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78 comments

1p (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17421928)

First 2007 post!

This is good news because a Mac is 1000 times better than a stupid PC with Microsoft's piece of shit operating system and a proprietary and useless NVidia card. Fuck NVidia and Microsoft!

Glass

I heard about this before... (4, Funny)

macadamia_harold (947445) | more than 7 years ago | (#17421942)

MyMacGames is preparing to launch a new 'games on demand' service for Mac users ($8-20 per month) in the third quarter of 2007 that will feature roughly 100 games at launch.

I've heard about this. Photoshop's a game, right? [blackgate.net]

Re:I heard about this before... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17421950)

Not just Photoshop. They have Breakout, Super Breakout...

Re:I heard about this before... (2, Insightful)

XxtraLarGe (551297) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422388)

I've heard about this. Photoshop's a game, right?

1998 called. They want their joke back...

Re:I heard about this before... (0, Offtopic)

einemillioneurohomep (1015575) | more than 7 years ago | (#17430942)

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Re:I heard about this before... (1)

IntergalacticWalrus (720648) | more than 7 years ago | (#17503916)

I've heard about this. Photoshop's a game, right?

Well I sure hope so, because a monthly 8 to 20$ to legally use Photoshop sounds like a damn good deal.

100 Mac Games (0, Flamebait)

toupsie (88295) | more than 7 years ago | (#17421962)

Have there been 100 Mac games worth paying for since the Lisa?

(Yes I am a Mac User)

Re:100 Mac Games (1)

shorty114 (1031030) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422204)

Yeah that's what I thought when I first saw this... are there more than 5 decent games for Mac OS X that don't require me booting into either Boot Camp or Parallels?...

Re:100 Mac Games (4, Informative)

jacobw (975909) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422478)

Have there been 100 Mac games worth paying for since the Lisa?

Hey, there are thousands of good games you can play on your Mac. You just have to install Boot Camp first.

Seriously, there is actually a pretty healthy Mac games market. I'm just not sure it's one that appeals to the average Slashdot reader. If you want the latest and whizziest FPS--or if you spend enough time gaming that you need a new epic game every few days--then yeah, you need to run Windows.

But for a more casual gamer, the Mac is a perfectly good option, even without Boot Camp. Many of the most popular Windows games eventually get ported to the Mac--the Sims, Doom III, Jedi Outcast, etc, etc, etc, are all available on a Mac. Then there are companies like Ambrosia Software [ambrosiasw.com] , Pangea [pangeasoft.net] , and Freeverse [freeverse.com] that make games primarily or exclusively for the Macintosh. The smaller Mac market means that these games will sell fewer copies, and they therefore tend to have smaller development staffs. On the one hand, this means Mac-exclusive games often don't have the vast scope of original PC games. On the other hand, it means there's more room for quirky, off-beat stuff [ambrosiasw.com] .

Re:100 Mac Games (0, Redundant)

bobblekabobble (985206) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422916)

List of Big Budget Mac Games:

Quake, Quake 3, Quake 4, Marathon, Marathon Infinity, Myth 2, Myth 3, Warcraft II, Starcraft, Age of Empires II, Age of Empires III, Civ 2, Civ 3, Civ 4, Simcity, Simcity 2000, The Sims, Alpha Centauri, Aliens Vs. Predator 2, Halo, Myst, Riven, Myst III: Exile, Myst IV, Myst V, Rollercoaster Tycoon 3, Zoo Tycoon, Railroad Tycoon, Unreal Tournament, Jedi Knight 2, Knights of the Old Republic, Star Wars Battlefront, WoW, Warcraft 3, Diablo, Diablo 2, Fallout, Obsidian, Call of Duty 2, Splinter Cell, Rainbow Six 3, Worms 3D, Alice, America's Army, Command and Conquer: Generals, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, LEGO Star Wars, Nascar 2003, F1 Championship Season, Heroes of Might and Magic 4, AGON, Rhem 2, Battlefield 1942, Homeworld 2, Masters of Orion 3, Tiger Woods PGA Tour '05, and a bunch of others.

add to that all the quirky, independently produced games by companies like Freeverse and Ambrosia and older classics like the MacVenture series (Shadowgate, Deja Vu, etc.) and you've got a pretty solid group of games to choose from.

Re:100 Mac Games (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17455342)

the list has some games that were good at the time, but give me a break. That comes down to 2 or 3 releases a year.

Re:100 Mac Games (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17469876)

"On the one hand, this means Mac-exclusive games often don't have the vast scope of original PC games. On the other hand, it means there's more room for quirky, off-beat stuff."

This is an obvious fallacy. There's a much larger market on Windows, and therefore more room for quirky stuff. Just because the PC market goes all the way up to huge commercial games costing millions to make doesn't mean it doesn't go all the way down to 1-man-team games. Check out any "indie game" website like gametunnel - dominated by Windows games. Or, better still, forget it and play DEFCON [introversion.co.uk] .

Re:100 Mac Games (1, Informative)

XxtraLarGe (551297) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422580)

Have there been 100 Mac games worth paying for since the Lisa?

Yes, there are. Here's a list I made in about 10 minutes off the top of my head. There are hundreds more.

