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Fallout From the November Console Wars

Zonk posted more than 7 years ago | from the whew-i-can-finally-take-off-this-helmet dept.

XBox (Games) 182

All three 'next generation' consoles are out, and we can finally stop using that term. The NPD numbers for last month have been released, and there's plenty of information there to discuss. Analysts have already made some observations, with brandintel specifically pointing out the Xbox 360's 'surprising' role in last month's fight. For some more well-reasoned thought, Dean Takahashi's take is the place to turn: "At this rate, Microsoft isn't going to hit its goal of 10 million units by year end ... Sony's number is consistent with its warnings, but 197,000 is worse than what many expected ... the fair fight is really going to be what happens in the year 2007, when all three console makers should be able to ship as many consoles as consumers want. To me, this looks like consumers are hit with a case of sticker shock. The mass market is paying for cheap PS2s, DS Lites, and GBAs." Despite the Wii's success last month, it should be noted that Nintendo is no longer bragging of 1 Million units in the U.S. by the end of the year. So, essentially, it looks like all three companies will fail to hit their console goals for the year.

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shucks... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17177886)

I saw Fallout, but no 3. Frankly, I don't care what happens with those consoles, just give me my Fallout 3!

Re:shucks... (0, Offtopic)

scombs (1012701) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178018)

I'm not sure you want that, with Bethesda behind the wheel. Elder Scrolls: Fallout, even more buggy than Fallout 2, but with light bloom! I'll take Van Buren, thanks.

Re:shucks... (1)

John Nowak (872479) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180552)

Only if they turn it over to the original developers first. The last thing I want is Morrowind with guns.

Re:shucks... (1)

HeavyAl (695278) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181094)

Amen, brother!

Screw the consoles, give us some quality game play with a real story line. And I'm not talking about the shoddy excuse for a story they threw out in FOT:BOS.

Hell, I'd settle for a retooled version of Dungeon Siege/Diablo and its ilk styled using some kind of isometric real time engine .. I've had just about enough of these attempts at making everything 3d and ultra-realistic.

Great games start in the mind, and those kinds of games start with a good story. This flashy console stuff is a bunch of fluff with no soul.

Interesting (0)

Kingrames (858416) | more than 7 years ago | (#17177890)

I rather expected a large turnout for the Wii.

Re:Interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17177924)

Thus far I've only seen a few interesting games. Nintendo has the best "Gift" potential due to the all ages tendency. Final Fantasy games (GBA, DS, PS2) have been highest on my wishlist this year.

Re:Interesting (2, Insightful)

Kingrames (858416) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178024)

"...Nintendo has the best "Gift" potential... "

Precisely.

Re:Interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17181948)

mod parent overrated..

Re:Interesting (3, Informative)

FroBugg (24957) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179562)

They're still selling every single Wii they ship, often within minutes of it leaving the box, but the problem is that Nintendo isn't shipping quite as many as they had originally said they'd like to. They haven't offered any reasons for this.

Re:Interesting (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17180410)

If I could find a place selling them where I did not have to wait in line for a couple hours outside the building for the opportunity to maybe buy one, I would go there and buy one right now. This holds for all of my friends who have the remotest interest in gaming that I have talked to. Wii is where it is at for price and actual innovation. Btw, improving graphics is no longer an innovation when I can get better graphics by building a computer myself and still spend less money. I am looking at you Sony. But even the 360 is not that great of a deal.

Re:Interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17180496)

Originally I believed it would be a Sony cakewalk. A grown man.. drooling in anticipation of a gaming system. However I changed by mind awhile back. The reason for this change in outlook isn't the delays, mixed reviews, nor sticker shock.

    It was the rootkit incident.

      Ridiculing Sony products used to be almost sacrilege but after that we (techie types) pounded them mercilessly for that incident. I know that it pissed me off royally. And today as a result that negative press seems to have taken a life of its own. I get a sense many are almost wishing for it to fail in spite. I suspect the incident literally cost Sony billions in sales across their product line.

        They may have overcome the other issues if we were all still in blind love with Sony. However I think that incident turned Sony away from the Santa company that sold us amazing toys we loved to buy... into being just another cliche faceless corporation. We all know companies are about making money but gamers are about having fun... and that incident really did suck the fun out of it for many of us.

    Of course they'll still sell plenty of units but it won't reach PS2 highs. PS4 may have more luck in ten years when the new kids come in and the incident will become another footnote in history. I don't hate Sony. I mostly feel the apathy of a lover that was once cheated on but has now moved on.

    I am looking forward to the purchase my new Xbox360.

Re:Interesting (1)

DECS (891519) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181904)

I agree that Sony acted irresponsibly in installing DRM software scandalously as it did. But the Sony Windows Rootkit was enabled by Microsoft, who shipped a product that happily installed the covert software for users without them even knowing.

So if the rootkit incident taints Sony forever, buying new products from Microsoft isn't exactly assuming some high moral ground. Microsoft's answer to Sony's "problem" (the rational behind the rootkit) was provided by PlaysForSure, a similarly twisted and evil system that is similarly built into the system and denies users' rights. Combined with the general security design flaws of Windows, Micosoft is no better than Sony on the DRM front or the "gives a crap about users" front.

You're better off buying the system you like to play, because whatever system you buy is going to be playing you, whether you realize it or not.

PlayStation 3 vs. Xbox 360 vs. Nintendo Wii [roughlydrafted.com]

Remedial geography (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17177916)

All three 'next generation' consoles are out and we can finally stop using that term.

*Cough* Europe.

Despite the Wii's success last month, it should be noted that Nintendo is no longer bragging of 1 Million units in the U.S. by the end of the year. So, essentially, it looks like all three companies will fail to hit their console goals for the year.

That was for 'The Americas'.

Re:Remedial geography (2, Informative)

keeboo (724305) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179160)

That was for 'The Americas'.

You mean North America.
I see no sign of any of those consoles here in Brazil.

Re:Remedial geography (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17180424)

Brazil != entire Latin America.

Re:Remedial geography (1)

caudron (466327) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180516)

That was for 'The Americas'.

Yeah. That's what he said. L.A. New York. Chicago. Detroit. etc.... You know, the Americas. What else is there?

(Es una chiste, mis amigos suramericanos.)

