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Mario 64 Working Full Speed on PSP

Hemos posted more than 7 years ago | from the full-speed-ahead-captain dept.

Emulation (Games) 51

YokimaSun writes "Homebrew coders push the boundaries on the PSP again, StrmnNrmn has released a new version of his Nintendo 64 emulator for the PSP that has been confirmed to play Mario 64 at Full Speed on Sony's Handheld. A full Compatibility listing is available with games such as Starfox64 playble too."

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Controls (2, Interesting)

ShaneThePain (929627) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571761)

Sounds to me like it would be hard to control. From playing on a PSP a few times I noticed a lot of games needed a lock on feature for the cursor to make it possible to do anything.

Re:Controls (3, Insightful)

Runefox (905204) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571945)

Not really, so did the N64. Both consoles have only one analog stick, and Mario 64 was a relatively simple game, control-wise.

Re:Controls (1)

D4rk Fx (862399) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572773)

I've played Super Mario 64 all the way through on an emulator on a PC using a KEYBOARD. Only arrows to control movement. The camera was fairly annoying some times as it's a lot harder to not fall off of things when the camera decides to shift a whole bunch. I usually just jumped my way around or through those areas. It is definitely doable.

Re:Controls (2, Informative)

metroid composite (710698) | more than 7 years ago | (#18574859)

and Mario 64 was a relatively simple game, control-wise.
I disagree--now, yes, Mario 64 is a relatively simple game, control-wise by today's standards, which is likely what you meant.

At the time, however, nobody was used to manipulating the camera, and needed to be taught that all through tutorials, making it a functionally 8-button game--more buttons than the vast majority of previous console games. It also had a much higher number of character-states than was normal at the time: "in-air" "on-ground" "sliding" "crouching" "direction-reversing" "hitting wall" "Flight mode" "swiming mode" "last command was double-jump". I can think of about 10 different results for the A-button depending on state, 8 different results for the B-button, and 4 different results for the Z-button. Again, not the most complicated game of all time, but certainly a step up in control complexity (particularly compared to previous Marios that were nearly one-button affairs).

Re:Controls (1)

Runefox (905204) | more than 7 years ago | (#18581097)

I agree; I remember my first experience with both analog sticks and camera management, and it wasn't pretty. However, I was referring to its use of the controller in relation to the available input on a PSP, which can and will fit the bill for SM64's controls quite easily.

AC64 Working Full Speed on PFP. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18571763)

(portable first post)

Funny (3, Insightful)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571785)

The main reason to buy a sony handheld is to play old Nintendo games...

Re:Funny (1, Funny)

ganjadude (952775) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571809)

seriously the PSP is useless, its nice to see its good for something other than pr0n ;)

Do The Math... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18579225)

PSP = Mario + pr0n...
.
.
.
ARRRGGHH! My eyes!

Re:Funny (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18571969)

And PSX games as well. With a few rare exceptions (sometimes important ones, like Final Fantasy 8), PSX games seem to run near flawlessly at full speed. Let's not forget full-speed GBA and NES emulation either. It's an excellent handheld for those who like those kind of games, especially when you're on a platform that doesn't have that many great emulators.

Re:Funny (0, Troll)

drsquare (530038) | more than 7 years ago | (#18577163)

The main reason to buy a DS seems to be to play games that are clones of PC/console games from over a decade ago.

Re:Funny (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18579791)

You're right, that's exactly the main reason.


And it's awesome.

Re:Funny (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18578817)

Yeah man. What a horrible console that vastly outpowers the DS and has a lineup this year alone to make up for previous shortcomings. You're right. The PSP sucks hard. I guess I'll go play "Cooking Mama" and the 500 other shovelware games I bought for my NINTENDO DS!

NDS??! (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18571815)

Or I could buy a DS and play the new version on a decent handheld...

Re:NDS??! (-1, Troll)

Xymor (943922) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572129)

Now, try emulating a psx game in your decent handheld.
yeah, thought so.

Now if only that psp2 had a touchscreen, 700mhz cpu, 128mb sys, 64mb gfx and we could have emulators (after a few hacks) for every console from atari to nds, ps2 and xbox.
Just imagine the possibilities, playing ninja gaiden, metal gear solid and phoenix wright in the same haldheld. If it was open and run linux then it would be made of win and god.

Re:NDS??! (3, Funny)

meringuoid (568297) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572549)

Now if only that psp2 had a touchscreen, 700mhz cpu, 128mb sys, 64mb gf

And a battery life measured in seconds.

Re:NDS??! (1)

Xymor (943922) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572843)

We have UMPCs with similar specifications today.
Maybe not from Nvidia or ATI, but there's a lot of research and in a couple years we should have a lot more energy efficient components, better batteries and everything small enough for a pratical handhelds.

