Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Hacked DX10 for Windows Appears

CmdrTaco posted more than 7 years ago | from the well-maybe-it-did-anyway dept.

PC Games (Games) 336

Oddscurity writes "According to The Inquirer someone managed to write a wrapper allowing DirectX 10 applications to run on platforms other than Vista. The Alky Project claims to have reverse-engineered Geometry Shader code, allowing Windows games to run on Windows XP, MacOSX and Linux. The Inquirer is understandably cautious about these claims, urging readers to investigate the releases themselves to ascertain whether or not it's a hoax."

cancel ×

336 comments

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

just buy Vista... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840109)

...you stingy bastards!

Re:just buy Vista... (1, Insightful)

eviloverlordx (99809) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840139)

No thanks. I'd like to be able to use my computer without needing five top-of-the-line graphics cards just to run the OS.

Re:just buy Vista... (3, Insightful)

brunascle (994197) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840167)

well, you're going to need those cards to run DX10 anyway.

Re:just buy Vista... (4, Insightful)

ivan256 (17499) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840181)

The article claims to have a software implementation of DirectX 10 Geometry Shaders, so no, you wouldn't.

Re:just buy Vista... (5, Insightful)

Beau6183 (899597) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840275)

So rather than a top-of-the-line GPU, you'd have to compensate with a top-of-the-line CPU to handle the load brought on by software rendering.

Re:just buy Vista... (5, Funny)

Surt (22457) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840353)

Realistically, to run any likely dx10 app, you'd need at least 64 top of the line cpus to handle the software rendering load.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

Gr8Apes (679165) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840369)

Which I have anyways, and is useful for other things like editing multi-media, unlike that high end DX10 card. Besides, I have a reasonably high-end DX9 card.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

SmokeyTheBalrog (996551) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840713)

XP will run certain programs better than Vista will. Consider that it is even more of a resource hog than XP.

Not to mention the large number of programs and device drivers wont run on Vista at all.

In 2 or 3 years Vista will be a good OS. Currently the bugs far out weigh the benefits. As I recall XP went through similar problems. At launch it was buggy, a resource hog, and many programs/drivers couldn't run on it. (It's still a resource hog compared to older OSes[or *nix / BSD OSes], but hardware has progressed to the point of it not being an issue for only most people/markets)

For a significant portion of the market the primary reason to "upgrade" to Vista is DX10 (once DX10 games come out).
Games are among the programs that ought to run better on XP.

Re:just buy Vista... (5, Insightful)

Blahbooboo3 (874492) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840213)

I can't ignore this comment as it seems Slashdot keeps perpetuating this myth...

Why do people keep perpetuating this misnomer?? If you don't use Aero and instead switch to Windows Classic Appearance, Vista works great on a wide variety of machines.

Now, if you had said it as below you would have had a point:
"No thanks. I'd like to be able to use my computer without needing five top-of-the-line graphics cards just to run the OS in 'fancy graphics' mode.

Re:just buy Vista... (1, Troll)

toQDuj (806112) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840257)

Or get a mac, for the price of windows Vista, with screen-licking graphics and other cool shininess! Ooh, shinyyyyyy!.

B.

Re:just buy Vista... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840407)

same problem, dumbass!

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

jimstapleton (999106) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840411)

except some people think the MacGUI looks ugly.

Actually, I think the default GUI on any OS I've used looks attrocious, but I find I can take Widows and KDE (ok, the latter isn't an OS, but it can work on many!) and make them look good with minimal effort.

Re:just buy Vista... (3, Insightful)

toQDuj (806112) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840559)

I'd be the first to agree that the UI in Mac OS X is quite limited in terms of customisability.

If you like the OS X GUI, great! If you don't, you'd be forced to use third party apps to change even the most basic elements.
Me, I'm happy with the way things are, but if there was an easier way to change the appearance, I might consider changing. All in all, it doesn't play that big a role though, the increase in productivity has been well worth the decrease in UI customizability.

B.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

jimstapleton (999106) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840651)

Such 3rd party apps exist?

A post involving links would be at least +3 informative -1 offtopic worth!

