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Hilf Claims Free Software Movement Dead

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 7 years ago | from the faster-than-a-speeding-fud dept.

395

moe1975 writes to mention that Bill Hilf has taken a rather aggressive stance with regard to the status of the Free Software movement. With claims like; "The Free Software movement is dead. Linux doesn't exist in 2007. Even Linus has got a job today" it would certainly seem that the next offensive is going to be sponsored by denial. "For the desktop, Hilf sees a new frontier in terms of rich client programming. With more and more services by Amazon, Google, Yahoo and, of course, Microsoft being run as services rather than as software installed locally, it will be up to the desktop to provide richer functionality."

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Oh man... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122159)

What a HILF.

Re:Oh man... (2, Funny)

lanc (762334) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122603)

erm, isn't he the guy that changed his name to Bill to be more like billgates?

lanc

ps: what, are they the only ones allowed to fud around?

Re:Oh man... (4, Interesting)

Tuoqui (1091447) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122649)

LOL... The guys picture in the article looks like an idiot. If anyone is believing this bullshit by some Microsoft shill... I got a deed to the Atlantic Ocean I want to sell, $1 billion dollars its cheap!

Software as a Service will never become popular as long as the open source movement exists. This is why Microsoft is trying its hardest to make everyone believe its dead and doing all the sabre rattling with regards to patents.

Proprietary software has its place in the marketplace but trying to force people who are already operating under the licensing model of software to switch to Software as a Service(SaaS) scheme... Even the most financially irresponsible person can see that paying $10-20/mo over the course of your computers lifetime is more than buying a single copy at $100-120 (oh wait sorry for Vista thats like $400 for Ultimate, this in comparison to Server 2003 which is $600).

SaaS has its place as well... I mean look at all the MMO's out there, they are all basically SaaS schemes. They work because they are providing something people want (a forum for interaction with both real people as well as computer AI 'mobs' and a sense of accomplishment). Of course one could argue that the servers the thing runs on is basically a service in which case a MMO truely becomes a Service as a Service scheme where you buy subscriptions (sorta like how Linux server distros sell service contracts to come help fix things if stuff gets broken)

Huh? (0)

grub (11606) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122165)


How can that be? I thought 2007 was the year Linux kicks ass on the desktop!

Re:Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122229)

That was the prediction in 2005. However, the new prediction is widespread adoption of desktop linux to come in 2009.

Re:Huh? (5, Informative)

aichpvee (631243) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122309)

From TFA: "The Free Software movement is dead. Linux doesn't exist in 2007. Even Linus has got a job today." Controversial statements from the head of Microsoft's Linux Labs, Bill Hilf.

They purposefully left the last sentence out of the summary to drive hits. This guy's just another paid microsoft shill. Nothing to see here, move along.

Viva Libre! (2, Informative)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122531)

You can go Hilf yourself, over the Gratis part.

Verdict? Obfuscation, misdirection and deliberate misinformation. Linux has ad a day job since he left University.

Re:Huh? (5, Insightful)

Bent Mind (853241) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122763)

I didn't recognize the name at first. Bill Hilf did a Slashdot interview [slashdot.org] a while back. He is currently Director of Platform Technology Strategy at Microsoft. Before that he was Senior Enterprise Architect at IBM.

He talks about being hired [microsoft.com] by Microsoft as an expert in Linux-based systems. Near as I can tell, he is a glorified network administrator.

As for his comments, stating that the Free Software movement is dead because Linus has a job speaks volumes about his ignorance on the topic.

Re:Huh? (5, Funny)

lanc (762334) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122367)

Ssshhhh. Just don't let my notebook know that linux doesn't exist on it. It works pretty well so far with making up this fantasy-OS in function. Dont wake it. Nor my PC. Nor my linux servers. Nor any of the kernel developers. Let them dream they still actually do stuff. A free OS, really :)

<on a highway>
radio: pls be aware of the one guy driving in the wrong way!
guy: one? All of them!
</on a highway>

Re:Huh? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122463)

True. I do not believe it as long as Netcraft won't confirm it.