Tom Caudron
http://tom.digitalelite.com/ [digitalelite.com]

Re:Remedial geography (3, Funny)

I Like Pudding (323363) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180772)

We'd be more than happy to give away Detroit

We are aware of Europeans. (1, Insightful)

dfenstrate (202098) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181024)

We are aware of you Europeans. But we're not talking about you. Not everything is about you guys, don't you know? Not everything is about the US either, but this article is

Anyway, It always helps to read the FAQ.

Especially the Slashdot version.

I quote:

Slashdot seems to be very U.S.-centric. Do you have any plans to be more international in your scope?

Slashdot is U.S.-centric. We readily admit this, and really don't see it as a problem. Slashdot is run by Americans, after all, and the vast majority of our readership is in the U.S. We're certainly not opposed to doing more international stories, but we don't have any formal plans for making that happen. All we can really tell you is that if you're outside the U.S. and you have news, submit it, and if it looks interesting, we'll post it.

It is worth noting that there is a Japanese Slashdot run by VA Japan. While we helped them a little in their early days, they essentially run their own content without any real involvement from us... none of us can read Kanji! There are currently no plans to do other language or nation specific Slashdot sites.


Do europeans want a pity mention every time a discussion of the North American market comes up?

It's the Sticker Shock (5, Insightful)

scombs (1012701) | more than 7 years ago | (#17177918)

When it comes down to it, I believe I can have the same amount of fun (if not more) with the $130 Nintendo DS than I could with the $300+ current-gen consoles. My fun wouldn't increase five-fold if I bought a PS3, I don't think.

Re:It's the Sticker Shock (5, Insightful)

2nd Post! (213333) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178114)

After playing Rayman and Sports, however, I do think your fun would increase two-fold if you bought a Wii... which coincidentally is less than twice a DS.

Re:It's the Sticker Shock (2, Insightful)

KokorHekkus (986906) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178120)

I think you're right when it comes to the long run ("extreme" gamers don't make up the majority of the customers. And from what I've read it would seem like Nintendo has an advantage when it comes to appealing to the non-gamers/occasional gamers with the new controllers... because. as you say, it allows them to have more fun. So I'm guessing the Wii will do allright (not saying it will come up on top but though) Me? No console and don't play much games.

Re:It's the Sticker Shock (1)

skam240 (789197) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179728)

"extreme" gamers can some times set the trends that more casual players will follow, however. it's still too soon to tell where this will all go.

Re:It's the Sticker Shock (1)

sootman (158191) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180544)

But I've got a family, and we can't all play a DS at once. I'd buy a Wii in a second if there were any around--$250 isn't bad at all. I will get one eventually but I'd love to get one for the family for XMas--too bad there aren't enough. With the great reviews and the great price I think it'd be the winner if there were more.

Re:It's the Sticker Shock (1)

Chandon Seldon (43083) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180964)

Fun doesn't need to increase linearly.

You can have quite a bit of fun playing various forms of solitaire with a $2 pack of playing cards. Are you really going to say that a Nintendo DS is 65 times more fun than a pack of cards? Actually, does trying to define a "fun comparison factor" even work?

Any notable increase in fun that you can afford is generally worth it. The Nintendo DS isn't 65 times better than the pack of cards, but it's still worth getting a Nintendo DS because it's fun. If you want to play games that are available on the PS3 and you can afford around $700 for the console and the game, that's worth it. If you can afford a 50" 1080p HDTV to go with your PS3, that'll be worth it too because you'll get an awesome picture.

One more system (2, Interesting)

Sciros (986030) | more than 7 years ago | (#17177922)

But what if I want to talk about the Infinium Labs Phantom? can I still use the term "next generation?" A friend of mine was really confused about the console sale figures, as was I. And then we both realized we're playing the PS2 I bought just a month ago :-) (for FFXII). With so many folks being excited for the Wii/PS3 releases, I'd say not only sticker shock but also a determination to have at least something to play is what sold the other consoles. That and black friday making Game Boys cheap-as-free. I wonder just how many sold on that day...

Re:One more system (1)

dotbenjamin (1034650) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179600)

"Black Friday"? Can anyone clarify what that is a reference to? Maybe it's an American thing.

Re:One more system (1)

Golin_KNar (692494) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179916)

Black Friday is the day after the American Thanksgiving and the begining of Christmas shopping. Most stores have huge discounts, vendors have cool displays, and new products are released. All of that causes lots of people to go to the stores en mass, making it difficult to get to anywhere or do anything other than stay home or shop.

Re:One more system (1)

idugcoal (965425) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180052)

Traditionally, "Black Friday" is the day after Thanksgiving, when (as the previous poster mentioned) many stores have huge sales. That day is, according to lore, the day that many businesses begin to make a profit for the year. I'm not sure how accurate this is, as I'm not in retail, but this doesn't sound reasonable to my ears. Check out snopes' perspective here: http://www.snopes.com/holidays/thanksgiving/shoppi ng.asp [snopes.com]

Re:One more system (1)

rfunches (800928) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182098)

The Snopes article only focuses on the myth that Black Friday is the busiest shopping day of the year (false: it is the Saturday before Christmas, has been for many years) but does correctly define Black Friday as the day which supposedly brings most businesses into a profit for the year -- the financial phrase "in the black" means you are making money, whereas being "in the red" means you are losing money. Snopes doesn't comment on whether the definition is true, but it certainly makes sense for seasonal retailers.

Analysts (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17177976)

Okay. Let's assume for a moment that I announce to the press that I'm going to sell 1 million units or Product A by year end. There's much hype and fanfare, then I'm only able to actually produce 500,000 units. The Sales numbers at this point no longer mean anything. You can only have a valid comparison if there is a steady supply of all three models. Come on folks THINK.

-ac

-Parent should have never made slashdot...there nothing to read here move on..

Re:Analysts (1)

iamdrscience (541136) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178148)

That's a good point, but if a company really thinks they're going to be able to sell a million units of their product it seems like they'd go out of their way to make sure that a million units are available. Even if it cuts into the amount of money you make per unit, it'd be worth it for double the sales.

Re:Analysts (4, Insightful)

Chris Burke (6130) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179212)

There's much hype and fanfare, then I'm only able to actually produce 500,000 units. The Sales numbers at this point no longer mean anything. You can only have a valid comparison if there is a steady supply of all three models. Come on folks THINK.