Age of Empires, Age of Empires 2, Age of Mythology, Alice, Alien Vs. Predator, Alien Vs. Predator 2, Alpha Centauri, Baldur's Gate, Baldur's Gate II, Carmageddon, Carmageddon 2, Civilization, Civilization 2, Civilization 3, Civilization 4, Command & Conquer, Command & Conquer Generals, Descent, Deus Ex, Diablo, Diablo II, Doom, Doom II, Doom III, Duke Nukem 3D, Escape from Monkey Island, Escape Velocity, Escape Velocity Nova, Fallout, Fallout 2, Freedom Force, Full Throttle, Giants Citizen Kabuto, Halo, Heavy Metal FAKK 2, Heroes of Might and Magic, Heroes of Might and Magic 2, Heroes of Might and Magic 3, Icewind Dale, Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis, Lode Runner, Majesty, Marathon, Marathon 2, Marathon Infinity, Master of Orion, Master of Orion 2, MDK, Medal of Honor:Allied Assault, Myst, Myst 2, Myth, Myth 2, Neverwinter Nights, No One Lives Forever, No One Lives Forever 2, Oni, Prince of Persia, Prince of Persia 2, Quake, Quake II, Quake III Arena, Quake IV, Railroad Tycoon, Railroad Tycoon 2, Railroad Tycoon 3, Rainbow Six, Rainbow Six 2, Rainbow Six 3, Red Faction, Rise of Nations, Rune, Sacrifice, Sam & Max Hit the Road, Splinter Cell, Star Wars Dark Forces, Star Wars Episode 1 Racer, Star Wars Galactic Battlegrounds, Star Wars Jedi Academy, Star Wars Jedi Knight 2, Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic, Star Wars X-Wing, StarCraft, Stronghold, Summoner, The 7th Guest, Tomb Raider, Tomb Raider 2, Tomb Raider 3, Tropico, Tropico 2, Undying, Unreal Tournament, Unreal Tournament 2003, Unreal Tournament 2004, Vampire: The Masquerade, WarCraft, Warcraft 2, WarCraft 3, World of Warcraft

Yes, there's 100 here. I tried to do an ordered list, but Slashdot gave me an error.

Re:100 Mac Games (1)

Aokubidaikon (942336) | more than 7 years ago | (#17429878)

Prince of Persia? Railroad Tycoon? You do realize you're talking about games from 1990 (17 years ago), do you not? (apparently not)

Re:100 Mac Games (2, Interesting)

XxtraLarGe (551297) | more than 7 years ago | (#17443054)

You do realize you're talking about games from 1990 (17 years ago), do you not?

You do realize he asked about games since Lisa, do you not?

Re:100 Mac Games (1)

zoid.com (311775) | more than 7 years ago | (#17423750)

One word... Bolo. It was such a cool game that I went out and bought a Mac so I could play it.

Re:100 Mac Games (1)

heroshima (1046776) | more than 7 years ago | (#17457300)

I have used mac's for years for everything BUT gaming. There just isn't that much of a desire to port games to mac. If there were more games then think about it mac might just sell some more. The fact that most macs are considered underpowered by todays massive x86 processors in a windows machine, its no wonder there hasent been a better following. The specs to play most of the games out now cpu and gpu speeds way pout flank what most mac users have.

"Developers please email contact@mymacgames.com " (2, Funny)

goldcd (587052) | more than 7 years ago | (#17421984)

That's not the most promising of starts..

Re:"Developers please email contact@mymacgames.com (2, Insightful)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422392)

I'm sceptical of a site which asks for your email address without providing any information. I was also intrigued by the title 'remember when you used to buy games?' Actually, I do. I bought Diablo II, and I still play it occasionally. I bought Escape Velocity Nova three years ago, and it's a lot of fun from time to time. The most recent game I bought was Railroad Tycoon 3, which didn't get much play time because it required the CD in the drive to work, which is not good for me, because my laptop and the CD are frequently not in the same place. The games I have played the most recently, however, have been free. I have enjoyed online browser-based games, such as Urban Dead and Tribal Wars. I spent a while solving all of the puzzles in Blob Wars (GPL) and I'm now spending a lot of my free time playing Oolite (CC). $8-22 per month seems a lot to pay, since the hobbyist community seems to have been doing a much better job of entertaining me than the big game development companies recently.

Re:"Developers please email contact@mymacgames.com (1)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 7 years ago | (#17426704)

The most recent game I bought was Railroad Tycoon 3, which didn't get much play time because it required the CD in the drive to work, which is not good for me, because my laptop and the CD are frequently not in the same place.

One of the things I like about OS X is that it works so well with disk images -- try creating one from your Railroad Tycoon CD, mounting it, and seeing if the game lets you play then. It works for me with Ghost Recon and Age of Empires 2 anyway...

Re:"Developers please email contact@mymacgames.com (1)

Juanvaldes (544895) | more than 7 years ago | (#17427464)

That trick works with tons of games (Civ 3, Blizzard games, etc), but sadly not RailRoad Tycoon 3. A few months after I got the game my CD drive died. :(

Re:"Developers please email contact@mymacgames.com (1)

FirienFirien (857374) | more than 7 years ago | (#17429992)

Amusingly, some don't even use the data on the disk - they just check for the presence of a volume with the right name. I had a 3MB empty disk image (or whatever the minimum limit was) that was simply called "Civilisation III" and it worked fine. However it's the prevalence of these kinds of tips on sites that lead to the physical disk check - the game companies don't want their games pirated.

