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Fedora Core 6 Released

Zonk posted more than 7 years ago | from the i've-got-a-new-hat dept.

230

Shadowman writes "Fedora Core 6 has been released. Recommended download method is via BitTorrent. For more information, see the release notes or the Fedora homepage. Slashdot interviewed the Fedora Project Leader back in August."

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Honestly (5, Funny)

suso (153703) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561292)

I literally just installed FC5 on a machine this morning.

Yes, but... (1)

YA_Python_dev (885173) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561376)

Does FC6 include Firefox 2?

Re:Yes, but... (1)

havardw (180104) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561636)

No

Fedora 6 patches to KDE are buggy, unpolished (5, Interesting)

billybob2 (755512) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562064)

The modified version of KDE that ships in Fedora 6 is really buggy and unpolished. There's been talk for two years about placing KDE in Fedora Extras [fedoraproject.org] so that it will be better supported by the dedicated KDE community, but Redhat seems to keep refusing the help and treating KDE apps as second-class citizens.

Some of the Fedora 6 changes (like taking away MP3 playing capability from KDE music players) are justified on a legal basis, but other changes (like using a 4-year old window decoration and widget styles) are at best the result of ineptitude or at worst a deliberate attempt to make KDE look bad and outdated.

Not flamebait (1)

Shawn is an Asshole (845769) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562544)

Really, have any of you actually used Fedora's KDE? The parent is correct, at least for releases up to FC5 (haven't tried FC6).

Re:Not flamebait (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562956)

It wasn't flamebait, just paranoia. FC uses the same default theme style for both GNOME and KDE (called "Bluecurve" in FC5, at least). Don't like the default? Pick another.

The missing default support for formats (such as MPEG-1 Audio Layer 3) that rest on shaky FOSS distribution grounds has nothing to do with Fedora's KDE. Of course it's exluded from the GNOME apps too, and it's as easily fixed with KDE as it is with GNOME. Add your favourite 3rd party RPM repositories and use yum.

There is no anti-KDE conspiracy.

Re:Not flamebait (1)

Metaphorically (841874) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563030)

I used KDE on FC4 for a while. I found it okay, but I hadn't touched KDE in years. Now I use KDE on opensuse 10.1 and it does seem better configured.

Re:Fedora 6 patches to KDE are buggy, unpolished (2, Insightful)

friedmud (512466) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563172)

Completely agree.

Fedora is definitely the worst offender when it comes to KDE support. Instead of their crappy old "blue curve" theme and replacing all the KDE default apps with crappy gnome ones (File Roller anyone?) it would be much preferable for them to just leave KDE alone... just let the defaults fall where they may as they come from the KDE gods.

I use Gentoo on my desktop... so I _know_ how good KDE can be when not messed with. I use FC5 (and 6 as soon as possible) on my laptop (I like the network manager and all the suspend/hibernate/resume stuff worked immediately... all of that is sometimes non-trivial with Gentoo) and in the research lab I help run at school... and the differences between FC5 and Gentoo are huge. At school I actually have setup a whole system tree where I put hand compiled versions of lots of KDE and related software that is either outdated or broken in FC5. I also spent a good deal of time undoing the Redhat intrusion of Gnome into KDE (and of course replacing the horrible theme stuff).

But... Redhat has always been about Gnome... so we shouldn't expect much. In the end, if you're a KDE person FC5 (and it sounds like FC6) probably aren't for you. For now, I put up with it because it is doing what I need in specific cases... even if it takes a while to massage it.

Friedmud

Re:Yes, but... (1)

spevack (210449) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561956)

No. The final tree for FC6 went Gold before the Firefox 2 release. I'm sure that you'll see it in rawhide before long, though.

Re:Yes, but... (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562580)

Considering that they were both released today, I highly doubt it. They wouldn't have any time to test it. This is one of my biggest problems with Linux. They release a new version of the distro, and then a major very important piece of software comes out shortly after the distro release. Which means that unless you want to get your software from outside the distro's repository, then you are stuck with the older version. Case in point, if you wanted OO.o 2, on Mandrake up until version 7 came out a little while ago, you had to download it from oo.o (the website), you couldn't just install it using URPMI and the regular sources. They could have released OO.o on urpmi, but most distros shy away from major version changes.

Re:Yes, but... (3, Funny)

cloudmaster (10662) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562680)

Yeah, Linux should be more like Windows. The OS comes with *no* useful software, and it's up to the software vendor to test the software on every possible install platform. I'm sure that wouldn't delay software releases for longer than the time period already present between most distro revisions.</sarcasm>

Re:Yes, but... (1)

chris_mahan (256577) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562974)

Oh shit this made me laugh... *no* useful software... Does that include the OS itself? eh?