Actually, they do mean something, just not that much about market acceptance. Since these consoles sold out, we can use the sales numbers as production numbers. And from that standpoint, there are really two interesting pieces of information: Not really a surprise given all the warnings, but Sony was able to make only half of their grossly down-sized forecasts. This means producing the PS3 is even more difficult than was thought, or the blue lasers are in even shorter supply than thought, and may even indicate that the longer term supply will be limited. In some ways more surprising is that Nintendo was unable to reach their manufacturing target for launch. I would naively assume that they should have minimal problems, but that apparently isn't the case. Maybe the remote is a trickier beast than thought? Supplies of extra remotes have been short for those who were able to buy a console.

I realize that these sales figures may not be complete. I doubt that means Sony really sold twice as many consoles.

An interesting catch: All these companies depend on IBM. Apple dropped IBM largely because they didn't seem ready or willing to develop and produce mainstream chips on a schedule that suited Apple. Are they partly responsible for the shortage of PS3 and Wii? I have no data to back that up at all; it's just idle speculation.

Re:Analysts (3, Interesting)

Hes Nikke (237581) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180884)

An interesting catch: All these companies depend on IBM. Apple dropped IBM largely because they didn't seem ready or willing to develop and produce mainstream chips on a schedule that suited Apple.


ah, but apple wanted faster iterations of PPCs every 6 months. What they got was a 700 MHz upgrade in 1.8 years, and then the top speed got cut back by 200 MHz to make room for dual core CPUs. Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft all have PPC specs set in stone for the next 5 or 6 years. much more compatible with IBM's slow pace of consumer chip upgrades.

Re:Analysts (1)

DeadChobi (740395) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179554)

While I agree that some of the analysis is a little overblown in significance, I think you might be overreacting. Slashdot is what brings us news every day, and to say that its parent should never have made it makes it feel very sad and unwanted.

Sticker shock for sure (5, Interesting)

analog_line (465182) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178090)

I've no plans to buy an Xbox or a PS3 for only reasons of price. $500 as the minimum cost of entry for a system and one game is just nuts. I can't afford it, and I won't bother with it. There's nothing inherent that I will get out of either of those systems over the Xbox and PS2 that I own now, other than the derision of my friends, that I spent a pile of money I could've spent on food or rent on those. I'm sure the games are great, and I wouldn't mind owning one, but they're not worth that, no matter how many fools are willing to overpay for it.

I'd like to get a Wii, and I have a reasonable chance of both affording and getting my hands on one at some point soon. However, right now, I'm actually considering getting a new GBA SP, because I have a lot of games I like for GBA, and an SP is a lot easier to carry around than even the new DS Lite (and a lot easier than my original recipe DS). And a second PS2 to backup my current box, so I can play all the good PS2 games that are now showing up in bargain bins before they become collectors items. Once the price comes down to something resembling reasonable, I'll get a PS3, and maybe even an Xbox 360, but it's got a LONG way to fall before it gets there.

Re:Sticker shock for sure (1)

karmachild (1036700) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178762)



Roger That!

"A fool and his money are soon parted" -W.C. Fields

Re:Sticker shock for sure (1)

Shemmie (909181) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179358)

Spot on. Not a console gamer myself, only ever owned a PS1 and my PSP, but the Wii is the console for me, and I look forward to getting one. The PS3 leaves me cold. If the Xbox 360 comes down a fair bit, I might get one for the Media Center functionality.

Re:Sticker shock for sure (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17178862)

sorry but i totally disagree! i buy a console today for $500, you buy it two years later for $200. that means i spend $150 a year for the console! thats a little over $10 a month, and for the enjoyment i recieve out of it i would gladly pay that amount of money!

you might want to get a gba micro not an sp (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17179276)

I just got one on black friday for cheap. it's tiny! I love it! only thing is the screen is pretty small.

X360 base price is $299 not $500 (2, Informative)

xswl0931 (562013) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181548)

The base X360 is $299. With game, that's $350. Use the Overstock 12% off coupon and it's ~$308 for the base console plus one game. That's a big difference from your $500 claim (even without the coupon). Don't confuse the 360 price with the PS3 price.

Re:X360 base price is $299 not $500 (1)

DECS (891519) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181946)

Of course, with the $200 Microsoft HD-DVD, the 360 is the exact same price as the PS3. Microsoft just allows you to not buy HD optical player as an option, so its not really less expensive at all, its just offered in a cheaper configuration.

PlayStation 3 vs. Xbox 360 vs. Nintendo Wii [roughlydrafted.com]

HD-DVD not required (1)

xswl0931 (562013) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182024)

You're assuming everyone wants or needs HD-DVD, which simply is not the case. Not everyone who buys the PS3 will play Bluray movies just like not everyone who buys a PSP plays UMD movies. The HD-DVD add-on is simply an optional accessory that has no impact on gaming.

Re:HD-DVD not required (1)

DECS (891519) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182084)

No that's the point of options: Microsoft provides an option of getting it or not. Sony doesn't.

Sony wants to force adoption of Bluray, and if it can make everyone who buys a PS3 a Bluray customer, that will help.

Microsoft's unbundling of the HD-DVD gives gamers uninterested in HD a discount, but that also means that HD-DVD won't be as widely available, making it less attractive for studios to release their movies for. It's the same problem Microsoft has with the hard drive option: the low end base model of the 360 lacks a hard drive, meaning that users will have to buy one in order to use the Live online movie service. Since many users will opt for cheaper, Microsoft is cutting down its potential audience for online movie sales, making it less likely that Microsoft will keep it going. It may end up ditching it like it abandonded PlaysForSure, screwing both partners and customers who bought into it, including many stupid libarians who made sure all their crap was locked up in PlaysForSure DRM.

The Two Faced Monster Inside Zune [roughlydrafted.com]

Re:HD-DVD not required (1)

GodInHell (258915) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182448)

I think it was very wise to cut the expense of the HD-dvd from the base model. Even assuming sony wasn't out there trying to tear buisiness away from HD-dvd, it wouldn't have been true to the xbox model. The original Xbox didn't play movies without the decoder/remote option. As then, there is no reason to try to make the 360 a true all-things to all people solution - give me what I want, let me leave what I don't care for on the floor.