Dear Slashdot: Post Some News, not FUD (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122495)


from Microcrap Craporation.

Does this story add ANYTHING to the conversation? NO.

Try posting News: ie. No Habeus Corpus in the United Gulags of Amerika etc.

Re:Huh? (5, Insightful)

/ASCII (86998) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122587)

His statements are an amazing mix of half-truths, selective reinterpretations and marketing drivel. I don't think he says anything that is a flat out lie, but every single word is on the edge. Congratulations to Microsoft for hiring the best spin doctor in the industry?

Re:Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122663)

I think what the reality is that really Really REALLY free truly FREE software doesn't exist for the vast majority of people. 99.9999999% of the public doesn't 't feel good about setting something up the Linux-way, tracking down all the other items an install requires, tuning the bytes, and flipping bits. Having a vendor behind it gives them the warm pricklies in their pants and leaves them feeling safe.

An corporations are going to take advantage of this by selling people ease (err, maybe more like easier) of use.

Oh, I think open and free software is here to stay in one form or another. Mainly new projects will be started by either people wishing to make a name for themselves or by idealists. Then corporations will come in and fill them out and support them. It's a win-win situation.

I'm still waiting for OSS/Free pron!!! :-)

Will someone please clarify "free" for him? (2, Insightful)

catbutt (469582) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122169)

Thank you.

Re:Will someone please clarify "free" for him? (1)

zappepcs (820751) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122261)

You mean 'free' as in he didn't get any of the 'free' lunch?
Or is that 'free' as in 'free' to ask "Hilf who?"
Or perhaps 'free' as ... well, you know, information about encryption cracks?

Re:Will someone please clarify "free" for him? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122349)

"People do not want ODF (Open Document Format), but they want a way to control the information they create, he claimed."
DUH!!! Thats the point of free software.

Misread ... (4, Funny)

Bassman59 (519820) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122173)

I though the headline read, "MILF Claims Free Software Movement Dead."

Re:Misread ... (3, Funny)

Mattintosh (758112) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122359)

Hey, yesterday was MILF Day, wasn't it?

anybody have a OS X 10.6 torrent? (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122387)

I'm after Cougar.

Re:Misread ... (1)

rohar (253766) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122429)

Horse

How different is Linux from Windows? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122443)

One of the points that Bill Hilf made in his interview [msdn.com] on Channel9 is that Linux was "very different" from Windows. (He then added that either one, other, or both were "very different" from OSX.)

How true is this? I only ask because I have had some experience with MVS (the operating system which has no concept of "files" or "directories") and Tandem (whose weird features I can't remember enough to describe), and I would describe both of those as "very different" from UNIX or Windows.

When it comes down to it, UNIX and Windows look pretty similair to me. They both support WIMP GUIs. They both have concepts of files and directories. They both have users and groups and permissions. Micah hacks the computer system so Nathan can win. Peter controls the radiation power, and the ending is a cliffhanger into the next and final episode. They both have preemptive multitasking and multithreading.

The whole reason that Hilf stated that "Linux is very different from Windows" was part of the justification as to why Microsoft would not build applications for Windows (which was transparent and deceitful). If my belief is correct (that Linux is "similar enough" to Windows), then my opinion of Hilf falls through the floor. Am I correct that Linux is "similar enough" to Windows?

Re:How different is Linux from Windows? (1)

MightyMartian (840721) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122713)

I suppose the chief differences are architectural. But then again, there are some pretty broad differences between various *nix architectures (Mach and Minix as opposed to Linux, for instance). These sorts of statements are supposed to show us how wise the speaker is, but to anybody with more than a surface-layer of knowledge, it's just another fartsy fool spouting crapola they likely don't understand any better than their average reader.

Re:Misread ... (1)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122837)

What I'd like to know is... If I submit an article, does it have a better chance of being accepted if it's from som obscure or international news source like www.bangkokpost.com?

Linux is dead? (1)

Marrshu (994708) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122195)

So that's why they don't call it Ubuntu Linux anymore. Oh wait...

Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122197)

Who the hell is Bill Hilf, and what kind of drugs is he smoking? He's obviously so far out of touch with reality that he must certainly be braindead.

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (5, Funny)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122257)

Who the hell is Bill Hilf, and what kind of drugs is he smoking?

You could try reading the article. He's the head of Microsoft's Linux division. Which is a bit like saying that Sun's Windows division just declared Microsoft Windows irrelevant. Who cares?

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (1)

lanc (762334) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122413)

well, not quite. latter would be quite real and true :)

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (1)

eln (21727) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122321)

Microsoft's "platform strategy director." Personally, I am SHOCKED that someone involved in strategy at Microsoft would want to spread a rumor that Linux and Free Software have no future, and that "Software as a Service" is where it's at.

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (1)

nine-times (778537) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122341)

I don't know how much you're joking, but I really didn't know who Bill Hilf was. I'll give you one guess which company he works for [microsoft.com] .

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (1)

aichpvee (631243) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122375)

He's obviously smoking the good stuff if he thinks windows runs 67% of the world's servers.

Who Bill Hilf is (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122501)

Bill Hilf is General Manager of Platform Strategy at Microsoft. This guy:
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/community/tnradio /bio/billhilf.mspx [microsoft.com]

Slashdot interviewed him about two years ago. The first question is possibly the best.
http://interviews.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/0 8/08/1247220&tid=109&tid=11&tid=106 [slashdot.org]

Re:Anonymous Coward Claims Hilf is Braindead (1)

kimvette (919543) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122645)

No kidding. Beryl on Linux plus any of the journaled filesystem options (Reiser, EXT3, XFS, etc.) offer for free what Windows Ultimate promised for $399 - and failed to deliver on.

Compare Microsoft's "3D desktop" to that of Beryl. Vista's 3D application switching is a joke. It's slow.

More "software as a service" crap (1)

Excelcia (906188) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122251)

I posted about this yesterday [slashdot.org] . Not a lot has changed.

Re:More "software as a service" crap (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122757)

So you sort of post to your previous post, as to create a comment dupe? Guess what, a lot of other people posted comments too. [slashdot.org]

Correction: free software development is funded (3, Insightful)

iamacat (583406) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122263)

TFA claims that just because IBM and Redhat are involved in free software development, the code is somehow less free. The fact is that anyone can fork off Redhat and give away or sell support for their own distribution. In fact, this is commonly done.

Re:Correction: free software development is funded (2, Interesting)

dpninerSLASH (969464) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122449)

This is just FURTHER indication about how scared Microsoft is right now. Even on the desktop side, in which Linux has arguably not made much of a splash, a major PC manufacturer has agreed to start distributing it.

It's almost sad, really. It's like that last emotionally-charged argument made when someone realizes they've lost debate. MS will never go bankrupt, but their days on top are over.

Re:Correction: free software development is funded (4, Insightful)

nine-times (778537) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122553)

That is what he's saying, but it's really hard to see how this could make sense to anyone. Bill Hilf quote from the article:

They are full-time employees, with 401K stock options. Some work for IBM or Oracle. What does that mean? It means that Linux doesn't exist any more in 2007.

What does that even mean? Linux is well funded, and therefore doesn't exist?

Bill Hilf saying FS is dead (1)

Associate (317603) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122267)

is like OJ saying he didn't do it.

Re:Bill Hilf saying FS is dead (3, Funny)

WilliamSChips (793741) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122335)

Except that there's a minute chance OJ might have actually not done it.

Re:Bill Hilf saying FS is dead (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122851)

Except that there's a minute chance OJ might have actually not done it.
HAHA. Good one.

php website (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122295)

The site this article is on is PHP, and last I checked PHP was still free. Someone should alert him that the free software running the site came back to life!

oh and the site is also running off of linux:
http://toolbar.netcraft.com/site_report?url=http:/ /www.bangkokpost.com [netcraft.com]

WOW (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122311)

Even Linus has got a job today
And I always thought all Linux programmers are just bums and crack addicts. Wadaya know...

