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Wii Internet Connection Reverse Engineered

CmdrTaco posted more than 7 years ago | from the probably-violating-some-sort-of-lame-law dept.

166

AlexTheBeast writes "By packet sniffing his Wi-Fi connection, this hacker has already begun to dig into the internet interactions of the new Nintendo Wii. Basically, by using Firefox and after setting the user agent correctly, anybody can easily browse many WiiShop pages including the WiiShop main page and startup manual. More advanced connections including binary and virtual console downloads are currently in the works. Come join the project."

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That's what happens... (4, Funny)

tttonyyy (726776) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964252)

..when developers play with their Wii.

(Sorry, couldn't resist YAWJ (Yet Another Wii Joke))

Re:That's what happens... (0)

JFMulder (59706) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964328)

or...

This is what happens when you spend more time playing with your wii than thinking about how to make it safe.

It's actually a very good name. (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964552)

Wii was a very good name to choose, just because of how much it sounds like a pet name for the penis.

Here in Finland there used to be a brand of chocolate milk called Jukiuilla. That sounds very, very close to a word which translates best to English as "bloody assrape".

People remembered that brand of milk. It became a hit sensation among teens just because of its name. While other chocolate milks had more benign names, that chocolate milk had a name that stood out. I think Nintendo has managed, intentionally or not, to do the same thing.

Re:It's actually a very good name. (2, Informative)

tttonyyy (726776) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964940)

That's true. When Nintendo announced the name, many people were disappointed, upset, and even angry. There was even a petition to Nintendo of America to change the name.

Certainly everyone talked about it.

And now we make affectionate jokes about the name, and it's quite accepted.

Methinks Nintendo made a very smart (or lucky) choice.

Re:It's actually a very good name. (4, Funny)

somersault (912633) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965074)

Wow.. interesting why anyone would want to think about pounded crap while drinking chocolate milk :s Yuck

Re:It's actually a very good name. (5, Funny)

eln (21727) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965378)

The Finns have a word for "bloody assrape"? I'm suddenly afraid to go to Finland.

Re:It's actually a very good name. (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965464)

Here in Finland there used to be a brand of chocolate milk called Jukiuilla. That sounds very, very close to a word which translates best to English as "bloody assrape".

Huh? I'm not that young but I've never heard of such product. It doesn't get a single google hit either, not even suggestions for possible typos. Also, while I know more filthy slang terms for shady activites than would be really healthy, I can't figure out how that word could mean anything at all, let alone violent sodomy in Finnish. Did this story take place in some parallel universe or are there more Finlands than I'm aware of?

The point is valid, of course. There are many products which have become legendary for their more or less intentionally funny naming or advertising. Still, this particular example leaves me completely puzzled. Got any references?

Re:It's actually a very good name. (2, Informative)

smoker2 (750216) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965536)

Wii was a very good name to choose, just because of how much it sounds like a pet name for the penis.
In the UK, wee is the "pet" name for piss.

Great choice, they could have called it "shite".

Re:It's actually a very good name. (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965538)

Here in Finland there used to be a brand of chocolate milk called Jukiuilla. That sounds very, very close to a word which translates best to English as "bloody assrape".



Sorry to be serious but no, we didn't have that brand of chocolate milk in Finland and no, it doesn't mean "bloody assrape" nor does it mean anything else in Finnish. This whole post is a nice story but totally false.

Re:It's actually a very good name. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965560)

Here in Finland there used to be a brand of chocolate milk called Jukiuilla. That sounds very, very close to a word which translates best to English as "bloody assrape".

I'm a little shocked that there is a specific word for "bloody assrape" in Finnish. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Re:That's what happens... (1)

JohnSearle (923936) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965066)

That's what happens... ..when developers play with their Wii.

What they wii-direct the DNS?

- John

Re:That's what happens... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965478)

Bad smell (3, Funny)

Rastignac (1014569) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964254)

I don't want to sniff out my wii. ;)

Re:Bad smell (5, Funny)

MyDixieWrecked (548719) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965248)

well, I've been playing with my wii so much, my arm is sore

in fact, all my muscles are stiff. I'm in such bad shape, my wii makes me stiff.

Re:Bad smell (1)

Crizp (216129) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965282)

Comedy gold. Shame I have no mod points :(

Re:Bad smell (5, Funny)

inKubus (199753) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965594)

I'm in such bad shape, my wii makes me stiff.

I can't decide if this is a Soviet Russia joke in disguise...

