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Red Hat Releases Version 6.1

CmdrTaco posted more than 14 years ago | from the download-and-play dept.

Red Hat Software 394

RaymondInFinland writes "Red Hat 6.1 appeared on ftp.redhat.com Only a i386 version but the release also comes as an ISO image. " Its not supposed to be official for a bit yet, and my guess is that it'll be pretty rocky downloading for a bit, but it is there.

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394 comments

another too quick to market jump.. (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643315)

this has gotta slow down.. i think there should be some "service packs" and not new version #'s for minor upgrades and such.. i would have hoped redhat 6.1 would have waited until Xfree86 4 or something a lil more worth the version # change would have come out.. whats new? is there anything listed on the site? and one beta release is pretty balsy..

Exactly 1 day after I start installing 6.0 (0)

Improv (2467) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643320)

Grr. The day after I decide to update my old
Alpha to 6.0, Redhat makes a 6.1 ... Oh well,
I guess it's not such a loss -- the Alpha 6.1
isn't around yet anyhow.

Jeez. (3)

rde (17364) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643416)

You'd think after the mandrake fiasco people'd learn to wait for official announcements.
I know that it's where were were told it was, but it's possible Red Hat are waiting for a reason.
News sources vying for market share may have a reason for being first with every story, but you'd think slashdot'd be above that sort of thing.
Any attempts to log onto ftp.redhat.com before typing this are purely hypocracy on my part, but should not invalidate my point.

ISO from Red Hat? (2)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643421)

I have to wonder how much Mandrake has influenced Red Hat. I first gave Mandrake a try with version 5.1 because of the ISO image availability and I imagine that much of Mandrake's initial success was built on the ease of acquisition.

It appears that the student is teaching the master.

Redhat 6.1 (1)

fusion94 (19221) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643424)

This is a good thing. It looks as though SuSE may be forcing Redhat to release versions more frequently which only benefits the community.

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (4)

bmetzler (12546) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643429)

this has gotta slow down.. i think there should be some "service packs" and not new version #'s for minor upgrades and such..

Not really. I mean this *is* a .1 release. nothing major. Basically this is just a "service pack" release, or as our arch enemy at Redmond calls it, the "Second Edition".

i would have hoped redhat 6.1 would have waited until Xfree86 4 or something a lil more worth the version # change would have come out..

Yes, but Linux 2.4 and Xfree86 4 are pretty radical changes. Don't you think that should get a version 7 number? That won't be for a few months yet anyways. Certainly way to long to wait to upgrade something that was released even longer ago.

-Brent
--

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643434)

so don't buy it.

Re:Redhat 6.1 (1)

Russ Steffen (263) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643442)

Actually, no. Red Hat has been on a six month (give or take a week or two) release cycle for a few years now. This release is right on schedule.

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643445)

Actually this release is extremely nice. It has a new graphical install that kicks OpenLinux's ass! I also has a new feature... "The Update Agent!" Looks neat but I couldn't get it to work. I think that you need to register first or something.

Got it installed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643448)

I downloaded it today and got Redhat 6.1 installed on my server system here. So far it works pretty well. I'm just waiting for a distribution to come set up with good options for firewalling and masquerading.

how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643450)

I want to switch over to Linux, but am running NT here - how so I burn an ISO image onto a CD from within Windows NT?

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643466)

I believe you're referring to kudzu which handles updates of the hardware in the system

beowulf (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643473)

does it have beowulf support yet? that would rock..

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (0)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643478)

I wont, but Redhat releasing new distros and fragmenting the industry is whats bad.. i don't use redhat, but being a market leader i would have thought they would be smarter about scheduling.

now all thos suckers who got "6.0" training need 6.1 training, now all the people who have support contracts need downtime to upgrade after only having a system up for 5 months..

Thats how *NOT* to run a business, i know RedHat won't just drop 6.0 but it won't be there truely supported platform once 6.1 is released..

had it been a service release, people could upgrade in due time and get the new patches/features and additions to the os..

a kernel upgrade, and a window manager upgrade don't consitute a 7.0 either.. IMHO 7.0 should be a radical new form of Linux with a solid foundation, a good programming backend, and a feature set to compare to other unices..

They need another way of getting money (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643482)

They should start selling update cd's. These could be made more often. Then they could have som kind of membership deal. Where the members got a cd once a month form RH. That would be a good service deal for many people.

almost got the first cd (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643484)

woohoo.... almost got the first cd...

already have more then 560mb downloaded, at over 100KB/s but the speed is rapidly dropping as I started at almost 300KB/s, so I guess more people have found out.

Upgrading? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643487)

I am currently using 6.0, does anyone know if RedHat is providing some sort of upgrade so that I don't have to reinstall from scratch?
(no matter how nice the new installer is, I would prefer not to have to reconfigure again)

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (1)

David Ham (88421) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643489)

Adaptec Easy CD Creator (you can get it from their website) should do the job quite nicely. Create CD from Image, and then select "ISO." I'm sure there are other programs on TUCOWS that will do it too. I'm sure you've got the bandwidth to download a few of them to check out if you're going to download an ISO....