Big plus for Mac gaming! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17421994)

Oh man. I bet they'll have Shufflepuck Cafe and Breakout! If we're really lucky, they might even have something as recent as Myth. : p

I'd be sceptical but... (1)

rucs_hack (784150) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422036)

Apple have this little habit of having these fun little idea's that turn into unstoppable revolutions. Were it not for the enormous braking force of Microsoft ripping their idea's constantly they'd be much further ahead then they are now.

Apple don't have a great record of games on their platform, but is that so terrible? They weren't really aiming at the gamer until relatively recently. After all, they'd never had a portable music player till the iPod, and that seems to have gone well.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17422054)

This has nothing to do with Apple (your post suggests that you think it does).

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

westlake (615356) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422170)

Apple have this little habit of having these fun little idea's that turn into unstoppable revolutions. Were it not for the enormous braking force of Microsoft ripping their idea's constantly they'd be much further ahead then they are now.

Apple has a way of leveraging Windows dominance on the desktop to its own advantage. Which is why half its current revenues can be traced back to the iPod and iTunes.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (-1, Troll)

popo (107611) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422212)


Really, MSFT rips off Apple?

Like with the infinitely superior wheel-mouse?
Or windows that maximize?
Or a hierarcichal file explorer?
Or a taskbar?
I could go on and on... but there's a whole lot in OSX that came from Windows.

I love bashing MSFT as much as the next guy, and I know its fun to deny Microsoft any credit as an innovator.
But anyone who knows multiple OS's knows it simply isn't true.

ps: And Apple's "fun little idea" of a gaming service as you put it... is hardly innovative. They are the last player at the table here.
Like so many of Apple's "innovations", they are only innovative for those who only know Apple.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (2, Insightful)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422290)

Like with the infinitely superior wheel-mouse?
Or windows that maximize?
Or a hierarcichal file explorer?
Or a taskbar?
Have you ever used OSX for more than 5 minutes? Then you, sir, are a stupid idiot.

* The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations. It doesn't have a wheel, it has a small trackball. That means a) higher resolution and b) ability to scroll in 2D instead of 1D. If you've ever used a mouse in serious work and not just websurfing, you'll know how infinitly valuable that is.

* OSX windows don't maximize. They optimize. There's a difference there, one you have to see to appreciate. Maximize is simple, wasteful and ugly. Optimize is simple (to use), efficient and beautiful.

* Finder isn't based on explorer, it's based on the NeXT filesystem browser as is immediatly obvious to anyone who's used both. In fact, from what I've heard the vista explorer has once again copied Finder's useful shortcut bar.

* There is no taskbar on OSX. The Dock contains information about running tasks, but it is much more, more useful, efficient and nicer to look it. If you call it "copying" that Ferrari builds cars with the same number of wheels as the original Ford, then yes. By any other definition, the Dock is not a copy of the taskbar.

Why's there no "-1 bullshit" or "-1 misinformation" mod choice?

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

spookmonkey (993942) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422560)

The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations
That thing is a piece of junk - the little scroll 'nipple' was difficult to use, and I had to make a concentrated effort to get it to recognize any right-clicks. Also, anytime I had to pick up the mouse near the edge of my mouse pad, it would activate the side buttons - though, when I did actually want to activate them, it seemed like I had to apply a death grip to do so. I've been using a Logitech G5 on my Mac since, and I love it - and it's scrollwheel (that also tilts to allow horizontal scrolling). I still can't seem to find a use for the weights it includes though. I just can't feel a difference between using all of them, or none of them.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

davidmcg (796487) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422572)

Like with the infinitely superior wheel-mouse?
Or windows that maximize?
Or a hierarcichal file explorer?
Or a taskbar?
Have you ever used OSX for more than 5 minutes? Then you, sir, are a stupid idiot.

* The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations. It doesn't have a wheel, it has a small trackball. That means a) higher resolution and b) ability to scroll in 2D instead of 1D. If you've ever used a mouse in serious work and not just websurfing, you'll know how infinitly valuable that is.
The Mighty Mouse was a long time coming after the PC wheelmouse (that I doubt was invented by MS but I can't be bothered to look up). There also have been other 2D scrolling mice. However, OS X has always worked well with multi-button and wheel mice. I'd say that a multi-button mouse set up to activate expose is much more useful to use than Windows with its taskbar. The mighty mouse is not my favourite mouse but as all USB mice have worked fine for me then that is not an issue


* OSX windows don't maximize. They optimize. There's a difference there, one you have to see to appreciate. Maximize is simple, wasteful and ugly. Optimize is simple (to use), efficient and beautiful.
Maximise seems to be the Windows way of doing things, to me it's only really useful on a small screen. With a larger screen I'd prefer to make better use of it. Clicking + on a Mac to get the Window an optimal size seems the best option - although some apps don't implement it properly (e.g. Firefox)

* Finder isn't based on explorer, it's based on the NeXT filesystem browser as is immediatly obvious to anyone who's used both. In fact, from what I've heard the vista explorer has once again copied Finder's useful shortcut bar.
The finder really does need an overhaul, the shortcut bar is the only good point about it. However, spotlight, has made searching the best way to look for files.

