For-Pay Demos Coming to Xbox Live? 112
The Opposable Thumbs blog is talking about a disconcerting new idea being floated by the Official Xbox Magazine. Most people only buy the mag for the demos; they're considering just offering up the exclusive demos on Xbox Live, along with the included trailers and such. The catch? They're going to charge you $2.50 for the privilege. From the article: "We're used to paying for Xbox Live at this point--the feature set is worth the money--but it was sold to us as something of an all-inclusive deal. You're a part of the Xbox network, so you get the demos and the videos and that's part of what you're paying for. Now there is even more of an incentive to offer for-pay demos to people with this new distribution model. In some ways the magazine is already obsolete, and they could conceivably soon be in the business of selling demos." Would you pay money for a downloadable demo?
Hell No (Score:5, Insightful)
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I've played numerous demo games, then bought the game to find out the "demo" was the best level of the game and the rest is just horrible.
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Re:Hell No (Score:4, Insightful)
There's certainly a cheapwad in the room and I don't think it's you. A demo is advertising for a product. By charging your customers to sell them something else, they've earned the title cheapwad.
And at 2.50, plenty of people are making a profit off of the demo itself. This is essentially an attempt by publishers to cash in on AAA status titles before they've truly hit the shelves, and isn't the first time. The trouble with AAA games is that they take a damn long time to make, meaning they take a long time to go from spending money to making money. Metal Gear Solid 2 had a demo released around six months before the game actually shipped. In an attempt to shorten the time from spending to making money, they packaged the demo with an otherwise weak game, "Zone of Enders". Sold like gangbusters simply on the market demand for that demo. I shouldn't have to mention how upset people were at how different the demo was from the game released six months later. (gameplay-wise, it was fine, but the setting and characters radically changed, which upset many longstanding fans of the series).
I believe, if you want to sell demos, make shorter games and sell them instead. 50 dollars or 2.50, it's the principle that matters here -- everyone knows its not about finding new customers.
It is insane to do this (Score:5, Insightful)
They release the demos exclusive to paid-subscription websites which I am not a member of
Then they insist on me 'waiting in a queue' to download it
Then they plaster pop up adverts over multiple pages in order for me to get to my download link.
Then there is the slow 6k download connection for 'non subscribers', mixed in with streaming ads.
Then they try and persuade me to buy it before I've tried it, pester me to 'pre-order' it, and have nag screens I cannot quit.
As a game developer myself, this all seems insane, and naturally I do things the more sensible way. Every one of my games has a free demo, thats always updated to be the very latest code (i patch my server copies of the demo the day I patch the main game). Each one is on a server hosted by me, with an uncapped connection, and a direct
My demo is my advert, I *WANT* everyone to get the demo as quickly and easily, and as hassle free as possible. I cannot understand the mentality of doing it any other way. Just another reason to stick with the PC and not get an XBox I guess
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Yeah, but...
4 of the 5 gripes you listed apply only to PC demos. I don't have to sign an agreement with FilePlanet, FileShack, 3DFiles, WorthPlaying, et cetera to get my Xbox Live demo - just gotta subscribe to Live. I don't have to wait in a queue to download it unless I've already queued up several other Live downloads. There aren't any pop up ads on Live, though there are sponsorships and blade page ads off to the side. My speed
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I can understand that some people would be upset to pay to download for a demo on a network they pay to be on, on the internet connection they pay for. BUT! This is all business. If a large enough part of the gaming population is willing to pay for a demo, then companies will try to make money out of it. Simple as that.
The ZoE example is pretty good. I'm convinced this game would've never sold nearly as well without the demo in it.
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I may be mistaken... (Score:2, Insightful)
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Didn't they?
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All this tells me (in my pessimistic mode) is that a large number of upcoming '360 games are so crap that they want to get some income up front because nobody would buy it. Now maybe if the demo lasted an hour or two it would be worthwhile, it would be like buying a part of a game, but if it was just a video/non-interactive content then I woul
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If I really (and I mean, REALLY) want to take a crack at the game, why not just rent the full thing (as opposed to an incomplete, cherry-picked demo) for a few bucks more?
Rent from where? (Score:2, Interesting)
I have an interesting, insightful response to this (Score:5, Funny)
Re:I have an interesting, insightful response to t (Score:5, Insightful)
No way. (Score:3, Insightful)
2. The biggest exclusive demo they have isn't exclusive if you have a Japanese account set up (Eternal Sonata- if you D/L the Trusty Bell demo it comes out Eternal Sonata when you play it)
3. Exclusive demos existed as a way to get you to buy the magazine, before. Now you're just paying for the demo?
Rental "demo" (Score:3, Insightful)
Wait! (Score:4, Funny)
Probably timed (Score:3, Insightful)
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Otherwise, I'm like a lot of the other posters. I'm not going to pay microsoft or the developer money for the honor of playing whats basically an advertisement and possibly a QA test.
