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SuSE Coming on DVD

justin++ posted more than 14 years ago | from the less-discs-more-data dept.

SuSE 155

SuSE has announced that its next release, 6.3, will be available on DVD as well as CD. The release date is supposedly December. I hope this practce catches on. Debian 2.1 was 2 discs for just binaries, and it's much larger now. I have a 6 disc set of SuSE 6.2. The packaging is both neat and clumsy. Too bad the only DVD player I own is connected to my stereo....

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Re:Oh no! Region locked DVD Linux distros! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568360)

Are you sure? The software that came with my (US Region 1) Creative DVDROM wouldn't even let me copy a .vob file from the DVD to the hard drive from either Explorer or from DOS on a region 2 DVD until I flashed the DVD firmware and downloaded RegionSelect. Maybe this was just a Creative-only "feature". Maybe.

Found a SCSI DVD-RAM... (2)

Sloppy (14984) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568361)

APS Tech [] has a SCSI DVD-RAM [] , but their DVD-ROMs are all IDE. :(


I miss the AOL floppies... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568362)

At least you could reformat them and use them. BTW, you could still get '95 on floppy by special request. Did this ever extend to '98/2k/NT?

File system: ISO9660 or UDF? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568373)

UDF support under Linux only sorta works and in read only mode only. How big can an ISO9660 filesystem get before it buckles under its own weight anyway? And when can Linux read/delete/write to CDRWs readable by Adaptec's DirectCD?

Re:FTP over what? (2)

BrianS (522) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568374)

You obviously live in the non-modem world. Try doing it over a 56k dialup. Not everyone has the luxury of dsl/isdn/leased/t1/etc.

debian (1)

nester (14407) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568375)

/me has dreams of every arch + source on one dvd
/me wakes up and realizes i don't have dvd drive and neither does just about any one else

[OT - Grammar] (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568376)

"from the less-discs-more-data dept."

It's _fewer_ discs, not less discs. This is reallllly basic stuff folks, the sort of thing you learn age 14 when English is taught as a foreign language.

Countable => fewer
Uncountable -> less

"There is less water in the lake today".

"I have fewer coffee mugs".

Re:DVD availability (2)

debrain (29228) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568377)

DVD's are more expensive because less fabs have the technology to burn the higher density DVD disks. But DVD drives are almost as cheap as CD drives of equivalent speed. With more demand for DVD's, because the drives are so cheeply available, more demand will arise for the actual discs, and as such the cost of DVD manufacturing will go down (according to scale). As for CD's dissappearing, I'm giving them two to three years until you *need* a CD player to get the goods. :)

Re:FTP (this doesn't match my experience) (1)

mellon (7048) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568378)

My experience installing off a CD in my DVD-ROM drive is that it's remarkably fast. Possibly you aren't getting good throughput from your CD-ROM drive for some reason. DVDs are almost an order of magnitude more dense than CDs, so I would expect an even higher transfer rate from a DVD.

Its about time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568379)

Its about time a linux distrubution hade the sense to make a dvd release. The one cd distrubtion don't hold enough packages and the multiple cd spanning installations are just annoying (i like to not have to sit in front of the computer and watch the packages install)

SuSE on CD, RE: size of SuSE (1)

chandler (98984) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568380)

For the person remarking about the size of SuSE: Interesting - RH6.0 was 3 CD's, i think, and you couldn't install it on a zip disk. SuSE 6.2 is 6 CD's and it can still be installed on a zip disk - it's just a matter of how compact the original disk is. As for the # of disks, it seems to be expanding at a linear rate.

DVD support for linux? (2)

tsphere (93898) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568381)

I may be missing the boat here, but I thought DVD drives weren't supported by linux. I mean, I'm using one right now, but Linux thinks it's a plain old ATAPI CD-ROM. I assume that the proverbial "bad things" will happen if i try to read a DVD-ROM. . .

Wouldn't make much sense to distribute an OS on a medium the OS can't use, would it?

Re:This will be nice (1)

cpt kangarooski (3773) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568382)

There are some Mac SCSI DVDs, but since most Macs have IDE now (as well as already having DVDs from the factory in many cases) they're getting rare. You might just want to get an IDE controller card and IDE DVD since they'll add up to be less than the SCSI DVD I bet. Too bad if you're short on slots....