* There is no taskbar on OSX. The Dock contains information about running tasks, but it is much more, more useful, efficient and nicer to look it. If you call it "copying" that Ferrari builds cars with the same number of wheels as the original Ford, then yes. By any other definition, the Dock is not a copy of the taskbar.

Why's there no "-1 bullshit" or "-1 misinformation" mod choice?
The dock is based on a similar concept in Nextstep. I used to use WindowMaker in the 90's as my Window Manager under Linux and that was based on a nextstep look and feel and that had a similar concept to the dock. I preferred WindowMaker over Windows at the time.

A mixed bag of features. (1)

argent (18001) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422646)

Some good, some bad. One, well, terrible... starting with the worst:

The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations.

It would be, if it had two real buttons. I'd rather use a plain old 3 button mouse (like Xerox had in the '70s) than Apple's passive-aggressive "you don't really need two buttons, honest" Mighty Mouse. I use Microsoft's plain optical wheel mouse by preference... and I wish it came in Bluetooth.

I wish they had a maximize button as well as an "optimize" one, for the apps like iTunes that do something weird on "optimize"... but, yes, maximizing to the limit of the content is good.

The Finder had a hierarchical view even before NeXTstep. And I wish they had kept the NeXT file browser separate from Finder, and let us pick which one we wanted to use primarily... I hate the "finder-like" aspects of OSX's finder, and the people who prefer Finder tend to dislike the NeXT Browser features.

I'm mixed aboutthe Dock, some days I like it, some days I abominate it.

Re:A mixed bag of features. (1)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 7 years ago | (#17423276)

I wish they had a maximize button as well as an "optimize" one, for the apps like iTunes that do something weird on "optimize"

It's been a while since I've used a Mac, but IIRC, option-clicking the 'zoom' button will do just that.

Re:A mixed bag of features. (1)

argent (18001) | more than 7 years ago | (#17423642)

Oh, yes, that's something else I wish they'd copy from Microsoft's older systems (Microsoft started drifting away from their original good design in Windows 95): simple, uniform, and consistent key and mouse commands. There's just too many command option control shift double corner click combos in OS X.

But, thanks for the clue anyway, I'll try and remember that one...

Re:A mixed bag of features. (1)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#17431920)

simple, uniform, and consistent key and mouse commands. There's just too many command option control shift double corner click combos in OS X.
You think? I'm not sure anymore. I started out thinking the same, but the more I think about it, the less I agree with my original feeling.

Command + something is always some, well command. "Do X".
Alt + something is always an alternative, like "shutdown, but without asking me".

Re:A mixed bag of features. (1)

argent (18001) | more than 7 years ago | (#17432820)

Command + something is always some, well command. "Do X".

Except when it's extend-select (This is what Sun used the middle button on their 3-button mouse for, by the way) like in Finder. Or when it's a secondary context menu for applications that need to use control for something else. Or when it's a second alternative like "open, but in a new window" like in Finder. In fact Finder manages to use command-click in multiple ways, just in one application.

Alt + something is always an alternative, like "shutdown, but without asking me".

Which sounds great, except there's no standard for what this "alternative" is. And you can't learn it by trying it because it could be something you can't back out of... which by the way totally violates the core Macintosh design: the UI is supposed to be "discoverable". This is what the right button context menu should be used for, except that Apple still has this passive-aggressive "thing" about right buttons.

Re:A mixed bag of features. (1)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#17431890)

It would be, if it had two real buttons.
I agree on that. The reply was to a specific feature, however, the scroll-wheel vs. trackball question. There are a couple of things about the Mighty Mouse that I would wish were improved as well.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0, Flamebait)

popo (107611) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422846)

Typical Mac fanboy fanatacism. Try not to break a sweat next time you post. My post was rational. Yours, fanatical.

First off, the Mighty Mouse is 3 times as useful? Let's forget about the math. If its so wonderful, why do more Mac users use third party wheel mice instead of it? The Mighty Mouse smacks of: "we invented the mouse and we *must* re-invent it rather than follow Windows' lead here."

Maximize is wasteful? Hmm... Let's see, there's no 1cm border on the outside of my work window. It seems to me that its OSX that's wasteful here. "Drag" in general is a system that is fading from interface design, so background visibility is less necessary every day.

Finder certainly isn't based on Explorer. You're right. Its got a very strange horizontal orientation and it badly, badly needs an overhaul. But PC's had a hierarchical system long before Mac's which used nested subwindows for years.

The Dock is yet another example of "Dear God, please don't let us get caught following Windows' lead". How many flavors of Linux favor the taskbar approach over the dock approach? Because that's a pretty good indication. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Why is there no "-1 Yawn.. its yet another fanatic Mac loving, Anti-Microsoft basher" mod choice?

Realize that most Slashdotters use Windows. Not Macs. Not Linux. Its the dirty little secret of the /. community.

