tag provides a convenient decoy mechanism for the terrorists. Drop/hide the tag somewhere or give it to somebody else, and the authorities tracking the RFIDs will think they're in one particular place when they're really somewhere else.

Dogs (1)

joaommp (685612) | about 8 years ago | (#16435499)

I've heard about being treated like a dog at airports, now they'll just make it official, collar and all.

Civil liberties down the drain (1)

Raisey-raison (850922) | about 8 years ago | (#16435541)

Seriously is there no civil liberty that we are allowed to keep. I know DC and Chicago want CCTV on all their streets and many other cities are following. The feds want to be able to phone tap at will. Trial by jury is sinking away. Defendants rights are also going south. We will never get these rights back. Once gone nobody will return them..... I fume every time I hear another one of these stories. There also seems to be another sinister subtext: That the constitution is just a bit of paper. And no longer will it really provide de fefacto protections.....

my dog has a tag (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435551)

my dog carries an identification chip

i'm his owner, and every computer can tell you that

love is the answer
control is bad for you~

oh those pesky little details... (4, Insightful)

v1 (525388) | about 8 years ago | (#16435683)

the article vaguely and briefly states that 'The issue of infringement of civil liberties will also be key,' but doesn't bother to go into any pesky details."

That's because the people setting all this up consider "civil liberties" to be one of those "pesky details".

Civil Liberties is not a set of rules that inconvenience you, that you should work to find ways around. If you are trying to find ways around laws designed to protect the public from abuse, you are not assulting the law, you are assulting the principles and ideals that the law was made for, and endangering those people whom those laws are designed to protect.

Hmmm.... (1)

oofoe (709282) | about 8 years ago | (#16435777)

Perhaps they should rig the tags so they explode if the wearer tries to remove them.

Re:Hmmm.... (1)

$0.02 (618911) | about 8 years ago | (#16435867)

Then all the terrorist needs to do is to try to remove them in the middle of the flight.

The tag isn't so bad... (1)

Sloppy (14984) | about 8 years ago | (#16435841)

What I really hate is how they always have to shoot you with a tranquilizer dart, first.

The good news is that this will allow us to learn about the migratory patterns of airline passengers, so maybe we can get ahead of them and into position to photograph their mating rituals.

I wonder.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 years ago | (#16435869)

..if they will just put the rfid tag in the Boarding pass,
which you are more likely to carry around with you at an
airport after you have checked in. A boarding pass is not
something you would flush down the toilet, as you need it
anyway to get on a plane.

BS meter spiked (1)

Fishbulb (32296) | about 8 years ago | (#16435887)

Security is an illusion created by those who would pilfer your wallet.
You are not safe, and no one can make you safe. Once you accept that you attain a level of freedom you never knew existed.

What about this? (1)

kernelistic (160323) | about 8 years ago | (#16435935)

If they are so concerned about passengers exchanging or placing collars in the trash in the sterile area, why don't they just embed the RFID tag in the boarding pass itself? The paper has the person's name on it, and you surely wouldn't want to trade that with a stranger, would you? After all, you can't get on your flight without it!

Slaves wear collars. Kneel for yours, bitch. (1)

gd23ka (324741) | about 8 years ago | (#16435937)

It's not that they would hide it somewhere in the plane tickets or give people an
'Airport Access Card' or something. No, this is something that goes around the neck
like a noose or a slave collars - which is what it is.

I guess by now a dozen people have already screamed possibly ALL-CAPS into the discussion with fury over
this, but this is really just the beginning. They were talking about implanting you
with an RFID chip at the hospital in order for you to get further treatment ("oh and
of course better treatment that would purportedly not be possible without being able to
swipe a scanner over you to get your ID). Now it's airports and oh it already has
happened in US school (nurseries of the future obedient serfs of America) many times over.

I'm not kidding you, flamebaiting, trolling, you, godwinning you or whatever else you
might think for you who this is hard to swallow. For me it's being forced to wear something
around my neck that can make them track and monitor even the slightest twitch I make
what is too hard to swallow.
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