Re:Yes, but... (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563056)

I'm not saying the windows model is any better, what I am saying is that I wish distro providers would put software like this into their current release when it happens. I really hope that Mandriva puts firefox 2.0 into 2007, although i'm not sure how it matters with auto-updates. I also don't know how firefox gets updated from my user account when /usr, where it is located isn't writable by my user account. Anyway, I like the way Linux handles everything, I just with the distro maintainers weren't so against upgrading major versions.

Re:Yes, but... (1)

nath_de (535933) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562724)

Well, Fedora does this from time to time. I'm pretty sure that there will soon be an update for FC6 bringing Firefox 2.0 to the system. Perhaps that will even come for FC5.

Re:Honestly (1)

SoapDish (971052) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561484)

Same thing happened to me when I installed FC5 came out. I had just burnt the FC4 discs.

Re:Honestly (1)

BunnyClaws (753889) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561714)

Same thing happened to me when I upgraded to FC4. Not that it really matters what is the real motivating factor to switch to FC6?
Not much really.

Re:Honestly (1)

friedmud (512466) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563258)

Two Words:

Jiggly Windows

(FC6 comes with AIGLX)

Friedmud

Re:Honestly (1)

gormanly (134067) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562214)

To avoid this, check out the schedule [fedoraproject.org] - though of course this should be easier to find from the Fedora site's front page...

Re:Honestly (1)

mikael (484) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562426)

Been there - done that!

It would be better if this link was at the download sites for Fedora Core.

It's a bit like finding out that the bus/train schedules have been cancelled only when you are trying to get home in the evening, because the company only put the notices on one side of the station doors.

Re:Honestly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561554)

I just downloaded Fedora 5 yesterday, and planned to install it tonight.

Re:Honestly (4, Funny)

jazman_777 (44742) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561922)

I literally just installed FC5 on a machine this morning.


Another excellent reason to use Debian. You'll never fall behind.

Re:Honestly (1)

ehrichweiss (706417) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562104)

Please tell me how you'll "never fall behind with Debian".
Do they have some magical way of updating a burnt CD/DVD that we are all unaware of? If not, then there's likely no difference from what you are talking about and simply updating your system via "yum" or the like.

Re:Honestly (5, Funny)

Orange Crush (934731) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562392)

Whoosh!

Re:Honestly (1)

Shawn is an Asshole (845769) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562712)

Well, Ubuntu at least makes update releases. For example, 6.06.1 had all current updates applied. It would be nice if Fedora made something similar available to new users. After a few months into a release, a 'yum update' takes a long time on a new install.

Re:Honestly (2, Informative)

nath_de (535933) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563050)

Use Fedora Unity [fedoraunity.org] for respins including all updates.

Re:Honestly (1)

sago007 (857444) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562640)

Another excellent reason to use Debian. You'll never fall behind.

In my expeperience you will fall behind even if you have the newest version of Debian STABLE

Re:Honestly (3, Funny)

ryanov (193048) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563278)

Whoosh again.

Re:Honestly (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563356)

Another excellent reason to use Debian. You'll never fall behind.
In my expeperience you will fall behind even if you have the newest version of Debian STABLE

In my experience, he who laughs last didn't get the joke.

Re:Honestly (1)

caseih (160668) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563144)

Change your yum sources and do a yum update. Of course you will need to wait a bit for yum mirrors to catch up likely.

Multimedia support (5, Informative)

Nighttime (231023) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561362)

As someone always comments on Fedora's (and by proxy, Red Hat's) multimedia support, here it is from the horse's mouth:

15.3. MP3, DVD, and Other Excluded Multimedia Formats
Fedora Core and Fedora Extras software repositories cannot include support for MP3 or DVD video playback or recording. The MP3 formats are patented, and the patent holders have not provided the necessary patent licenses. DVD video formats are patented and equipped with an encryption scheme. The patent holders have not provided the necessary patent licenses, and the code needed to decrypt CSS-encrypted discs may violate the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, a copyright law of the United States. Fedora also excludes other multimedia software due to patent, copyright or license restrictions, including Adobe's Flash Player and and Real Media's Real Player. For more on this subject, please refer to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems [fedoraproject.org] .

While other MP3 options may be available for Fedora, Fluendo now offers a free MP3 plugin for GStreamer that has the necessary patent license for end users. This plugin enables MP3 support in applications that use the GStreamer framework as a backend. Fedora does not include this plugin since we prefer to support and encourage the use of patent unrestricted open formats instead. For more information about the MP3 plugin, visit Fluendo's website at http://www.fluendo.com/ [fluendo.com] .

Re:Multimedia support (1)

kjetiln (729530) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561682)

Yes.

I know this is irritating. But most users of fedora install third-party mp3, dvd and such software. This is explained in the unofficial Fedora FAQ.

http://www.fedorafaq.org/ [fedorafaq.org]

Bah - that's what Livna is for :) (3, Informative)

Penguinisto (415985) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561768)

No, seriously: Livna works just fine for me (And I think DAG should cover it as well; can;t remember the URL offhand, though). Both Livna and DAG have yum repos that will grant all the necessary tidbits needed to complete the install (including NTFS support for weirdoes like me who have to plug in HDD's formatted in that recover others' data on occasion...).

