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Crowther's Original Adventure Source Code Found

kdawson posted about 7 years ago | from the hollow-voice-says-plugh dept.

Programming 309

drxenos writes "I don't know how many of you are fans of old-school text adventures (interactive fiction), but Will Crowther's original Fortran source code has been located in a backup of Don Woods's old student account. For fans like me, this is like finding the Holy Grail."

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309 comments

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I am hoping (2)

Mipoti Gusundar (1028156) | about 7 years ago | (#20223203)

Pleased to be telling me, is it running on linux?

Re:I am hoping (1)

drxenos (573895) | about 7 years ago | (#20223327)

If you look at the posting in the link to the usenet group, someone has converted the code to compile with g77.

Re:I am hoping (1, Informative)

KiloByte (825081) | about 7 years ago | (#20223405)

someone has converted the code to compile with g77.
An a href [russotto.net] would be nice. Fixed that for you.

Re:I am hoping (2, Insightful)

drxenos (573895) | about 7 years ago | (#20224159)

I didn't wish to hammer the poor guy's site. The lazy will always click the link. Only those truly interested would take the time to look for it. The man is doing people a favorite, and now your going to punish him by slashdotting his site.

he was meant to say (0, Offtopic)

wwmedia (950346) | about 7 years ago | (#20223211)

For nurds like me, this is like finding the Holy Grail

Re:he was meant to say (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223339)

So, what the hell is wrong with being a nerd? And if you are not, what the hell are you doing here?

Re:he was meant to say (1)

wwmedia (950346) | about 7 years ago | (#20223551)

i didnt mean it in a bad why

lol

funny seing peoples reaction even tho bellow the slashdot logo it says "news for nurds, stuff that matters"

Re:he was meant to say (0, Offtopic)

mwvdlee (775178) | about 7 years ago | (#20223453)

Yeah dude, nurd are... uh... nuuuuuurds! Headbutt, jock-buddy! Yeah!

Re:he was meant to say (2, Insightful)

Ant P. (974313) | about 7 years ago | (#20223531)

You know, I'd rather have other people see me as a nerd than as someone gratuitously illiterate and idiotic.

Wow.... (0)

ookabooka (731013) | about 7 years ago | (#20223221)

For fans like me, this is like finding the Holy Grail.

It's early. . .I'm not even going to bother, I could have probably easily gotten a +5 funny mod with a statement like that though. Someone mind finishing the work for me?

Re:Wow.... (4, Funny)

PrescriptionWarning (932687) | about 7 years ago | (#20223483)

Q: "What is your quest?"

A> "To Seek the holy grail!"

Q: "what is your favorite text base adventure game?"

A> "Colossal Cave Adventure... NO wait, blue!"

*Gets launched into the death pit*

   tttttt
  t      t
t          t
t   R I P  t
t          t
t          t
tttttttttttt

Re:Wow.... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223601)

"Someone mind finishing the work for me?"

Fine, fine.

For fans like me, this is like finding the Holy Grail.

Drxenos! Drxenos, King of the Nerds! Oh, don't grovel! If there's one thing I can't stand, it's people groveling! ...
[slightly later]

Behold! Drxenos, this is the Holy Grail of Computer Games. Look well, drxenos, for it is your sacred task to seek this Grail. That is your purpose, drxenos -- the Quest for the Holy Grail of Computer Games: Adventure. And it is written in FORTRAN.

Wait, FORTRAN? Lord, you're kidding right?

[significantly later]

He says they've already got one!

Yes, it's-a verry nice-a. It is-a coded in C.

[substantially later]

We are the Knights Who Say ... IP! IP! IP!

Augh!!!! Stop it!

[much later]

What is the net speed of an unladen TCP/IP data packet using PPP over a 1200 baud modem?
What do you mean? With or without parity, 7 or 8 bits, with or without flow control?
What? I don't know all that! Auuuuuugh!!!

[slightly later but a little further that the previously-mentioned "slightly later"]

The Castle Stanford. Once we brave its maze of twisty little passages, all alike, our quest is at an end!

THIS IS A HOAX (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223229)

4chan is responsible. Who else would call FORTRAN a "text adventure"?