Japan migrates to Non-existant Software (5, Insightful)

alucinor (849600) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122313)

Wow! And aren't the Japanese getting ready to migrate to this non-existant software ecosystem? How very philosophically Eastern of them! It's like some sort of crazy Zen thing!

When is his last day? (1)

thrills33ker (740062) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122319)

"The Free Software movement is dead. Linux doesn't exist in 2007. Even Linus has got a job today." Controversial statements from the head of Microsoft's Linux Labs, Bill Hilf.

So I guess you're out of a job then, Bill?

Denial (5, Funny)

phoric (833867) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122323)

This article does not exist in 2007.

Move right along.

He doth protest too much. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122329)

Windows Vista is a failure and proprietary office file formats are unacceptable for data interchange or archiving. Companies are switching to OSX and linux in droves, Microsoft is fucked and it'll take more than FUD from dickhead employees to turn back the tide.

Yawn. More FUD (5, Insightful)

rohar (253766) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122337)

FUD confusing open source with free software by unpaid programmers, making up windows server base numbers and referring to _AMP as "Visual Basic of open source" that pulled Linux along and what the programmers really want is to run their apps on Vista. Interoperability should only happen after a decade or so, because no one wants it anyway. A guy develops a 3d interface but can't figure out how that would work with Linux. Just FUD, nothing happening here folks, keep moving along.

u-uhm (1)

Kuku_monroe (753761) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122355)

Yup, it's dead.

My computer's wallpaper even changed to one of a tomstone with a tux plushy on top.

Only one way to respond to this... (5, Insightful)

CanSpice (300894) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122365)

LOL

Remember (1)

Simon Garlick (104721) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122371)

This is Bill "Pay me and I'll say whatever you want" Hilf we're talking about here. The guy would say black is white and up was down if there was a buck in it.

Gandhi (1)

fregaham (702982) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122377)

First they ignore you,
then they ridicule you,
then they fight you,
then they ignore you again...

Who? (1)

Greyfox (87712) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122379)

Probably just some schmuck trolling for Slashdot-generated ad-dollars again.

How did I know this guy works for Microsoft? (4, Interesting)

Anarchysoft (1100393) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122385)

"They are full-time employees, with 401K stock options. Some work for IBM or Oracle. What does that mean? It means that Linux doesn't exist any more in 2007. There is no free software movement. If someone says Linux is about Love, Peace and Harmony, I would tell them to do their research. There is no free software movement any more. There is big commercial [firms] like IBM and there is small commercial [firms] like Ubuntu," he said.
Right, because commercial businesses have never supported, contributed to or founded free software before. Oh yes, and because FSF has always stated that free software is against business. People work at companies and people power free software. Having a job doesn't make a someone a non-person. And, for the record, Linus Torvalds is not the representative of the free software movement (thank heavens!) -- he's half-assed even as an advocate.

Indeed (4, Funny)

sd_diamond (839492) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122395)

You might even say that the Free Software Movement is in its "Last Throes".

Microsoft: (1)

simonharvey (605068) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122403)

"The Free Software movement is dead. Linux doesn't exist in 2007"
Now linux users know how it feels. First *BSD, then Windows and now Linux.

Will the death never end?

Re:Microsoft: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122699)

I'm an AmigaOS user, you insensitive clod!

Microsoft hurting? (4, Informative)

PineHall (206441) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122405)

This person at InfoWorld [infoworld.com] thinks Microsoft must really be hurting for them to be saying these things.

Hurting big time? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122813)

According to this [theregister.co.uk] , they are even hinting at suing their own customers for using Linux. Now that sounds desperate.

Re:Microsoft hurting? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122833)

Not yet... When it'll be really hurting, their voice will be two octaves higher.

Is that what the story is about? (1)

91degrees (207121) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122415)

Thanks, Slashdot, for the interpretation. Not sure I agree with it, but I'm really not quite sure what he's saying. It seems a bit of a ramble on standards and free software being commercial and various other stuff. Maybe there's a few cat anecdotes in the full transcript.