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643495)

With Easy CD creator, cdrwin and many other cd-burning programs.

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (1)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643500)

Adaptec EZ-CD Creator software burns ISO images wonderfully. Check out the readme file that accompanies the ISO for details.

Excellent point... (1)

DrSpoo (650) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643503)

This is the beauty of the GPL. RedHat and Mandrake feed off each other in a symbiotic circle.

Question is, when can we expect to download the Windows 2000 ISO? Answer: never, unless it's WaReZ.

Re:Redhat 6.1 (1)

fusion94 (19221) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643506)

True enough but one of the key ingredients to making Open Source work is "Release Often".
I've also heard that 6.2 is to be released shortly after this one.

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (1)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643509)

CDRWin will not burn ISO files directly. You have to change it to a Bin/Cue format.

broken redhat (1)

smash (1351) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643511)

I'm not ever going to bother with Redhat again unless they fix the following major problems:

RPMS
There is no way that I know of to easily upgrade packages. Sure, you can just rpm -i the new rpm, but then it depends on some other new rpm that you have to locate, download, upgrade, only to find THAT requires something else.. etc.. There is no central repositry for RPMs like there is with debian...
Something like apt (debian) is desperately needed to figure out package dependancy downloading for you :)
To get around the braindead dependancies i just compiled stuff from source, which kinda defeats the purpose of HAVING rpms :P

General flakiness
The last redhat release i played with (version 5.2) had sendmail 8.8, and bind version 4.9 or something... any reason for this? Both were known security problems (that had been fixed for a while) on the day it shipped AFAIK :P

I really dont know what everyone seems to see in redhat...

smash (not intended to be flamebait, just curious - btw I was a Redhat user for all versions between 4.1 and 5.2, switched to debian...)


Re:Nah... (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643512)

Mandrake is nice.. its had a simple upgrade wizard for a while now.. and the graphical install? that could have been a release 6.0 workstation addition or feature demo of upcoming 7.0 with a bunch of new stuff..

Re:First Post (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643514)

Y'know, the "First Post" thing is neither cool nor funny anymore... Not to flame or anything, but just letting you know for future reference...

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (1)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643518)

Unfortunately, EZ-CD Creator is not free. You will have to purchase it to burn an ISO image.

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (1)

pebenito (89598) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643523)

Adaptec's EZ CD Creator should be able to burn the iso. Use file->create cd from image.

Re:They need another way of getting money (1)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643527)

They should start selling update cd's.

Sounds like you have a good business idea. Go get some venture capital money and post your URL. Just make sure I get a cut for the idea.

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (2)

alexandre (53) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643529)

ISO image as their names imply are universal :-)
i already burned iso of debian from a mac and it worked very well! :)

---

does anyone EVER DO ANY RESEARCH?????? (4)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643531)

Redhat offers the - Red Hat Member More program.

http://store.redhat.com/commerce/store.cgi?page= /more_rh_rhmembermore.html

Includes the following:

1 Membership Card
Each release of the Official Red Hat Linux Box Set for one
year
8 Update CD shipments
Quarterly Newsletter
1 Red Hat Baseball Cap
1 Red Hat T-Shirt
15% Discount on all Red Hat, Inc. retail products* during
membership
Free passes to all tradeshows Red Hat, Inc. attends during
membership period
Complimentary gifts at tradeshows
"Members only" specials announced on our website
periodically throughout the year for RHMember Program
participants.
Additional "members only" specials reserved only for
RHMember More program members.

Window Manager (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643536)

Anyone know what the default window manager is? Ist it the same one that was with 6.0?

Re:broken redhat (2)

Beached (52204) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643538)

Actually you are incorrect. Go to http://www.rpmfind.net or ftp://ftp.rpmfind.net . They have nearly every rpm created with numerouos versions.

Ok.. so for the new features .... are they GPL'd (0)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643540)

I've heard of a graphical installation now, and an update wizard. Are these under the GPL as well? just wondering if redhat is going back to proprietary software or if it is open sourced. just curious, a license doesn't bother me, but since "linux" should be a base, any veering off from Linux and just into RedHat is more market fragmentation..

redhat should buy up a few distros to narrow it down and bring more talent in and spread some of the wealth.

Re:Exactly 1 day after I start installing 6.0 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643543)

It was their choice to place it on a pub distro site.

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (1)

Bob Uhl (30977) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643544)

Hardly. IMHO, the whole reason for 'service packs' is that companies like the Colossus of Redmond feel that it makes them look better to release a service pack rather than a bugfix release.

The more insidious effect is that this encourages the whole 'software as car' idea: yearly upgrades for cosmetic reasons, the notion that software is expected to have problems requiring a bit of servicing, and worst of all, the notion that a trained serviceman is required to work on said software (e.g. MSCE).