Re:THIS IS A HOAX (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223285)

Rules 1 and 2 you idiot! It's ALWAYS ebaum's fault!

Re:THIS IS A HOAX (5, Funny)

pla (258480) | about 7 years ago | (#20223389)

Who else would call FORTRAN a "text adventure"?

Well, calling it a "programming language" certainly qualifies as "fantasy"... ;-)



/ Props to HPF, though
// Still wouldn't use it unless forced to at gunpoint

Re:THIS IS A HOAX (2, Funny)

john_sheu (755802) | about 7 years ago | (#20223659)

// Still wouldn't use it unless forced to at gunpoint

You'd use it at gunpoint? Kids these days, they have no moral fiber...

The Fortran gods shall smite thee (5, Funny)

White Yeti (927387) | about 7 years ago | (#20224231)

program smite_em
c-----
      IMPLICIT NONE      ! Catch typos and un-initialized variables.
      integer       IERR_smite
      character*200 ch_name
c-----
      write(6,1)
1     FORMAT(/,' This is one smiting program!',/,
     &   '   Enter name of smitee --> ',$)
      read(*,fmt='(A)') ch_name

      DO while(.TRUE.)   ! Endless smiting loop.
         call smite(ch_name, IERR_smite)
         if(IERR_smite.GT.0) goto 20
      End DO             ! smite loop.
20    CONTINUE

      write(*,*)' Done smiting.'
      if(IERR_smite.LT.0) then
         write(6,2) IERR_smite
2        FORMAT(' ***Possible smiting error, IERR_smite = ',I)
      endif
      STOP
      END
c-----
c End of Main.
c-----

rogue for me (2, Insightful)

fifedrum (611338) | about 7 years ago | (#20223231)

yeah, can't say I'm anything other than a rogue, nethack, moria, umoria fan. the modern games with their "animation" and "pictures" and "sound" are just too easy.

Re:rogue for me (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223351)

This has nothing to do with modern games, animation, pictures, or sound. This predates Rogue.

Re:rogue for me (1)

computer_redneck (622060) | about 7 years ago | (#20223765)

I remember on the TRS-80 the tape loaded adventure called pyramid in 1976.

A good example of how coding has progressed (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223235)

Increased memory (both RAM & Disc storage) availability has allowed us to make our code more readable.
I looked at the various FORTRAN files and am amazed at the spaghetti GOTO maze which, although messy, was probably the only way to do things in FORTRAN at the time with no structuring capability.


A random example:

IF(K.NE.1) MASK1="177*M2(K)
        IF(((A(J).XOR."201004020100).AND.MASK1).EQ.0)GOTO 3
        IF(S.EQ.0) GOTO 2


Wow! Is that the opposite of self-documenting code or what?

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223291)

Holy Grail? More like finding the Arc of the Covenant. As it's being opened.

Looking upon this madness leads only to ruin!

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (5, Funny)

SIGBUS (8236) | about 7 years ago | (#20223305)

So maybe the inspiration for the "maze of twisty little passages, all alike" wasn't Mammoth Cave, it was the code itself.

You are in a maze... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20224049)

...of twisty FORTRAN spaghetti code, all alike. You are likely to be eaten by an IBM punchcard reader

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (5, Funny)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 7 years ago | (#20223347)

Um, could you repost that please? It seems your original post got corrupted somehow. All I see is gibberish where the code should be.

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (1)

Jugalator (259273) | about 7 years ago | (#20223431)

Yes, holy goto madness! I don't even understand the goto statements here:

GOTO (5014,5000,2026,2010)KQ
        PAUSE 'NO NO'
2026 JVERB=K
        JSPK=JSPKT(JVERB)
        IF(JTWO.NE.0)GOTO 2028
        IF(JOBJ.EQ.0)GOTO 2036
2027 GOTO(9000,5066,3000,5031,2009,5031,9404,9406,5081, 5200,
        1 5200,5300,5506,5502,5504,5505)JVERB

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (5, Interesting)

LMacG (118321) | about 7 years ago | (#20223607)

Ah, the old computed GOTO. In the first line, the value of KQ is used as an index to the list of labels. If KQ=1, GOTO 5014, if KQ=2, GOTO 5000, etc. etc. If KQ is outside the range (0 or greater than 4), then no GOTO is performed, so you'd hit the PAUSE statement. Looks like it's essentially saying "this shouldn't happen".