This will be nice (1)

Drakino (10965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568385)

This will definitly be nice seeing that SuSE has been growing by one CD since 6.0 (excluding the live filesystem cd). Plus it will help with remote installation of packages via Yast since no disc swapping will be necessary. Now to just find a cheap 4x or so DVD drive.


Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwagon (1)

bconway (63464) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568387)

Can we have a day on slashdot with just DVD related articles? I think it'd be pretty fun. Regardless, I think this is a great idea, assuming they market them cheaply (we hope). Any problems getting a standard dvd drive to read the full disk space or can that already be done now?

Please no (0)

Fjord (99230) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568389)

I'm short on cash and really want a DVD player. I'm afraid that will drive me to do something I would regret later.

Re:Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwago (2)

Drakino (10965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568391)

DVD drives are just seen as a standard ATAPI Disc drive to the computer. The only difference between DVD drives and CD drives are the lasers used to read the data off the disk.


cool.. (1)

lawn_ornament (99174) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568393)

hell yeah! this is neat... one question tho: can you boot an OS from a DVD drive? (I can't see the option for that in my BIOS :o)


could you boot of a DVD? (1)

airfabio (6375) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568395)

and could cheapbytes and places like that duplicate these? anyone got a DVD copier? (not DVD ram)
how much $ for it? how much for blank DVDs?

A simple answer for Justin (3)

jd (1658) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568397)

All you have to do is hardwire your stereo to play data DVD's as audio, hook a microphone up to your computer, and download the files via your sound card. :)

Just remember to crank the volume way up, to reduce data loss from background noise. (eg: Neighbors screaming at you to turn that b* racket off)

FTP (1)

henrik (98) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568399)

It is faster to install via FTP than from my 24x CD-ROM, and I guess DVD is not much faster either. I'll remain an FTP installer.

Oh no! Region locked DVD Linux distros! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568400)

I can just see it now. A worldwide region 0 linux distro with standard crypto and a region 1 (US and Canada) locked one for the distro with the strong crypto tools.

Re:FTP (this doesn't match my experience) (1)

Luyseyal (3154) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568401)

and higher seek times if the data is poorly organized.


DVD Boot (1)

zCyl (14362) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568402)

Can a DVD be made bootable, and if so, is there existing hardware support for this? This would seem important for releasing flexible operating system installations. Floppies are old fashioned, just look at the iMac. (j/k)

But are there cheap DVD *BURNERS* (2)

Christopher B. Brown (1267) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568403)

I will begin to care about DVDs at such time as:
  • DVD writable disks cost not more than $10, so that they're not too much more expensive than CD-R's
  • DVD writer drives cost not more than $500

Until that time, I'm quite happy using the so mature they're dead cheap technology of CD-ROMs.

Re:[OT - Grammar] (1)

Luyseyal (3154) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568404)

Well here in the United States, English has been in the grip of the "learning by doing" methodology which has all but wiped out formal learning of grammar beyond the basics in primary and secondary education. Unfortunately (here in Texas anyway), the standardized tests are only interested in basic grammar. I don't remember ever hearing the phrase "accusative case" in all thirteen years of school. I learned more about English grammar in my Latin classes than I ever did in English where they were more concerned about five-paragraph-essays than the ability to speak and write correctly.

Be that as it may, I am not against the "learning by doing" methodology in and of itself. Rather, my concern is that English teachers take so little interest in fact whilst delving so much into the world of fiction.


Re:Speaking of DVDs as install media .. (0)

B1FF (73807) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568405)

1T D3P3NDZ. R U 3L33T?
------ ------ ------
ALL HA1L B1FF, TH3 M05T 31337 D00D!!!!!1
------ ------ ------
ALL HA1L B1FF, TH3 M05T 31337 D00D!!!!!1

Slashdot needs a DVD icon! (1)

timothy (36799) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568406)

(Since playing DVDs under Linux, till recently seemingly only a frustrating dream, now gets closer and closer ...)

And is there a USB icon, too?