/P

URL's for alternate repos: (3, Informative)

Penguinisto (415985) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561834)

Livna [livna.org]

Dag [wieers.com]

Cheers! /P

Re:Bah - that's what Livna is for :) (5, Informative)

the COW OF DOOM (tm) (1531) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561882)

Not only that, but in FC6 you can enable Livna right in the installer. So your system will have MP3/DVD/etc. support right at first boot.

Just point it at http://rpm.livna.org/fedora/6/[arch] and those packages will magically appear as install options. Yay!

(link: http://rpm.livna.org/fedora/6/ [livna.org] )

Re:Bah - that's what Livna is for :) (2, Interesting)

spevack (210449) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562300)

Having suport inside of anaconda (the installer) for third party package repositories (like Fedora Extras) is one of the new features that I am most excited about.

Obviously the general case of that feature is that you can specify your own URL for external repositories -- be they livna, dag, or your own custom repo.

Livna Respin (1)

GodWasAnAlien (206300) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562092)

yes, one only needs to install the livna-release rpm in order to have yum set up to get the missing packages.

But it would be a good idea for someone to offer Fedora+Livna respin DVD/CD's, that have all the missing packages on the disc.

Re:Multimedia support (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562116)

"Fedora does not include this plugin since we prefer to support and encourage the use of patent unrestricted open formats instead.

Then I prefer another distro.

Re:Multimedia support (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562504)

"Then I prefer another distro"

That's absolutly up to you, Mr Troll.

Re:Multimedia support (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562648)

Which is why I use Mandriva which can play DVDs and MP3s out of the box. What are the legal implications of Mandriva putting in this functionality? Could they be shut down?

They mean gratis, not necessarily freedom. (2, Insightful)

jbn-o (555068) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562746)

Fluendo now offers a free MP3 plugin for GStreamer that has the necessary patent license for end users.

They mean gratis, not that this plugin necessarily gives you the freedoms of free software (for those of you who live in countries saddled with software patents). You could install and run this plugin but doing so would be installing non-free software on your machine. For the rest of you, the Fluendo GStreamer MP3 plugin is free software, licensed under the MIT X11 license. Richard Stallman, founder of the free software movement, talked about this during the first GPLv3 conference [archive.org] when discussing what was then known as the "Liberty or Death" clause of the upcoming GPL. The GPL strives to not only create software freedom (the freedom to share and modify computer programs) but defend it in the face of new threats like software patents (patents on algorithms used in computer software):

The need for this provision was underlined by a recent article talking about a GStreamer plugin which includes source code distributed under an X11 license, or so it says. But then when you read further you see, in fact, that that's not the whole of the license; there's a patent license involved also, and that, in fact, it's not free software at all! And this was presented as a way of making things better for our community. So you believe that a non-free program can make things better for people, that it's a step forward, as the author of the article I read did, then you might think what they did was great. But if your goal is to make sure--is to defend user's freedom, to establish a community of freedom, to spread the idea that freedom is important, than you cannot accept the idea that such a thing is a positive step. It's a surrender, not an amelioration. And so the "Liberty or Death" article of the GPL is just as important as it ever was.

I discussed this some more at the time on my blog [digitalcitizen.info] .

Are you Sure??? (1)

Artie_Effim (700781) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561368)

I mean, did you check with the site, try a torrent link out. You're gonna get a nastygram from the FC team if you didn't.

Yes, they're sure. (4, Informative)

Kelson (129150) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561672)

Torrents are up. The Fedora websites seem to be down (fedora.redhat.com) and overloaded (fedoraproject.org), but if you can get the latter to load, it does announce "Download Fedora Core 6"

Through the magic of Bittorrent I'm downloading the official release faster than their server can manage right now.

Re:Yes, they're sure. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561910)

go to http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/ [fedoraproject.org]

that should have the torrents and should not be impacted by the issues on fedoraproject.org or redhat.com

thanks,
-sv

Re:Yes, they're sure. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562308)

Shame one can't use bittorrent from an unmodified Red Hat Enterprise desktop to download Fedora Core. It'd save a lot of bandwidth for redhat.com ...

But does it come with... (2, Funny)

croddy (659025) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561404)

But does it come with GNU Iceweasel? [gnu.org]

Re:But does it come with... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562804)

Is there an Iceweasel 2.0 RC3 somewhere?

lolo fr1st (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561416)

fr1st ps0t nigz

Damn, if only they'd waited a little longer (1)

davidwr (791652) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561438)

Just. One. More. Day.

Damn, now I'll have to install Firefox 2 myself :(.

Oh, PS, the release-notes page is down for maintenance:

"Fedora Infrastructure Logo
Down for Maintenance
Fedora Project Infrastructure is currently unavailable. We apologize for any inconvenience this outage may cause. Thank you for supporting Fedora Project.
Fedora Infrastructre Team
For status updates and information on what systems are affected please visit fedora wiki

Fedora is a trademark of Red Hat, Inc.
The Fedora Project is maintained and driven by the community and sponsored by Red Hat, Inc.