Re:NDS??! (1)

Zo0ok (209803) | more than 7 years ago | (#18573367)

My PSP has a battery time of 7h for games or watching movies. With a 700MHz CPU it would probably be shorter.

Battery time together with the larger display was the reason I got a PSP instead of a vides iPod.

The question on everyone's mind: (2, Funny)

TheSpinningBrain (998202) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571841)

But does it emulate running Linux?

Re:The question on everyone's mind: (1)

Wanon (808109) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571961)

It doesn't emulate it. It runs it, uClinux [dot5hosting.com] . Albeit a cut down version especially for processors without a memory management unit.

Re:The question on everyone's mind: (1)

TheSpinningBrain (998202) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572519)

I think you missed it... I meant running Linux on top of the emulator.

Now... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18571851)

If only sony would let us have access to the graphics hardware on the PS3.

I wonder... (2, Interesting)

Runefox (905204) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571857)

Is this full speed without specific optimizations, or full speed by using game-specific hacks? I'd be interested to know, since I have a PSP that's soon to be homebrew-ized.

Re:I wonder... (1)

toejam316 (1000986) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571883)

It uses a few optimisations, but they're not game specific. Mainly its all just preference, but the general tip is to use Frameskip 2 or 3.

Re:I wonder... (1)

Runefox (905204) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571955)

Ouch. That's a high frameskip... I wouldn't consider that to be completely full-speed, but hell, I guess the emulation is technically full-speed.

Full speed?? (4, Insightful)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 7 years ago | (#18571995)

It isn't 'full speed' if you have to turn on frameskip to get it that way. That's like saying 'if you don't mind missing 2/3 of everything, it's all there.'

From TF... I hate to call it an article. From the forum posting: "mario 64 is really good arounf the castle with audio on frameskip 3" 3! That means it's at 1/4 detail for the audio.

"a steady 20fps and sometimes alot higher in mario 64" Yeah, full speed indeed.

No, Mario 64 is now -playable- on the PSP. Not full speed.

Re:Full speed?? (1)

ZakuSage (874456) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572125)

Yeah, basically... not to mention you have pretty annoying slowdown once you enter the first level and emulating sound (which sounds rather choppy) makes it slow down to a point beyond playability. Still, considering the emulation environment of N64 even getting where he has is a mighty big accomplishment. Hopefully with time, Mario 64 will actually be full speed.

Re:Full speed?? (1)

Mitchell Mebane (594797) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572429)

Except a lot of N64 games only ran at 20 or 30 FPS, to begin with. F-Zero is the only one I can think of that ran at 60, although I believe there were a few more. So, 20 FPS probably isn't missing much.

Re:Full speed?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18572599)

20 fps is missing one third of everything. A slowdown from 60 to 40 fps may not be important, but you can actually notice a slowdown from 30 to 20. Most of the N64 games run at 30fps, a few of them run at 60fps, none of them run at 20fps (except when the load was too hight and you got slowdowns, of course). A videogame at a constant rate of 20 fps is barely playable, I can tolerate sporadic slowdowns... you know, from time to time... if a slowdown suppose going from 20 fps down to 10 fps (or even less) we are talking about going from slowdown to full stop.

Re:Full speed?? (3, Insightful)

kalirion (728907) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572829)

Heh, I remember, back in the day, playing Duke Nukem 3d on my P100 at an average of about 17fps (640x480) and not seeing anything wrong. How spoiled we've gotten...

Re:Full speed?? (2, Insightful)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572885)

I can actually still play games as low as 15-20fps without it interrupting my immersion. I count myself lucky that I can't tell the difference between anything 30fps and up. For those than can tell the difference up to 120fps, it must be really annoying to play at the lower fps.

I agree we've gotten spoiled, but it's also true that most newer games rely on the sense of immersion to make a good game, instead of other things like strategy or comedy. Since that's what sells, we're to blame for that. ;)

Re:Full speed?? (0, Offtopic)

Nozsd (1080965) | more than 7 years ago | (#18574875)

It's not that people can see the difference between 30 fps and 120 fps, it's the benefit that a higher fps brings. In Quake 3, at least, hitting that 125 fps will allow you to jump to areas that a player with a lower fps can't. For example, the mega health ledge in Q3DM13; you'll never make the jump at the default 85 fps cap, but if you set it to 125 (140 is actually better) with /com_maxfps [int], you'll be able to jump to it easily provided your graphics card can give you that frame rate of course. Not only can you jump higher, but your strafe jumps will be noticeably faster and the game will be much more fluid. So when people say they see a difference, what they really mean is that they can feel a difference.

Re:Full speed?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18576737)

I can tell the difference, but it only really bugs me once the framerate drops below 12-13. Everything above 20 is gravy.

Re:Full speed?? (1)

aliquis (678370) | more than 7 years ago | (#18580631)

People who are after 120 fps and so on probably do it for in game physic advantages and not for looks.