Multiple Distros/versions on DVD? (1)

Xunker (6905) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568407)

Just a thought for all software developers like me who want to test an app on differnt plaforms.. Apple has a package for MacOS developers that has all OSs from 7.1 to 8.6 on a DVD for your compatibility testing pleasure; Prehaps the same with Linux and *bsd would be useful as well?

Re:DVD support for linux? (2)

bgdarnel (2144) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568408)

IDE DVD drives use the ATAPI protocol. Put a CD in, and it looks just like a normal CDROM drives. Put a DVD in, and you can mount it just like you can a CD, except it can have a lot more stuff on it. (You should have a recent kernel to be able to read the larger filesystems).

cheapbytes: not yet (1)

rillian (12328) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568409)

I just wrote to cheapbytes [] and asked about their dvd plans.

Basically, they said "not yet." The price-per-disk is coming down nicely, but the hefty set-up cost makes them wary of titles that won't sell well. They're waiting for better market penetration of the drives.

Bootable DVD? (1)

Chemical (49694) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568410)

The coolest thing about Linux on CD is that the CD's are bootable. I don't have a DVD-ROM drive so I was kind of wondering: Are DVD-ROM drives bootable? I guess DVD's really are catching on now. I thought it was one of those fad technologies like LaserDiscs or DAT audio tapes. This is a step in the right direction for the whole software industry.

Bootable DVD? (1)

Chemical (49694) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568411)

The coolest thing about Linux on CD is that the CD's are bootable. I don't have a DVD-ROM drive so I was kind of wondering: Are DVD-ROM drives bootable?

I guess DVD's really are catching on now. I thought it was one of those fad technologies like LaserDiscs or DAT audio tapes. This is a step in the right direction for the whole software industry.

DVD Burners (1)

Ermit (27328) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568412)

I think it's cool that SuSE is doing this, but my main question is, how long until we get DVD burners for home use? I imagine recordable DVD CD's are probably relatively more expensive than CD-R's, but at the same time, one can store several (if not more) CD-R's worth of information on a single DVD.

widescreen, subtitles, omitted scenes (1)

eries (71365) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568413)

Does this mean we'll get exclusive DVD-only features like a widescreen installer? How about "the making of SuSE Linux" video?

How about linux installer subtitles in 87 languages? Simultaneously too?

Re:DVD support for linux? (2)

enrayged (67136) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568414)

essentally dvd movie decoding and playback is not supported in linux. data dvd's should work just fine... IE not encoded.

Re:I'm having flashbacks... (2)

Yarn (75) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568415)

wolf3d was on 2 or 3, doom was 5.

I had win95 beta on floppies, that was fun ~21 floppies. OS2 was about the same.

DVD (1)

Zach978 (98911) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568416)

DVD- Digital Video Disc.

I think that it needs to be renamed, DVD is obviously used for more then video now. I would think that eventually it would replace CDs, used to music, video, and of course data.


DVD and FreeBSD (1)

questionlp (58365) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568417)

I received two copies of FreeBSD (2.2 and 3.2) on DVD's already... but it's no use to me right now since I don't have a DVD-ROM in my computer.

They are very rare, so I'm definitely going to keep it for myself ;)

Anywho... it's nice to see that more and more orgs and companies are making DVD-ROM a very reliable and smart storage solution. I wouldn't mind buying a subscription of DVD's that mirror the data on :)

Re:Great! (1)

Tools (95822) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568418)

Yup, I'm getting a DVD just for this, I can still remeber installing OS/2 Merlin, inser disk #44 here. :| The best thing is that there is finaly a good use for DVD on PC, seeing as how much most linux users are getting fed up with switching CD's, I think these kind a steps should increase DVD-player sales.

Re:DVD (wrong) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568419)

Someone lied to you. It's "Digital Versatile Disc".

s/Video/Versatile/ (2)

Yarn (75) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568420)

According to the ads here in the UK.

Re:FTP over what? (1)

luge (4808) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568421)

Yeah. I dread moving to 56K- I've seen transfer rates spike at 4-5 meg/s to metalab/ from my room, and consistent rates of 800K/s. At that speed, I easily beat CD. But not for long :(

Re:DVD (wrong) [wrong] (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568422)

Someone lied to you too. It doesn't actually stand for anything. I read that somewhere a long time ago.