2027 is similar, there's just a lot more possible values. That rogue 1 is a continuation indicator, it would have been in column 6 on your punch card.

Yes, the famous FORTRAN computed GOTO... (1)

Traf-O-Data-Hater (858971) | about 7 years ago | (#20223713)

And you beat me to it in posting. A true relic of the evolutionary dead ends in the history of computer science :)

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (1)

PCM2 (4486) | about 7 years ago | (#20224275)

AppleSoft BASIC had something similar that I used to write adventure games for the Apple ][:

ON KQ GOTO 5014,5000,...
(where KQ was an integer variable)

If I remember my FORTRAN at all... (1)

SIGBUS (8236) | about 7 years ago | (#20223667)

That last GOTO would be like this in BASIC:

2027 ON JVERB GOTO 9000,5066,3000,5031,2009,5031,9404,9406,5081,5200, 5200,5300,5506,5502,5504,5505

i.e. a multiple-branch GOTO where the destination depends on the value of JVERB. That extra "1" on the second line indicatates that line 2027 got split over two physical lines; FORTRAN dates back to the days of 80-column punch cards.

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (1)

akheron01 (637033) | about 7 years ago | (#20223619)

Hah, if you guys think this is bad I'll bet you've never tried writing a game assembly more gotos than a billy g basic game

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (1)

slummy (887268) | about 7 years ago | (#20223969)

No games, but I programmed a robot once.

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223745)

no it's not that bad. back at DEC in the '79 we got a copy of this source code and figured out how to win the game in as few steps as possible. sure it ruined the game - bu we were at work anyway :)

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed, (5, Interesting)

junge_m (410514) | about 7 years ago | (#20223821)

This is why the grandmaster of 'Literate Programming', Donald Knuth, has done a translation into his CWEB Language which is totaly devoid of jumps and other 'dirty' Fortan:
http://www.literateprogramming.com/adventure.pdf [literateprogramming.com]

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (2, Funny)

Mr. Underbridge (666784) | about 7 years ago | (#20223829)

Wow! Is that the opposite of self-documenting code or what?

Well...it doesn't *look* like Perl...

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20224223)

Bah, kids these days - that's nothing. Try these basic gems for size:

00010 goto 6000+10*int(10*rnd())

00010 input a2$
00020 read a1$
00030 read d
00040 if a1$=a2$ then d
00050 goto 20
00060 data "N",1000,"S",2000,"E",3000,"W",4000

(ok, should use capitals, but cbf)

Re:A good example of how coding has progressed (2, Funny)

j00r0m4nc3r (959816) | about 7 years ago | (#20224227)

Wow! Is that the opposite of self-documenting code or what?

I would call it self-obfuscating.

Oblig Fortran: (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223237)

My eyes, the goggles etc.

The Holy Grail? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223249)

Bad, bad Zoot. I'm sorry that's just the grail shaped light.

Soon to be assimilated (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223251)

And soon a free version with "clean room" (yeah right) source code and the exact same designs will suddenly appear called Linadventure, driving the original version out of business on a wave of proto-socialist bandwagonism.

Re:Soon to be assimilated (1)

rgravina (520410) | about 7 years ago | (#20223365)

I'd love to see it done with lots of design patterns, sort of a contrast between the old and new! You could even go nuts and over apply them just for the hell of it. Actually, the GoF Design Patterns book uses a maze example to illustrate the various creational patterns, so we already know we need a AdventureFactory in there somewhere :)

Re:Soon to be assimilated (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223391)

Yes that would be interesting. But when the march of the communist bolshevik assimilate the fruits of people's hard labour, quality always drops, bugs always rise and the code becomes unstable rubbish. As expected when you replace economic incentive with tired, discredited dogma.

Still pouting, Darl? (1)

Weaselmancer (533834) | about 7 years ago | (#20224311)

I know, you've had a bad week. Here, have a cookie.