A far better solution is to aim for perfection, plan for failure and release bug fixes as needed. Besides that, RedHat 6.1 is much easier to say and deal with than NT 4.0 Service Pack 4. Plus the version numbering system gives a finer level of granularity: <major release>.<minor release/bug fix>.<developmental release/minor bug fix>. In a way, it's similar to the English system of measurements: a unit for each job (sorry, couldn't resist:-). Seriously though, it's more compact and more elegant. It packs more information into a smaller package, plus it requires no translation (well, not into Roman-numeral languages anyway). And it doesn't add any nasty new buzzwords to our already overloaded language.

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (1)

drudd (43032) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643546)

now all thos suckers who got "6.0" training need 6.1 training, now all the people who have support contracts need downtime to upgrade after only having a system up for 5 months..

Not really... 6.1 is 99% the same as 6.0, just with bugfixes, new versions (which usually means bugfixes on that end as well).

Doug

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (3)

kovi (52074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643553)

Well, I guess this is wrong place to ask such a question... but what'a hell.
Moderators, please kill me, cause this is completely off topic.
First, I have no fintest idea about the software to write CD on WinDos. Never seen/used any.
Therefore I'd suggest to go for cdrecord. Nice UNIX command line tool recently ported to NT (alpha stage, but quite stable :-)

Find it at:
ftp://ftp.fokus.gmd.de/pub/unix/cdrecord/alpha/w in32/

Then get your iso image and just type:

cdrecord dev=3,0 -v speed=2 -dao iso_image_name.iso

dev is SCSI number of your CD writer, dao means disk at once, speed means speed. Ah, if you CD writer is IDE, then I don't know. Best woud be to sell it and buy SCSI :-)

Good luck :-)
kovi

PS Sorry for style/typos I had too much beer

Thought they'd wait for GNOME 1.50 and new kernel (1)

kondrag (3980) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643555)

I was certain the hangup for the release of 6.1 was the new GNOME 1.50 and the big bugfix 2.2.13 kernel. Probably too much pressure to get something out, now that they are publicly traded.

Re:how to burn an ISO image on a CD from NT? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643557)

Sure it will. In the File Backup & Tools area, just choose to record an ISO9660 image, choose the iso-file and burn...

Re:broken redhat (1)

smash (1351) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643559)

ah well.

it still doesnt fix the other problems with releasing products with known dodgy versions of sendmail and bind, etc :)

Debian's apt is better. total machine upgrade overnight with the following commands:

apt-get update
apt-get dist-upgrade

if some debs are missing, do an apt-get -f to fix them :)

then go to sleep while it download the 50meg or whatever, wake up and press enter to install it all :)

smash

Redhat 6.1 - its worth it, but hold off please (5)

barlowg (5396) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643560)

As opposed to those who believe that Redhat should have waited for Linux 2.4 or XFree 4, I don't realistically believe that either of those will be available for some time. One of the major advantages of Redhat is that they follow a regular release schedule for the most part. (Twice a year)

As for this release just being an update, that if for the most part true. The main focus of this release was the introduction of the graphical installer. This is and excellent installer, easier than previous Redhat installs and far easier than other Linux distros and Windows installers. (My roommate did extensive testing of it in lorax) Kudos to Matt Wilson for his excellent work.

As for the announcement of this on /. before it was officially released by Redhat, I think a huge mistake was made. /. often warns that downloads may be rocky for awhile when it reports on a new distro release or a new kernel, but part of the reason that this is true is that the mirrors don't have time to get it before /. users start pounding it. I think many of us dislike the "first post" mentality that clouds useful discussion on /. and we should be fed up with /. following the same model for news when doing so is inappropriate.
--
Gregory J. Barlow
fight bloat. use blackbox [themes.org] .

Re:Ok.. so for the new features .... are they GPL' (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643561)

It is all still GPL. They still pledge to release everything they write under GPL, and show no signs of changing that. ~luge

What are you talking about? (3)

Cardinal (311) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643563)

What are you talking about? RedHat isn't fragmenting anything by releasing a new version of their distro.

People shouldn't be getting "6.0" training, I'm not even sure they should be getting RedHat training. I would suggest teaching on two levels:
  • Administrators: Learn the core system of Linux, a typical layout of files, runlevels, daemons, etc. Then learn how some distros organize those files differently. I administer a company with Debian and RedHat systems, I know this works.
  • End users: End users don't care what distro they're using. Seriously. They barely care if they're using Gnome or KDE, but that's what they should be taught, because the theory is that's all they'll need. Gnome apps, KDE apps.
Errata is released almost constantly as bugs of a sufficent severity are found. But that doesn't help people who buy RH on CD and don't have the bandwidth to be downloading big binary patches like the updated X packages.