Zero-day (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964258)

A decade and a half since I've been sucked into the virtual world, ten years of the Web for everyone and "Zero-day warez" are still the rage.

Not much changes.

So ... What's next (4, Funny)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964262)

So ... what's next?

Will we be getting a news story about a Hacker who had installed the Wiis web-browser on his PC by going to http://www.opera.com/ [opera.com] ?

Re:So ... What's next (4, Interesting)

cloricus (691063) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964364)

I was thinking that... Seriously today at work I sat in front of ethereal for two hours sniffing packets for regular network reports and just for general knowledge of what's going on and god knows what I saw go past. It isn't at all skillful to sniff out of a agent string and use a Firefox plugin to put in what ever you want - heck if you want to be 'uber leet' you can code your own agent string into Firefox! How awesome!

So in summery this isn't even remotely interesting. Go home script kiddies...and by home I mean digg! (Yes I do have the karma to burn.)

...Still four weeks till we get Wii's in Australia. :(

I knew it... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964422)

...Still four weeks till we get Wii's in Australia. :(

You can hardly wait to get some Wii downunder.. I knew that you guys were suckers for wii... :P

Re:So ... What's next (2, Insightful)

Programmer_In_Traini (566499) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965002)

i dont think the point was to be uber by displaying l33t h4ck1ng skillz0r. :)

but its a start at developping homebrewed apps for the wii. heck, maybe create homebrewed wiishops servers so users can share wii games.

thats the good thing with consoles on the net, its fairly easy to fool them once you know what kind of answer they expect.

Re:So ... What's next (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965370)

You poor little jaded admin..... Loosen up man.

Re:So ... What's next (3, Interesting)

SausageOfDoom (930370) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964392)

Well, seeing as this shows that the channels are web-based, I would imagine that one possible next step would be to hijack the connection when it reaches your router, and then, depending on the page request, return your own content.

I'm guessing this would allow you to create custom channels by returning whatever content you wanted to the Wii. Perhaps it might also bypassing the need to buy Opera, as it sounds like it's already built in.

Already Locked Down (5, Informative)

A Brand of Fire (640320) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964274)

Apparently Nintendo has caught wind of this and has already set up redirects to the Wii root website from these links.

Correction (5, Informative)

A Brand of Fire (640320) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964296)

It seems that it redirects with links referred from other websites. After putting in the URL manually, I was able to view the pages. Pretty cool stuff.

Re:Correction (4, Funny)

tttonyyy (726776) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964334)

Given the number of consoles Nintendo must be anticipating serving those pages to, I'd expect them to be pretty much unslashdottable. A few people from slashdot? T'is but a scratch!

Re:Correction (1)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964646)

Not sure if this was implied in your post or not, but you still need to set the user agent as well.

Re:Already Locked Down (2, Informative)

l_bratch (865693) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964298)

This only happens if your user agent is set incorrectly.

If you RTFA, you will see what user agent to set your browser to.

Re:Already Locked Down (1)

Zangief (461457) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964678)

Did you change your user agent? For example, for the Wii shop you need to identify as

Opera/9.00 (Nintendo Wii; U; ; 1038-58; Wii Shop Channel/1.0; en)

OMG!!! DMCA!!! (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964300)

Pirates! You are killing our livelyhood! Shame on you! etc etc tec ad nauseum

Roms! \o/ (5, Interesting)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964322)

Once the Virtual Arcade system has been worked out, someone will put up a custom server where you can download the games for 0 points. All you'll have to do is point wii.com (or whichever A/AAA records are needed) to their server.

It seems like this system will be hacked rather easily. :/

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

Mage Powers (607708) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964346)

unless they do some of that stuff through https...

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964492)

Then you just make a machine appear to be a Wii. Their server is none-the-wiser.

Re:Roms! \o/ (3, Insightful)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964348)

Once the Virtual Arcade system has been worked out, someone will put up a custom server where you can download the games for 0 points. All you'll have to do is point wii.com (or whichever A/AAA records are needed) to their server.

It seems like this system will be hacked rather easily. :/


Well, being that Nintendo is not stupid I suspect that ever virtual console game is signed to prevent copying; on top of that (being that each game is only usable on one particular system) it is possible that Nintendo signs the signed code for each console when you buy a game. Now, unless the system is physically cracked, I think that it is nearly impossible to break this system.

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

Lissajous (989738) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964436)

...on top of that (being that each game is only usable on one particular system) it is possible that Nintendo signs the signed code for each console when you buy a game. Now, unless the system is physically cracked, I think that it is nearly impossible to break this system.