Found? When was it lost? (4, Funny)

Smallpond (221300) | about 7 years ago | (#20223253)

I once wrote a script to find and delete copies of this and the star trek game due to the limited disk space on our PDP-11/70. It had to compare file contents because the sneaky bastards would change the file names to something like TPSRPORT.DOC to hide them.

Re:Found? When was it lost? (0, Troll)

rmezzari (245108) | about 7 years ago | (#20224197)

People renaming files to .DOC in the PDP-11 era? Yeah, right...

Re:Found? When was it lost? (3, Interesting)

ari_j (90255) | about 7 years ago | (#20224255)

I'm not sure about the PDP-11 era, but as early as the mid-80's it was common to use .doc to indicate that something was a general document as opposed to a .ltr, .mem, or the like. The word processor used was irrelevant. (We used XyWrite at the time.) MS Word commandeering .doc is a relatively new phenomenon - the .doc extension itself is not.

Re:Found? When was it lost? (1)

eudaemon (320983) | about 7 years ago | (#20224299)

Er, I vaugely remember the runoff command creating .doc files? Or at least
seeing other .doc files on pdp-10 and pdp-11 systems in the early 1980's.

I don't think ".doc" is excluse to MS in any case.

Meh! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223267)

I'll wait till it's reviewed on Penny Arcade [penny-arcade.com] .

command (0, Redundant)

suso (153703) | about 7 years ago | (#20223271)

xyzzy

Re:command (1)

Krisbee (644227) | about 7 years ago | (#20223303)

A hollow voice says: PLUGH

unbeleivable, isn't it!

Re:command (1)

Gill Bates (88647) | about 7 years ago | (#20223307)

plugh

Re:command (1)

Bloody Peasant (12708) | about 7 years ago | (#20223313)

suso wrote:

xyzzy

PLUGH!

comparison? (1)

catbertscousin (770186) | about 7 years ago | (#20223323)

But is it more like finding the Holy Grail or the Dead Sea Scrolls? Ancient scrolls stored in a cave sounds more appropriate . . .
Read it? y/n

This sounds familiar (1, Funny)

thatskinnyguy (1129515) | about 7 years ago | (#20223279)

I've never seen this game or anything like it. (too young) It sounds to me to be like one of those interactive books. It would seem to be a little easier to go the book route than to have to mess around with 70's era computers. How this was successful at all is a wonder.

Re:This sounds familiar (4, Funny)

Barny (103770) | about 7 years ago | (#20223297)

GIT OFFA MAH LAWN! /me waves a shotgun around menacingly

Re:This sounds familiar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223367)

This has nothing to do with those moronic books.

Reversed causation (4, Interesting)

dazedNconfuzed (154242) | about 7 years ago | (#20223419)

Those interactive books came about because of Adventure.

Re:This sounds familiar (3, Interesting)

Xiaran (836924) | about 7 years ago | (#20223515)

My first expose to Collosal Cave was when I was about 10ish... my Dad was a programmer(mainframes... mostly IBM, sperry etc) and I played it on a Sperry mainframe terminal. It may be hard to imagine for someone like yourself that has probably grown up with high resolution, high powered desktop PCs... but playing it for me was eye opening in the extreme. I suspect Im not alone and many other got hooked on development and technology because of interactive stuff like the good old original adventure.

xyzzy

Re:This sounds familiar (1)

thatskinnyguy (1129515) | about 7 years ago | (#20223569)

First computer for me was the '88 model of IBM XT bought brand-new... just to give you a measuring stick of how far back I go.

Re:This sounds familiar (1)

dknj (441802) | about 7 years ago | (#20223967)

they had fortran, we had basic (soon after, qbasic). they had millions of punch cards, we had millions of 5 1/4" 160KB floppy disks. they had pong, we had test drive (4 color CGA goodness). i think we had a good childhood :-)

i got into computing in 1987 with an 8088 (with a whooping 20mb hd!) i did the unix/dos thing until 92 when i got my hands on windows 3.1. funny thing is my mom actually taught me fortran, which i had zero use for. thats about when i hit the demo scene....

Re:This sounds familiar (1)

jim_redwagon (845837) | about 7 years ago | (#20224037)

well, i think you got in a bit late ;-)

I remember going into RIT in the Fall of '86 and the 'computer lab' was row after row of mainframe terminals. however, if you got in there early enough (before professors started logging in) you could plan a mean game of Moria [users.tkk.fi] , to me, still one of the greatest games going.