I would tend to agree that jumping to 7 over a window manager and kernel would be silly, but nobody's doing that. :) I would even go so far as to say jumping to 7 when XFree86 4 and Linux 2.4 comes out is a bit of a stretch. For example, when RedHat went to 6, it switched to glibc2.1, a newer X, and Linux 2.2. This is a pretty big deal. But I bet 7 will come about when we see XFree86 4, Linux 2.4, and either (or both) Gnome 1.0.50 (or 2.0) or KDE2.

FreeBSD (2)

drwiii (434) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643566)

This is a bit off topic, but Walnut Creek CDROM [cdrom.com] just started shipping FreeBSD 3.3 [cdrom.com] CD sets yesterday. If you enjoy open computing, and want to expand your horizons while supporting a wonderful project, it may be worth your while to pick up an official copy of FreeBSD along with that shiny new Red Hat 6.1. (:

--

Re:broken redhat (2)

emrek (11121) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643568)

Hi,

Check out http://www.rpmfind.net/ for a nice rpm repository.

They have a web index, but the easiest way to use the database is with the 'rpmfind' command. For more info on that go to http://rufus.w3.org/linux/rpm2html/rpmfind.html It has some nice options, including downloading dependencies for rpms, checking for upgrades, etc.

Emre |=)

Re:Upgrading? (1)

Speed Racer (9074) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643572)

When you install Red Hat, it asks if you are installing or ugrading an existing installation. YMMV but when I upgraded from Mandrake 6.0 to 6.1 the upgrade went very smoothly. Just some duplicate KDE icons to get rid of.

Red Hat should be similar as Mandrake is the spawn of Red Hat.

Re:ISO from Red Hat? (1)

Cardinal (311) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643574)

If the student is indeed teaching the master (And I would tend to agree that Mandrake has influenced RH's routine) then more power to them. This lends support to the idea that multiple Linux distributions really is a good thing, and not a threat to world peace. I would congradulate the staffs of RedHat and Mandrake for, even if unintentionally, challenging one another to improve themselves.

Does this mean that more and more distros is unconditionally good? No, of course not. I'm sure one of these days we'll see a distro behave in a manner that seems inappropriate or even a little juvenille. But I would still prefer the diversity over relying on one group for my system. After all, relying on one source is why a certain Redmond company writes notoriously late and bloated software.

Re:broken redhat (1)

mattdm (1931) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643576)

AFAIK, the versions of those packages that Red Hat shipped had security fixes applied.

--

Re:broken redhat (1)

CodeRed (5676) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643577)

This can all be done on RedHat as well.
Of course, GnoRPM is high on my list (once you set it to RPMFIND).

Shaky versions is true. They used Pre-Kernels even :) How bad can you get... And an unfinished GNOME.

But I prefer RedHat because it comes with what I need, and has a standard (RPM) instead of going against the grain (especially since RPM is GPL'd).

Debian has too late a release schedule for me.

It would be better if Debian used RPM's. Then I could just mix and match them.

Where to buy quick cheap version of CD? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643579)

How long does it usually take cheapbytes.com to make a cheap version of RedHat after it is released? Does anyone else know a cheap, reliable place other than cheapbytes to get Linux cd's (I wonder who will make RedHat 6.1 available first)?

Re:beowulf (1)

Cardinal (311) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643582)

Don't expect to see beowulf support in your standard RedHat any time soon. According to US export laws, beowulf-capable systems are, for all intents and purposes, munitions.

RedHat does (or did, at one point) carry a beowulf distro called Extreme Linux. I'm not entirelly sure what the status of that is these days.

Red Hat Versions & Updates (5)

Can (21457) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643584)

I really wish Red Hat would open up their development process a bit. Or, at least tell us some of their plans. I realize they don't like to pre-announce features and be accused of vaporware, but it would be nice to know what their thinking is in terms of when packages get updated and when they don't. Or when/why major version numbers increase.

I also know Red Hat is trying to strattle the line between stability for servers and functionality for users, so maybe it's time for two development tracks? One that has a smaller, with a core set of sever-type packages and an server-centric installer. This distribution would get the current treatment of quarterly, well tested updates, and emergency security patches.

But then there should also be a second distribution that is more of a "rolling release" system that maybe gets a bi-weekly set of updates. I think this second distribution is needed to keep up with the active development in the area of user applications.

Both packages would have a lot of overlap, in fact the RPMS should generally usable on either distribution. But for example, we don't need GIMP and the latest version of XBill on servers, but it might be nice to have newer version of GNOME for the desktop distribution since there is such a big difference in the software in four months.

I realize this may not be the ideal way of doing things, but we need to keep two things in mind:

1) Linux is still under heavy development on the client end. In one month, Linux has gnoe from completely unusable on my brand new laptop to almost fully functional thanks to new releases of software. We need this kind of functinoality in the biggest distribution.

2) Microsoft has shown what kind of a mess you can get into when you try to maintain everything from the consumer-level system all the way up to the highets end server-level systems all in one bundle. You get a compromise that doesn't work well for either.