Re:[OT - Grammar] (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568423)

"fewer is more" then? I don't think so. If you want to get really picky, you'd have to say "fewer are more", and that just doesn't make sense.

Then again, what do I know? I'm just an AC...

I got it (1)

CrAlt (3208) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568424)

Ill put it up on my FTP site. You can download vie my high speed 28.8K modem. Login: cypherpunks/cypherpunks :)

Re:About bloody time... (1)

the_tsi (19767) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568425)

You mean you haven't been playing Riven: The Shorter, Better Looking Version of Myst?


SuSE on your Stereo (1)

PurpleBob (63566) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568426)

Wow - playing the SuSE DVD on your stereo would be even more fun than 'cat /vmlinuz > /dev/audio'!

Too bad S.u.S.e doesn't boot PowerPC's :( (1)

GreyFauk (18632) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568427)

Then maybe my lil' bro's G3 would be able to use the
DVD player he had installed when he bought it...
The one they didn't tell him he needed extra software (==$400) to watch movies with.
Don'tcha just love build it yourself Macintosh ordering personell?

(No.. I wasn't around when he ordered it, or that wouldn't have happened)

Re:Slashdot needs a DVD icon! (2)

Pascal Q. Porcupine (4467) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568428)

Uhh, what's wrong with the 'hardware' category? It's not like there's going to be a constant flux of non-movie DVD articles or USB articles period... (And it's a category, not an icon. Categories just happen to have icons.)

Reminds me of this one conversation I overheard in a library. A bunch of posers trying to look intellectual were talking about how they "got on the information superhighway by running Netscape. What's it that Netscape is... oh yeah, it's an icon."
"'Is not a quine' is not a quine" is a quine.

one more proof, linux is best unix (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568429)

now distributed on DVD...can you say technically superior?

it just amazes me how sun/sgi/hp can even get away with marketting their slow/insecure/unscalable and poorly coded closed source operating systems on overpriced, underperforming hardware these days.

linux/intel outshines, outscales and outperforms all other unix operating systems hands down!

now with DVD install, GNOME desktop, linux just keeps innovating and blowing away the competition!

linux, the choice of a GNU generation

Re:annoying, but almost necessary now (1)

lubricated (49106) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568430)

I'm not positive on this but I think some alan cox kernels have support for large files. I could be totally wrong thoug. It just sounds like something that crazy old hacker might do.

Re:This will be nice (1)

kemdi (41391) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568432)

The world ended in 1900
then S.u.S.E invented the universe with Linus quietly sanctified.
Off I go, in search of a DVD drive.

Thank you very much.

DVD is coming (1)

rc-flyer (20492) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568438)

I'm sure this trend will continue. It really is a chicken and egg syndrome. First there needs to be enough DVD drives in the field to make it worth the publisher's time and expense to produce the DVD distribution. But, people are still questioning the need for DVD drives. Luckily, the movies being available on DVD are helping to kick-start the availability of DVD drives.

Remember how long it took for CD's to take over the software distribution. For a long time the software was being distributed on floppy (first 5 1/4, then 3 1/2), until now software only comes on CD. Be patient, it will come.

Could be a boon -- or a curse. (2)

Stonehand (71085) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568439)

First the curse. SuSE 6.2 is already 6 CDs, and that's a lot of packages (although, thankfully, it seemed decently organized... and the INDEX file means that with grep, it's not a problem figuring out what's where.) However, with all that extra space... is there going to be much reason to allow for minimalist distributions? or encouraging compact packages?

However, it might be a nifty boost to the multi-distro folks. Imagine a DVD with just the GPL'd versions of multiple distros, and one front-end that asks for which installer to use...

It'd be nice if they bring back the live filesystem with the main distribution rather than as a separate product.

Or, say others could package a minimalist distro, a full-featured distro, and a BSD or two onto the same disc. Or a distro plus a Sunsite pub/linux mirror...

And so forth.

Bloat Factor (0)

Jordan Graf (4898) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568440)

Think about how much more bloated MS products will get when they have all the room on a DVD to play with. I just installed MS Visual Studio, and I thought it obscene that it required 550Mb. This is probably just the tip of the iceberg.