Someone missed a memo (5, Insightful)

Hobbs0 (1055434) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122417)

If Free Software and Linux is dead then why is Microsoft claiming that it violates 235 of their patents.

Re:Someone missed a memo (4, Funny)

gall0ws (902335) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122665)

They're just afraid of zombies.

Re:Someone missed a memo (1)

Bruitist (987735) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122667)

Maybe Linux is violating their patent on marketing non-existent software?

Re:Someone missed a memo (1)

ABoerma (941672) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122709)

Probably for the same reason the RIAA sues dead people: Money.

Hunh? (1)

technos (73414) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122441)

Who the hell is Bill Hilf and why should I care?

Seriously. Someone give me a reason this isn't just the mass-media version of a GNAA/"BSD is dying" comment on /.

It's still free! (3, Insightful)

LoudMusic (199347) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122445)

"For the desktop, Hilf sees a new frontier in terms of rich client programming. With more and more services by Amazon, Google, Yahoo and, of course, Microsoft being run as services rather than as software installed locally, it will be up to the desktop to provide richer functionality."
The online services provided by Google and Yahoo are ... wait for it ... free software!

People aren't moving to online services. They're still moving to "free". Just happens it's online instead of locally installed. Woop-de-fucking-do.

Slight clarification (1)

Frenchman113 (893369) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122487)

Hilf (Milf? hehe) seems to be saying that the idea of a community-written and developed platform is dead and points out that much Linux development is done by companies like Red Hat, Novell, and SUSE. Hilf seems to be equating free software with community software, however, free software refers to freedom, more specifically, the relatively greater amount of it in "free" software. This doesn't make Hilf's statement any less of a biased propagandistic statement, but I feel that a slight clarification is necessary as nobody RTFAs.

On a last note, although the self-organizing and self-fixing quality of open source software is more or less a myth, several projects are headed by dedicated individuals. An example is cdrtools.

Nothing to do with Linux (1)

Tribbin (565963) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122491)

Hilf said that the Linux phenomenon had nothing to do with Linux, but rather it had a lot to do with Apache, MySQL and PHP. It was those applications which pulled Linux up with it, the "Visual Basic of open source."
Yeah, and Microsoft had it's breakthrough because they bought an IBM compatible OS, made the right deals and all games/apps were written for MS/DOS because of monopoly and trust in the already established Intel/IBM. It had nothing to do with MS/DOS per se. It was an arbitrary OS at the right place, at the right time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QDOS [wikipedia.org]

But I think the gain of Linux has more to do with quality in comparison to MS/DOS and Windows.

What does that say about me? (1)

glwtta (532858) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122511)

I spent like 5 minutes trying to figure out what the 'H' stood for, before reading the rest of the summary.

Re:What does that say about me? (0, Redundant)

n6kuy (172098) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122597)

I was interested until I realized it was an 'H' not an 'M'...

Re:What does that say about me? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122765)

Horses (OMG Ponies)

Story Mod (2, Interesting)

Daishiman (698845) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122513)

Can we moderate this story "Troll" or "Flamebait"?

What do Google and Amazon run? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122523)

Ask him that, then see what he says.

Incoherent FUD from Microsoft... (4, Interesting)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122547)

Linux doesn't exist in 2007. Even Linus has got a job today.


So, apparently, "Free Software" only exists if the people making it are unemployed?

Does this even begin to make sense?

Oh, wait, its from the "head of Microsoft's Linux Labs". Microsoft sayibng "Free Software is dead and Linux doesn't exist" isn't news, though I guess the fact that they've changed how they are saying it might be.

Having failed with the "Free Software is unreliable stuff put out by hippie slackers ideologues that have no idea how to make software usable in the real world" line, Microsoft is apparently now trying out a new line of FUD which doesn't even superficially make sense. "Big companies are involved in open source and people are getting paid, so, whatever the licensing terms say, its somehow not really free"?