The lack of Hard Drive in the 360 seemed at first to be a rip-off.. but I went without one for the first few months (relying on a trusty memory card) and I never noticed the lack of storage space, even while downloading some minimal content. the Hard Drive is thus similar to the HD-dvd add on, if you want the space to support movies and make the best out of the machine, you buy the hard drive at a decent price. Not a fair price for sure, but well within reasonable for the demos, movies, and games you can get off Live.

This modular design has allowed me to build my xbox the way I need it, yes to the hard drive, yes to wireless, no to HD-DVD, and 4 wireless controllers. Defraying the cost by spreading it out also helped diminish sticker shock, for what that's worth.

-GIH

XBox a surprise winner? (4, Insightful)

Hawthorne01 (575586) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178210)

No, not when you think about it. Consider the typical big-box electronics store customer:

"Excuse me, do you have any PS3's?"
"No."
"Nintendo Wii's?"
"No."
"Well, what do you have in stock?"
"The xBox 360."
"We'll take it."

Having product on the shelves covers a multitude of sins.

Re:XBox a surprise winner? (1)

mgabrys_sf (951552) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179146)

And they'll take it back to the store after Johnny registers his dissapointment in not getting the "hot new game system of 2006". Sorry - I think the eBay frenzy is pretty much solidified which consoles are "hot" in most consumer's minds.

BTW It took me 3 weeks to score a "classic controller" for the Wii. This blue-ray laser shortage is really packing a punch!

Re:XBox a surprise winner? (1)

robbiedo (553308) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179498)

Thousands of PS3 are selling closer to cost on eBay.

I think you mean something else ... (1)

jchenx (267053) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180650)

Sorry - I think the eBay frenzy is pretty much solidified which consoles are "hot" in most scalper's minds
There, I fixed it for you.

Re:XBox a surprise winner? (1)

donaldm (919619) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180420)

Well I live in Australia and have a PS2 so it would go something like this.

Browses massive selection of PS2.
Find some very good games for half to a quarter of retail price.
Go home with a collection of good to very good PS2 games.
Saves myself a huge amount of money.

Or the person who is looking for a game machine for a present.
Hmm! PS2 is cheap and I can get a huge selection of games for a smaller outlay of money
Guess I'll get the PS2 plus some games.

Or the grandparents/parents buying for the kids.
Hmm! The kids already ave a PS2 so I could get some games for them. This will save me.
Hmm! Handheld appear to be popular so I will get the DS plus some (not many) game for the kids.

Even some of the cheap second hand PS2 games look attractive so why would I want to spend AU$600 to AU$750 for an Xbox360 or AU$400 for a Wii and a pack-in games.

Re:XBox a surprise winner? (1)

Hawkxor (693408) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181976)

[i]Even some of the cheap second hand PS2 games look attractive so why would I want to spend AU$600 to AU$750 for an Xbox360 or AU$400 for a Wii and a pack-in games.[/i]

Why would somebody want to do this? Because they can afford it. ...

Couldnt be worse for Sony (3, Insightful)

LibertineR (591918) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178220)

Has another corporation ever had such a single bad year?

Who'd thought that the Wii would suck the life out of the PS3 launch?

The Wii gets all kinds of free press and publicity, if not for Sports, then for idiots destroying their plasma screens and blaming the Wii-mote strap for being too weak.

In the mean time, Microsoft has the best game out in Gears of War for the 360, while the only thing I hear about the PS3 is that it is so hard to program that most games will suck on it for another year.

Oh, and thanks for the root kit, Sony. Karma is a bitch, eh?

Re:Couldnt be worse for Sony (2, Interesting)

Jace of Fuse! (72042) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178698)

I am not going to knock Gears of War, since I just bought it the other day and have yet to have a chance to really sit down with it. But I don't think Gears of War is going to appeal to too many people other than shooter fans and Xbox 360 fans.

Sure, the game looks beautiful, amazing even. But to jaded gamers or casual gamers there isn't enough there to draw in anyone who wouldn't have already been drawn in already. I personally picked it up, played it for about 10 minutes, said "neat", and put it down. I'll get back to it when I have more time.

When I picked up Wii Sports, on the other hand, I said "neat", and I couldn't put it down.

There is a huge difference here.

Gears of War isn't going to expand the 360 much further beyond the existing gaming crowd. Wii Sports will.

On the other hand, there is a lot to be said about stores actualy having 360's and Gears of War in stock. Because, you know, you can actually get those if you want 'em. Of course, you can also get a PS2 and FF12 or Guitar Hero II as well... for less money.

Re:Couldnt be worse for Sony (1)

LibertineR (591918) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178768)

I should have been more clear, as I only meant best game out during the launch season, when Sony should have captured all the attention. Gears of War is good, but not earthshaking. I expect Halo 3 to accomplish that, though. The big winner is the Wii, and Microsoft did okay for not having any big news of their own. Sony lost this one big-time.

Not sure yet about Wii Sports (1)

jchenx (267053) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180548)

I'm not so sure on Wii Sports. I got a chance to try out two games recently, Tennis and Boxing. Both were interesting, but really seemed gimmicky. It disturbed me that in Tennis, you didn't control player movement and all you could do was swing. As for boxing, my character didn't really do what I always wanted it to do. You know how people "button mash" to win certain games? For Wii games, it's all about the "violent shaking". That said, I've heard that Tennis and Boxing may be the worst of the Wii titles, so I am hoping that the other sports are better.

That said, I agree completely with your statement that Wii Sports will expand beyond the existing gaming crowd. As a free pack-in game, it does a great job introducing the console to non-gamers. I just don't know how long its going to last. Anyone who thinks that the Wii is going to suddenly take the middle-age non-gamer public by storm, is going to be mightly depressed. It's not going to make a gamer out of your parents, but it might be something they pull out every so often, when they have friends over.

Then again, that might be good enough for Nintendo, since they make money off console sales and don't need a high attach rate like Sony and MS do.

Re:Couldnt be worse for Sony (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17180562)

I think the surprising thing is that the 360 is not doing better than it is. The PS3 numbers are limited by supply. We know there aren't any more to be had. The same for the Wii. There's no such restriction on the 360, and with the so-called 'Sony backlash' I thought the 360 would get a huge boost. Look at the numbers. It didn't happen. The 360 isn't doing much better than the 'can't be found in stores' Wii. I think this doesn't look good for Microsoft. Surprisingly, it seems that when the supply restrictions for the Sony disappear, more people will be buying that than the Xbox.