I find it doubtful that Nintendo would do this. This would be putting the private signing key on a theoretically publically accessable network. You wouldn't believe how tightly guarded signing processes are - it's normally only 2 or 3 people in the world that have access to it. The implications for are far too great for them to even contemplate that approach. But I do agree with you that it's not going to be easily cracked, by any means.

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964560)

I find it doubtful that Nintendo would do this. This would be putting the private signing key on a theoretically publically accessable network. You wouldn't believe how tightly guarded signing processes are - it's normally only 2 or 3 people in the world that have access to it. The implications for are far too great for them to even contemplate that approach. But I do agree with you that it's not going to be easily cracked, by any means.

Not really ...

If Nintendo can keep their super private signing key private and sign the rom before it gets to the distribution service.

Now, for every console you can generate a public/private key pair where the console holds the private key (without knowing what the public key is) and the service holds the public key (and keeps it secret). The result would be that you'd have to hack the online service in order to get the public keys to transfer the already signed rom to another console; not the easiest thing to do.

If you crack the console on the other hand this can all be bypassed though ...

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964618)

Exactly, I don't see what is so hard about cracking this setup.

Once you've purchased said games, they're a) stored unencrypted on your machine, or b) decrypted during runtime, and could be intercepted fairly easily.

Unless I'm wrong? Enlighten me!

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964756)

They would probably be decripted durring runtime but we don't know whether this would be stored in memory or whether this memory would be easily readable from outside the CPU ... Being that the CPU was designed with signed emulation in mind, the Wii CPU could (theoritically) take in encrypted data/instructions from memory, decrypt them into registers/on chip memory, re-encrypt the output and store that in memory. Ultimately, it is beyond me (or anyone I know) to break a system like that but I'm sure there is someone who could.

Re:Roms! \o/ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965140)

I think the games probably will be sent unencrypted, or with trivial encryption, but your Wii will refuse to load them unless it can validate two signatures:

1. A master signature, made using a super-secret key like the one used to sign games on disc,
2. A per-console signature, made using a key that is unique to your Wii.

The first key stops you loading games that aren't approved by Nintendo. The second key stops you loading games that weren't bought by you. You can copy games that are intended for another person's Wii by listening to TCP traffic, but you can't actually run them unless you can forge the second signature to match the one expected by your Wii. Nintendo can make this very difficult for you by embedding that key in ROM - like the TCPA keys in the Xbox 360.

DRM is much easier when it comes to games consoles, because there's no meaningful analogue hole, and the manufacturer has complete control of the hardware. There's no "crack once, run anywhere", because "run anywhere" means forging digital signatures.

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

Lanttu (1027010) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964694)

What if someone makes a system that can generate Wii compatible roms from all those rom files that you can download from the internet? I mean - there has to be somekind of signing system or FairPlay -styled coding system where you account is going to be the key to open those roms that you download from Nintendo. But what if - now, you have to realize that I dont know a **it about Wii's accounts or even seen the console in real life. Just general interest cause I am going to buy one. - someone puts up a server which uses same kind of system. It requests your account and then modifies the rom of that you want to use your account? Or even better - a downloadable program that does it for you and then you just need to build a server... I dont see any reason why that isn't possible because it downloads those roms via internet. I think that it is not going to lock those files with any fancy copy protection which needs internet connection (or is it?) but it might encode those files to match your Wii Account. Just like FairPlay. Now - if there is a way to build account free rom or modify the software to always try one decode style first or a software that transforms a standard .NES / whatever rom to Wii readable format then it should be pretty easy hack - no hardcore chips needed... but this is only what if... :D

Re:Roms! \o/ (2, Informative)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964836)

I'm not positive I know what you're asking, but I think I'll give it a try ...

I could be wrong but I think the difference between what I'm describing and Fair Play is that Fair Play takes an unsigned data format and signs it to be specific to your particular account/machine and there is nothing that prevents you from using an unsigned version of that data with your account/machine; now, Nintendo could design a system such that it will only play games that were both signed by Nintendo (to make them an official rom) and signed for your specific machine. In Nintendo's case, stripping the per-account signing would give you an officially signed Nintendo rom but that would not be playable on an unmodified machine unless you had access to the account based signing key (by modifying the system you'd be attempting to remove the requirement that the game had to be signed per machine, or for homebrew that it was even signed at all).