Re:Incoherent FUD from Microsoft... (1)

AlgorithMan (937244) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122811)

Oh, wait, its from the "head of Microsoft's Linux Labs"
is he really the head of MS linux labs?
so he saies "I am paied for nothing and should be fired immediately"?

Uh... Bill? (1)

phoric (833867) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122559)

So, wait..

"When I talk to open source developers, at least half are talking about Windows, from SugarCRM, MySQL, PHP. Every single one"

So which is it Bill? Half? Or Every single one?

Even Linus has a job today? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122567)

"Even Linus has a job today?" He doesn't really know linus then! If you read his book, Just for Fun, you'll realize he's always had a job. He's just been doing what he's always wanted to do. You'll also learn in his book, people have been sending him money because of linux from the start. It was actually a problem because most of the time it was american money and finnish banks didn't like it :D, so much so, he asked people just to send him post-cards.

Why can't people earn money working on "free" software? I even have a job now working on free software because I like to do it, and people want to pay me for it! I think it's scary for him that licensing is dying and that is why he's promoting the online apps subscription model in the same interview.

Once again.. (1)

jfb3 (25523) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122575)

Once again, why does anyone care what an employee of company says about a competitor?

It'd be news if he said something like "Hey, open source will eat our lunch."

Re:Once again.. (5, Insightful)

MightyMartian (840721) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122773)

I hope the next time some Microsoft shill comes around Slashdot telling us how MS is open source friendly, and wants us to supply some questions for him not to answer, we all ask the same one; Have you stopped beating your wife?

I'm serious. After Microsoft's positioning over the last few days, I don't think there's anything more to talk about. They are THE enemy of open source. They are THE enemy of free software. There are THE enemy of choice. They are THE enemy of competition.

Wait a minute (1)

fishthegeek (943099) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122579)

If Hilf has a point it isn't a very sharp one and it is strategically poor for MS to adopt his mindset. There are no fewer hobby developers involved than there have been, and I'd not hesitate to guess that there may be more of them now than the pre-corporate Linux community offered. What I believe is misplaced is his insistence that FOSS is dead because of corporate contribution to FOSS. His argument is substantively the same as saying that because some companies contribute to charities for the poor that charity itself is dead. There are companies that actually hire people to direct charitable giving, heck even MS has Barbara Dingfield to direct their community affairs! They just don't get it. I really want to admire a company that has created more wealth than any in the history of the world but when they spout of crud like Hilf and the aforementioned 235 patents and do it without offering one single shred of evidence I just can't bring myself to do it. SC... errr Microsoft is just silly.

February 1997 called. They want their news back. (1)

iabervon (1971) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122593)

Linus has been employed for more than a decade with duties including maintaining Linux kernel development. In fact, Linus has had a Linux-related job longer than Hilf has worked for Microsoft. In the past decide, Linux doesn't seem to have lost much of its standing or popularity due to commercial participation, so it looks like that wasn't bad news.

Oblig... (1)

Adambomb (118938) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122615)

[Scene: A room that looks like a giant shoe box made to look like a dollhouse or a diorama (remember those from elementary school?) This whole skit is shot in black and white and has the tone of a fifties school film both in music and acting style.]

[The philosophers sit and, and drink and stroke their beards until Bruce turns to Mark.]

Bruce: Free Software is dead.

Announcer V.O.: Yes. "Free Software is dead", cried Hilf. And the cry has been heard for years. But for each philosopher, there has been a cynic. [Scott and Kevin pop out of nowhere]

Kevin: No way!

Scott: Prove it!

Announcer V.O.: And that is where the argument has stalemated... until now!

[We see a man holding a small body. Two other men stand in the back.]

Man: Free Software IS dead. And here is the body to prove it.

[The cynics appear, their hair messed]

Kevin: You've just blown my mind!

Scott: Our minds have been blown!

[We see the philosophers, looking very smug]

[A doctor examines the body and nods sadly at the camera.]

Announcer V.O.: The world is shocked. First to find out Free Software did in fact exist and second to find out it is now dead.