Still, being visually impared, I doubt there's anything to fix the one problem that I find makes it unusable...
That menu bar stuck at the top, rather than with the applicationw indow involves a lot more head movement.

Re:just buy Vista... (3, Informative)

toQDuj (806112) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840769)

A quick google results in "ShapeShifter" http://unsanity.com/haxies/shapeshifter [unsanity.com]

I've had good fun with ctrl scroll-wheel-up and ctrl scroll-wheel-down though. So that might be a way to go for visually impaired.
It doesn't solve the menu bar problem though. Whilst annoying at times, I've recently seen a widescreen windows notebook with adobe reader within a browser. My word! There was hardly any space for the text left due to the sheer number of toolbars present.

Good luck.

B.

Re:just buy Vista... (2, Insightful)

shaitand (626655) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840287)

'Why do people keep perpetuating this misnomer?? If you don't use Aero and instead switch to Windows Classic Appearance, Vista works great on a wide variety of machines.'

A variety of machines with really fast processors and boatloads of ram.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

jimstapleton (999106) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840449)

Actually, it just needs boatloads of RAM in the classic interface, can be average. You only need a good GFX card and a powerful CPU in Aero...

But, if you do have those boatloads of RAM, Vista can be faster than XP. The turnaround point, according to some tests I've seen, is between the 1 and 1.5GB mark, varying on the apps you use.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

penp (1072374) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840797)

Actually, it just needs boatloads of RAM in the classic interface, can be average.
What?

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

jimstapleton (999106) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840835)

CPU can be average... Sorry, not sure how I missed typing that.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

holysin (549880) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840865)

Pretty sure they mean, it just needs boatloads of RAM. In the classic interface (the graphics card) can be average....

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

LSD-OBS (183415) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840319)

Looked up the definition of "misnomer" recently?

Re:just buy Vista... (5, Funny)

Minwee (522556) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840347)

I think it's a perfectly cromulent word.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

drxenos (573895) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840525)

Please, tell me where that is from. It's been driving me nuts trying to remember the source of the reference!

Re:just buy Vista... (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840615)

It's a lovely word, isn't it? I really think it's use embiggens the English language.

Re:just buy Vista... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840637)

Re:just buy Vista... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840719)

Thank you, ever so much A/C for copying and pasting what took me an entire 3 seconds to find on my own!

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

LSD-OBS (183415) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840549)

In actuality, although the word might be nice, its usage above is rather malapropistic, for the denotation of "misnomer" is along the lines of "using the wrong name for a person, place or event" as opposed to "perpetuating untruthiness".

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

Blahbooboo3 (874492) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840535)

Yes, I have, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misnomer [wikipedia.org] . Have you?

A misnomer is a term which suggests an interpretation known not to be true.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

LSD-OBS (183415) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840643)

Did you even bother to read the rest of that page? Or cross reference with a publication reputable in the area of word definitions, such as a dictionary? It's really not complicated. "Misnomer" is the wrong word to use.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

brunascle (994197) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840661)

A misnomer is a term which suggests an interpretation known not to be true.

FAIL!

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

Syowr (50984) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840711)

A real dictionary might have served you better.

From the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary:

Main Entry: misnomer
Pronunciation: "mis-'nO-m&r
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English misnoumer, from Anglo-French mesnomer, from mes- mis- + nomer to name, from Latin nominare -- more at NOMINATE
1 : the misnaming of a person in a legal instrument
2 a : a use of a wrong or inappropriate name b : a wrong name or inappropriate designation

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

garcia (6573) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840331)

Does the OS detect the card you have and then tone down the OS' level of resource hogging based on that?

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

Blahbooboo3 (874492) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840585)

Yes, it only runs Aero if your graphics card can support the interface.

Re:just buy Vista... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840593)

But if you don't use Aero and run it in classic mode instead then what are you getting from Vista? Nothing that dramatic since Aero is the big selling point for MS. Sort of like buying a big house and not being able to use most of the rooms.

Re:just buy Vista... (5, Informative)

Pengo (28814) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840677)


I kind of went along with that too, but have now re-installed XP out of frustration.

I'm using a Dual 8800 GTX video card (the Dell XPS H2C system: http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetail s.aspx/xpsdt_710h2c?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs [dell.com] is my rig).