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965206)

That's an awful lot of ifs. It's a lot harder to duplicate Nintendo's system than just saying "I know!!! - What if someone cracked it!!1!!!oneeE!!!!!! Yay!!!". If the pricing is fair then why try to crack the system? Someone will probably work out how to break it if there's any incentive though..

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

assassinator42 (844848) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965322)

I don't know if I'd say the pricing is fair. Plus, you'll never be able to buy every NES/SNES/N64 game. What if I want to play Perfect Dark on the Wii? Anyway, I doubt you'll be able to do it without a custom firmware of some sort. Perhaps a modchip?

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965390)

How much does it cost? I wouldn't have too hard a time believing they're overcharging, seeing as Tetris for the DS costs £30 here.

If I wanted to play NES or SNES games I'd just get an emulator (I know it could be cooler using a Wii but meh..). I'm not a Nintendo fanboy so I don't have much Nostalgia for any old Nintendo games (apart from MarioKart :) )

Re:Roms! \o/ (1)

Lissajous (989738) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964778)

Now, for every console you can generate a public/private key pair where the console holds the private key (without knowing what the public key is) and the service holds the public key (and keeps it secret). The result would be that you'd have to hack the online service in order to get the public keys to transfer the already signed rom to another console; not the easiest thing to do.

This was my point. The online service is accessable to the g.p. so would be theoretically open to t3h l33t h4x0rZ. Ninty (or anyone) would not under any circumstances what the key to fall into nefarious hands.

If you're generating a unique key-pair for each console, then this is another area of possible exploit. There'd be a difference between two identical systems based solely on this key pair. Remember that part of copy protection is protection-by-obscurity. Making it more apparent where the protection system lies is a big hint to t3h h4x0rZ as to where to look to break it.

The only redeeming factor would be that seeing as this is an online operation, they would be theoretically able to change the signing key, change the setup on you box you through a system update, and lock out any roms signed by the old system, whilst at the same time providing you with fresh shiny new copies of the legit. ones you bought. Huge bandwidth issue I grant you, but still cheaper than leaving the system wide open.

Re:Roms! \o/ (2, Interesting)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964952)

What the hell are you talking about? Signing a binary doesn't prevent copying. All it prevents is someone from modifying the ROM and then running it on the Wii. The only thing that will "prevent copying" is full-on encryption. However, the Wii would then need the key to decrypt the content, at which point you just hack the Wii to get the key.

Basically, they're facing the exact same problem content providers are facing: you're trying to lock down content while at the same time giving the user the means to unlock it (so they can use it). And unless you can ensure the hardware is unhackable, this simply cannot work.

Re:Roms! \o/ (2, Informative)

Xenographic (557057) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965678)

If they did any such thing to prevent people from downloading the ROMs, quite frankly, it would be a complete and utter waste of time.

As anyone should know by now, you can download ROMs and emulators for nearly any system you want online. It's not even hard. The Pirate Bay even has nice, huge, torrents with practically every ROM ever (including tons of bad dumps I have no idea why anyone would ever want).

So really, they shouldn't even bother. It would be a total waste of their time and money. Heck, if they're getting it from the store, at least people are paying for the ROM. So they can laugh about "hacking" the Wii store all they want, but if they're paying Nintendo instead of downloading it for free from any of the hundreds of ROM sites, well, they'd be shooting themselves in the foot to discourage that, I'd think.

Not that they wouldn't do such a thing, but...

Re:Roms! \o/ (2, Insightful)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965920)

I suspect that Nintendo would be very careful about what code was running on their system for fear that it could be exploited to produce a soft-mod to allow for pirated games to be run.

Imagine if a buffer overflow error was found in the emulator, which allowed for unsigned code to be run, so the hacker could replace your firmware which allowed for booting from a usb hard-drive ...

too slow? slashdot it! (1)

Boeboe (815330) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964388)

Slashdotting the official Wii shopchannel, while people were already complaining about a slow performance? Damn thee in hell!

FAILZORS (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964412)

The proje37 as a [goat.cx]

So when will the remote get hacked? (2, Insightful)

DrXym (126579) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964434)

If it uses Bluetooth as it is supposed to, what is to stop the Wii remote being used on a PC or even a PS3 if you wanted to? What's the point you may ask - well it would make for useful mouse replacement for presentations, or just for couch surfing.

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964540)

Writing a driver for the remote which handles the pointer IR info just so that you can sit on the couch in the same room with your TV and Wii and surf the 'net from your pc sounds like way more work than just getting the opera browser for the Wii and using that.