Re:Couldnt be worse for Sony (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17181028)

bitter bitter nerds ever since the root kit fiasco.

Hate to burst your bubble but nobody cares and the PS3 will still sell.
Go back to your hole nerd and play the Wii with the children.

Many with worse years, and Sony's not bad. (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181870)

Perhaps you've heard of Tyco or Enron or Worldcom?

See, there are plenty of corperations who have had way worse years. Even with teh Rootkit stuff Sony isn't even on the same level as those guys.

What Sony has had is manufacturing problems, and some bad press. But they have actually had not a bad year when it comes to the gaming segment - sure the PS3 supply is lower than they had hoped but it is still selling out of stores instantly - some people seemed to feel Sony wouldn't sell ten units. Nolan Bushnel doubted they could sell a million in a year, but Sony still says they can sell taht many by the end of this year! And while many think the PSP is a dismal flop, what people don't realize is that it's actually selling OK - it just looks like a flop next to the supernova that is the DS Lite. But one companies success does not autmatically mean anothers doom, and so the PSP continues on in the market. The only real gaming failure I've seen from Sony this year is UMD, now that was the most awful idea ever.

And of course, what you seem to have forgotten is that eclipsing all the sales of NextGen consoles was the PS2, just as it has done almost every month this year. So was this even the year of NextGen consoles at all? And don't you think Sony might have made just a tiny bit of money on all the PS2's that sell month after month in greater numbers even than the Wii?

Supporting evidence - NPD PSP numbers (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181906)

And while many think the PSP is a dismal flop, what people don't realize is that it's actually selling OK - it just looks like a flop next to the supernova that is the DS Lite.

I just thought I should provide supporting evidence for that assertion - From the NPD report [joystiq.com] :

Units:
DS, 918k.
PSP, 412k

See? A little under half of what the DS sold. Not nearly as many as the DS but also not an unmitigated disaster either - I'll bet you wish you made something that 412,000 people wanted enough to pay $200 for. That's enough units being sold that Sony does not have to think of cancling the PSP, just as Gamecube's third place standing in the last round of consoles did not mean Nintendo had to fold either.

Re:Supporting evidence - NPD PSP numbers (1)

catprog (849688) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182230)

Don't forget the other handheld

DS, 918k
Game Boy Advance: 661k
PSP, 412k

Irrelevant to my point (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182266)

I already said that Nintendo's success was like a supernova. Adding in GBA figures does nothing to address the point I was making.

Just because Nintendo is doing amazingly well, does not mean the PSP is not also doing OK. From the press and general comments in forums I had though the PSP was selling more like 20k units a month - and was startled that so many were being sold. At 412k units a month, nothing can be considered a "failure" even if the success is not as great as Nintendo has seen. And looking back, PSP figures have been more in the hundreds of thousands each month - not the tens of thousands trash talk had led me to believe.

I don't even own any handheld units; I just don't have places in my life where they would be of use often enough to justify one. But many people out there seem to be buying both the DS, and PSP.

Cheap PS2s... (4, Funny)

LearnToSpell (694184) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178298)

Re:Cheap PS2s... (1)

momerath2003 (606823) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178640)

I appropriately misread "Bid with confidence" as "Bid with confusion."

Re:Cheap PS2s... (1)

Kreigaffe (765218) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179016)

haha

"You're bidding on Sony Playstations, 3 of them."

mod auction +5 clever (or is that +5 slimy?)

Re:Cheap PS2s... (1)

xantho (14741) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179024)

Wow, and the buyer's ebay handle is a 10 digit number. You think that's a phone number? I normally wouldn't think so necessarily, but this person did pay $900 for three of the original Sony Playstation. Now that's dumb.

Not worth the entry price (1)

RichPowers (998637) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178302)

Consumers aren't entirely stupid. If you don't already own one, you can snag a PS2 dirt cheap. And there's a huge library of games - many going for $10-30, even cheaper used. PS2 even has some awesome games coming out in 2007, like Rogue Galaxy. If you're itching for party games (sans Wii Remote of course), you can't go wrong with Gamecube's library. The last gen (funny saying that) still has plenty of life.

The point is the current lineup for Wii and PS3 isn't that great, especially considering the high asking price.

That, and the technical jump to Wii/PS3 from GC/PS2 is less than the jump from N64/PSX to GC/PS2.

surprising (1)

Superfarstucker (621775) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178314)

I think things actually look pretty damn good for Microsoft's console considering it has been out for over a year. How many consoles do you think Nintendo and Sony will be selling next holiday season? For reference, Microsoft moved about 900,000 units in 2005 when they launched and due to supply issues it was almost impossible to find one until mid february according to wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_launch#North [wikipedia.org] _America [wikipedia.org]

From those numbers it really seems like nintendo has screwed the pooch with this launch or that they are artificially restricting supply to give the illusion that greater demand exists. They should have had many more units available for sale given they are using essentially the same hardware that was found in the gamecube. To be fair I do believe Microsoft's advertising budget absolutely dwarfed what Nintendo has spent on launch advertising. But from where we are standing right now it seems Microsoft has positioned itself well and stands a good chance of taking the lion's share of the 'next generation.'

Stop the "Artificial restricting supply" nonsense! (5, Insightful)

jchenx (267053) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178610)

From those numbers it really seems like nintendo has screwed the pooch with this launch or that they are artificially restricting supply to give the illusion that greater demand exists. They should have had many more units available for sale given they are using essentially the same hardware that was found in the gamecube.
When will people realize that this whole "artificially restricting supply" theory is just wrong. First there were claims that MS was doing this with the 360, then next with Sony, and finally with Nintendo. The theory is just absurd.

Do you think those companies want to miss their sales forecasts, and get punished in the stock market for doing so? Of course not. All three companies have run into supply problems because, well, releasing a console worldwide is pretty damn difficult. (Consider that in the past, hardware releases were generally not global either) Should MS, Sony, and Nintendo be chastised for their errors? Certainly.

But this whole "oh, they're just artificially restricting supply to make the illusion of demand" is just nonesense. It's usually spouted off by fanbois who can't imagine that there are actually consumers that want the "other" system.