Now ask "why"? Is it "the man" or is it choice.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

CrackedButter (646746) | more than 7 years ago | (#17423114)

I want to pick up on your comment about the dock usage in other operating systems. I use a mac but I'm speaking as a designer. I find the dock visually more appealing than a task bar to begin with and in nearly all occasions a task bar cuts off text within its program or is indistinguishable from other programs apart from a tiny icon. Due to that behavior I would question the use of text, something which NeXT originally did. Have you ever thought that Apple has applied a larger level of thought for the dock while Windows designers and linux designers haven't? Linux and open source software is widely criticised for its lack of UI design, Open Office for example and Windows fudges some elements of their GUI design because they copied off Apple in the 80's. I briefly wanted to mention this, I could go into more detail but I don't have the time.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17430014)

"The Dock is yet another example of "Dear God, please don't let us get caught following Windows' lead". How many flavors of Linux favor the taskbar approach over the dock approach? Because that's a pretty good indication. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."

1) Most flavours of Linux predate Mac OS X, so it wasn't around to copy when they were incepted.

2) Linux GUI's are typically designed to replicate Windows in order to make Windows users feel more at home and encourage them to switch. Linux isn't trying to convert Mac OS X users because for the most part they wouldn't have a hope in hell.

3) Running a sophisticated GUI like OS X's is a real resource hog if your windowing system isn't optimised for it. What's easier, building a GUI with flat, grey, non-overlapping rectangles, or a GUI that uses transparency and dynamic resizing effects and needs hardware GFX support to run smoothly? Linux users want an OS that can run on their wristwatch.

4) Coders can't do art. Doing the dock in a way that doesn't look rubbish compared to OS X is a lot harder than the aforementioned grey rectangles. People imitate what they are able to imitate most easily.

This isn't flattery, it's disinterest. Remember half of *nix users never leave the terminal anyway and still consider a GUI to be somewhere between a necessary evil and an abomination. The idea that Linux should be held as the gold standard for user-friendly GUI design is laughable - yeah, cos that's really what Linux was all about.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#17431856)

Typical Mac fanboy fanatacism. Try not to break a sweat next time you post. My post was rational. Yours, fanatical.
Fanboy? Yes, by experience. I use a Mac and nothing but brute force will get me to windos. As for rational, it was also full of false information. Your reply, on the other hand, is ad hominem, which on my scale rates far below fanboyish.

If its so wonderful, why do more Mac users use third party wheel mice instead of it?
Everyone has different preferences. I don't find the Mighty Mouse perfect, either. However, we were comparing one specific feature here - trackball vs. scroll wheel. You claim one is a "cheap copy" of the other, when it in fact is at the very least an improvement.

Let's see, there's no 1cm border on the outside of my work window. It seems to me that its OSX that's wasteful here.
You have no idea what you're talking about, do you? OSX doesn't just leave a "pretty border" around stuff for no reason. The green window icon puts a window into optimal size. For many windows, that means less than full screen simply because there is not enough content in the window to justify using up the entire screen. Why would I want to maximize to 1600x1200 a window that has a 300x200 content?

"Drag" in general is a system that is fading from interface design,
Says who? Any sources for that bold claim?

The Dock is yet another example of "Dear God, please don't let us get caught following Windows' lead".
This is the point where I get a bit irritated. Other replies have given you a clean history of the Dock and should be more than enough evidence that its design is older, more refined and mature than the windos taskbar which is, in fact, a bad copy of the same source that the Dock is a better copy of. Now if you insist on not being educated by fact, I can't change that, but I don't see a need to argue over facts that are so well known even the most ardent windos fans readily agree on them.

How many flavors of Linux favor the taskbar approach over the dock approach? Because that's a pretty good indication. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
And here I was thinking everyone on /. agreed that after Betamax vs. VHS it's a well-known fact that preponderance is not an indication of quality.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17423060)

* The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations. It doesn't have a wheel, it has a small trackball. That means a) higher resolution and b) ability to scroll in 2D instead of 1D. If you've ever used a mouse in serious work and not just websurfing, you'll know how infinitly valuable that is.
The Mighty Mouse sucks big time. I'm a Mac user and I'll take "those wheel-mouse abominations" over the mighty mouse any day of the week and twice on Sundays. The Mighty Mouse is annoying to use and is nothing more than an overpriced one-button mouse with a nipple on it. Sorry.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Ash-Fox (726320) | more than 7 years ago | (#17423514)

* The Mighty Mouse is at least 3 times as useful as those "wheel-mouse" abominations. It doesn't have a wheel, it has a small trackball. That means a) higher resolution and b) ability to scroll in 2D instead of 1D. If you've ever used a mouse in serious work and not just websurfing, you'll know how infinitly valuable that is.
  • Scrolling in 2d can be annoying on some websites.
  • I haven't found a need to scroll horizontal yet.
* OSX windows don't maximize. They optimize. There's a difference there, one you have to see to appreciate. Maximize is simple, wasteful and ugly. Optimize is simple (to use), efficient and beautiful.
I disagree, I find this really primitive in OS X. On KDE, I can maximize windows, making full use of space desktop space. I'm able to set important small windows to always remain ontop (or like in 'Spaces', another virtual desktop).