I wonder which would be ready first - a Wii remote driver for pc's, or the Wii opera download? :)

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (2, Interesting)

DrXym (126579) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964634)

You don't need the sensor bar functionality as the thing is armed with gyroscopes and accelerometers, which are more than enough to control a cursor on an overhead projector. All those buttons could be mapped as mouse buttons and the D-Pad as a scroll wheel. Gyroscopic mice have been available for quite a while now that do just that, but they cost far more than a Wii remote.

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (1)

Spokehedz (599285) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964882)

The above is true, with the exception that the sensor bar tells the system what relation to the screen you are. It doesn't use the sensor bar all the time--such as when you swing the controller off the screen, for example.

But you DO need to point it at the screen so that the camera in the front of the wiimote can see the IR beams to know how to translate the sensor data received from the wiimote into movement in the screen.

Let me put it another way: The wiimote doesn't know which way is up if you don't point it at the sensor bar. If you don't know up, how are you going to translate changes in G forces (which is what the accelerometers measure) into movement of a pointer? You wouldn't be able to know what the data you were receiving meant, without a point of reference--and that is what the sensor bar provides.

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (1)

AvitarX (172628) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964936)

You could use something such as the acceleration of gravity to know which way is up. Pressing buttons 1 and 2 simulteniously to recalibrate which way is up if that becomes a problem.

Mice without sensor bars have existed in the past and work.

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (1)

Evangelion (2145) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965394)

It knows which way is up, so it can figure it's pitch (rotation around x) and roll (rotation around z), but it can't use gravity to figure out it's yaw (rotation around y).

It also can't use gravity to figure out it's position relative to anything.

It can detect *movement* in six axes (x/y/z, rotation around x/y/z), but it can only figure out absolute position in two of the rotational ones due to gravity.

That's where the sensor bar comes in -- it gives the remote a reference point (above or below the display) so that it can be used as a pointer.

Also, it's worth noting that the "sensor bar" is passive. It doesn't read anything, it just gives the remote a reference point to use. Assuming the Wii is on, the wiimote will be able to figure everything out on it's own.

(y=up/down,x=right/left,z=in/out)

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (1)

DrXym (126579) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965032)

The above is true, with the exception that the sensor bar tells the system what relation to the screen you are. It doesn't use the sensor bar all the time--such as when you swing the controller off the screen, for example.

Doesn't matter. A mouse doesn't know where the edge of the screen is either. Besides, having a controller which requires you constantly point it at the screen to use a cursor is tiring and very clumsy. But you DO need to point it at the screen so that the camera in the front of the wiimote can see the IR beams to know how to translate the sensor data received from the wiimote into movement in the screen.

Again, doesn't matter. All the driver would require is to know when you swing it left, right up or down and translate that into the appropriate movement of the pointer. You don't even need to point the thing at the screen to move the pointer. That's exactly what existing gyroscopic mice do.

Let me put it another way: The wiimote doesn't know which way is up if you don't point it at the sensor bar. If you don't know up, how are you going to translate changes in G forces (which is what the accelerometers measure) into movement of a pointer? You wouldn't be able to know what the data you were receiving meant, without a point of reference--and that is what the sensor bar provides.

The driver makes the assumption that people hold the remote in a horizontal fashion and swing it left or right, or tilt it up or down to move the mouse. You can refine this I'm sure and even offer left / right handed behaviour but those are the basic requirements. I expect a peek at the driver for a gyro mouse would offer likely other enhancements.

And if by chance someone does want to implement the sensor bar, the thing is just a dumb strip with LEDs that and it might even be possible to jury rig it to work from a USB port.

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964958)

It appears it already has...

http://www.gamebrink.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1 2011 [gamebrink.com]

Re:So when will the remote get hacked? (1)

odyaws (943577) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964974)

If it uses Bluetooth as it is supposed to, what is to stop the Wii remote being used on a PC or even a PS3 if you wanted to? What's the point you may ask - well it would make for useful mouse replacement for presentations, or just for couch surfing.
Apparently it's trivial to at least use it as a gamepad: link [gamebrink.com] . Pointer functionality can't be far off...

Squid proxy = Homebrew injection (4, Interesting)

palad1 (571416) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964460)

Good news everyone!
By setting-up a squid proxy one could be able to make homebrews appear as games requiring 0 wii points before being sent to the wii, which will gladly accept it as a runnable executable!