(paraphrased of course, thx- kids in the hall)

Apps as services means desktop freedom (3, Insightful)

dalutong (260603) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122625)

His logic is absurd. Assuming these web apps are standards compliant, they are the death knell of Windows hegemony. The only question is whether Microsoft can somehow manage to make their apps only work (or at least only work fully) on IE/Windows.

It worked as a marketing campaign against OS/2 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122633)

Why shouldn't it work now. Rinse and repeat as needed.

Nathan

Huh, strange... (3, Interesting)

HaeMaker (221642) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122639)

How am I able to read this article? It is running LAMP.

Netcraft on bangkokpost.com [netcraft.com]

Even more strange, over 56% of the web [netcraft.com] must not exist either?

Move along folks, nothing to see here. (0, Troll)

OrangeTide (124937) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122653)

There term is called Grandstanding.

Commercial web services benefit GNU/Linux (3, Insightful)

dircha (893383) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122661)

These same commercial web services will benefit GNU/Linux.

At present I am an OS X user because I am willing to pay for the high quality, hassle-free user experience Apple provides.

But already 90%+ of my computer use outside of work is of web-based. So long as GNU/Linux continues to be - and continues to improve as - a viable platform for this content, I suspect a great number of users will continue to inch nearer to being able to use GNU/Linux as their primary (and sole) system.

I'd really like to see usage statistics for the general populace: percentage breakdowns of non-business related usage categories.

My guess: email, web browsing, multimedia, games, taxes.

Top of the line FUD (1)

Dracos (107777) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122673)

I'm impressed, even the open source guys at Microsoft don't get open source. Last I heard, Hilf had done a lot to promote open source principles in Redmond. Either that was bullshit, or Ballmer finally noticed and is now stuffing FUD-filled press releases into Hilf's mouth for him to dutifully regurgitate.

There is no Linux, Inc. that employs the kernel developers. If he thinks OSS is all about Apache, MySQL, and PHP, then he is inconceivably myopic.

"That's the dirty little secret. When I talk to open source developers, at least half are talking about Windows, from SugarCRM, MySQL, PHP. Every single one," he said.

Anyone with a brain realizes that Windows is not the ecosystem, it is part of the ecosystem. About half, by Hilf's estimation.

People don't want ODF? Who lives in Norway [slashdot.org] , Aliens?

The rest of this article is just infuriatingly contrary to the real world. If Open Source is dead, then what is MS so afraid of?

Re:Top of the line FUD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122741)

Who lives in Norway, Aliens?

Yeah, pretty much.

Bill Hilf (1)

DaMattster (977781) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122687)

I wonder what flawed logic Bill Hilf bases his prediction on? His baseless remarks, if anything, are indicative of the fear that must be pervasive in the Microsoft culture. Linux is not the moot point that Hilf claims it is nor are the BSDs. Mostly his statement is a FUD attack that is so desperate that it is laughable. As little as five years ago, statements like these were apt to be taken more seriously. Free/Open Source Software is here to stay. Once the Samba Project completes its version 4, Microsoft Windows Server becomes the moot point because active directory features will be freely available. If Microsoft allowed some of their arrogance to deflate a little, they would consider open sourcing the active directory protocols and claim victory over Samba. By open sourcing their protocols, they tap a large and freely available programmer base. Active Directory could concievably become so much better for markedly less in terms of development costs. Why not have the community develop for you? Red Hat does just that and is a very profitable company. Instead Bill Hilf et al. remain blind to the potential benefits and see open source as a "cancer." This just might be their own undoing.

Obviously hasn't looked at Netcraft (1)

artifex2004 (766107) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122693)

I'll skip the usual Netcraft.com joke, and just say that the Bangkok Post, which is the linked host, itself runs on Linux, according to Netcraft.

another irrelevant guy named Bill. BFD, he's paid (1)

Locutus (9039) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122707)

to say that crap and he's paid to harm the open source market because it threatens the Microsoft Windows monopoly.
I hope this isn't new folks because Bill Hilf went to 'the dark side' the day he signed up with Microsoft because Microsoft's only* product is Microsoft Windows and must be protected at all costs.