Feel free to explain how 'Zoom' is a better way to-do things though.
* There is no taskbar on OSX.
The Dock contains information about running tasks
It doesn't really contain information compared to others [theden.ws] ...
but it is much more, more useful, efficient
I don't agree. I like having my application menus separated from the task list (which is why I usually have just the Applications folder in the dock, nothing else). I know on OSX the idea is that you use pretty window switching, but the visual indications in the dock are very poor.
and nicer to look it.
I don't really find it that pretty... It's a square at the bottom-center of the screen... You call that pretty? The default is a giant rectangle with a bunch of monster sized icons at the bottom of the screen (Is this because Mac users can't use a mouse well, so they need giant icons?). I find the dock rather primitive [theden.ws] to other other solutions [theden.ws]
By any other definition, the Dock is not a copy of the taskbar.
I agree.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Tragek (772040) | more than 7 years ago | (#17428406)

Of course, with all your comparisons between OS X's dock and KDE's kicker, you forget (or at least gloss over) the fundamental differences in design philosophy. Especially when you put in those two screenshots of the dock's configuration options versus the configuration options for KDE's panel. The difference is that OS X gives you a solution, take it or leave it, with the minimum amount of customization such it won't get in the way of you doing what you will. With KDEpanel, you have a plethora of options, and as result can craft any solution your little heart desires.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Ash-Fox (726320) | more than 7 years ago | (#17433274)

The difference is that OS X gives you a solution, take it or leave it, with the minimum amount of customization such it won't get in the way of you doing what you will.
Which makes no sense to me -- Because it actually does get in my way. I guess I would have to 'leave it' as you put it.
With KDEpanel, you have a plethora of options, and as result can craft any solution your little heart desires.
True, which is why I use KDE primarily.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#17431774)

* Scrolling in 2d can be annoying on some websites.
        * I haven't found a need to scroll horizontal yet.
You don't have to scroll in 2D, you know? You can, but you don't have to. I've yet to scroll horizontal by accident. And if you've never had to do that, you aren't doing much work on a GUI. Image manipulation, CAD, 3D animation and so on for a long list of applications where your view needs to move in 2D all the time.

I disagree, I find this really primitive in OS X. On KDE, I can maximize windows, making full use of space desktop space. I'm able to set important small windows to always remain ontop (or like in 'Spaces', another virtual desktop).
True that, there's a few nice features I miss on OSX. Though all of them are lacking on windos as well and that was the topic. Which also covers most of your other answers. Then again, KDE did copy a few nice ideas from OSX - Katapult is a nice copy of Quicksilver, though it's lacking all the advanced features.

As for customizability - a few years ago I thought that was king. I don't think that any longer. Being able to sit down on any other Mac and being able to start working right away without having to figure out for half an hour where everything has been customized to has a value all in itself. What I need to customize, I find I can.

But, there are always different preferences. You have yours and that's fine.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

Hes Nikke (237581) | more than 7 years ago | (#17424876)

There is no taskbar on OSX. The Dock contains information about running tasks, but it is much more, more useful, efficient and nicer to look it. If you call it "copying" that Ferrari builds cars with the same number of wheels as the original Ford, then yes. By any other definition, the Dock is not a copy of the taskbar.

it's better than that! the taskbar is a copy of the NeXT Dock... the progenitor of the OS X Dock :)

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (2, Informative)

gsnedders (928327) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422308)

The dock in OS X is a direct descendent of NeXTSTEP's dock (which is hardly odd, seeming Apple bought NeXT for the OS) which existed since version NeXTSTEP 0.9, released in 1989, before Windows had a taskbar.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17422382)

this has nothing to do with apple...this is a 'my mac games' initiative

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

bobblekabobble (985206) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422530)

Actually Apple made a big deal of aiming at gamers about six years ago after the first or maybe second gen iMac was released. Quake 3 was on the Mac, Myth 2, Starcraft, etc. And they started a games page on Apple.com.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

stlthVector (468932) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422550)

I'm not sure Apple deserves so much credit. They have good marketing. I don't think they have much more than that. Apple has just been better at getting the word out. They tell people what their product can do and people buy it without realizing what it can not do. Apple's arrogance and lack of competition has undoubtedly stunted the progress of the mobile media market. I guess you could make a strong argument that they did help the "mp3" market to take off though.

Take a look at the ipod for instance. It's been, technically, the worst mp3 player since it came out. Sure, audio playback is excellent. But similar offerings from companies like iRiver, Samsung, Creative, Archos, and others have pretty much always had other features like line-in recording, fm tuner, fm recording, voice recording via internal mic, optical audio i/o, and support for more audio formats. Apple have never pushed the envelope from what I can think of. They have a cool interface here and there and a lot of people seem to like their hardware designs.

I don't think apple has much of a chance of doing anything exciting in the gaming market. They are artists, not tech geeks. Today's games need tech geeks to optimize the software and hardware required for gaming. Apple's games may be simple enough for any bonehead to use but they won't push the envelope with graphic effects, framerates, or subversive audio. Could they still be fun...well, look at the wii. I'm not a fan of the wii but it sounds like those who have it love it!

I guess we'll have to see what happens but I'm very skeptical of Apple gaming.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

that this is not und (1026860) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422760)

I guess you could make a strong argument that they did help the "mp3" market to take off though.