Now we just have to reverse engineer the 'Virtual Game Console'. 100 say it will turn-out to be a Mame clone.

Can't wait till the Wii gets released in Europe. Oh my :)

Besides, we may even be able to stream a divx player using this technique.

Signed code You (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16964482)

I assume the phrase "signed code" has never entered your mind?

Something tells me they learned a few lessons from the DS and WiFiMe.

Re:Signed code You (1)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964716)

I assume the phrase "signed code" has never entered your mind?

Well that has never been cracked before ;)

Re:Squid proxy = Homebrew injection (1)

EvilRyry (1025309) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964544)

I gotta believe these executables need to be signed or something. I can't believe they'd leave the back door wide open like that.

If not though, does it run Linux?

Re:Squid proxy = Homebrew injection (3, Informative)

geekboy_x (410674) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964862)

You dont need that - the Wii Opera browser can hit normal web pages just fine, so flash-based homebrews can just be served off regular ol' pages, like this:

http://wiicade.com/Home.aspx [wiicade.com]

Have fun!

Am I the only one who is impressed by..... (4, Interesting)

8127972 (73495) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964470)

..... the fact that this doesn't look like some sort of custom solution that would be forever tied to the hardware. Instead it seems to be very "off the shelf" in nature from what I can see. I'm impressed that Nintendo would go that route. Many companies wouldn't.

Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (5, Interesting)

SalaciousPucker (911419) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964496)

Microsoft is really the only console maker that has ventured online in any substantial way. They locked down their hardware and sealed off the wild wild internet (no IE on the 360) for good reason.


I really think the Wii and/or the PS3 are going to be hacked to death. They have browsers, neither are experienced here and with Sony in particular, the whole thing seems kinda....rushed(?). I mean, with the media they are fine - people won't be burning blu-ray cheap enough soon enough. One click pirated downloads would be even worse though...it would be much easier. Given the cost & market for the PS3, a hack like this would be instant death for developer support.

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (4, Funny)

iapetus (24050) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964648)

Yes. With potential security holes like this, I doubt it'll be long before we see some sort of crazy hack to run Linux on the PS3. Wouldn't that be great?

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (0, Offtopic)

Tigwyk (855379) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964930)

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, but there's already videos on GooTube (haha) of someone running Linux on their PS3. The PS3 "dashboard" already gives you access to boot into a different operating system, or at least it did in the video (it didn't look hacked at all).

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (2, Insightful)

Virgil Tibbs (999791) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965204)

thats where yellow dog linux is going- with all macs going intel, yellow dog hasno choice but to go to the ps3 because there are no other powerpc processors

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (1)

xtracto (837672) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964650)

Microsoft is really the only console maker that has ventured online in any substantial way. They locked down their hardware and sealed off the wild wild internet (no IE on the 360) for good reason.

That is something I found very interesting about Microsoft's new console. I kept hearing about the Hypervisor this and the Hypervisor that and the new Xbox was unbreakable and antihacker box and all that from Microsoft, after it was released I followed some of the hacking efforts and it seemed to be very heavy locked. (of course it is now possible to play pirated games... duh!).

Au contraire, neither Nintendo or Sony have braged about any antipiracy methods... I could think that 10% of the Xbox360 power is wasted in the Hypervision anti haxx0rs software (the most funny thing is that they still think they can fix a HARDWARE PROBLEM [this is the reproduction of illegal copies] with a software patch...).

I for one am really happy to have preordered my Wii yesterday (Comet shop in UK) I am waiting for it as the first console I have got in 5 years .

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (4, Insightful)

FroBugg (24957) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964858)

Is this really such a terrible thing for the Wii?

Sure, some people may end up downloading pirated games instead of buying them from Nintendo, but as iTunes shows, people are perfectly willing to pay reasonable prices for things they can get free elsewhere.

And since the Wii hardware itself is actually profitable for Nintendo (as opposed to the PS3), they're still going to make money from people who buy a Wii with no intention of ever buying a legit Virtual Console game or even a real Wii game. And maybe once these hackers have a Wii they'll buy some games after all.

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (2, Interesting)

xtracto (837672) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965372)

Sure, some people may end up downloading pirated games instead of buying them from Nintendo, but as iTunes shows, people are perfectly willing to pay reasonable prices for things they can get free elsewhere.

And I am sure their primary userbase is not the hacker that downloads from romhustler or priarrrbay but mom and dad that get out of work, turn on their Wii and choose the newly released game from the Wii Channel.