Going back a bit further, my first computer would be the Atari 1200XL with external cassette drive and plug in Basic cartridge. My display would be my then 10 year old black and white TV. Still have it, should fire it up one day.

Why it was special... (1)

maillemaker (924053) | about 7 years ago | (#20223519)

I'm old enough to remember, though I was a kid.

I'm not sure I can explain the sense of wonder. It was like the first time I got my modem working and realized I was _connected_to_another_computer! It was amazing to be able to type in a command or a question and have the computer _talk_back_to_you. Even though we all _knew_ it wasn't real AI, it felt like AI.

It wasn't the format of the _game_ that was special. Like was said, there were books that could do something similar. It was the fact that you were, basically, talking to a machine that was special.

Re:Why it was special... (5, Funny)

ian_mackereth (889101) | about 7 years ago | (#20223767)

I encountered it as an engineering undergrad, on a university Cyber 204 or 205 mainframe, the first computer I'd ever used. I had to hack extra console time via various means to complete it, using a mega flowchart I drew up as I went.

When I finally finished it, the screen cleared and an operator in the computer centre was typing to me and asking me to come over to the centre. I figured I'd been sprung for all the extra time I'd 'arranged', but instead they gave me printout and iducted me into the Order of Wizards!

A nerdy proud moment... (I wish I hadn't lost that printout in the intervening decades and moves.)

Cool (1)

maillemaker (924053) | about 7 years ago | (#20223845)

Cool story.

Re:Why it was special... (1)

jollyreaper (513215) | about 7 years ago | (#20224069)

I encountered it as an engineering undergrad, on a university Cyber 204 or 205 mainframe, the first computer I'd ever used. I had to hack extra console time via various means to complete it, using a mega flowchart I drew up as I went.

When I finally finished it, the screen cleared and an operator in the computer centre was typing to me and asking me to come over to the centre. I figured I'd been sprung for all the extra time I'd 'arranged', but instead they gave me printout and iducted me into the Order of Wizards!

A nerdy proud moment... (I wish I hadn't lost that printout in the intervening decades and moves.)
That's probably the geekiest thing I've ever read. I'm proud of you. Nothing like that happened for me when I beat The Pit.

Re:This sounds familiar (3, Insightful)

Targon (17348) | about 7 years ago | (#20223545)

In an era where there were no computer graphics at all, text was the only thing available. And it was a lot of fun as well.

The original Zork games, as well as the rest of the Infocom games were inspired by Adventure to a large degree. It should be noted that because they were text based, some things that would be considered obvious were not necessarily obvious in those days, which added to the puzzle solving aspect of the game.

These days, everything is made almost too obvious, because too many potential customers don't like a challenge(note that many games can be beaten straight out of the box in under 24 hours of playing). Back in those days, a game could take weeks of playing to figure out what to do, beating your head against a problem for several days before a solution would present itself wasn't uncommon.

Then again, it seems that too many people never bother to pick up a book when movies are available, and never realize how horribly the film makers have screwed up a great story, so it's no wonder some people would never understand why text adventures were fun.

Re:This sounds familiar (2, Informative)

hateful monkey (1081671) | about 7 years ago | (#20223679)

Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. If you didn't pick up the mail that is casually mentioned in the first few moments of the game, you are essentially screwed once you get on the Vogon ship. If you didn't by the extra "hint" books some of these things where almost impossible.

Re:This sounds familiar (1)

Bigbutt (65939) | about 7 years ago | (#20224147)

It took me 2 years of playing back in the mid 80's to finally beat hack (1.0.3 I believe or possibly nethack). That was a proud moment to me.

[John]

Re:This sounds familiar (2, Informative)

91degrees (207121) | about 7 years ago | (#20223617)

The 70's era computers weren't so bad. You had a command line interface and generally human understandable commands.

A few of the classics are available as free downloads. They became more sophisticated over time. Have a look at Zork [thcnet.net] for an example of one of the popular ones.