The 'MP3 market' took off on it's own, in the form of the P2P populist movement. Apple helped 'reign it in' so that it could be commercialized and introduced the most successful 'creeping in of DRM functionality.'

Dunno if that's what the "MP3 market" was looking for.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17423118)

It's been, technically, the worst mp3 player since it came out. Sure, audio playback is excellent.

An audio player with excellent audio playback is "the worst"?

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

iMusician (1045688) | more than 7 years ago | (#17425636)

That seems like the trend so far. I'm not so sure that I see Apple getting into making their own games, but I do see popular games in the future being release not only on PCs, but on Macs as well, because of the growing number of mac users. It's now finally profitable to develop game for Macs.

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

7Prime (871679) | more than 7 years ago | (#17426204)

Don't mean to sound like a troll, but I think the PC games market, as a whole, is looking pretty grim, as consoles are (once again, the way they were in the 80s), taking the gaming community back by storm. Obviously, Computer games will never completely dissappear, but with development costs and support for consoles falling, the rise of the handheld market, and the skyrocketting adoption rates of consoles, not to mention console hardware matching (if not surrpassing) PC hardware, for the first time in it's existance, you're going to see more and more companies at least making consoles their first priority. I don't know if this will immediately effect the Mac game lineup, though.

I've always wondered this, though, it makes sense, in my mind, that one of the reasons that the Mac doesn't have a lot of games (besides the obvious), is possibly because of a larger percentage of Mac users being in the console camp. I have no data to back this up, and I wonder if anyone else did. There are a lot of similarities between the design philosophies of Nintendo and Apple, for instance, and in a way, the Mac is sort of like the console of the computer world (plug'n play, all-in-one units, an emphasis on more efficient interfaces). Does anyone have any statistics, or an analysis of the types of people who use Macs, and whether they're more likely to be console gamers? I know I am, and I know quite a few people that I know are, but what about the world at large?

Re:I'd be sceptical but... (1)

iMusician (1045688) | more than 7 years ago | (#17426350)

Yeah, I agree. Since I started using a Sony PSP, I've been convinced that a lot of the gaming world will eventually lean towards mobility, and the "staionary" consoles will become smaller, and more portable, which a desktop computer is not, and most likely will never truly be.

What about the Gamerhood? (2, Interesting)

spookmonkey (993942) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422316)

Wasn't Aspyr launching something similar to this called the 'Gamerhood [macnn.com] '? Originally supposed to launch in Fall of 2006, I don't think it ever made it past the press release stage of it's life. In fact, searching Aspyr's site doesn't return anything even mentioning the Gamerhood.

Yay! I can't wait to play (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17422336)

Spectre VR... AND WoW!!! I don't know how they're going to find 98 more games though.

Another monthly fee (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17422630)

I am really tired of the constant push by companies for monthly fee based services. They do very little for the consumer(besides appearing convenient) and they make an awful lot of cash for the service provider. This seems like a bad idea to me.

Great (0, Redundant)

crossmr (957846) | more than 7 years ago | (#17422966)

That's the full catalogue, where do they go from there?

Re:Great (1)

crossmr (957846) | more than 7 years ago | (#17484978)

Was someone just biding their time for mod points to come back days later and mod this down? Especially considering I actually checked to see if someone had made the joke before doing so...

So this means that finally (1)

zpeidar (969377) | more than 7 years ago | (#17424158)

The mac-users finally get the games they've been demanding? Or, are they simply making a new game about the "Demand Service"?

Nice, Thanks!!! (3, Interesting)

GanjaManja (946130) | more than 7 years ago | (#17425832)

This is great, thanks so much for posting this link!

I've been searching for some fun PWOT games for the last 3-4 weeks, and this'll fill the void perfectly!
For those of you that keep saying there's no mac games, I think I know why:
I read the lists of "top 10 games of 2006" and "top 10 indy games" and all those things hoping for some good games: they all sucked.
They're full of fantastical role-playing games, not the kind of game where you can't just open it and play, but instead all these long, drawn out stories: absolutely not what I'm looking for. I want a fun game, not a soap opera or 2 month-long drama. You guys just want a different type of game.
I DID just install BootCamp for a game, in fact. 1/2 year ago, I tried SimCity (in Parallels/Windows), then deleted it. I Tried Halo then deleted it. This time I installed Windows solely for WORMS ARMAGEDDON, the best game ever invented (short of the Mario games)! (Pissed that I have to use BootCamp, it used to work great in VirtualPC, meaning I didn't have to shut down my servers just to play a game! Parallels doesn't do "DirectDraw" or some crap, so I gotta fully restart into Windoze)

So the games I've found are great. Ambrosia Software has Great Mac games (tho I wish they'd update some old one's out of Classic). I even found a new version of CrystalQuest for Mac OS X (in 3D!) [apple.com] . That game [apple2.org.za] absolutely kicks ass, the first game ever to really use the mouse as a totally new type of input device.
Also, NES and SNES emulators absolutely rule. Back before insane 3D graphics, people were forced to sell games on gameplay Only. Hey, I'm only 24 and I'm this into retro games, so it's not just nostalgia!