 

Re:Welcome to the New Console Hack-fest (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965818)

They have browsers, neither are experienced here and with Sony in particular, the whole thing seems kinda....rushed(?)

Wrong. The PSP has had internet integration since day one, and ships with a web browser. The DS has one (in some regions), but we all know that Nintendo doesn't care one bit for online community (which is different than online play...)

Now that they both (and especially Sony, which has embraced online gaming with the PSP in a way that Nintendo flat out refuses to) have experience getting hacked to death, maybe the consoles will be different? I doubt it personally, but it's not like they havent tried before.

DNS redirection (5, Informative)

AsnFkr (545033) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964520)

Using DNS redirection you can get the Wii to any website you wish. Video [youtube.com]

MOV (1)

HappySqurriel (1010623) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964600)

Something I would like to see someone try is to redirect to a page that contains a movie file format which the Wii supports (like MOV); this could be the easiest way to convert your Wii to a media center extender (with crappy file support).

mythtv client (1)

perler (80090) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965770)

i wonder if fullscreen for flash videos is enabled in wiipera. this way i somehow imagine a myth frontend, on the fly encoded by the mythbackend, in the end a tv in the tv..

PAT

Re:DNS redirection (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965154)

My Wii keeps on wanting me to go to hustler.com...

Here is how to do it. was:Re:DNS redirection (1)

2bitcomputers (864663) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965278)

In case anyone here doesn't quite understand the fundamentals of DNS here is how you would do this:

1. On the wireless access point you use to connect your Wii to the internet modify the DHCP server to hand out an IP address on your network for a DNS server.

2. Setup a DNS server at that IP (BIND, Windows DNS, etc)

3. Manually create a DNS entry for the following domain: oss.shop.wii.com

4. Use: 64.233.187.99 (google.com) for the A record

Now when you fire up the Wii and go to the shop channel you should be sent to google.com instead

(Note: I have a Wii but have not tried this yet, I am at work, but I will as soon as I get out of here)

DMCA violation...? (3, Funny)

creimer (824291) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964546)

Isn't reverse engineering the Wii packets to figure out the proper browser user string a DMCA violation?

Re:DMCA violation...? (0, Flamebait)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964710)

Of course it is.

Nobody cares about the DMCA nowadays but lawyers and businesses who claim reverse-engineering hurts their business model.

Re:DMCA violation...? (4, Funny)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964742)

Isn't reverse engineering the Wii packets to figure out the proper browser user string a DMCA violation?

Depends. Reverse engineering is not a violation, but cracking encryption is.

Note I haven't ever read the DMCA, so am I am relying on what I have heard on forums and new sites.

Re:DMCA violation...? (1)

remembertomorrow (959064) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964758)

If you have to question whether or not something violates the DMCA, chances are it does (unfortunately).

Don't Make Content Accessible

Re:DMCA violation...? (1)

Dr. Mortimer (461903) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964924)

No, because there's no encryption being broken here.

Re:DMCA violation...? (1)

crossmr (957846) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964964)

Who cares, I don't live in a country which recognizes the DMCA. Lesson 1: America's laws are not the world's laws.

Re:DMCA violation...? (1)

ajs318 (655362) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965058)

No, but telling you you can't look at the data packets originating from a piece of hardware you own is a violation of common-law property rights.

Re:DMCA violation...? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965604)

Isn't reverse engineering the Wii packets to figure out the proper browser user string a DMCA violation?

Only if you live in Suckmerica.

why does this even work? (2, Funny)

v1 (525388) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964588)

I am very surprised we are not seeing them use public key encryption here. If the wii has microsoft's public key, it can send encrypted requests which cannot be reverse engineered unless you are able to guess microsoft's private key. The way around this would be to disasemble the code on the wii. Since they are merely using packet sniffing, the traffic must not be encrypted. If someone were to have bet me if this would have been encrypted, well, I guess I would be out some money about now. Not that it's a bad thing for us, but what is microsoft thinking?? They had to know this would happen, and I can't believe they would sit idle and let it occur.

Though I suppose in a couple months we'll see a "software update" (i.e. they drop the portcullis) and that'll be the end of the tinkering without a screwdriver.

Re:why does this even work? (4, Interesting)

Yosho (135835) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964602)

You appear to be under the misconception that the Wii is produced by Microsoft. It's not. It was created by Nintendo. Unlike Microsoft, they're not obsessed with encrypting everything under the sun. Why would they care if somebody figures out their network protocol?