I have 2 fast disks striped w/hardware raid and things like file copies felt sluggish and slow. (Moving files around the hard disk).

Using the windows explorer was numbingly frustrating.

The Video driver would crash frequently, even after disabling SLI (I know, it's nVidia's problem, not MS's...) But, the driver would recover and then it would go into a chain of driver crash warnings.

The BSOD's would occur not hourly, but seemingly about 1-2x per week.

The AERO didn't seem to make the system sluggish, but I'm running the fastest video cards on the market..

I'm sure if your running a simple system, integrated graphics card and AC97 audio, your disk configuration isn't complex, or has good drivers.. you might be ok, but some of the subtle problems of vista don't show up until after a month or two of using it. (I've been using since Beta 2 off and on, including RTM and bought a copy at launch).

Funny enough, my wife got my old computer (dual core 3600+ AMD, 2 gigs ram and ATI Radion XT1800), and I put a copy of vista on that machine and it works fine, but all she does on her computer is open the web browser and play solitaire. She has FAR from high end hardware, and she runs it in the high graphics desktop mode without a hickup. the issues I've described on my machine doesn't bother her, she doesn't do things like open the file explorer or copy large files around.

We ordered a batch of dell low end desktop for customer-service reps here at our office, they are running Vista. They have integrated video cards (probably Intel) and it seems to be fine with Aero running, 1 gig of ram. But the only app they use is Mozilla.

I personally regret not buying a Mac Pro after spending 3 or so months fighting with Vista on my new machine, I've concluded that XP will have to work until it's EOL'd and I can feel I didn't completely waste my money on that Dell and buy another Mac to replace it.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

Vexorian (959249) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840823)

But last time I checked the 'fancy graphics' mode was the only vista feature...

Re:just buy Vista... (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840289)

Well i likee to use my computer without having to read 50 manuals and then going to 150 sites on top of that just to be told "RTFM noob" while said manuals are incomplete.

Li-nux sucks nuts.

Re:just buy Vista... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840751)

Don't likee your computer you drooling windows chump. It will
make it all wet.

Disgusting child.

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

robbiethefett (1047640) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840841)

linux is a kernel. it is incapable of sucking nuts. distributions, on the other hand.. they often suck nuts. good thing theres like 1000 of them, many of which have nice gui installers and tons of newbie help guides available for the most common problems. then again, you can always install slackware 2.0 from a floppy and then bitch about the remaining 6 slack users telling you to rtfm.. whoever modded parent "insightful" must have been trying to use a creative spelling of "troll."

Re:just buy Vista... (1)

BlueTrin (683373) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840727)

Hello Steve, how are you ? Not too busy at the office with the Vista issues ? :)

DMCA?? (5, Insightful)

Pompatus (642396) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840163)

Even if he really managed to do this (which I doubt, look how long wine has been around and it still doesn't run everything), won't he get sued immediately for something like this?

Re:DMCA?? (4, Informative)

OverlordQ (264228) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840243)

Thought there was a compatibility-exemption for reverse-engineering.

Re:DMCA?? (5, Informative)

Mr. Sketch (111112) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840421)

Thought there was a compatibility-exemption for reverse-engineering.
Riiiiight. Tell that to the makers of bnetd.

Re:DMCA?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840515)

The DMCA relates to copy-control circumvention -- it has nothing to do with this case.

You'd think the people who are so obsessed with the DMCA would bother to have the slightest idea what it says, but you'd think that about the GPL also.

Re:DMCA?? (2, Funny)

kinglink (195330) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840577)

But this is slashdot. If we had a molecule of knowledge on the subject, we'd be working on it instead of here discussing it in very vague terms.

Oh damn now I made myself feel bad.

Re:DMCA?? (4, Funny)

Deanodriver (962608) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840863)

It's fun to screw with the D M C A!

now all we need is a cop, a construction worker, and those other ones...

Free Information! (1)

b0z0n3 (1086487) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840309)

If he releases the code to the whole world, then who will they sue?

Re:Free Information! (3, Insightful)

CaseM (746707) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840379)

Kinda how no one sued DVD Jon [slashdot.org] ?