So, at least for another couple years while Linux is in such constant development, wouldn't it make sense to treat Linux distributions a bit differently?

Re:FreeBSD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643586)

Most of us already enjoy open computing, and are supporting a wonderful project by using Linux. Thanks though.

Re:Redhat 6.1 - its worth it, but hold off please (3)

bjk4 (885) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643590)

Official mirrors *do* have time to get a copy ahead of everybody else. As I understand it, there is a private server that mirrors can copy from. They get their copy a few days ahead of schedule, and should they abide by the rules, they do not open the directory until the official announcement.

-Ben

Have you USED Red Hat? (2)

Booker (6173) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643592)

If you've actually used Red Hat, or Linux for that matter, I wouldn't expect you to make comments like "suckers who got 6.0 training need 6.1 training" - that's just not the way it works. If you know how to use Red Hat 5.1, you can probably do just fine with 6.1. Linux changes every day. Red Hat rolls up those changes every 6 months or so, with their new features as well.

And of course, anyone trained on 6.0 who thinks 6.1 will be confusing (!) well - they can just keep running 6.0. :-)

Roman-numerical? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643593)

Seriously though, it's more compact and more elegant. It packs more information into a smaller package, plus it requires no translation (well, not into Roman-numeral languages anyway)

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, while we may use the Roman alphabet, we don't use Roman numerals, otherwise we'd be releasing RedHat VI.I with kernel II.II.XII. Most Western nations and some non-Western nations (like Japan) use Arabic numerals which give us a revolutionary concept of place value

Not XFree or 2.4, but Gnome maybe (2)

Booker (6173) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643595)

Gnome 1.0.50 (which is a major-effort coordinated release) is *almost* ready to go - so I'm surprised that they didn't wait a week or so for that. Ah well. Easy enough to upgrade. Or maybe it's already in there?

Re:does anyone EVER DO ANY RESEARCH?????? (1)

Can (21457) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643598)

Of course, the Membership Card is the piece that makes the difference!

Seriously, though, has anyone tried this program? Are the update CD's anything other than the RHSA updates shipped on a CD? If I wait for RedHat to ship me a CD full of security updates that have been available for a month, aren't I being a bit irresponsible as a sysadmin?

Just wondered

Re:First Post (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643600)

I think, "First Post" posters are cool. I'm an 11 year old boy who's been trapped in a sewer pipe at a construction site for two years now. All I have with me is my laptop and network connection and it's dark here and my leg's broken and wedged behind me and the only thing I have to look forward to is reading /. The "First Post" posts really brighten my day. Oh yeah, my sister e-mailed me today to tell me she has cancer. So please, think of me and don't stop the first post posts! Ok, back to trapping rats for food :(

Re:FreeBSD (1)

weloytty (53582) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643602)

Buy 'em both...I have a firewall running natd for the cable modem on FreeBSD, and a desktop running RH6. Then, there is the NT box, and the 98 box. I have a 486 I am playing with OpenBSD on, but that will be a while. More is better.

Re:Upgrading? (2)

phalanx (94532) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643604)

Redhat 6.1 has an upgrade option. I tested it in the beta of 6.1 on my home pc, and it worked great. It checks the rpm install log, and then just Upgrades everything that you had installed. Not everything will need to be reconfigured, some things might but not everything. Make sure you are not using a USB Keyboard of Mouse, or the cool installer will not start.

Re:Redhat 6.1 - its worth it, but hold off please (2)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643606)

I still disagree.. This is leading to market fragmentation. 6.0 is still *FULL* on the shelves at *EVERY* store i see that carries it. Dell, Compaq and other Vendors now have to do a costly revamp to install 6.1 on machines unless they don't plan on upgrading and then whats the point of following redhat if you don't use the latest.

I firmly believe that this should have been a PRE-RELEASE for 7.0. I believe Beta Xfree86 4.0 should have been included, i believe the beta kernel should have been included, and beta of whatever gnome or kde it wants to use in the 7.0 release should have been included. This would create a market presence.. everyone would be able to toy around with the latest and greatest, vendors wouldn't have to revamp, but would have a roadmap of whats coming..

beta's aren't simply to test, but are also for market acceptance, revamp of installation methods and procedures, sales training, literature planning, advertising and marketing.

ALso, putting out a huge maybe even kludgy beta release would offer the *FIRST* production os to work out the compatibility bugs.. bugs could be killed alot quicker if the applications were interopable and interlaced from the get go.. that way the whole system as a whole gets upgraded, bugs get squashed and the system develops as a piece to function together..

This *IS* market fragmentation.. and NOT what we need. IS groups run stable systems, IS groups will upgrade workstations for the latest and greatest, but never a rollout on such a short product cycle would happen in any instituin of a good size..