Re:This sounds familiar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20224103)

too many people must be following your zork link, because it keeps throwing errors at me while i'm trying to play. :(

I must not be old enough (3, Informative)

ArcadeX (866171) | about 7 years ago | (#20223283)

Had to go to wiki [wikipedia.org] for this one...

William ("Willie" or "Will") Crowther (born 1936) is a computer programmer and caver. He is best known as the co-creator of Colossal Cave Adventure, a seminal computer game that influenced the first decade of game design and created a new game genre, text adventures.

[edit] Biography
During the early 1970s Crowther worked at defense contractor and Internet pioneer Bolt, Beranek and Newman (BBN). Following his divorce from his wife Patricia, Crowther began using his spare time to develop a simple text-based adventure game in FORTRAN on BBN's PDP-10. He created it as a diversion his daughters Sandy and Laura could enjoy when they came to visit. (Montfort, 2003, pp. 85-87)

In Adventure, the player moves around an imaginary cave system by entering simple, two-word commands and reading text describing the result. Crowther used his extensive knowledge of cave exploration as a basis for the game play, and there are many similarities between the locations in the game and those in Mammoth Cave, particularly its Bedquilt section. (Montfort, 2003, p. 88) In 1975 Crowther released the game on the early ARPANET system, of which BBN was a prime contractor. (Montfort, 2003, p. 89)

In the Spring of 1976, he was contacted by Stanford researcher Don Woods, seeking his permission to enhance the game. Crowther agreed, and Woods developed several enhanced versions on a PDP-10 housed in the Stanford Artificial Intelligence Laboratory (SAIL) where he worked. (Montfort, 2003, p. 89) Over the following decade the game gained in popularity, being ported to many operating systems, including personal-computer platform CP/M.

The basic game structure invented by Crowther (and based in part on the example of the ELIZA text parser) was carried forward by the designers of later adventure games. Marc Blank and the team that created the Zork adventures cite Adventure as the title that inspired them to create their game. They later founded Infocom and published a series of popular text adventures.

The location of the game in Colossal Cave was not a coincidence. Will and his first wife Pat Crowther were active and dedicated cavers in the 1960s and early 1970s--both were part of many expeditions to connect the Mammoth and Flint Ridge cave systems. Pat played a key role in the September 9, 1972 expedition that finally made the connection. (Brucker, 1976, p. 299)

Will has also played an important role in the development of rock climbing in the Shawangunks in New York State. He began climbing there in the 1950s and continues to climb today. He made the first ascent of several classic routes including Arrow, Hawk, Moonlight, and Senté. Some of these routes sparked controversy because protection bolts were placed on rappel; a new tactic that Crowther and a several others began to use at the time. The community reaction to this technique was an important part of the evolution of climbing ethics in the Shawangunks and beyond.

Re:I must not be old enough (0, Flamebait)

zero_offset (200586) | about 7 years ago | (#20223467)

The community reaction to this technique was an important part of the evolution of climbing ethics in the Shawangunks and beyond.

I hate to go off-topic, but what the fuck does rock-climbing have to do with "ethics"?
Sometimes I hate Wikipedia.

Re:I must not be old enough (1)

rgravina (520410) | about 7 years ago | (#20223677)

Just a guess, but probably something to do with not damaging the rock you are climbing.

Re:I must not be old enough (5, Informative)

Mr. Slippery (47854) | about 7 years ago | (#20223789)

what the fuck does rock-climbing have to do with "ethics"?

The same thing leaving a campsite better than you found it has to do with ethics, or not littering has to do with ethics. Altering the environment and depriving others of potential experiences is an ethical issue.

A quick Googling [google.com] will reveal that "climbing ethics" is not an invention of the Wikipedia author, but is an active area of discussion among climbers.

Re:I must not be old enough (1)

zero_offset (200586) | about 7 years ago | (#20223827)

You have illuminated my light bulb. Thank you, sir.

Climbing ethics. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223841)

Take 4 of the most common styles of climbing*:

1. "aid" climbing.

The climber uses a rope, can pull on fixed protection, use etriers (a type of ladder) etc. Anything goes.

2. "sport" climbing.