Re:Stop the "Artificial restricting supply" nonsen (1)

dunstan (97493) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179152)

Nintendo's game plan is surely influenced by the fact that Sony hasn't launched PS3 other than North America. They have the European and Asian market buzz to themselves - the news channels here in GB are full of stories about Wii, while there has been nothing about PS3 because it doesn't launch until March.

If I were Nintendo I'd want to be getting units into the European markets pronto before people start holding back their purchases for the PS3 launch. For the unlucky ones there is a waiting list for Wiis to be delivered in the new year - there is no waiting list for PS3.

Whatever, I've got a Wii safely tucked away for my children's Christmas present (just had to make sure it worked properly - took a while coz i needed to check all the games in Wii sports). No way I'd have bought them a PS3 at launch prices.

Re:Stop the "Artificial restricting supply" nonsen (1)

Chris Burke (6130) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179314)

Do you think those companies want to miss their sales forecasts, and get punished in the stock market for doing so? Of course not.

Spot on with the stock market comment. Plus we all saw pictures of the lines for the PS3 release. If Sony could have sold a PS3 at $600 to every one of those people instead of the first half dozen, do you think they wouldn't have? PS3 is a strategic tool for Sony for pushing Blu Ray, and the strength of that push is dependent entirely on the number of PS3 sold. So they would limit the number they sold, keeping it unclear whether their strategy would pay off or backfire? It makes no sense. Some nonsensical "perceived demand" is irrelevent compared to actual consoles in the market as far as directing the future of the market. Which does a better job of encouraging sales via word of mouth: "I wanted a PS3 but there wasn't one to buy", or "I got a PS3, check out how cool it is, you can get one too".

Same goes for Nintendo. If you're trying to expand beyond the traditional gamer demographic, then you damn well better be able to sell to people who aren't willing to wait in line for it!

Re:Stop the "Artificial restricting supply" nonsen (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17182336)

>When will people realize that this whole "artificially restricting supply" theory is just wrong. First there were claims that MS was doing this with the 360, then next with Sony, and finally with Nintendo. The theory is just absurd.

Absurd but true. Even after the launch date, Nintendo still dictated when stores could sell their Wiis they have in stock. One store here (Futureshop) sold some wiis on the wednesday before black friday (no black friday in canada but during that week) and they got bitched at by nintendo hq.

Also Nintendo has always been known to artificially push back release dates (even if they are finished) for games, to spread them out during the year. One such example is earthbound on nes. The game was completely finished/translated and they didn t relaase it so as not to interfear with the sales of other games.

Re:surprising (1)

doormat (63648) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179934)

From what I've read, Nintendo is having supply chain issues - that is they physically are having problems getting consoles to the big box stores. And when you look at the issues present, it seems about the only explanation - the hardware isnt too advanced to be having yield issues, manufacturing capacity is there, its just they cant get the boats fast enough here from China or whereever its made.

They're not restricting supply intentionally - they could probably sell 2M+ this season if they had the stock to sell. But there is no stock.

Re:surprising (1)

TheLoneDanger (611268) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180478)

Have you considered that Nintendo will also need units for Japan? Which, let's be honest, the 360 didn't?

Or... You could get a life. (-1, Flamebait)

Colin Smith (2679) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178320)

Just a thought.

 

Nope. Still Next Gen (4, Funny)

moehoward (668736) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178328)


They are still to be referred to as "next generation" until you can actually get one. Just because Nintendo shipped its only Wii to Zonk does not mean that we are suddenly in a new generation.

The PS3 and Wii are vaporware at MSRP. I await proof to the contrary.

P.S. Oh, and when you get proof, pick one up and ship it to me. I'll reimburse via Paypal. Thanks in advance!

How in the hell did I turn into one of those Tickle-Me-Elmo parents???

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17178932)

Did you try pre-ordering, or did you just decide in advance to come to slashdot and be a complete jackass?

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17179194)

Paypal? No thanks. I'd like to actually OWN my money.

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (1)

Firehed (942385) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180190)

Would you like to see a receipt? I paid $249.99 plus tax for my Wii, along with 43 others a few weeks ago.

The trick to getting one is knowing an employee who will tell you expected shipping dates (thanks, Lexxx!), and getting to the store two hours early. Time wasted argument aside, you know that you wouldn't have billable hours at 8am on a Sunday, and you'll more than piss away that "lost" two hours actually playing the thing.

Of course, if you want the PS3, you're SOL. But I haven't met one person who seems very happy/impressed with one yet (whereas with the Wii, I've met a single person of several dozen who didn't like it, and it had nothing to do with graphics).

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (2, Informative)

necro2607 (771790) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181838)

The Best Buy near my girlfriend's place got a shipment on Friday. You know what? There were about 30 people lined up, THE NIGHT BEFORE, with TENTS. This is fucking three weeks after the console's launch. Who knows how long the line was by the morning (needless to say we went home as soon as we saw the line the night before). But guess what? Best Buy received ELEVEN SYSTEMS. Fucking eleven. Can you imagine how pissed off the rest of those people were after they camped out all night, three weeks after the console was made available?

We've been calling stores for nearly two weeks, about 20-25 stores every single day, and that was the only place in the surrey/langley area at all that received any. And they received 11 fucking systems. Frankly, I'm getting pretty pissed off.

Unless I want to pay 3x the price by buying one through craigslist or ebay or whatever (or start camping out at stores days before they receive shipments), I doubt I'll have one before my birthday in March, let alone before Christmas time (which I was really looking forward to having all my family over for, and have a new Wii system for the party).

Oh here's another story. A friend of mine who works at EB Games here told me about four mothers who came into the store one morning wanting to buy Wii systems. They were told how the store didn't know if they were receiving any but they're getting some kind of shipment in that day. The women all stayed there and just sat on the floor the rest of the day until a shipment came in in the afternoon (no Wii systems).

Oh and people are now just cutting us off when we call about the Wii. We say "do you have any-" and they say "no, no Wii systems, sorry" (not because they recognize us as having called before). Trust me, at least around here, these things are NOWHERE TO BE FOUND in retail... :(

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (1)

meringuoid (568297) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180860)

The PS3 and Wii are vaporware at MSRP. I await proof to the contrary.

Well, going by the furious screams of agony I'm receiving from muscles and tendons that have spent the last decade in complete disuse, I'd say that Wii is pretty damn real...