Legal | Trademark Guidelines"

Re:Damn, if only they'd waited a little longer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561584)

... and this is what it said before the story went live:
Fedora Infrastructure Logo Down for Maintenance Fedora Project Infrastructure is currently unavailable for scheduled maintenance. The servers will be back online by no later than 05:00PM MST (UTC-6) on Wednesday, August 30th, 2006. We apologize for any inconvenience this outage may cause. Thank you for supporting Fedora Project. Fedora Infrastructre Team For status updates and information on what systems are affected please visit fedora wiki Fedora is a trademark of Red Hat, Inc. The Fedora Project is maintained and driven by the community and sponsored by Red Hat, Inc. Legal | Trademark Guidelines

Fedora Core.... (-1, Flamebait)

gerrysteele (927030) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561500)

most boring linux yet. I didnt even know it was still going.

Somebody posts Torrents - (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561518)

Means many people are interested. Chinese proverb.

Seriously, people aren't using red-hat any more.

Whatever (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561560)

I was a Red Hat and Fedora user until FC5 pissed me off for the last time. I really don't care at all about FC6. Wake me up when Ubuntu 6.10 is released.

Re:Whatever (0, Flamebait)

eno2001 (527078) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562482)

Ubuntu is for pussies. Gentoo is where it's at beyotches!!!! And before the troglodyte hordes of BSD users get on my case, read my lips: BSD is DEAD.

Re:Whatever (1)

racebit (959234) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562768)

Lemme straighten some things for you.

Ubuntu is for working techs and n00bs who need a quick linux install that. just. works. period. It also has the most support and a very quick apt-get with extensive repositories, making installs a breeze.

I have never had any great experiences on gentoo that come close to my ubuntu flexibility.

And BSD is not dead, its called Apple OSX.

Mandatory Zod quote (3, Funny)

Fry-kun (619632) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561620)

Come to me, son of Jor-El! KNEEL before ZOD!!

Okay, I got it out of my system now...

ZOD!!!!!

Re:Mandatory Zod quote (4, Funny)

Kelson (129150) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561758)

You should see the announcement they posted to the mailing list:

This is the announcement of Zod. Zod permits you to call him "Fedora Core 6".

Tremble, Earthlings, for Zod is released from the confines of testing. Zod intends to hammer the servers of the world ... starting TODAY! For those who chose the world-domination-acceptance package in your last installation, you need do nothing -- Zod is beaming itself to your computers already. If your keyboard begins to get hot, back away ... very ... slowly ...

For the rest of you minions who failed to do Zod's bidding previously, this is your ONE AND ONLY CHANCE to redeem yourself. Go quickly! Download the torrent NOW. Obtain the ISO immediately. Zod's minions know to back up their /home directory and to begin immediate installation of the GREATEST version of Fedora Core EVER.

When you are done genuflecting, listen carefully. Zod now delivers an important message to Zod's predecessor, the Fifth Iteration of Fedora Core, known to some as Bordeaux:

"KNEEL BEFORE ZOD, for Zod has many improvements that convince users to upgrade and abandon you! Ph34r me! Mwahahahaha."

Zod accepts that the Fedora Project continues to provide software and security updates for Bordeaux, as per the policy of Zod's minions. Zod chooses to permit this action to continue.

It goes on to link to release notes and such, then adds this note:

Massive downloading of Zod is known to melt servers worldwide, so Zod commands all who are able to use bittorrent.

Re:Mandatory Zod quote (2, Interesting)

Speare (84249) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562574)

It's interesting that they chose to call this release "Zod." The traditional Red Hat maintainer of XFree86/Xorg, Mike Harris, for a long time went by the alternate nickname of "zod" on IRC support channels and the like. He left Red Hat a little while ago, and now this release bears this name. I have no idea if there was any intentional connection.

ObTrivia: In case you missed the other fifty explanations, General Zod is the leader of the Krypton villains in Superman II.

In Other FC News... (1)

nojjynb (1003593) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561690)

Fedora Core 7 alpha 1 was also released today, a trend which we will keep up through FC 1000

Re:In Other FC News... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561836)

what i thought fc7 was already rolled and ready for dist in books... whats this fc6 non-sense...

http://www.amazon.com/Fedora-Core-Red-Enterprise-L inux/dp/0071486429 [amazon.com]

(yes, I realize its pre-order, but still impressive)

Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (5, Informative)

SlashdotOgre (739181) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561816)

Here's a mirror of the release notes: ftp://limestone.uoregon.edu/fedora/6/i386/os/RELEA SE-NOTES-en_US.html [uoregon.edu]

Things I'm finding interesting are:

Section 9 (Desktop Effects) Looks like its just AIGLX, not Xgl (in fact there's no mention of Xgl).