Re:Woohoo (1)

discore (80674) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568441)

heh you always get a 'installing from floppies' flashback when suse asks you for the next cdrom.

wise move by the suse team, those crazy germans.

drives and disks. (1)

delmoi (26744) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568442)

I belive he was just refering to the way the computer saw the disk, in otherwords, you didn't really need any new drivers to get them to work. I've managed to get a frends computer up and running, reading CDs with an old ATAPI CD-rom driver, eventhough it was a DVD-rom drive. I'm not sure if older drivers would beable to handle the larger storage aria
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"

Re:DVD (wrong) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568443)

This is absolutely right. Digital Versatile Disc. It also happens to be VERY easily called Video Disc for very obvious reasons.

DVD stands for DVD (3)

redled (10595) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568445)

It's true. Some members of the DVD forum (a group of commercial companies that manufacture DVD devices -the same group responsible for the tricky copy-protection) wanted it to stand for Digital Video Disc, while others wanted it to stand for Digital Versatile Disc. So, officially it stands for absolutely nothing. ONe good thing about this: It makes a fairly good gauge of a salesperson's knowledge. If a salesperson knows that DVD stands for nothing, then he is probably not completely clueless. Unfortunatly, most salsepeople are quite positive that it's "Digital Video Disc."


Re:DVD support for linux? (2)

axboe (76190) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568447)

The usual DVD drives conform to the Mtfuji or MMC spec, which is basically just a beefed up ATAPI. It will understand exactly the same packets as those defined in ATAPI 2.6 and then some. There are other differences as well, but these all relate to DVD _specific_ features, such as reading of DVD structures, CSS authentication, etc. So saying the Linux sees it as just any other CD-ROM drive is correct - indeed it should.

The only problem you'd see by inserting a DVD movie (for instance) and copying files from it, is if the disk is encrypted. You'd then get an error in your logs stating that a "read of scrambled sector without authentication". For your run-off-the-mill porn, you could probably get by without any problems :)

Overpopulation (Somewhat offtopic) (0)

delmoi (26744) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568449)

Actually, the worlds overpopulations problems *aren't* in the industrialized nations where these medical advances are taking place. There was a good article in wired talking about how the predictions of mass world starvation by 1970 were off (gee, really?), today we are producing more food then was ever possible, with even less farmers.

That fact brings up an interesting point about 'technology for societies sake', what about all the advances in agricultural science in the world? Without those advances the world would be starving, but they were made, and the world, in general, is not starving (save a few paces where political, not economic difficulties prevent food from reaching the mouths of the hungry)

Anyway, As more of the third world reaches our 'dangerously high' levels of technology, there birthrates will go down not up. A lot of Japan's economic trouble right now is caused by birthrates that are two low, not to high.

"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"

Re:Found a SCSI DVD-RAM... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568451)

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm!! SCSI DVD-RAM... *grin* w00d!

Great! (1)

BoneFlower (107640) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568458)

This is a great thing. Like the days before the CD-ROM became universal, there were wonderful things like "Insert disk #15". We are seeing software ship with multiple CDs, in some cases all of which are absolutely necesary to use the software. DVD can buy us at least a few years before that happens again. Linux distributions won't have to think twice about whether or not its worth putting that last program on the disc, or devoting the space to something else, after this catches on. Good move SUSE, this will improve Linux and get me to buy a DVD drive.

DVD availability (1)

Xerithane (13482) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568459)

I've been waiting to see this for quite a while -- but I'm curious as to what they are going to do with the people that are still using archaic CD's
I realize they are going to be making the CD set -- but will their be a cost difference etc to compensate for the extra 5-6 0.2 cent disks?
I'm pretty sure DVD's are the same cost to produce as CD, could be mistaken -- but I am having flashbacks of the transition from floppy to CD-Rom... if I have to mail off to get a set of CD-Rom's I'm going to be a bit irritated..
-= Making the world a better place =-

Funny how it gets bigger... (1)

Kid Zero (4866) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568460)

Granted, I recall trying v4.0 via floppy. Future Brother in Law brought over a box of 50 floppies and said "You won't need the 12 or so with xwindows..."