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (1)

jZnat (793348) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181100)

I feel your pain; this is fucking ridiculous. Scalpers are almost as bad (if not worse) when it comes to the Wii compared to the PS3. I am not going to wait several hours in subzero weather outside a Target/Best Buy/Walmart/non-gaming store (wtf is up with the low supplies given to the stores that actually specialise in games?) just to get one.

Re:Nope. Still Next Gen (1)

!eopard (981784) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181300)

I wandered into the local Electronics Boutique yesterday and picked one up. Someone that pre-ordered didn't pick theirs up in the timeframe listed, so their order became 'general availability'. Good for me, too bad for them. It was an impulse buy, I didn't realise the Wii was out until I heard people talking about it. Good upselling on peripherals though by the girl behind the counter. However, after looking through a few other places, I reckon there's none left down under until the next shipment.

impossible business model (1, Interesting)

edwardpickman (965122) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178356)

The technology is so expensive that they almost have no choice but to give away the consoles. By give away I'm referring to dropping the prices below $200. They need to sell games and a lot of them to pay off the machines. If you're already loosing a few hundred on a machine you have no choice but to depend on game sales. Prices have to drop like a rock next year or they'll never sell enough games to break even let alone show a profit. They are taking advantage of early adopters now but there will be price drops once the manufacturing volume chatches up. If you have a million machines out there and you are loosing a couple of hundred on a system and after buying the expensive box people can only aford three games you are loosing a fortune. Better to sell 5+ games to ten million customers. Xbox can better aford to loose the money on sales than Sony can with P3. They have far more units on the streets. Sony needs to drop to at least $250 ASAP to promote game sales. Sony dropped the ball on this release and may never catch up again. Microsoft is now positioned to release their next generation consoles a full year before Sony and they already have a commanding lead in sales. Sony may be forced to accept the Apple position of a perminate second place. They may be more innovative in the future but it's doubtful they'll ever catch up. The company is not positioned well to take risks where as Microsoft is cash rich and can take risks. Wii is kind of the small nimble hare in this race. They'll eventually have to drop their prices but for now they are the cheap fun alternative to the bloated big boy systems. They can't compete with Microsoft but they can blow Sony out of the water. Both Microsoft and Sony are likely to come out with competing controllers for their next generation systems but the Wii will have several years jump on either and will have a huge backlog of games based on the controller. The strategic win has to go to Nintendo even if they can't win overall sales.

Re:impossible business model (1)

Planesdragon (210349) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179740)

The technology is so expensive that they almost have no choice but to give away the consoles.

Wrong. Sony could very well have gone with a "real cost" figure for the PS3, and cut their liense feel and MSRP for games as well. They made a concious corporate descion to keep the same idea that got the PS and the PS2 out the door and into the mindset of everyone around. I doubt it'll work, as the PS3 isn't nearly as big a leap forward as either of its predecessors were.

The strategic win has to go to Nintendo even if they can't win overall sales.

Nintendo won the last generation on straight profit; they were simply a better investment in a business sense, unless you count the entire DVD universe as part of the PS2 picture.

In six months, I expect everyone who couldn't get one the day after launch but wanted one to have a Wii. In eighteen months, I expect virtually everyone who has an Xbox 360 to have a Wii, and a fair share of those with PS3s as well. By thirty months, I'll expect the Wii to be successful enough that a "Wii DS" or similar reconfiguration will all but repeat the Wii's sell-out performance.

In the same time frame, I'll expect the six-month out mark to include stories of how well the XBox360 works with Vista for media sharing, followed by a hack by Sony (and possibly NS) to do the same, albeit with a proprietary format or "special software" that will hinder both advances. Eighteen months will solve the production problems, and show price cuts due to R&D costs being largely paid off. By thirty months, we'll see a right-turn with the X-Box, possibly something as simple as a "computer attachment" to enable it to act as a terminal, and Sony will start hyping the PS4.

And in thirty months, someone on /. will be trolling because their favorite console didn't do as well as they thought it was going to.

Re:impossible business model (1)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180840)

What again does Nintendo have to do for your consider them able to compete with Microsoft?

Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

maynard (3337) | more than 7 years ago | (#17178904)

OK. After bitching over how my first 360 died within an hour, instead of returning it I exchanged it for a new unit and a 2 year warranty. I'm pretty sure the second unit will croak, but I'm am totally sucked in by Gears of War and Dead Rising. Shit. I want to hate this thing, but the games are freak'n great.

Oh! The blood!!!

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17179172)

I think any 360's made within the past year shouldn't give you any problems (other than a lemon, and all electronic products have their share of lemons).

Don't worry too much about it.

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

maynard (3337) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179274)

Oh, I disagree. I think the current 90nm based 360 hardware is junk. But the games are incredible, and the PS3 will be no better in the near term. I've decided to stick with the 360 for my own online gaming fun, and buy a Wii for party games with friends. This - I think - is the sweet spot right now.

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1, Offtopic)

walnutmon (988223) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179422)

Ok, Can someone please tell me about these incredible games? I really would love that explanation, because I hear it all the time, but I see no proof of it, and I would love my 500 dollar purchase vindicated.

I bought and xBox360 at launch, and it is technically a very good machine. I have had no problems or complaints with it's operation. It is loud, but not as loud as the volume I play at. It is sleek and looks cool where I have it. I like the controller more than any other controller to date (haven't played a Wii, played a PS3). The graphics are great and looks cool as hell on my high def TV. I can't wait to actually enjoy a game for more than 5 hours.

Fight Night was cool for awhile, about 5 hours. But single player mode is very repetative. I'll throw smackdown and the racing games under that category too. The racers are not as good as Gran Turismo for PS2 5 years ago, disapointing. I don't play online that much because everyone online is better than me, I am into consoles for the single player experiences for the most part. Not that I don't dabble in online play, I just think that consoles should offer games substantial enough to stand on their own.

So we have Gears, which is short and not in the same league as most FPS on the PC, not suprisingly. If I want to play online shooters, I will boot my computer and play one of the many awsome online games.

So what else is there? Why did I spend 500 dollars on a system that has given me probably less than 50 hours of enjoyment in a full year. WoW did many times that for about $180, game and subscription, which I no longer play.

And please don't try to sell me on rainbow six or any other FPSs, consoles are still behind PCs in those games, and since I have both, I excersise my better option %100 of the time. Oh yeah... and what the hell happend to Madden? How does EA skip over their big franchise title on the big new console two years running. They still haven't caught up to their PS2 offerings.