Section 17 (Virtualization) FC6 uses Xen 3.0.2, I know Xen was in FC5 but I haven't had a chance to play with it. The release notes mention something about it being connected with the installer, so perhaps I'll get a chance.

Section 22 (Package Changes) Interesting removals IMHO are: mozilla, xscreensaver, gkrellm. I'm sure all can be found in the Fedora Extra's Repo or some place similar. I'm not a big fan of where some of the desktop apps are going (eg. I hate gnome-screensaver), but the beauty of Linux is it's quite simple to solve this problem.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (4, Informative)

TheOrquithVagrant (582340) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562112)

> Section 9 (Desktop Effects) Looks like its just AIGLX, not Xgl (in fact there's no mention of Xgl).

Fully-implemented AIGLX pretty much makes Xgl obsolete. Compiz runs on top of AIGLX now, and compiz is shipping with Fedora. That means all the "bling" normally associated with "Xgl" is available.

> Section 17 (Virtualization) FC6 uses Xen 3.0.2

Xen 3.0.3 was released on the 17th, in time to get included. The release-schedule slippage had a silver lining.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562538)

Obsolete is the wrong word. XGL is a fine bit of experiment, and it's lessons (and even code) may show up again in AIGLX. AIGLX is just a better choice because it's a bridge to an OpenGL desktop rather than a both-feet-in that cuts off lots of cards.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562720)

AIGLX is just a better choice because it's a bridge to an OpenGL desktop rather than a both-feet-in that cuts off lots of cards.

You must be posting from Soviet Russia, because your metaphor just mixed me (up, that is).

Seriously, a "bridge", "cards", "both feet", WTF?

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (1)

rbochan (827946) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562158)

I couldn't find anything about this in the release notes, but have they yet taken care of my biggest pet peeve with regards to rpm based distros yet? That peeve being: having to install from a static set of packages, then having to update 200-300 megs of packages immediately following - even via a network (internet) based install. I've always hated installing this way, the redundancy is inane, and I can't image having to do it on a dial-up. Spending an hour installing a system, then spending another hour updating that system is maddening. One of my favorite parts of apt based installs is that you can get the updated packages right from the get go.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562218)

"Spending an hour installing a system, then spending another hour updating that system is maddening."

Try Windows.

;)

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (1)

rbochan (827946) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562496)

I did.
It made me switch to Linux.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (1)

tinkerghost (944862) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562834)

When I went from 4 -> 5 I ran the yum update the night before to make sure everything was up-to date (nice but not 100% nescesary) then installed 1 RPM & ran yum upgrade. Worked like a charm at work - was ugly at home following a brownout halfway through the upgrade.
For fresh installs, I suppose you could build a network installer CD based on yum. Not sure if I would want to download & install everything over the net though....
  • live CD ... check
  • mount /dev/hda /mnt
  • mkdir ... check
  • chroot ... check
  • cat package_list.txt | yum install ... check
Yeah you should be able to do it with a bit of prep work to get the list of all the packages you need to build the system.

Re:Release Notes Mirror & Thoughts (1)

nath_de (535933) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563270)

Simply try Fedora Unity [fedoraunity.org] . They provide updated DVD images.

Fails to install (1)

von_rick (944421) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561890)

The installation process failed to access the hard drive! I have no clue what it means, but just so you know, the hard drive has undergone installations of Suse, Ubuntu, and Fedora Core previously. Currently my drive houses a dual boot Windows/Suse and I was planning to overwrite Suse with FC6. However it seems like FC6 chickened out at the very onset so Suse 10.1 stays on my drive.

package for "forbidden items" (1)

freg (859413) | more than 7 years ago | (#16561900)

I'm to lazy to go look for it... Could someone point us the way to an installer that gives us mp3, dvd playback etc all at once. I seem to recall that something like this exists somewhere.

Re:package for "forbidden items" (2, Informative)

eelcoh (775552) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562138)

You could try http://rpm.livna.org/livna-release-6.rpm [livna.org] . That will add livna's rpm repositories to your yum configuration. After that it should be straightforward to install stuff like mplayer or xine (yum install mplayer xine).

Yeah (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562188)

Re:package for "forbidden items" (1)

mozkill (58658) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562296)

yes, you use Ubuntu and then run the script that is called Automatix (there is another called 'Easy Ubuntu' but I have never tried it).

Re:package for "forbidden items" (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562870)

You might want to try This site [mandriva.com] . /Ducks

Did they really fix anything? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16561988)

"pkgname-1.2.345.678 replaces pkgname-1.2.343.678" is *NOT* an informative message to display when doing an update. How about telling us something about pkgname?

I know this is OT, but have the Gnome guys finally figured out that hidden files (.filename) are completely different and distict from "backup files"? They have had how long to get this right? If I inadvertently tar up anymore files with names ending in '~' because I can't see them, I'm moving to KDE.