Now it comes on a DVD. Odd that this is the same system you can install on a matchbox sized server.

Director's Cut (2)

Mr_Plow (30965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568461)

That's the letterbox director's cut edition, right? With the free poster and the commentary play-by-play?
----------------------------------- -----------------------

Re:A simple answer for Justin (1)

rde (17364) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568462)

Neighbors screaming at you to turn that b* racket off
Aah, sweet nostalgia.
It's just like owning a Spectrum again.

Re:cool..Booting DVD's (1)

Xerithane (13482) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568463)

I have a DVD drive in my laptop, and it has no problems booting the red hat CD and installing
I'm guessing it's the same all around, because it uses mostly the same data standards. Just more data
-= Making the world a better place =-

Re:Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwago (1)

BoneFlower (107640) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568464)

The only difference between DVD drives and CD drives are the lasers used to read the data off the disk.

And of course the little side effect of drastically increased storage capacity means nothing.

Why is it that techie types seem to get obsessed about the technology behind the result and sometimes act like the technology behind something is everything, when the technology is nothing more than a means to an end, and the end is what is really important.

Woohoo (2)

Graymalkin (13732) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568465)

Finally use SuSE users won't be prompted to insert CD-ROM disk #4. DVDs and Linux are a good combonation. Linux distros can more easily package all the components they want to include without a 4 pound box filled with CDs. Especially SuSE, 6.1 had 5 CDs and 6.2 has 6, which means a lot of extra goodies that don't need to be downloaded but that comes at the cost of keeping track of half a dozen CDs.

Debian status (1)

bug1 (96678) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568466)

Acording to a quick check of my debian archive.

Potato has 1.78 GB of binary-i386 .debs , debs are compressed with bzip2.

over 4100 packages.

There is supposed to be an anouncement on the debian feature freeze today.

Re:cool.. (1)

m3000 (46427) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568467)

Yes, you can. I have a Creative DVD player, and I booted into Linux just fine for installation. I'm not sure if it would work if you had both a CD Rom and DVD though, because I only have a DVD player.

Re:Well, I suppose its a good thing (1)

Matthew Weigel (888) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568468)

Cody, is that you? That has to be you. I can't imagine anyone else going by a variation of Judge talking about his 35" TV and 19" monitor...

If I'm wrong, I apologize :)

DVD Bootability questions not answered (1)

lanner (107308) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568469)

I was looking through these messages for answers to my question regarding bootability from a DVDROM disk. I had seen some answers, but they were clearly not thought out very well. Both the drive hardware, media hardware, and media format is different with DVD disks. Booting a regular CD in a DVD drive means nothing. There are three issues, the drive itself, the physical media, and the data format of the CD. What is the data format that DVD disks use? We know that an El-Torito CDROM disk will boot in a DVD drive, but the disk is still not a DVD. I believe that El-Torito bootable CDs also MUST be ISO9660 in their format, is this true? There are other formats such as ISO9660 Xtra, JOLIET -- which I know is NOT bootable -- and CDUDFRW. DVD disks probably do not use ISO9660. There will have to be systemboard BIOS issues. I believe that there are several types of physical media formats because of the different data capacities. We have a standard with CDs (Thank you Sony and Philips), but with DVDs, every company and their dead grandmothers poodle has been trying to make their own format the standard for monetary purposes, thus all of those different types of DVD disks, dare I mention those super audio disks? We may find information at I am going there next. Will post if answers found. What about SPARC? I do not know how their booting CDROMs are different other than the boot block size difference, which I belive is also true or Macintosh systems. I use Debian which has been ported to many different platforms -- SPARC, i386, Alpha, M68K -- and I question the use of DVD for these systems. There is no way that my SPARC 10 is going to boot on a DVD. Regular old CDs will still be around for some time, but using DVD disks is a good idea. The next version of Debian LINUX will take up three CDs just for the binaries. This will help. I very seriously doubt that any DVD disk at this time is bootable or could be made to do so, unless they conform to the El-Torito standard which I doubt that they do.

Re:Bootable DVD? (1)

axboe (76190) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568470)

Sure, there's no problem booting off a DVD
ATAPI/SCSI drive - if your BIOS supports booting
off an ordinary CD-ROM drive, it will handle
DVD too.