Re:Nice, Thanks!!! (0, Offtopic)

GanjaManja (946130) | more than 7 years ago | (#17425906)

Oh, and I've devised some great games using Adobe Photoshop, just a few simple rules, a board with some pieces for the players and hey Presto! A game that's fun for the whole family!!!


heheh

Email from MyMacGames (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17426618)

I received an (unexpected) email from MyMacGames last Saturday:

Subject: MyMacGames and [my company name deleted]

Hey,

I'm Mark Howson, and I'm a marketing manager for MyMacGames.com. MyMacGames is a forthcoming service set to change the world of mac gaming for ever, and we're so impressed by your product, we'd love you to come on board.

Your paid games show a great level of dedication and hard work, that needs rewarding.

MyMacGames wants to bring the excitement of your games, and hundreds of others to mac games throughout the world. Before you stop reading, we're not asking to buy your game, we're not asking to remove the amazing creativity that controls it. We're just offering you another way to distribute it.

Games don't last forever, and every game is not right for every person, so the MyMacGames system follows 3 central strategies to provide a new way of buying games for the mac platform, and a new 'rental' strategy to mac gaming around the world.

These 3 pillars are:

        Choice
        Anti Theft
        Fair Pay

Firstly, choice. We feel the consumer deserves a choice as how they play games, how long they keep them for, and which games they play. We charge between $8.00 and $30.00 to the consumer per month, for them to experience a number of exciting mac games (between 8 and 35 simultaneously).

The consumer can change the game in each slot every 14 days. This is on a slot by slot basis, so if a consumer adds a game to one slot on the 1st, they could change it on the 15th. Another slot, with a game added on the 3rd, could be changed on the 17th. The user has 24 hours to change the game. If they play the game during this 24 hour window, we assume they wish to keep the game.

Our system will email users to tell them when a slot is available to switch, and will warn them if playing the game will mean they forfeit the opportunity to 'swap' the game out for another game. These methods make the user feel in control, while giving you greater earning potential.

Of course, you're not going to earn money if we just give users unlocked dmgs, so we're going to be sure to protect your intellectual property. Which brings us on to our second 'pillar', anti theft.

We know that your work is your most valuable asset, and we really do care for your property, and the time you've spent. The idea of providing us with an unlocked dmg sounds stupid, but it's not.

Games are spliced with code that means they live in our application, can only be played via our application, and are encrypted with the AES method. The AES (or Advanced Encryption Standard) is an encryption standard involving unique keys. It is the standard encryption method of the US government, and is one of the most secure methods around. But for your game, that's just not enough.

All downloads will also be watermarked, so if encryption is broken, we'll know exactly who broke our encryption, disable the version where possible, send out a whole load of intellectual property notices, and disable the account. Of course, this won't happen, but we'll be equipped with this, and other, secondary safeguards just so we sleep well at night.

Which leaves us with the final pillar, fair pay. We feel this is the most important pillar, and one that will be crucial to our business with you. For every game slot you fill, we'll pay you 10 cents/week. This money will be provided monthly by your choice of method, we will support:

        Wire Transfer
        PayPal

You will have a control panel, where you can hold payments, check payment data (updated daily) and find out how your game is doing. If your game is in our top 10, or less than 1 month old, then 2 slots are required to play the game, and we will, of course, pay you twice as much money.

Here's some examples of quite how much that is

Normal game 1000 players weekly (average) $4000 p/m
Top 10 game 1000 players weekly (average) $8000 p/m

Even low sales can produce a substantial secondary income stream

Normal game 200 players weekly (average) $960 p/a

And a popular top 10 game can produce really spectacular results

Top 10 game 5000 players weekly (average) $4000 p/m
                                                And over the year $52000 p/a

Of course, you'll also be able to continue selling your game, and all we ask for is 30 days notice to remove your games from our service. There's no ties, no setup fees, and we only ask for an exclusive on rental, not sales (heck, it's not like there's an alternative).

I hope I've covered the three main 'pillars' of MyMacGames, and can't wait for your email requesting further information. Or, simply iChat me, I'm always here to help (well, not always, we do sleep). I'm [aim address deleted]. We're happy to talk via any popular IM network, email, or even a traditional phone. Just tell me in your return email.

I can't wait to work with you to make your game even more successful.

Mark Howson
[email address deleted]
AIM [aim address deleted]

Re:Email from MyMacGames (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#17496088)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but:

Normal Game (1000 users per week) is 1000 x 0.10 x 52 = $5200 per year, or around $433.33 per month, not $4000 per month as claimed

Top 10 Game = $10400 per year, or $866.66 per month, not $8000 per month

And 200 pleayer per week on a normal game is 200 x 0.10 x 52 = $1040 per year, or $86.66 per month.

I hope they didn't use the same mathematics when they were formulating their business plan....

Classic Mac Games? (1)

oesii (26082) | more than 7 years ago | (#17431342)

A lot of Macheads I talk to are still addicted to games they played 10 or 20 years ago. Stuff like Dark Castle, Marathon, and Risk were fun stuff back in the day. I'll have to RTFA and check out the link to see if they have some oldies but goodies.

100 games at launch.... (1)

Ribbo.com (885396) | more than 7 years ago | (#17439642)

None of which involve right clicking.... So that leaves what? Minesweeper? Nope, right clicking in that... Hmmm... I guess you only need 1 button to play whack-a-mole.
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