Re:why does this even work? (1)

JFMulder (59706) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965582)

You said : Why would they care if somebody figures out their network protocol?
The summary said : More advanced connections including binary and virtual console downloads are currently in the works.

I suppose this means that there could be a way to get Virtual Console games for free or to leach them from someone else downloading them. Not good for Nintendo's business. Too bad it wasn't encrypted.

Re:why does this even work? (2, Insightful)

Yosho (135835) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965654)

I suppose this means that there could be a way to get Virtual Console games for free or to leach them from someone else downloading them.

I highly doubt that knowing how the protocol works will enable people to get Virtual Console games for free. Everybody knows how HTTPS works, but you don't see people getting things for free from online stores all over the world. I suppose, in theory, it might be possible for somebody to sniff the connection of a download in progress, intercept the binary game data, and get it over to their Wii -- but the number of people who are capable of doing that, let alone would do it, is insignificant compared to the rest of the market.

Re:why does this even work? (1)

dimer0 (461593) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964674)

What does Microsoft have to do with this?

Why would you encrypt this? (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 7 years ago | (#16964832)

Honestly, why would you encrypt this?

Encryption takes overhead. And since every console would have to have the same key (public not private by the way in order to sign a page with something Nintendo would recognize) the key would not remain secret for long - so it would be a bit of development trouble for zero gain.

Re:Why would you encrypt this? (1)

marcosdumay (620877) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965332)

The news is that someone at a 'enterprise' was able to figure that out.

Because of all other examples we're getting recently, we expected otherwise.

How to setup for this (simple way) (5, Informative)

zepo1a (958353) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965028)

This is for FF 1.5 (yeah lame..haven't updated yet, I assume will work for 2.0)
type
about:config
in FF Address bar
right click in window. New->String
use
general.useragent.override
for preferemce name, click ok
use
Opera/9.00 (Nintendo Wii; U; ; 1038-58; Wii Shop Channel/1.0; en)
as string value. click OK. you should now be able to hit the site without a redirect to wii.com

Re:How to setup for this (simple way) (1)

inKubus (199753) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965446)

After doing this, try going here: http://209.67.106.203/oss/common/vc/ [209.67.106.203] and then viewing the source. It seems that there's a lot of cool java and javascrpt here. Apparently there are java objects to access the video and sound of the Wii, some other stuff.

Lots more to explore, more later.

Reverse engineered? (1, Troll)

sid77 (984944) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965226)

!iiW

Mirrors (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16965304)

Mirrordot Links:

This Hacker [mirrordot.com] How to view them [mirrordot.com]

The wii uses a browser to communicate. By emulating this browser with firefox, you can surf the wii shop.
1. Open Firefox
2. Install the User Agent Switcher [mozy.org]
The previous tech-recipes on the use of this tool is also killer.
3. Click Tools
4. Click User Agent Switcher
5. Click Options -> Options
6. Click User Agents
7. Click Add
8. Description: wii
9. User Agent: Opera/9.00 (Nintendo Wii; U; ; 1038-58; Wii Shop Channel/1.0; en)
10. Click OK X 2
11. Click Tools again
12. Select User Agent Switcher
13. Select wii
14. Copy and paste one of these links into firefox and visit it:

Main Channel:
http://oss.shop.wii.com/oss/common/vc/W_01.jsp?lan guage=en®ion=USA=US [wii.com]

Surf the Manual!
http://209.67.106.203/en_US/html/manual/USA/startu p.html [209.67.106.203]

My Nintendo Membership Link:
http://oss.shop.wii.com/oss/common/vc/S_02.jsp?lan guage=en [wii.com] ®ion=USA=US&=init

Sonic The Hedgehog Page:
http://oss.shop.wii.com/oss/common/vc/B_05.jsp?tit leId=000100014D414845 [wii.com]

HTH, Monkeyboi (AC, I'm no karma whore...)

Where's the Opera browser download then? (2, Interesting)

assassinator42 (844848) | more than 7 years ago | (#16965426)

It seems like they have it sort of working. When will they release it? And does this mean we won't be able to use USB keyboards and mice with the browser?

Re:Where's the Opera browser download then? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#16966000)

If I'm not mistaken, Opera is already built into the Wii. There's probably a mechanism for autoupdates, but it's highly unlikely that they're going to make the browser a separate piece of software that you'll have to go out on your own and download, especially considering it's been customized to run specifically on the Wii.
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