Dammit, Slashdot, quit fucking with my CSS! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562082)

What is it about certain slashdot stories (such as this one) where they override my userContent.css file? I have link underlines turned off, thank you - please quit turning them on again!

Not to troll, but... (2, Interesting)

MikeRT (947531) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562084)

The vast majority of experiences that I and every other person I have met with Fedora have been profoundly negative on some level. Version 1.0 was nice on my machine, and 2.0 didn't slip far, but 3.0 and especially 4.0 were just total piles of dog shit for everyone I have known. I watched as an entire CS class composed of people who ranged from total newbies to gentoo and debian rabid partisans couldn't get it installed on hardware that RHEL and SuSE 10 had not 1 iota of a problem working with. My girlfriend, who actually has a little bit of experience writing kernel modules, spent two days trying to get Fedora 5 to install on her work machine. Rinse, repeat for every other person I have met who has used Fedora post v 2.0.

When is the Fedora project going to start fixing its bugs instead of just pushing out bleeding edge packages? OpenSuSE has its problems, but it is significantly better than Fedora and Ubuntu makes Fedora look like useless because those teams work hard on bug fixes. Fedora doesn't even do Core 5.0, 5.1, 5.2 then 6.0. It's like very release they just cross their fingers and pray that the bugs will go away.

Hey, I'm just saying that it blows my mind how bad Fedora has been for everyone I know, how much griping I have seen about it online, and yet... things never change. I for one have given up hope for it since being severely burned on version 3.0 (had it kernel panic in the middle of a demo, trying to run Tomcat of all things!) and then having 4.0 refuse to even install on the same hardware that 3.0 worked on.

Re:Not to troll, but... (1)

erikvcl (43470) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562184)

I had exactly the same experience as you had. My frustrations with FC3/FC4 reached fever pitch and I switched over to Slackware and I've never looked back. Slack is the way Linux was meant to be (at least in my opinion).

I installed FC4 some time ago on the computer I use at work and I'm still fighting with it to this day. The Fedora folks need to start fixing bugs and they need to take a serious look at software quality.

Re:Not to troll, but... (1)

everestx (852845) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562436)

I have to add that my experiences with Fedora have been excellent. RedHat9 ---> FC1 was the transition that truly allowed me to migrate completely AWAY from Microsoft. And I have FC2,4,5 and soon FC6 running my digital life. In the cases of MythTV and understanding RHEL through free software, Fedora Core is truly a great and resourceful distro.

Ubuntu is good too. I have used it on many occasions, but the FC user community and availability of troubleshooting docs (via Google searching) is by far much more effective than Ubuntu.

I do agree that the bugs in FC releases have been pretty hefty, but Red Hat ?touts? FC as the bleeding edge. No mistake there. My advice is to run the latest Core versions with caution and give a month or so for things to work themselves out.

Re:Not to troll, but... (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562560)

I have to agree with you. Fedora is a nightmare, especially with SELinux causing kernel panics....and dont even THINK about downloading the FC6 ISO and trying to upgrade. I tried to do that with FC4 to FC5 only to find out after it didnt work that doing an upgrade, "is not recommended".

Fedora is dead as a distro. The absurd patent restrictions that no other distro obeys, and to sum it up Ubuntu, have killed it off. The people who work on it are literally wasting their time, making a distro that competes with Ubuntu, which is the best desktop distro out there.

No one has managed to explain to me why Fedora is even being worked on at all. If all the developers who are working on disparate desktop distros would join together and work on a maximum of three distinctive desktop distros (Gentoo, which is unique, Ubuntu, the people's Linux, and one other) the users would benefit by orders of magnitude. Instead, they bicker like children (see the latest debian debacle) and chip away at their little ghetto distros instead of working for 'the big prize'.

And thats a pity.

btw, there was never a 2.0, 3.0, or 4.0 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562608)

The last version of Redhat-Linux/Fedora with a ".0" was rh 8.0.
Past that, it was rh9,fc1,fc2,fc3,fc4,fc5,fc6.

I would tend to agree, if you don't need bleeding edge, then OpenSuse or Ubuntu would be a better fit.

But there are things that I have needed to be at the bleeding edge, so fedora+livna works for me.

Re:Not to troll, but... (1)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562700)

Funny, I just installed a MythTV backend server using FC5, and it was an absolute dream. It's running on paired SATA using LVM over RAID-1, so it's not your most standard configuration, and it works like a charm. Granted, it's a backend server, so I have no idea how good the X setup stage is, but for my purposes, FC5 was a very good experience.

BTW, for the record, I run Debian on all my other machines, but the Debian packages for Myth are no longer being maintained, so FC5 was my only option.

Re:Not to troll, but... (2, Interesting)

turbidostato (878842) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562892)

"The vast majority of experiences that I and every other person I have met with Fedora have been profoundly negative on some level." /TROLL MODE ON
That only means that you and almost every other person you know is dumb enough not to read documentation about the tools they try to use. /TROLL MODE OFF

"When is the Fedora project going to start fixing its bugs instead of just pushing out bleeding edge packages?"