Re:Full speed?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18579735)

Well, I did see 17fps wrong even back those days. The human eye can perceive from 50 to 60 frames per second, that's a fact, so you can really notice the difference at least up to that point. You will see the movement smoother and even your eyes will suffer less stress, and so on. The point in reaching higher frame rates is that when the load raises and the frame rate falls down, you cannot notice a slowdown from 120 fps to 60 fps (50%), but you will damn the fucking game if the frame rate falls from 50 down to 25 (50%).

It does not matter that you can play ancient slow games at low frame rates (don't get me wrong, I love DN3D, still one of my favorites games ever), if the screen fills with fast enemies or you have to accurately jump just on the right time, you need frame rates higher than 20. In other words, if a game is programmed to be playable at 20fps, you may be able to play it at 17. If a game is programmed to be played at 30fps (or more, I'm not totally sure that Mario64 runs at 30fps) I'm not so sure that you will be able to play it at 20 fps (and even less, if 20 is the average).

Re:Full speed?? (1)

Kennego (963972) | more than 7 years ago | (#18574503)

I remember Killer Instinct Gold was one of the 60 fps ones, and that also came out pretty early. But most games were in fact 30 fps, which was fine for most people at the time.

How to get it to run at 60 fps... (1)

aliquis (678370) | more than 7 years ago | (#18580595)

Of course you could just buy Mario 64 DS instead and play it at 60 fps on the NDS. But maybe that is to simple?

/ Aliquis, NDS owner at troll mod risk :D

Re:How to get it to run at 60 fps... (1)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 7 years ago | (#18581439)

I actually didn't like the DS one. -sigh- Something's just different in how it plays. (Besides the add-ons, I mean.) I got it for the Wii also and I like the Wii's unmodified one better.

pish posh (0, Offtopic)

j00r0m4nc3r (959816) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572139)

Call me when it can emulate an AppleTV that emulates OSX

Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettier.. (3, Insightful)

GweeDo (127172) | more than 7 years ago | (#18572699)

on the Nintendo DS. Seriously, congrats PSP, you can run a worse looking version of a game that runs on the DS.

Re:Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettie (0)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 7 years ago | (#18575369)

What kind of crack do you smoke? It's gotta be pretty amazing stuff, because the DS has never, and will never, run Super Mario 64. Yes, it has Super Mario DS, which is a *remake* of the original specifically tailored for the DS, but that's hardly the same thing as emulating a Nintendo 64 so you can run the original game.

Fact is, if someone had the rights and the willingness, they could easily reimplement Super Mario 64 for the PSP. No one will, but they could.

And to the moron who modded that post up as insightful, please turn in your modpoints, you're too stupid to use them.

Re:Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettie (1)

7Prime (871679) | more than 7 years ago | (#18577667)

Actually, the full name of the game is "Super Mario 64 DS". It's not so much a remake as a port with a few additional features. I think it's perfectly reasonable to point out that Mairo 64 runs on the DS. I don't know why you would get so angry with the poster for mentioning anything like this, for one thing, it's perfectly true. Furthermore, questioning the +1 insightful in that manner is simply childish, he had a perfectly ligitimate reason for marking it in that way.

Furthermore, WHY run Mario 64 on the PSP? If you're into Nintendo's games, buy a DS, it's cheeper, and the games are catered directly to the system. It's going to be a very long time before Ocarina of Time is able to run on a PSP, and by that time, we'll have Phantom Hourglass, a NEW game. Playing old games is great, but it's stupid to be playing them at the expense of good new games.

Re:Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettie (1)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 7 years ago | (#18577785)

It's not so much a remake as a port with a few additional features.

And you know this how? The DS is significantly different than the Nintendo 64 from a hardware standpoint. I'd be very surprised if it was just a straight port. Wikipedia describes it as an "enhanced remake", though it's hardly an authoritative source.

I don't know why you would get so angry with the poster for mentioning anything like this, for one thing, it's perfectly true.

Umm, no, I don't believe it's true, and thus, to me, it constitutes blatant misinformation, not to mention irritating fanboism.

And before you paint me as a Sony shill, I have a DS phat, plan to get a Lite, and will be buying a Wii.

Furthermore, questioning the +1 insightful in that manner is simply childish, he had a perfectly ligitimate reason for marking it in that way.

Actually, no. As far as I'm aware, the comment is simply *wrong*. Thus to claim it's insightful is, simply put, dumb. Worse, in an article about emulation, the post triumphantly crows about a remake, as if these are the same things. They're not, and so the post is at best off-topic.

Furthermore, WHY run Mario 64 on the PSP?

Well, that's a good question. :) Although, the goal is probably to run other Nintendo 64 games on the PSP, which is an interesting-enough goal. After all, plenty of other console emulators are available for it, why not the Nintendo 64?