Yes - like a short story (Score:2)
Yes. I rarely have time to take on an entire 40/80/hundreds hours game, and am not inclined to spend upwards of $60 on it.
I do have a few hours to fiddle with a demo and be amused by that.
I recall playing "Kingpin" - a demo long enough to be a fun, short session.
There is a category of more sophisticated (than Tetris etc.) players who want the game equivalent of a short story.
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Why dont you get your quick gaming fix from there? Because the demos are not designed for that, they are supposed to fix you on to the big, long game for the big bucks, so clearly not what you wanted...
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Why not... (Score:2)
Why not games.
A fool and his money are soon departed.
(Just like that Paris bitch!! http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=disinherited+
Can we at least get a demo of the demo for free? (Score:3, Interesting)
But if we could get a demo of the demo before buying, it would let us make a well informed judgement.
On a serious note, I have mixed feelings about this. Previously, those demo magazines were a bit more expensive than usual magazines. I understand this to be due to the cost of compiling the content on the discs, producing the discs, etc. That's fine.
But at this point, you're eliminating that step, but still charging? What are you charging for? Does the game company get a cut of that? Or is this a deal where the demo magazine is paying a game company for exclusive use of their demo, then charging for it on the hopes of netting a profit?
On the other hand, there have been a handful of games I've wanted to get a taste of badly enough that I went out and bought an $8-$9 magazine just for that demo. I might have leafed through the magazine, and played a couple of other demos as well, but pretty much, I was after a specific demo. Paying a couple of bucks for one, where I don't have to even leave the house doesn't sound so bad.
Better Question (Score:2, Insightful)
The answer is more than likely the latter. I don't expect this to change.
Silly slashdotters - the market usually solves questions in the consumers favor.
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Really, I've gotten a helluva lot of play from demos over the years when I never bought the actual. FEAR for example. The Age of Empires online demo (played the hell out of that).
But, you know, for the 100s of other game demos out there, they only get tried for fun and maybe sell you on the game, so they best keep the first 'hit' of the gamin
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First, MS and the publishers both know if you playing the demo resulted in a sale of the game. They will know the exact conversion rates (assuming you got the demo from XBL.)
Also, realize that game developers currently PAY OXM to put the games on their disks, not the other way around. It's doubful that XBL will be allowed to hinder distribution of the developers games - especially since MS makes more money off the
In Other News (Score:3, Interesting)
Pricing info has yet to be released, but it is expected that trailers made available on the internet will be cheaper and probably different than the Pay-per-View trailers made available for television.
For-pay demos are not necessarily new. (Score:2)
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Okay, Or we could do it this way: (Score:3, Interesting)
This way, if we like the game we get first dibs AND that payment is already applied to the purchase price. If we don't like it, MS keeps the money and there's no hard feelings.
It makes it feel more like a rent-to-own than a scam, the difference being that there's now some value besides the soul-crushing sadness that comes from the "honor" of paying for advertising.
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Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. If it was $2.50 to play the demo, that would equate to X amount of MSPoints. So, when the game is purchased, it looks at whether or not you purchased th
As an Xbox Live Gold subscriber.... (Score:1)
1. 24/7 access to play online multiplayer games (unless there is an additional mmorpg fee)
AND
2. Instant access to new demo's, trailers, etc.
I have noticed that sometimes magazines will get an occassional demo before it hits the Live Marketplace, but it usually is only a week or two difference. What would happen if this new money-making model is rolled out? Will I ONLY be able to download certain demo
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And the "experience"... Held on high as if it were the second coming by yet another person who hasn't even tried a PS3. Yeah, maybe matchmaking is slick, but it's not $50/year better. If I had to come up with a single adjective to describe how much better it was I'd pick "marginally".
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That's what we are talking about here, consoles. You can compare it with gaming on Mac or Windows if you want, but either offer a much more fragmented platform as far as online gaming and downloads are concerned and a smaller market (as evidenced by the console market outselling the Windows gaming market by so much). Windows Live! gaming service may yet change that (as Fire once looked like it was going to do) but that's still in development.
Held on high as if it were the sec
No chance (Score:1)
Also what game developer or publisher would possibly want to limit access to their demo in this manner?
To echo others (Score:2)
I know for certain games I would be willing to pay to have a playable demo (Bioshock, Fable 2, and Mass Effect come to mind) but in general, I likely would be able to wait it out until the demo was either free or the game was released.
Much Ado About Nothing (Score:2)
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Say it twice. People seem to be assuming that this means all demos will become $2.50 when the truth is that OXM is trying to stay in business by offering their exclusive demos over XBL for a fee.
Yes, but there are a couple factors working against the article (and OXM) here.
1) It's on Slashdot, so nobody RTFA.
2) It's on Slashdot, so people see 'pay' and freak out.
3) It's on Slashdot, which means the summary is sensationalized and completely wrong.