The lead climber uses a rope, and protects himself by clipping it to fixed bolts attached to the rock. He (or she) only uses the bolts for protection - moving upwards is only achieved by climbing the rock.

3. "Traditional climbing"

The lead climber uses a rope, and protects himself py placing his own protection. This consists of "nuts" (metal wedges), "friends" (spring loaded camming devices) and other stuff. The climber who comes up second removes the protection.

4. "solo" climbing.

No rope, no protection, just you and the rock. Fall off from too high up and you will probably die.

Now to the ethics:

If a climb is usually led as a "trad" climb then it is very bad form to turn up with a drill and put a line of bolts on it. Climbing it solo or trad is "good style", bolting it or aiding is poor style.

Similarly you don't get many points for aiding a sport route, although soloing it or bypassing the bolts and using traditional protection is good.

Essentially climbing ethics comes down to respecting the local climbers, not doing anything to ruin peoples routes (bolting is irreversible), and not cheating.

Most climbers, when faced with a climb they aren't competent to lead, will walk away and come back when they are ready. Some will come back in the night with a cold chisel and hammer and cut themselves some extra holds - at a stroke destroying the challenge every future climber.

Now that is unethical.

*i know there are others.

Holy Grail (2, Insightful)

biocute (936687) | about 7 years ago | (#20223287)

I digged out my Transformers toys when the movie was out, but playing with them doesn't give me the same thrill as they did 20 years ago.

This, is probably the same.

Re:Holy Grail (1)

raddan (519638) | about 7 years ago | (#20223491)

Case in point: I rediscovered Scott Adams' text adventure stuff a few years ago. I grew up playing those games on my TI99/4A. I fondly remember playing Strange Odyssey and Pirate Adventure, thinking that games couldn't have gotten better than this. Anyway, games I spent weeks chugging through when I was a kid, I plowed through in about a half-hour. Fun, but not quite the same thing anymore. Another one, Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, though hilarious to me when I was a kid, is now mostly annoying (still love the books, though).

Re:Holy Grail (2, Funny)

FauxPasIII (75900) | about 7 years ago | (#20223851)

> I digged out my Transformers toys when the movie was out, but playing with them doesn't give me the same thrill as they did 20 years ago.

Then your fandom is WEAK.
/me cuddles his masterpiece edition Optimus Prime

at last! (3, Funny)

pbjones (315127) | about 7 years ago | (#20223295)

I may print it out and use it for wall paper. or etch it on silicon.

I was at my wit's end (2, Funny)

phunctor (964194) | about 7 years ago | (#20223315)

but fortunately I had the source.

--
phunctor

movie (1)

Dethboy (136650) | about 7 years ago | (#20223341)

I'll wait for the movie to come out...

Re:movie (1)

psbrogna (611644) | about 7 years ago | (#20224229)

That's a HUGE idea. You should put together a script and court Hollywood. You could get The Rock to star- he did good work in Doom. I think to stay true to the period though Adventure The Movie should be in b&w.

This is very important (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223363)

Maybe a lot of today's nerds are too young to remember, but ADVENT was one of the most important computer games ever written. Its influence is still with us today, from mere hacker jargon to standard features of many modern games. Scoff if you want, but this discovery has historical significance. There has been a great deal of speculation and debate over the years about Crowther's and Woods's relative contributions to the game, and Crowther's source code puts numerous questions to rest. If the history of computers, and particularly of computer games, is at all a subject worthy of study, then this source code has to be considered a major find.

Full source published (1)

dazedNconfuzed (154242) | about 7 years ago | (#20223435)

An old copy of Creative Computing magazine had a spoof edition which, among other amusements, (IIRC) listed the entire source code for Adventure. I have it in storage somewhere; will dig it out this week and see if it matches TFA's discovery.

Re:Full source published (1)

drxenos (573895) | about 7 years ago | (#20223643)

I doubt it, as this version is before Woods turned it into a game (The original Crowther's version was just a simulation for his kids). But please do dig it out. I have made a hobby out of collecting all the various versions of Adventure (and also Zork--AKA Dungeon--,and Rogue).