DVD is a beautiful thing... (1)

HamNRye (20218) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568471)

But how is the linux side of it?? The last time I tried to set up a DVD drive I had nothing but trouble. I finally just put in an old 16x CD rom... (After all, until now I didn't need one for linux...)

Also would like to add that kudos to SuSE for this one. They consistently have the most complete distro, even if they try to install everything in German... I just hope that they keep all of the great things involved in the OS. The live filesystem, the bootable CD, etc. We use the live system cd here often for troubleshooting.

~Jason Maggard
"God, Root, what is difference?"

Re:Well, I suppose its a good thing (1)

[Entropy] (87954) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568472)

Movies on a 19" monitor may not sound all that great, but remember that monitors are non-interlaced, which makes a world of difference compared to TVs. Watching The Matrix on my 19" computer monitor is not bad at all; the picture is great even when you get really close. So that's why a DVD drive for your computer is a Good Thing, especially now that 1) Linux will be playing DVDs decently real soon now and 2) Linux distributions are beginning to arrive on the medium.

Re:DVD Bootability questions not answered (1)

Eric Smith (4379) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568473)

DVD disks probably do not use ISO9660.
DVD-ROM discs can use ISO 9660, UDF, or both. El Torito bootable DVD-ROM should not be a problem, as long as the boot image is not out past 4G. (Which might someday be nearly as annoying as the 1024-cylinder problem.)

DVD-Video discs are REQUIRED to be in UDF-bridge format, which includes ISO 9660.

Video Or Versitile? nither, actualy (1)

delmoi (26744) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568475)

Origionaly, the name was Video, but aperantly some people didn't like the name, and wanted it changed to "Versatile". In the end, the meaning behind the name was completly dropped. "DVD" dosn't stand for anything.
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"

Re:DVD availability (1)

ctusar (104172) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568476)

Just for the record, mass produced DVDs (and CDs, for that matter...) aren't burned, they're stamped and laminated...

Re:This will be nice (1)

Minstrel78 (28344) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568478)

Pioneer makes a Scsi DVD drive. I have one in my pc right now, which is 6x DVD and something like 24x cdrom. It is model number S303, I think (but am not certain). It's notable feature is the slot load mechanism, like a car stereo cd player. There is also an ide version of this drive.

Re:I'm having flashbacks... (1)

HamNRye (20218) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568481)

Actually, I still have my Wolfenstein floppy. (Registered version) and it is just one floppy. Ultimate Doom 5. NT 4.0 and SP4 (In our shop by special request)63 Floppies!!! All because my PHB says, "We don't need CD rom's on all of the servers. That's an X-tra 50$ per unit." It cost us 24$ in shipping to get Microsoft to ship us SP4 on floppy. We spent ~24$ on floppies to make a backup set. The extra hour and a half it takes me to install the programs costs the company somewhere in the neighborhood of 50$.

My god! Do I really work here???????

~Jason Maggard
"Because there's an atom bomb in front of the refrigerator that's why!"
~Vivian (The Young Ones)

Re:Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwago (1)

Drakino (10965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568488)

As I said, the only difference in the DRIVES is the laser. The DVD discs are what have the extra storage capacity. Just like the hard drive platters have the extra capacity and not the hard drive heads.


Re:A simple answer for Justin (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568489)

It's just like owning a Spectrum again.

DVD's storage ability may make it possible for scanned images of punch cards for those of us who wish to install linux that have not yet invested in sound cards. wheeeeeeee!

multi-distro DVDs (2)

apocalypse_now (82372) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568490)

cheapbytes should offer a DVD which includes SuSe, Red Hat, and Debian on it. Mmmmm.
Matt Singerman

Re:Oh no! Region locked DVD Linux distros! (1)

Drakino (10965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568491)

Region locks on DVD only come from the way a DVD MPEG2 movie (VOB files) is encoded and encrypted onto a disc. Data cannot be locked down to a specific region as it is simply put on the DVD discs and not encrypted like the DVD movie files.