4) It's on Slashdot, which means if its Microsoft its automagically bad, unless it hurts Sony, then its good.
Did I miss any?
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The future of gaming (Score:2)
You even have to pay for the privilege of paying (this is actually already true, because you need a creditcard to pay in the first place).
No debit cards? (Score:1)
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I pay no fee for my credit card. Don't carry a balance, so no interest. So how does paying via cc require me to pay for the privilege of paying them?
Ignorring that, you do know XBL works on points, and you can buy cards for those points at your local electronics bigbox store with cash, right? No card of any sort necessary.
WTF? (Score:2, Insightful)
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I remember when vid'o games only cost a quarter! And you could play as long as you could stay alive. And these were in, what we called then, Arcades. Had to walk a mile to get there just for the honor of playing. None of this sittin' on your couch bullcrap! We'd walk it and we were happy to walk it! Up hill, both ways! Which weren't so bad if it hadn't been for those snow drifts. Bigger than your head boy! But we did it, and we liked it.
Now its all-day with the online, and t
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it's not nickle-and-diming when you have a choice - don't buy the downloads if they charge for them. problem avoided and sends a consumer-initiated message to them which will probably result with them lowering or hopefully pulling the prices away from demos. act
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after you're done with that, there's a finer point you've missed. There is a big difference between theoretical and actual when talking about performance. For example, the theoretical transfer speed of USB2 is 480mbs while the theoretical transfer speed of Firewire is only 400mbs. However, in actual practical use, USB2 can't even get close to Fi
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Pay For Everything (Score:2, Insightful)
I personally refuse to purchase any of these games, but as long as there are those willing to (o
Rent instead (Score:1)
"Never heard of it" (Score:1)
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Didn't anyone RTF? (Score:4, Informative)
Viva Pinata? (Score:2)
Seriously, if this is true then their just abusing the market and the gamers. I already commented on the exclusive title garbage today and now they might charge for demos. Give me a break.
I could see it... (Score:1)
Problem solved (Score:1)
Would I? Not often, but possibly (Score:1)
No; but sometimes the demo is worthwhile in itself (Score:2)
However, in some cases the demo is a very worthwhile, if small, game in itself. I am thinking in particular of Unreal Tournament 2004, which made a demo with several maps on several game types, including online play. This demo is still being played today, 3 years later, so in fact that was a very entertaining ame in itself (albeit a bit limited).
Epic might have gone too far with UT2004. But the fact remains that oft
Paying for advertisements (Score:1)
It seems like this is starting to be a trend. Just look at some of the magazines out there. They are like 15% content and 85% advertising.
Looks like MS is trying to pull off the exact same thing.
Slow Down... (Score:1)
Paying for a demo is silly, but... (Score:2)
I don't get this article (Score:2)
I think it's just a "twisted" way of looking at what's REALLY happenning and put it in the worst negative view possible for the customers / gamers.
XBOX magazine is loosing in sales. All gaming magazines are.
So they decide to put XBOX magazine on Live, which makes sense. Download your issue through Live. Now you'll have to pay a small fee to get the magazine, just as you do now for the "paper" version. All of that is understandable.
XBOX magazine included a disc with trailers and Demos. Some of
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And I'll be buying fewer games.
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It's hard not to read anti-microsoft propaganda into every ms article.
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again to your point, before xbox live, I would regularly see demo discs for sale at the checkout counters of stores like Gamestop for a price.
still, what are we paying for when we sign up to xbox live? the ability to pay MORE for demos?
I regularly download demos from xbox live - even games I'm not really interested
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Actually, nothing. Access to demos requires only silver, which is free.
Re:Amusing (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:Amusing (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't think you really find that amusing. I think it pisses you off. I think maybe you are even a little put out by the idea of anything being free, and relish the commoditization of everything that was once cooperative and social. It all smacks of hippie liberal activism, doesn't it? All these tiny, unimportant people, talking amongst themselves and screwing with the God given right of important people to make a profit, it's horrible, isn't it?
Re:Amusing (Score:5, Interesting)
Making money is okay. Sure, I made a big leap of inference there. Something about the attitude pissed me off. It's not just you, I've seen it before and I guess I took it all out on you, sorry. It really feels like some people have a knee jerk reaction towards people complaining about commercial things, like the only legitimate way to express one's dissatisfaction with a commercial product is by not buying it. Complaining about it to others is too much like collectivism, and we can't have that! I don't know if that's what you really think or feel, but it's the impression I get whenever anyone makes those kind of anti-free-speech, shut-up-and-just-don't-buy-it arguments.
So, okay, maybe I over-reacted. I'd love to hear your explanation as to why people complaining about something they don't like is so bad. When people complain, they are providing free information to the producers of the goods being complained about, who would otherwise have no idea exactly why people aren't buying their product. Maybe we should charge for our complaints.
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