I run a companies oracle financials package on oracle and hpux, i am responsible for 200+ workstations that monitor assembly, marketing, inventory and process control. no way in HELL i could implement redhat on these systems with such a short market life. 2 years is what any company expects as MINIMUL life in market, 3 years is the ultimate goal. 6 months is a sham..

again, these are my beliefs.. no reason to flame, but just what i feel. so don't reply with "then don't say anything or don't buy it" because this does'nt explicitly relate to redhat, but the linux market in general.

FreeBSD 3.3 .iso images...finally! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643607)

I was very impressed that the folks at FreeBSD finally offered official .iso images, as I had picked up the official 3.2 at a computer show 2 days before the release of 3.3. It's nice to see this becoming a more popular form of download and more distros of both Linux and *BSD doing it. I'm primarily a Redhat user, so this was an additional plus.

Re:Roman-numerical? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643608)

This is out of topic but the Arabic Numerals you're talking about are in fact Indian Numerals that the arabs "stole" and made theirs before spreading them to the rest of the world...

Re:Where to buy quick cheap version of CD? (1)

Paran (28208) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643609)

linuxmall [linuxmall.com] normally gets their cds made pretty quickly. they're something like $1.99 for linux/*bsd.

Re:Have you USED Red Hat? (1)

hadron (139) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643610)

That just proves the certification model is broken. People should be hired for being able to find out stuff, not knowing stuff. (Although knowing stuff is good).

Re:Redhat 6.1 (2)

hadron (139) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643612)

No, RedHat 6.1 is _not_ an unstable release!!! RedHat does not use the kernel version numbering system for it's distro. Some non-kernel space does use even/odd, but not all of it, and certainly no distros that I am aware of!

odd/even (2)

mattdm (1931) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643613)

Not every project follows the Linux kernel convention of making odd-numbered releases devel and even-numbered ones stable. Red Hat doesn't. (Although historically their .1 releases haven't been the most stable, it wasn't on purpose.)

--

Re:Redhat 6.1 (1)

barlowg (5396) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643614)

Unlike some other software, Redhat does not follow this schema for version numbers. (Most distros don't) Whereas Linux 2.3.x is experimental, Redhat 6.1 is stable. (Lorax, the beta, was 6.0.5x)

And the name of the release is Cartman
--
Gregory J. Barlow
fight bloat. use blackbox [themes.org] .

Do these announcements bother anyone else? (2)

barzok (26681) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643615)

I love the fact that Linux is constantly being improved and new releases coming out, but I worry that the early announcement of Mandreake 6.1, and now RedHat 6.1, could hurt the community. Or, rather, the world's perception of the community.

Things like this could very well foster the idea in the media and the "mainstream users" that Linux users are greedy, immature, impatient, I-want-it-all-screw-you-hippie-gimme-what's-mine-a nd-it's-mine-because-it's GPL'd-right-now people. Yes, the stuff's on a public FTP server. But it has yet to be announced as officially released.

If RedHat felt that the time was right to tell the world, they'd tell the the world. But announcing the release before the mirrors are ready, and before RedHat is ready (if they were ready, they'd make the announcement themselves) is bordering on irresponsible, IMHO. The whole thing isn't even posted yet, just the i386 binaries!

Re:This is not a help service (1)

pest (24214) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643616)

This may not officaly be a help center, but in reality it is where alot of people learn about linux. If help is needed i don't see why we can't give it here on /.

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (1)

Uart (29577) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643617)

Actually redmond called their .1 release windows 98, Second edition was .2, and .3 is codenamed "millenium"

At least RedHat gives bug fix releases away for free (well, they practically have to...) while our friends from washington state call it a new version and charge you mucho pesos for it.

Re:Not XFree or 2.4, but Gnome maybe (2)

MindStalker (22827) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643618)

Yes, but its generally not a good idea to take a brand new release, especially something that has the potential of being buggy like GNOME, and just throwing it into the release. Redhat spends time testing any major new released add to their distro. Plus they would generally want to tune thier distro to work with GNOME, not to mention tuning a specific desktop for thier users. But, if what you want is GNOME and X 2.4 just simply thrown in their, wait till they are released and throw them into redhat 6.x yourself. But unless you really know what your doing, you will have an interesting time trying to customize.

RedHat probably did something wrong wrt mirrors (5)

Yenya (12004) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643619)

I am a maintainer of ftp.fi.muni.cz [fi.muni.cz] (aka ftp.linux.cz [linux.cz] ), which is one of the official mirrors of RedHat Linux. On the RedHat mirror-list they asked us (mirror maintainers) to mirror the 6.1 release, but to not make it available until Monday 4pm UTC.

But: They left their FTP servers open for public downloads of the RH6.1, which does not make sense for me (they have a separate host rh-mirror.redhat.com for mirrors downloading).

Does anybody have an explanation for this?

-Yenya

ummm .. the Redhat minor numbers are bugfixes (1)

Barbarian (9467) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643620)

5.1 and 5.2 were mostly patched versions of 5.0.