Re:Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwago (1)

Mija Cat (94021) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568492)

Why, so we can leverage the new cool tech gear to further our goal of world domination, of course!

annoying, but almost necessary now (2)

rcw-work (30090) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568493)

Two things are gonna make this a royal pain for people trying to make their own DVD's:
  • Filesize limit on 32-bit linux means it gets tough to create 5GB dvd images. You'll have to do imaging from an Alpha, Sparc64, MIPS64, or Itanium box.
  • Outrageous prices on DVD-burning/pressing equipment

Also, to answer another poster, the potato freeze is being postponed until at least Nov 7, basically the holdup is the boot floppies - it's a bad idea to go into a freeze without working boot floppies.

Re:could you boot of a DVD? (2)

the eric conspiracy (20178) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568494)

DVD-R copiers are available from Panasonic etc. $5k or so. I don't know about media. But that is not important. Almost all of the disks I have ordered from Cheapbytes have been done by a mass duplication system, not one at a time in a CD-R drive.

It was about time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568495)

I think it was abou time I think one DVD makes a lot more sense than 6 or more cds. At least if you've got a DVD drive that is

Speaking of DVDs as install media .. (2)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568496)

.. does anybody have a copy of DVD #8 of Microsoft Office 2000? Mine was eaten by the dog. DVDs #7 and #9 are okay, but number 8 has the paperclip on it and you can't have a complete Office installation without that little bastard.

please mail me if you have this dvd

About bloody time... (1)

warlock (14079) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568497)

...that I get to use my DVD-ROM for something useful

I was getting kinda worried about splashing out all that cash for a DVD-ROM a year or so ago and ending up using it for bog standard CD-ROMs and the odd pr0n DVD =)


How about SCSI DVD-ROM drives? (1)

Kit Lo (45824) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568508)

Speaking of ATAPI, has anybody seen any SCSI DVD-ROM drives lately besides the HiVal offerings (with the drive made by Pioneer)? I'm more of the "give-me-SCSI-or-give-me-death" user. Are those drives bootable as well?

No, I am not using the Creative Labs stuff. IDE drives give me the chills...

I might have to look for a separate decoder some day. Something that has to work with Linux and Windoze...

Well, I suppose its a good thing (2)

Judg3 (88435) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568509)

I didn't want to buy a DVD ROM for my computer, I thought "Hey, I dont wana see movies on my dinky lil 19" Monitor when I can watch em on my 35" TV". But seeing as we are starting to get some real use out of DVD besides just movies, I may have to splurge for one. I think Ill hold out awhile though before I buy my DVD player for the comp. I'd really like the DVD-RAM, but at 500-600$ for it and 20-40$ for each disks its a little out of my range. But kudos to SuSE for starting to make DVD's more useful. I always loved SuSE, now I know why. =]


Re:Well now that everyone's hopped on the bandwago (1)

BoneFlower (107640) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568510)

You have a point, but, without a new laser, the increased storage capacity would be irrelavant as nothing could access it. LArge advances in storage size occur with advances in read/write head design. This goes for all storage media.

Linux on DIVX. Pay per install! (2)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568511)

Special DIVX-ROM with built in modem and user supplied phone connection required! $1.00 per install or "permanently unlock" your Linux distro (on single DIVX-ROM drive only, phone connection still required) for a $30.00 one time fee!

Re:This will be nice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1568512)

Now to just find a cheap 4x or so DVD drive.

In addition to cheap, I need to find a SCSI DVD drive. My box doesn't have an IDE controller. I've been looking for one for months now, with no luck. Does anyone make these?

Wait, wait! You can't do that! (4)

extrasolar (28341) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568513)

I just patented:

Using a storage media greater than 500 megabytes for the storage of many individually compressed software components.

Pay up! Yep, that means you future mp3 DVD burners too!


But seriously, this is great. While the rest of the world is getting excited about DVD movies and mega-games, I think the greatest thing about DVDs are more space! Just think: all the binary packages AND the source on ONE disk.

Oh yeah!

Linux? That's GNU/Linux [] to you mister!

I'm having flashbacks... (1)

Weramona (23619) | more than 14 years ago | (#1568514)

Remember the last days of the "Software on Floppies" age? I still get warm fuzzies when I think of that stack of 21 disks which held King's Quest V. I think Wolfenstein 3d was 12. We're starting to reach that point with cds...
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