As an aside, I highly doubt they'll reach full speed with that thing, but it's interesting, nonetheless.

Playing old games is great, but it's stupid to be playing them at the expense of good new games.

And this I just don't understand. How is emulating the Nintendo 64 being done "at the expense of good new games"?

Re:Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettie (1)

7Prime (871679) | more than 7 years ago | (#18578953)

Jesus dude, I own the game, and I played a lot of Mario 64 (the original), not too long ago. It's an update, not a remake, trust me. They ADDED multipul characters (of which you can choose to always play as Mario), and slightly altered the power-up system (I'll remind you that the power-up systems in both versions of the game are an extremely minor part of the gameplay, unlike the games in the rest of the series). After that, they ADDED one more star to each course, without altering the courses. Made very very few gameplay changes. It was an update with a few added goodies, like Super Mario World Advanced. Even the graphics are pretty much identical. You want a remake? Metroid Zero Mission is a remake. Mario 64 DS and Mario 3 All-stars, those are updates.

The DS seems incredibly capable at handling material originally made for the N64. MarioKart DS had identical gameplay and look&feel to MarioKart 64, used many of the same levels, and had about the same quality of graphics, or maybe just a bit better. Sure, they had to port the code... that's why it's called a PORT.

And by: "at the expense of good new games", I'm making a jab at the PSPs relitively weak library, as compared to the DS... of whose library you would be sacrificing if you chose to get a PSP, instead, just so you could play Mario 64, in all its original, "single-character glory."

Seriously, call me back when I can play Majora's Mask.

Re:Ha ha ha...zo'o (1)

mattxmayhem (961548) | more than 7 years ago | (#18581623)

You are definitely missing the point. It is a remake, in that the original code has been drastically optimized to run on the ds. I don't know the specifics, but since they are DIFFERENT platforms, you can't just use the initial data with a veritable expansion pack and play it on whatever system you want, otherwise PC's wouldn't be the computer system of choice for gamers, and Dreamcast games would work on playstation - they can read the discs, can't they?

SM64DS was largely a recompile (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 7 years ago | (#18578469)

the DS has never, and will never, run Super Mario 64. Yes, it has Super Mario DS, which is a *remake* of the original specifically tailored for the DS

Likewise, Windows has never, and will never, run GIMP or Gaim. Yes, it has GIMP for Windows and Gaim for windows, which are *remakes* of the originals specifically tailored for Windows.

Super Mario 64 was written in C++, and its game logic was recompiled to form the single-player portions of Super Mario 64 DS. Yes, the graphics engine had to be rewritten in part to port it from UltraSDK to NitroSDK, just as GTK+/GDK/Glib had to be rewritten in part to move GIMP and Gaim from an X11/POSIX backend to a Win32 backend.

Re:SM64DS was largely a recompile (1)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 7 years ago | (#18578667)

Likewise, Windows has never, and will never, run GIMP or Gaim. Yes, it has GIMP for Windows and Gaim for windows, which are *remakes* of the originals specifically tailored for Windows.

Correct. What's your point? Mine was that the DS will never run a Nintendo 64 emulator, and comparing a DS-targeted remake of Super Mario 64 to a PSP Nintendo 64 emulator makes no sense, as they're drastically different animals. Thus the post is hardly insightful, and is definitely off-topic.

Compare to UltraHLE (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 7 years ago | (#18579085)

What's your point? Mine was that the DS will never run a Nintendo 64 emulator

It was expected that the PSP become able to emulate the N64, as the UltraHLE emulator ran on PSP-class PC hardware by intercepting UltraSDK calls and translating them to the Glide API, just as the N64 to DS ports replace UltraSDK calls with NitroSDK calls. My point is that it would have benefitted them to demonstrate their work using a game that isn't officially ported to a modern handheld, so as to avoid "well whoop-dee-shit, I can do that cheaper than it would cost to mod my new PSP and without breaking exclusive rights law" type responses.

Re:Update: Mario 64 Working Full Speed and Prettie (1)

Perseid (660451) | more than 7 years ago | (#18575539)

Are you trolling or do you seriously not understand the difference between a remake and an emulator? The fact that the N64 emulator is improving means it can potentially someday run any N64 game. Can your Super Mario DS cartridge do that?

Full speed, pretty, but legal? (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 7 years ago | (#18578519)

The fact that the N64 emulator is improving means it can potentially someday run any N64 game
Yeah, and CSS descramblers can rip DVD-Video discs. But that doesn't make it lawful on U.S. soil. (Slashdot is on U.S. soil.) Running Super Mario 64 DS on Nintendo DS doesn't infringe Nintendo's copyrights nor Sony's patents nor Nintendo's anti-circumvention rights nor Sony's anti-circumvention rights. Can your modded PSP and bootleg N64 ROMs do that?
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