*)Without Microsoft Windows, none of their other products matter. None.

LoB

Tagged "Baghdad Bob" (1)

Pantero Blanco (792776) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122725)

"We have driven the infidels from the nation...There are no enemy troops within the city...Our troops have reclaimed the airport."

Seriously, this guy is *literally* trying to claim that F/OSS is dead because it's succeeding.

Netcraft confirms: Linux is dying. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122727)

Do you people really get worked up because of what one lone goofball says?

Hilf? (1)

trollboy (46578) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122731)

Am I the only one that read the headline and said "I know what a Milf is, wtf is a Hilf?"

Yeah, right... (1)

xPertCodert (596934) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122733)

"God is dead." - F.Nietzsche "F.Nietzsche is dead" - God.

Re:Yeah, right... (1)

Knara (9377) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122807)

Yeah but at least Nietzsche existed at some point

(cue flamewar)

So what this Hilf weirdo is really saying is... (5, Insightful)

SadGeekHermit (1077125) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122819)

* Linux doesn't exist because it's actually everywhere, distributed by gigantic companies which make zillions of dollars off it.

* The Open Source Movement doesn't exist because it's been adopted by companies both large and small, which are all merrily making a profit from it.

* Because Open Source is mostly commercial and very successful, making lots of money for the large and small companies that are involved in it, the only way to "grow the ecosystem" is to switch to the Microsoft products nobody wants to buy anymore.

* Linux is only popular because it's the foundation for the LAMP web-development stack, which has been trouncing .Net in the market (this makes me wonder if Hilf, back in high school, used to grumble that "the only reason Randy the Quarterback gets laid is because he has a Mustang...").

* Because Open Source Software runs on Windows too, all those Apache guys are probably running Windows.

* Standards are a communist plot started by those hippies at IBM because darnit, they just don't like Microsoft. It's not fair (hilf makes pouty face).

* WPF-E needs a better name so everybody will want to program in it. If WPF-E gets a cool name like Flash, everybody will use it immediately.

* Because Programming is Hard and that's Just Not Cool, Microsoft wants to make it like "turning a knob" so that developers don't have to work in high-paying jobs anymore, and can go find something new to do for minimum wage that'll probably be funner.

Did I miss anything? I swear reading his comments is like being hit with one Zen Koan after another, machine gun style. What is the sound of one hand clapping?

Phew. Too much, too much. I've gotta go do something fun for a while. Hmm...

Warhammer 40K! Death to the False Emperor! C'mere, you Eldar hussy, you...

Ignore anything from the Bkk post... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#19122831)

I submitted a letter to the register that was quoted verbatim (with permission) on a story about piracy in BKK. Two days later it was copied in the database section of the Bangkok post, verbatim and unattributed. I've since noticed that most of their news is recycled from online sources like the reg and /..

The guys running that editorial are more interested in chasing down the red light shows than actually following whats happening in IT. Move along folks.

Is this the best Microsoft has to offer? (1)

Kidbro (80868) | more than 7 years ago | (#19122849)

I've always considered Microsoft a dangerous beast. I mean, given their size and their success, they must have some really smart people there, no matter if their products are crap most of the time. Then this joker comes along and gives me that warm fuzzy feeling. Is this what they have to offer as head of their Linux Labs? Ah, we're safe.

"[Linux developers] are full-time employees, with 401K stock options. Some work for IBM or Oracle. What does that mean? It means that Linux doesn't exist any more in 2007. There is no free software movement. If someone says Linux is about Love, Peace and Harmony, I would tell them to do their research. There is no free software movement any more."

The guy clearly hasn't understood a thing. The power of Open Source lies not in volunteers working for free (although they have been extremely important), but rather in the GPL (and other free licenses) and open standards that are ensuring the users' freedom, protecting them from vendor lock in, and giving any developer the possibility to address any problem that can be described (by users or by themselves).

He can stick his so called innovation where the sun doesn't shine. Who wants new utilities, sci-fi-esque as they may be, unless they can control what they do?

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