At some point, it sucks for new people to download 6.0 and apply 25 patches. So 6.1 is released, new and improved.

Re:First Post (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643621)

It never was cool or funny.

Re:Red Hat Versions & Updates (1)

zilym (3470) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643622)

But then there should also be a second distribution that is more of a "rolling release" system that maybe gets a bi-weekly set of updates. I think this second distribution is needed to keep up with the active development in the area of user applications.

What you're describing sounds like the Red Hat RawHide distribution. While I've never installed a full blown rawhide distro, I do steal SRPMs from it from time to time when a new release of some package comes out that I just gotta have for my standard Red Hat release. Sometimes I even burn new CDs with the updated packages integrated in. See fix-rhcd [ajusd.org] for some information on how to burn custom RH CDs.

Re:They need another way of getting money (3)

bmetzler (12546) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643623)

They should start selling update cd's.
Sounds like you have a good business idea. Go get some venture capital money and post your URL. Just make sure I get a cut for the idea.

LSL [lsl.com] updates their GPL RedHat CD [lsl.com] constantly. From their web site:

Many times after an official distribution is released, bugs are found and updates are posted to the distributor's ftp site. The GNU General Public License allows us obtain the software and it's updates from a distribution site and creating a CD ROM with the site's contents. This ensures that you have the latest material and updates for the product and have a more recent version than the official distribution.
-Brent
--

rpm -Uvh (1)

gothic (64149) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643624)

No easy way to update RPMs? Try reading the man page. =] The -U does a 'update' though it might not be an update some people like. Of course everyone knows what the -v is for .. =] And of course the -h prints hash marks. Anyway, the help associated with the -U is as follows: Upgrade the package currently installed to the version in the new RPM. This is the same as install, except all other versions of the package are removed from the system.
I do agree with the package dep. part, but hey, that's the fun of admin'ing.. =]
As for a 'central location' of RPMs, try http://www.rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/ ...They have more then just RedHat rpms (SuSe, Caldera, OpenLinux, etc) ...Though, RPM Repository and Linuxberg have to be the best sites to goto.. =]

Re:Redhat 6.1 - its worth it, but hold off please (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643625)

I do think that the shorter cycles are better. They are no different from service packs under NT. The idea behind them is to make sure everything is upto date and put it all in one place. The differences between 6.0 and 6.1 are very, very mininal. And not like the jump from 5.2 to 6.0 I think Dell, Compaq, etc would have no problem upgrading to 6.1.

FreeBSD 3.3 - an awesome release of the best OS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643626)

One distro. Incredibly easy and sane remote source updating. Awesome linux compatibility. /usr/ports. All system files available on the world-record holding ftp.freebsd.org. FreeBSD rocks.

can i do an ftp install via my cable modem??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643627)

When i boot up with the bootnet image disk, it's not logging into my road runner account, so i can't get anything except my ip address.

does anyone have any suggestions to get around this??

Re:Not XFree or 2.4, but Gnome maybe (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643628)

Well, Debian already has 1.0.50 in their Gnome directory (not in the unstable distro) so I'd presume that RH has it as well, and that the GNOME folk are only waiting for an official announcement so that the can get complementary publicity. ~luge

Re:another too quick to market jump.. (1)

_SkiBum_ (21493) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643629)

You don't even need to down your system to upgrade, I've changed everything but the kernel without rebooting. And as far as still supporting 6.0, they still release security updates as far back as 3.3 I believe.

debian users are almost as bad as the *BSD guys (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643630)

Na .. *BSD guys hate everyone in their little stuck up little world

Re:Have you USED Red Hat? (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643634)

Certification for *ANY* server OS is a letter saying that you are certified for product rollout, maintenance, administration and configuration.

according to the news, Redhat has a completly new Installation procedure, a completely new upgrade system and other major differences in feature sets

I'm sure for a company to be "Certified RedHat Partner" they have to carry the latest training, vendor approval and QOS so that they can roll out the product according to Vendor Specs.

Should redhat not care about these "security and business ethics" for reliability, and quality of product the that is there problem.

simply being you know linux and then your the king of all unices is bs, and vice versa, just becuase you know 6.0 and are certified on 6.0 doesn't mean your certified to rollout millions of machines with 6.1 installed and still be able to maintain vendor or partner status with "Redhat".

its not as simple as ls is still ls in 6.1 and rpm is still rpm in 6.1, its the business side of this short market life being effected.

Re:What are you talking about? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643635)

So, you have a major change in the kernel, the graphical system, and one the desktop environments, I think that suffices for a 7.0.

Re:does anyone EVER DO ANY RESEARCH?????? (1)

Alan Shutko (5101) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643636)

The update CDs are simply errata on a CD, with an automated install script (since rpm -Uvh * will install rpms you hadn't installed previously).

It's really best if you have a low bandwidth connection, and can't download all those updates all the time.