Re:DMCA?? (1)

MadJo (674225) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840367)

Not if said person did not come from the USA.
Luckily, that dragon of a law isn't enforced globally.

Sapling? (1)

monkeyboythom (796957) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840171)

Well the first three letters are right...

Members of its Sapling Program will be able to get the wrappers for DirectX10 applications and run them not just on DX10 hardware under Windows XP, but with some DX9 hardware as well.

Re:Sapling? (2, Interesting)

brunascle (994197) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840229)

yup. from what i gather, many who entered the program are pissed because they payed $50 and have seen nothing come out of it yet. and this release seems to be nothing more than him trying to prove that he's actually working on it. it's not very functional.

i really hope he does succeed though. we really need something like this.

If nothing else... (5, Interesting)

RyanFenton (230700) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840183)

If nothing else, this can be a call to others to create similar projects. If the Alky Project is real (which it is by all accounts so far), then even if it is shut down, their work will continue. If it can't meet it's goals in some way, then it's full promise will remain as a focus for the great need to NOT 'upgrade' to Windows Vista, drawing in a large number of developers. It is also the promise that applications made for DirectX 10 may live beyond their operating environment.

This is very much a more direct refection of the same phenomenon that allows entire hardware systems to be emulated against the wishes of console, arcade and computer manufacturers.

This is the start of the market's reaction to Vista, made manifest.

Ryan Fenton

Re:If nothing else... (1, Troll)

EveryNickIsTaken (1054794) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840305)

This is the start of the market's reaction to Vista, made manifest.
Actually, this is Linux users' and MS-philes' (over)reaction to Vista. And they'll get sued.

Re:If nothing else... (2, Insightful)

MetalPhalanx (1044938) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840799)

This is the start of the market's reaction to Vista, made manifest.
Agreed.

It's great to see that at least some people are fighting back against Microsoft's nasty move. If it's possible to implement DX10 on any other OS than Vista, it's just proof that M$ was just trying to force everyone else out of the gaming market. Of course, most of us already know about how slimy they are... but it's always nice to see a reminder.

Are we sad yet (5, Insightful)

willie_nelsons_pigta (1006979) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840211)

We are hacking Windows apps to run them on Windows OS's.

Let the sadness ensue.

Re:Are we sad yet (5, Funny)

foniksonik (573572) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840365)

Let the sadness ensue.


"Cancel or allow?"

Re:Are we sad yet (3, Insightful)

beset (745752) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840385)

Not that I understand anything about DirectX but wouldn't this be the first step to getting something functioning in WINE?

Re:Are we sad yet (2, Interesting)

Jaseoldboss (650728) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840579)

wouldn't this be the first step to getting something functioning in WINE?

If it's true it will be. See here [theinquirer.net]

Cody claims he reverse-engineered the Geometry Shader code, and that users will be able to run Windows games intended on the Mac OS X on x86-based Macinteltoshes as well as Linux.

Re:Are we sad yet (0, Redundant)

Samhain (6902) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840461)

"You are coming to a sad realization. Allow or Deny?"

- I could not resist.

didn't work for me (4, Interesting)

oliverthered (187439) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840245)

I downloaded it and everytime I start up a Direct X 10 tutorial it crashes out, the file sizes 400k also seem a little small.

I'd also like to know how he implemented Vertexs and Indexs since in DirectX 10 you allocate one buffer and it can be any type but under DirectX 9 you have to choose the type of buffer when you create it. Copying all that stuff into memory so you can allocate the buffer in the DirectX 10 drive at render time is going to slow things down a hell of a lot.

Still if it worked it would be very interesting for the wine project.

Re:didn't work for me (0)

jeswin (981808) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840631)

Still if it worked it would be very interesting for the wine project.

And totally illegal as well. All Microsoft EULAs for their free stuff (or stuff which is not sold, like DirectX) forbid installation on non-Windows platforms. I don't see how this is different from pirating Windows in the first place.