Re:Full source published (2, Informative)

Mr2001 (90979) | about 7 years ago | (#20223989)

I doubt it, as this version is before Woods turned it into a game (The original Crowther's version was just a simulation for his kids).
Not true, RTFA [uiuc.edu] ! It explains that Crowther's original had puzzles and fantasy elements, intentionally changed parts of the map, and was designed with adults in mind.

Re:Full source published (2, Informative)

Dennis G. Jerz (473507) | about 7 years ago | (#20224257)

Crowther's original was a game, and you can play it for yourself. Matthew Russoto tweaked the recovered source code so that it will compile under g77.

http://www.russotto.net/~russotto/ADVENT/ [russotto.net] ... and David Kinder published a Windows executable.

http://www.ifarchive.org/if-archive/unprocessed/ad v_crowther_win.zip [ifarchive.org]

That file will move eventually... you will probably be able to find it from here:

http://www.wurb.com/if/person/2 [wurb.com]

There are also photos of the inside of the real Colossal Cave, including photos of what's left of the famous brick building (just a foundation, sadly) the famous rock with a Y2 on it, and even a rusty axe head and an iron rod.

http://brain.lis.uiuc.edu:2323/opencms/export/site s/default/dhq/vol/001/2/000009.html [uiuc.edu]

or

http://www.digitalhumanities.org/dhq/vol/001/2/000 009.html [digitalhumanities.org]

History - Looking for Scheme tarball 1986-87 era (3, Interesting)

scottsk (781208) | about 7 years ago | (#20223449)

The adventure source is a great find. I've been looking for the Scheme source tarball from the 1986-1987 period (i.e. when SICP was still new) for over a year, with no success. The changelog is online, and shows the work that was done in that period, but none of the tarballs still exists. Anyone have a Scheme distribution tarball from late 1987? I would like to run the code from that time along with the book to do screen captures, etc for something I'm working on.

Fight the power (2, Informative)

ShawnCplus (1083617) | about 7 years ago | (#20223505)

Even though they are obviously overtaken by Graphical MMOs like WoW, MUDs are still fairly prevalent. There are still thousands of active MUDs/MUSHs/MOOs/BBSs and (extremely hard to calculate accurately) roughly 15,000 active players in the community.

Ironic (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223577)

Ironically, I used to have the source code to an adventure game called The Holy Grail. :-D

At Last! (2, Funny)

corby (56462) | about 7 years ago | (#20223675)

Now, I will finally be able to unlock the Hot Coffee mod.

Re:At Last! (2, Funny)

Gregg.Baker (1142539) | about 7 years ago | (#20224137)

Does this mean the ESRB is going to retroactively give it an AO rating for ASCII boobies?

A lesson here (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20223693)

What if the game was closed source or infested by DRM or saved in a proprietary format by a company that went bust two decades ago and whose products nobody had specs for?

EAMON!!!! (3, Interesting)

WED Fan (911325) | about 7 years ago | (#20223905)

This was fun. I remember running it on a teletype terminal in programming class (damn, thats old) BANG BANG BANG BANG BANG. You couldn't do a quick CLS to hide the evidence when the instructor came by, "Do you think paper grows on trees?" he yell. Of course all was forgiven when we showed him our course work was done. Then, he made us write our own dungeon code.

Much later, Don Brown(?) came out with EAMON [wikipedia.org] , with a write your own framework. Fun fun fun.

Wait for the Game... (1)

hotrodent (1017236) | about 7 years ago | (#20223975)

So how long before someone writes an IF game that involves exploring the real caves and finding the source code about an IF game called Adventure thats about exploring the caves?

Does anyone remember... (1)

wandazulu (265281) | about 7 years ago | (#20224279)

...the version that was available for the IBM PC? It was one of the original programs available on the PC and was, presumably ported, by that little company that provides DOS, Microsoft. In a nod to the future of DRM, it was also the first program I came across that was "copy protected"; you could make a single copy and then that was it.

Man, that game was just so much freaking fun; I can still see that little bird driving the snake away to this day.

XYZZY forever, baby!

Useable code (1)

qwp (694253) | about 7 years ago | (#20224303)

In the thread about it someone posted modified code that can actually compile.. (Even with cygwin!)
http://www.russotto.net/~russotto/ADVENT/ [russotto.net]
I just compiled and it was flawless, so cheers
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