So when I think incredible games I think, Mario World, Half-Life, WoW, Warcraft, Oblivion (oh yeah, I forgot, that game is sweet! So sweet that I stopped playing it on xBox after about 10 hours and bought it for the PC, awsome decision), FF1-7 (haven't played 12 much yet, but I hear it is pretty good). I am a gamer, I love games, and I love being sucked into a great experience. So please, "incredible games", can you enlighten me?

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

maynard (3337) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179662)

I was sold by Gears of War and Dead Rising. I'll also probably buy Call of Duty 3, but that's been ported to everything. So, if you've played those games and didn't dig 'em, dump that 360 right now. Sell it on craigslist or whatever.

But I'm totally hooked. --M

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

Nightspirit (846159) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179838)

Well, according to gamerankings and metacritic, GoW is better than any recent PC FPS release, so if you want a recent FPS there is no reason to not pick up GoW for the multiplayer, as the controls work well for a console. Viva Pinata is a great game, even though it looks childish it is alot of fun. Dead Rising is pretty good as well.

So, 3 excellent games, a few great ones (there are other FPS games+racing games), and a ton of o.k. games.

So we compare consoles at this point, the wii and ps3 have 1 excellent game, and mostly shovelware.

All 3 consoles are going to have a ton of great games next year.

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

colmore (56499) | more than 7 years ago | (#17181894)

I can't tell you why you spent $500 on a machine that didn't have any games you were interested in. Compulsive consumerism?

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (1)

walnutmon (988223) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179292)

Sucked in by Gears of War? Hope you enjoy all 8 hours of gameplay. That sucks.

Re:Sigh. Buy a 360. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17179868)

Yeah, I just hate games that are really great, and have all these multiplayer options, because then the eight hours are over so fast and then it is time to bin the game...

I think it is too expensive. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17179244)

I bought a 360 and a couple of games, about two months ago. Mostly because I wanted to check it out. Today my live account is downgraded to silver after the free trial ended, and I haven't upgraded it again since I don't play much online.
But the games are to damn expensive, I paid around 90$(local currency converted to $) for GoW at the local ebgames and even though I didn't rush through it. I finished it in a couple of days. Even if I liked playing online, I believe the multi player part would get boring soon.
It seems to me that most of the games that sells the capabilities of the 360 are still in development. It is all fine to see Halo 3 trailers but the game is still a year away.
Why are the games so expensive when they are full of bugs. With these new consoles, you get patches for the games via the internet. New console games are more complicated than the old generations so of course there are bigger chances of bugs. But when the games costs as much as they do, I'd say that they should have found by the time it went in the press. As far as I can see from my 2 months of ownership, 360 game developers rely heavily on the possibility of online updates, something you could expect with lower priced games that are copied a lot, not from expensive console games.

I want my Bomberman.
A of course, the 360 lacks a good party game(as in play with you friends while drinking) like bomberman, yes they have "Bomberman: act zero" or something like that, but it seems like a step back making it 3D. Having the screen split into four does not look like a step forward. I haven't tried it, because I don't want to pay 90$ for it. Release something closer to the original on live arcade, please.

Noise.
Then there is the irony of the noise you have to put up with when playing the games. Forget about fan noise. Imagine the cheapest DVD drive you can find, running at full speed all the time when playing a game. The irony part is that after you have downloaded a 1GB demo via Live, you get to play the demo in relative silence(only fan noise). But when you get the game, you are treated with the full experience of the glorious 30$ DVD drive warp speed sound.

20gb enough for everybody?
Please give me the option of buying a 100gb drive. I love all the demo's and video's you can download from live. But I filled up the 14gb available in 3 days. So I started deleting and re-downloading stuff when I wanted to show it to friends. 65GB of traffic on my internet connection the first month I owned it. I used about 10-15gb before that. I have "unlimited" usage so I won't complain about that, still it can't make the ISPs happy with a lot of console customers. :) I looked into buying a 100gb drive and replacing the original one, but it seems like it can't be done.

They will offer 60/100gig next year (1)

cheekyboy (598084) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182224)

.... at DOUBLE the retail price of a 100gig SATA drive, because you know
that plastic casing and special format costs SOOOO much and not to mention the retail margins at the shop.

When Mr Microsoft could get a damn CLUE, and sell a $19 DISK to reformat ANY replaced HD. This would make them
an instant $18.99 profit. Or let people go to 120/150 when the get released.

Curse the evil Business Analyst , not the programmers, because im sure the coders at microsoft have 100gig + versions in the lab and AT HOME.

Year end for the 360 isn't dec 31st (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179496)

Its financial year end, somewhere around March if i'm not mistaken. I don't see them missing there goal.

Microsoft's FY isn't ending in March, either. (1)

Corvaith (538529) | more than 7 years ago | (#17182166)

Nitpick: Microsoft's *fiscal* year-end (fiscal, not financial) is June 30. But that doesn't preclude them from having goals for any period, up to and including December 31... in fact, it's a fairly good bet that they do have projections in place for Christmas sales.

As the articles don't seem to actually mention specific Xbox360 goals, I don't think we really have any way of knowing if they'll meet them or not, but they probably do exist.

However... (1)

Omeger (939765) | more than 7 years ago | (#17179774)

NPD doesn't count online sales. Those numbers are a LOT higher.

And the loser is... (2, Interesting)

danwesnor (896499) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180452)

I was in Best Buy today and noticed the console displays. One guy in his mid-40's playing the PS-3, nobody watching. There was nobody near the Wii. I didn't look at the 360 (forgot about it, actually), but there were about 10 people standing around watching a kid play Guitar hero on a PS-2.

Looks like the last gen is winning the next gen war.

Console displays suck (1)

jchenx (267053) | more than 7 years ago | (#17180694)

Bah, console displays suck. Store employees often don't set them up right (composite cables on a HDTV!?) or take care of them. Many of the displays I see are "demoing" error or blank screens.

Additionally, I believe you can only demo ESRB-rated "E" (everyone) games, which means no Resistance for the PS3 or Gears of War for the 360. Nintendo is actually fortunate here, since they don't rely on M-rated titles to be some of the best games for their systems.

That said, I am excited for Guitar Hero II, although I'll be waiting for it on the 360.
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