Here it is, from the EULA for DirectX:
NOTE: IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A VALIDLY LICENSED COPY OF ANY VERSION OR EDITION OF MICROSOFT WINDOWS XP MEDIA CENTER EDITION, MICROSOFT WINDOWS 95, WINDOWS 98, WINDOWS NT 4.0 WINDOWS 2000 OPERATING SYSTEM OR ANY MICROSOFT OPERATING SYSTEM THAT IS A SUCCESSOR TO ANY OF THOSE OPERATING SYSTEMS (each an "OS Product"), YOU ARE NOT AUTHORIZED TO INSTALL, COPY OR OTHERWISE USE THE OS COMPONENTS AND YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS UNDER THIS SUPPLEMENTAL EULA.

Re:didn't work for me (2, Insightful)

Pulse_Instance (698417) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840763)

It may be because I just started my first coffee, but as far as I can tell from reading that you only need a validly licensed copy of any windows operating system. It says absolutely nothing about only installing it on a validly licensed copy of any windows operating system.

Re:didn't work for me (2, Insightful)

BlueTrin (683373) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840859)

So if I have a Windows Licence, I can use it even on non-Windows OSes, isn't it ?

Actually the opposite would be in contradiction with EU law.

Re:didn't work for me (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840717)

128 kB file sizes should be enough for anybody, you insensitive clod!

According to Hans Phall, It is a Hoax (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840247)

It is a hoax according to Hans Phall

Re:According to Hans Phall, It is a Hoax (1)

empaler (130732) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840479)

It is a hoax according to Hans Phall
He's just a sock-puppet for Edgar Allan.

that would be nice (1)

Coraon (1080675) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840259)

Seeing as how I do not like vista, on the basis that I like to be in control over what software I run. That being said I can't wait to run DX10 on my build of linux and my XP rig! we just need someone evil enough to prove it.

Re:that would be nice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840537)

Can you provide examples of how Vista controls what software you run? Because to be honest with you, I think you're full of shit.

Re:that would be nice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840715)

> Seeing as how I do not like vista, on the basis that I like to be in control over what software I run.

Never understood this. You act like Linux gives you unlimited control over all your apps. And, I guess it technically does because you can technically go in and edit the source code and recompile it so it does what you want. But, do you actually do this? How many people who use Linux actually do this? From my experience, very few. (I use Gentoo myself.)

If not, there's no extra control that Windows doesn't give you. Fact of the matter is, Vista is a decent OS. I don't want to say great because there hasn't been enough time yet to decide. And, despite (stupid) commercials, it is not that restrictive.

Let the karma burn.

If only windows were like Linux (3, Insightful)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840265)

If only windows were like Linux. I don't really mean in the open-source way, but more in the separate projects way. If DirectX was a separate project from the windows OS, then it would work on windows XP without us having to go hack it. There's no reason why DirectX 10 can't work on windows XP. It's just an artificial limitation that MS through in to get people to buy Vista. MS does this a lot, with IE, IIS, MS Office, DirectX, and many other tools. I don't see why people put up with it.

Re:If only windows were like Linux (1)

anss123 (985305) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840499)

Ehe, from what little I've read about DX10 I don't think I can agree with this. DX10 is very much a rework of the entire applicationAPIKernel pipeline, and can't simply be backported without backporting the Vista kernel while at it.

Naturally, it should be possible to make a DX10 runtime that sits on top of DX9 or OpenGL, and run that on XP. Or have GPU vendors create a DX10 driver from scratch.

Bottom line, you can't just copy some *.dll files to have DX10 working on XP.

Re:If only windows were like Linux (2, Interesting)

cnelzie (451984) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840625)

If that's what they did, then they broke what DirectX was about, simply because they wanted/needed a serious reason to force people to upgrade.

    Do you recall the history of DirectX and how it wasn't ever supposed to be available on NT 4.0? What happened? They put it out for Windows NT 4.0 and then took it all the way up to version 5.something and eventually dropped DirectX for NT 4.0 support when practically nobody was using NT 4.0 as a Desktop OS anymore. They did the same with Windows 2000 DirectX Support, even though there was very little change between Windows2000 and Windows XP and now they are claiming total incompatibility, when there is little other reason for ANYONE to want to upgrade to Windows Vista...

Re:If only windows were like Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840803)

"DX10 is very much a rework of the entire applicationAPIKernel pipeline, and can't simply be backported without backporting the Vista kernel while at it."