Plain simple: never.

It is not as if it were a deeply hidden fact; it's even on the fundational papers from RedHat/Fedora. It is known from day O that Fedora's main goal is being Red Hat's testing field for bleeding edge technologies both from the technical and the "social" points of view. From the technical point of view that means its software will be *always* less than polished; from the social one, it only makes sense to open the "build process" as it currently is to gain knowledge about what is well recieved and what, even if hyped, it is not, in order to move RHEL accordingly (once the software is properly polished out of Fedora's suffering).

In sort: Fedora is, and it always has been kindof a "beta" aimed at technoenthusiasts, aficionados and redhat-involved hackers.

"Hey, I'm just saying that it blows my mind how bad Fedora has been for everyone"

It is *NOT* so bad for everything: it is really good for Red Hat Inc. and Red Hat hackers (meaning people that hack/develop on the Red Hat platform not only people that work within Red Hat). But yes, it is quite bad for unknowledgeable people that uses Fedora under false assumptions.

Just exactly the same happens whenever somebody tries to use a hammer as a teaspoon, and you can imagine what the usual name for someone that uses hammers as teaspons is.

Re:Not to troll, but... (1)

SlashSquatch (928150) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563018)

is she hot?

A house built on sand... (1)

petrus4 (213815) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563210)

I'm guessing one of Fedora's single main problems is rpm. I haven't used Fedora myself, but I did use RH 7, 8, and 9...I'll never forget how relieved I was to move to Linux From Scratch.

rpm has a number of features which IMHO should not have been implemented at all (subpackaging being the most egregious in the list, although the macro format would be close) which are used on a routine basis. The specfiles are consistently of a hideous standard from what I have seen as well...they are utterly incomprehensible when there is no sane reason for them to be whatsoever. Don't even get me started about how loose most people usually are with dependency lines in specfiles, either. Then there are the horror stories about mangled databases and trashed installations, etc. In short, it's a completely broken system...I wouldn't touch it with a forty foot pole for use on any computer, production or otherwise.

Re:Not to troll, but... (4, Insightful)

Phisbut (761268) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563344)

When is the Fedora project going to start fixing its bugs instead of just pushing out bleeding edge packages?

The whole point of Fedora is to be bleeding edge, not to be 100% stable. Fedora introduces bleeding edge features, and Red Hat fixes the features, that's how it is, and that's how it is supposed to be. If you can't cope with bleeding edge features that are not guaranteed to be stable, then Fedora is simply not for you.

Ubuntu makes Fedora look like useless because those teams work hard on bug fixes.

Ubuntu aims for usability and stability, Fedora aims for bleeding edge. Different distros, different goals. Use the right tool for your job.

Who cares? (2, Informative)

slashdotmsiriv (922939) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562098)

Ever since I installed Kubuntu i threw a black stone to the dark days of Fedora Core Installations ... Since then i can completely install linux systems on any laptop and PC without writing a single script and without having to compile my own kernel modules.

Re:Who cares? (2, Interesting)

loconet (415875) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562266)

Agreed. I used to be a long time Red Hat user but dropped it as soon as they stopped support for their desktop version. I moved to Suse and then Ubuntu (besides trying dozen of other dists and bsds). Although I had never used Linux as my primary desktop OS (it has however been my primary application server at work and home for years), thanks to Ubuntu's ability to take away the headache of spending countless hours fetching for obscure modules, compiling unsupported libraries, etc, in order to get my hardware or a piece of software working, I am now using Linux as my primary desktop OS and can't say I have much to complain about. Ubuntu just works (most of the time). Is it ready for my mom/dad/MySpace-sister? I don't think so IMO, but it is closer than ever and getting there fast.

Re:Who cares? (2, Interesting)

binner1 (516856) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563062)

I cut my inlaws over to Ubuntu this past (Canadian) Thanksgiving weekend. They're happy so far. I only had to install gtk-gnutella and a few other comfort type apps on top of the default install. I transferred all of their old data from their ntfs disk (left intact in the event that they hated ubuntu) and they're good to go.

I guess I did have to grab the mplayer codec package to satisfy a few of their media dependencies too...

The cutover was eased by the fact that I've had them doing:
a) running with limited user rights in XP [this was the only way I was going to continue providing support]
b) using firefox only
c) using thunderbird for mail
d) running gaim for im

I set their OO.o defaults to use the ms office formats so that they didn't have to futz with file extension changes when sharing docs and presto, chango, a perfect setup for their needs.

The funniest thing I've heard so far was the following from my sister-in-law:
SiL -> Hey Ben, what do I use to scan the music I just downloaded for viruses.
Me -> Don't worry about viruses any more.
SiL -> Interesting!

(The last line is a direct quote.)

-Ben

Damn, get it right... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562274)

ANOTHER release? How many are they going to have?