Re:Redhat 6.1 (2)

MindStalker (22827) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643637)

Well, yea they have got a few more million in their pockets, not to mention the fact that 6.1 being an odd number probably means its an experimental release. (BTW, now that linux is gaining popularity.. do we need to start teaching the PLBs about odd/even releases, if we don't we'll have problem on our hand we the boss starts telling us to upgrade to such and such x.3 or whatever.) Anyways yes, I would hope 6.2 would come out soon, just like 6.0 came out shortly after 5.9 (which was really not 5.9 and geez I've already forgotten the name) Personally I thought that lorax was 6.1 and 6.2 would be the next release.. guess I was wrong.. btw.. whats the name on this release... is it still lorax?

BETAs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643638)

There have been and there are betas of RedHat. This is what lorax was and this is what usually the `roughcuts' is for. "Cartman" is supposed to be a stable release and I think that for some of us the inclusion of XFree-3.3.5 makes it worth downloading. Please remember also that this is FREE SOFTWARE and that it can be easier to ship a completely new `fixed' distribution rather than loads of `service packs'... It is worth remembering as well that the 2.2.5 kernel of Hedwig was not one of the "most stable" ever released... hence I belive that a 6.1 before the 7.0 has been a good idea... Still I'm looking forward to install the successor-to-be to lorax! [with maybe XFree 3.9]

My Take on 6.1 from Beta Testing->Release (5)

Unknwn (646) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643639)

I've been beating pretty hard on the 6.1 beta (lorax) since it's release.

To say that at first there weren't any bugs would be a lie of course, but I've seen _great_ leaps ahead over the course of it. At the beginning, it took some work to get it to work.

But, through lots of beta testing, and lots of late night hacking by Matt Wilson, it's now to the point that it's the easiest installer I've seen. Much easier than Caldera's graphical, in large part, because it gives you a lot more freedom in the install. The GUI install works for CDROM installs, NFS installs, and (untested, but should work I believe) hard drive installs. If the GUI installer doesn't work for you (or you don't want it even), never fear. There's still a text-based installer for low-ram machines, and ftp or http installs.

Other nice neat things in 6.1 (for those wondering)
- kudzu: kudzu does hardware detection and will start the appropriate configuration tool. Very neat
- an interactive startup option (disable-able) ala choose what you want to start during startup for Windows 9x and DOS; so for when you screw up your sendmail config, you can still start without taking ages :)
- up2date: service to give access to a priority server upon registration and then will give you the new rpms in updates and give you the opportunity to install them, just download them, few other options
- fsck has a progress bar :)
- rp3: an easy-to-use ppp configuration tool. I haven't actually completely tested this one being on ethernet and all, but it appeared to work
- XFree 3.3.5, 2.2.12, GNOME 1.0.40 stuff (newest when it mastered...), KDE 1.1.2, glibc 2.1.2

Think that's most of the good interesting stuff. As I said, it's shaping up to be _really_ solid from what I can tell.



--
Jeremy Katz

Re:broken redhat (3)

Aaron (1233) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643641)

re rpm:
RPM uses -i for install, -U for upgrade, and -F for freshen. Have a bunch of RPMS, and you just want to install the updates for what you already have? Freshen them (rpm -Fvh *). Unfortunately, I have seen this break down, especially with kernel rpms. As for the central depository, anything that comes out of redhat proper doesnt depend on anything not in the distribution. 3rd party RPMS are different, but I have never had a problem finding requirements at freshmeat.

re: flakiness.
6.x (i am currently using rawhide), gnome issues aside is quite stable for me, and is current as far as i know. And actually, even gnome is decently stable now.

I like redhat myself, but I havent tried debian yet. One of these days, when I have an extra machine to play with, i might.

Re:Red Hat Versions & Updates (3)

barlowg (5396) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643643)

Redhat did have an open beta, it was called lorax. I believe it was announced on /. Lorax included the graphical installer and featured two releases for testing. There was also a mailing list for discussion of bugs and things that needed to be added or chnaged. If this is not open development, I don't know what is.

Secondly, your wish for a parallel distro with the newest of everything has been around for quite awhile. It is called rawhide, and it is the current status of Redhat's development. If all you want are updates, Redhat has those too, and they come out pretty frequently. Though the boxed sets may not offer the stuff that came out last week, the updates do. In 6.1, getting updates is even easier. Seems they have a nifty gui update tool, and if you buy a boxed set and register, you get access to a separate (and probably faster) ftp site for updates.
--
Gregory J. Barlow
fight bloat. use blackbox [themes.org] .

Re:FreeBSD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1643645)

Yeah, if you've got nothing better to do than screw around with a bunch of OSes that are basically the same thing (UNIX)

My, aren't you a dickhead (0)

Bhagera (82795) | more than 14 years ago | (#1643647)

If you don't want to help someone out then just quietly move on with your reading.
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