Ah, but the poster was saying Windows should be more like linux - and linux allows you to use different kernels pretty easily. OK, linux IS a kernel, so what I'm actually saying is that the typical linux userland (bash, gnome, etc) can very easily be moved to other kernels. If Windows was like that I could just recompile my trusty Windows 2000 explorer, command line and assorted tools on the Vista kernel and get DX10 without having to learn a new interface or use quite so much RAM.

Re:If only windows were like Linux (2, Insightful)

ipjohnson (580042) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840581)

I'm sure if they wanted to they could get it working on XP but if they did that one of the big incentives for upgrading to Vista (To play DX 10 games) goes out the window.

Re:If only windows were like Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840693)

That's the miracle of "productized" software. It's become pretty clear that software development works best as an evolutionary process, but with commercial software there is always the pressure to make every new version look "new and improved" enough to warrant an upgrade. So they have to toss XP just about when it's actually becoming good and reliable and sell people on a new unfinished piece of crap.

Imagine if they had just kept improving on win2k, making lighter, faster and more stable without trying to come up with new technology buzz words to sell.

Re:If only windows were like Linux (1)

hxnwix (652290) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840699)

You have to remember that sometimes an older version of an operating system isn't worth supporting anymore, since the differences necessitated by the evolution of the OS would make back-porting costly.

In a related sense, the differences inherent to the de-evolution (ie the retrogression) of an operating system can make back-and-up-porting tricky and definitely just too hard for rapidly degenerating Microsoft programmers to possibly even consider thinking about achieving. Fortunately, basement dwelling clever people clearly outclass all of Microsoft put together, at this point.

Why in heaven's name did Microsoft think it would be a good idea to install lead plumbing at their Redmond HQ?

Useless? (-1, Troll)

jswigart (1004637) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840333)

Imagine what the community of online coders could accomplish if the majority of them spent their time on useful projects.

HURD DX (1)

empaler (130732) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840529)

Imagine what the community of online coders could accomplish if the majority of them spent their time on useful projects.
We'd have a functioning version of HURD ten years ago...

Re:HURD DX (2, Funny)

mwvdlee (775178) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840641)

He said _useful_ projects.

Presure for legit DX10 on XP? (5, Interesting)

Brit_in_the_USA (936704) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840339)

With the (arguably) poor reception for Vista from the press and user communities and the (GPU) Hardware and Games writers obviously wanting to push DirectX 10 to help sales (ooo shiney AND blured!) is MS under non-trivial pressure to bring DirectX10 to XP? What are the chances of this happening?

Will we end up with a backlash where OpenGL is updated to include features parity of the DirectX10 cards and developers switching to using OpenGL as the driver layer so they get the XP market?

Re:Presure for legit DX10 on XP? (1)

Last_Available_Usern (756093) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840469)

Have you (or others) really looked at Vista's management of resources? There's a good reason it's only for Vista. I would liken trying to run DX10 on XP to trying to run Gears of War on an old XBOX.

Re:Presure for legit DX10 on XP? (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840563)

And what if the overhead of DRM requirements [auckland.ac.nz] is left out?

mod this guy up. (1)

plasmacutter (901737) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840745)

AC sir.. that link of yours is #$@#$in saved.

Re:Presure for legit DX10 on XP? (1)

Tom (822) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840721)

is MS under non-trivial pressure to bring DirectX10 to XP? What are the chances of this happening?
Slim. They need Vista to succeed, otherwise investors will ask ugly questions, like "what exactly is the estimated ROI on the $5bn you spent on Vista?".

It shouldn't work... (2, Funny)

Last_Available_Usern (756093) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840381)

Even if it did, XP (the primary OS this would be desired for tbh) doesn't have the necessary resource management necessary to fuel the power needed for the graphics processing that DX10 takes advantage of. Sure, you might get it working, but it would be slow as heck.

Re:It shouldn't work... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840681)

do you even know what you are talking about? ;) what exactly do you think the ms coders added at the os level that makes vista so much more graphically "powerful" than XP?

Re:It shouldn't work... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840893)

yeah poor kid. He actually believes that...