Maybe they should have programmed it right the first time: then they wouldn't need to come up with ten new releases every week.

nforce acpi (0)

chipace (671930) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562384)

Nvidia is keeping me away from desktop linux... vista can count on my money. Tried Core 6 & ubuntu 6.10, and am ready to write-off linux until I buy a new system 3 years from now.

Re:nforce acpi (1)

Shawn is an Asshole (845769) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563090)

I've maintain many nVidia-based machines (nForce2 and integrated GeForce4) and have not had any problems. Either with FC4, FC5, and Ubuntu. I remember reading about problems with FC5, but the articles made it seem the problem was just with the installer.

Have you tried installing Fedora with the text installer (IIRC, type "text" at the prompt)? Have to tried installing Ubuntu with the text installer (the alternate cd, not the desktop cd)? Have you tried OpenSUSE*?

* Give it a try. It definitely has polish, though the default Gnome in 10.1 is too Windows-ish for my takes, complete with the urine-like color. It's KDE support is excellent. Once you make it's Gnome look and behave like Gnome, it's also excellent.

CentOS? (1)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562618)

Is there any reason to care about Fedora now that we have CentOS?

Also, I spent the day mapping configurations between Debian and RHEL. It was not fun.

Could someone please, pretty please, come up with some kind of XML file to abstract everything commonly found in a linux /etc, then write conversion tools for each OS to move from XML to /etc files?

Then we could have one configuration tool for the XML file, instead of having to use hundreds of tools (system-config-foobar, dselect reconfigure foobar) or learn hundreds of config file parsing languages.

99% of configurations done in /etc/ are simple concepts that should not require looking up some random guy's BNF.

Re:CentOS? (1)

tuffy (10202) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562920)

Is there any reason to care about Fedora now that we have CentOS?

Yes. Many of CentOS's packages are of older versions than Fedora's. Python 2.3 instead of 2.4, GCC 3 instead of GCC 4, a 2.6.9 kernel, etc. If older (and presumably more stable) software is what you're interested in, go for CentOS. But for something a bit more recent, I'll stick with Fedora.

Re:CentOS? (2, Informative)

Limecron (206141) | more than 7 years ago | (#16563028)

> Is there any reason to care about Fedora now that we have CentOS?

Huh? Most desktop Linux users like running the latest and greatest which is clearly not what CentOS is intended to do. That's why Fedora and the Ubuntus exist, for desktop users to have all the latest versions before they're completely tested.

Not to mention that Fedora is essentially the test bed for RedHat, which is what CentOS carbon copys itself from. So essentially, if you use CentOS, you need people to use Fedora to ensure your copy of CentOS is tested properly.

> Also, I spent the day mapping configurations between Debian and RHEL. It was not fun.
> Could someone please, pretty please, come up with some kind of XML file to abstract everything commonly found in a linux /etc, then write conversion tools for each OS to move from XML to /etc files?
> Then we could have one configuration tool for the XML file, instead of having to use hundreds of tools (system-config-foobar, dselect reconfigure foobar) or learn hundreds of config file parsing languages.
> 99% of configurations done in /etc/ are simple concepts that should not require looking up some random guy's BNF.

Good idea. I nominate you.

Re:CentOS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16563120)

XML is a tool of the devil.

Since the user would have this "configuration tool" and the output would be ascii text in various formats, what's the point of the XML intermediary ? If you are a programmer with only a year's experience, it might seem like the first thing to try because you have heard people talking about XML a lot and there are XML libraries available for whatever sucky language you have cleaved to. However, what about XML solves any problem ?

Firefox (1)

ehaggis (879721) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562690)

Is this the best way to download firefox 2.0, with the fc6 distro?

FC's Package Manager (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16562844)

Whenever I hear someone talking about a new distro release I think to myself, "Great, but your package manager isn't apt." Does anyone actually prefer rpm to apt?

Remember what failure FC5 was upon release (1)

postmortem (906676) | more than 7 years ago | (#16562868)

and still is.

First, the shipped kernel had to be updated right away to allow other modules such as video drivers or ndiswrapper to work.

Second, kudos for FC/ RH team for putting the dmraid in boot time, allowing FC5 to be first and only distro with support for most motherboard fakeRAIDs, that are widely present today. However, dmraid booting was broken as soon as you get first kernel update (original kernel was useless).

Then there were daily updates. I can't keep it up-to-date no matter why: it takes 10 minutes just to resolve dependencies, while Ubuntu updates its own system in that time.

For example, I had KDE 3.5 and I decided to get the Kile package. Peace of cake it should be. The file itself on Debian systems (Ubuntu) is about 4MB. In FC5 - it took 100MB of downloads to get it running. And when I was done, I checked for updates, and there were another 500MB of minor updates waiting to be resolved and then updated. And system was up-to-date day before.

This quick FC6 release just tells me it is going to be same story. Sorry, but I'm not going to try it, although I've tried releases 2 to 5 and RHEL - Ubuntu just works, and it works FAST.
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