Re:It shouldn't work... (3, Interesting)

adam.dorsey (957024) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840807)

I've seen 2 posts so far where you state that Vista has some superior "resource management" that will make a massive difference in between it and XP.

From my personal experience with Vista, everything runs slower than on XP. Identical binaries, identical versions, Vista is slower.

Why should DirectX 10 be any different?

Might be just me . . . (4, Insightful)

OverlordQ (264228) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840393)

. . but this screams "Getting gullible people to give me $50 for mostly snake oil"

Re:Might be just me . . . (4, Interesting)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840617)

Why oh why must I be so gullible!?

Yes, I paid. I'm one of very few so far, apparently. At the time, I thought their focus was to make Windows games run natively on Linux, 1 at a time. (Meaning the game will work well and they won't move on to the next until it does.) The very next week, their focus is shifted to DX10. 'Cool,' I thought, thinking it was DX10 on Linux. I now see it's on Windows XP... Bleh. No answer from them on if they plan to make it work on Linux also.

$50 wasted.

See, I've -got- the money to spend on the hardware and the OS and all the upgrades for the next few years. That isn't the issue. I just want games to work on an OS with good moral character. Or at least neutral. I'd settle for 'not completely shady.' But nooooo.

By the way, their Linux demo that is only for paying people... It doesn't work on my system. There's no sound, and it crashes after the menu. They spent a couple weeks looking at it, but their final answer was 'We can't reproduce this bug' and 'we need to focus our effort on the product.' While I agree that's probably the right attitude at some point... When you've only got a very very few paying customers, you make ALL of them very happy so they'll bring in other paying customers.

why buy (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840405)

Well if so many tools out there weren't mindless lemmings, having to have the latest PC games and thus buying an OS they dont need, we could all send a message to M$ and the game writers that we're not interested in buying into their planned obsolescence.

M$ has functionally taught us that security is going to be something that's left up to us.....so OK, no sweat, redmond......BTW, I won't be needing the OS you spent many many millions developing, thanks.

The Inq (5, Funny)

cmcguffin (156798) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840445)

> The Inquirer is understandably cautious

Wow, now there's a sentence I never expected to see in print!

You are all clueless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840483)

and shouldn't be deriving anything meaningful from this.

I'm just happy you're not the ones making any decisions about the future of any sort of tech.

Wine? (2, Interesting)

ion_ (176174) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840523)

A chap called Cody Brocious from San Diego, California, claims to have started to create an wrapper for Windows executables so that they can be ran on another operating system, with no prejudice about that operating system.
Why reinvent the wheel, when you could just add the DX10 functionality to Wine [winehq.com] ?

Or is that exactly what the project is?

Re:Wine? (1)

brunascle (994197) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840607)

Or is that exactly what the project is?
he's said specifically that he's not using wine. whether or not he could, i dunno.

he apparently was going to be making a general Direct X wrapper, including DX9, but changed it to only DX10, saying that Wine was already doing a good job with DX9 so there wasnt much of a point.

Re:Wine? (1)

Compholio (770966) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840669)

Why reinvent the wheel, when you could just add the DX10 functionality to Wine?
Or help out the existing work:

Beginning of Direct3D10 implementation by András Kovács, mentored by Stefan Dösinger
WWN Issue #329 [winehq.org]

That's nothing!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#18840645)

I already wrote a DirectX 11 emulator for the Sinclair ZX Spectrum! Booya b*tchez I'm da hacka p1mp! Who wants to send me $500?

that's a hoax! (1)

frik85 (951295) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840673)

It looks like Wine (Codeweaver) for MacOS X 10.4 Intel-PC.

Prey is NOT a DX 10 game but a DX 9 game which works more or less okay in WineHQ/CW.

Re:that's a hoax! (1)

malevolentjelly (1057140) | more than 7 years ago | (#18840849)

It looks like Wine (Codeweaver) for MacOS X 10.4 Intel-PC.

Prey is NOT a DX 10 game but a DX 9 game which works more or less okay in WineHQ/CW.
Seconded. We have a hard enough time working with Direct X 10 as a professional game studio, BS someone "reverse engineered" it. :P
Load More Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>