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Mandriva Linux 2008 RC 1 Released

ScuttleMonkey posted about 7 years ago | from the marching-on dept.

Mandriva 182

AdamWill writes "The first release candidate of Mandriva Linux 2008, codenamed Galilee, is now available. The release notes are also available via the wiki. A guide to major new features (some of which are not yet implemented in this release candidate), and the detailed technical specifications are also available. This release candidate is available as a three CD or one DVD Free edition (containing no non-free software or drivers) for the x86-32 and x86-64 architectures, with a traditional installer, and as a mini-CD edition for both x86-32 and x86-64 architectures. A One combined live / install CD edition will be released in the near future (problems with unionfs prevented the One edition from being release at the same time as the other editions)."

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Hopefully (2, Interesting)

fleshball (606934) | about 7 years ago | (#20487987)

This will reignite interest in mandriva... I o not know why people always go for the less polished distros, like ubuntu, over something supported nad stable like mandriva.

Re:Hopefully (5, Interesting)

CastrTroy (595695) | about 7 years ago | (#20488051)

I've been using Mandriva for 6 years and I am thoroughly unimpressed with Ubuntu, Fedora, Gentoo, and all the other Linux distros that seem to be garnering so much attention. Ubuntu especially unimpresses me because it's supposed to be some big jump in desktop usability, but doesn't seem to offer anything that Mandriva doesn't offer, and actually tends to be lacking in quite a few areas.

Re:Hopefully (5, Informative)

Steel Shepherd (755314) | about 7 years ago | (#20488373)

I used Mandriva for a few years and switched, eventually to Kubuntu. I tried Suse, Fedora, and Mepis. I really liked Mepis (based on Ubuntu) but switched to Kubuntu based on a sound driver problem. The switch was almost effortless. There is no question Mandriva is a polished distro. Desktop usability is certainly it's forte. My problem with it was package availability, especially when it's popularity began to slide. I ended up running cooker to try to keep up to date and try packages that were not available as stable. Switching to Mepis, based on Ubuntu, solved that for me. The management tools are not as good or as complete as the drake tools, but they are generally sufficient. I can't say though that I recall desktop usability being a strength of Ubunutu's. It's for everyone, as in many languages and affordable to all. If Mandriva gives you what you need, VERY COOL! If something isn't there, doesn't work, or isn't being kept up to date, a switch to Ubuntu will probably solve the problem.

Re:Hopefully (2, Insightful)

Goldberg's Pants (139800) | about 7 years ago | (#20488627)

Not sure why the original post is flagged as a troll right now. It's a perfectly fair comment. I've just got back into using Linux with Ubuntu and I love it. I used to use Mandrake in my previous Linux days. I always found it to be exceptionally good. Better than RedHat, Suse etc...

If I could be bothered I'd do a comparison of distros, but Ubuntu was largely painless, does everything I want, and is ludicrously popular meaning if there's a program I want and I don't want to cock about with source releases, I can invariably find a package of it.

Re:Hopefully (1)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about 7 years ago | (#20490021)

I tried Suse, Fedora, and Mepis. I really liked Mepis (based on Ubuntu) but switched to Kubuntu based on a sound driver problem. The switch was almost effortless.

I'll second that, and point out it's one of the reasons I choose Linux over single-origin operating systems.

Like Steel Shepherd, I've tried several distros (Ubuntu, Fedora, etc) and was impressed with aspects of them, but eventually settled on the ones which work for me now (SLED10 for business and Sabayon for fun). Switching between the distros while I was testing was totally painless, and installs mostly took just a few minutes of my time, with the bulk of the install occurring unattended.

If someone develops a new distro which works better for me, I can change to that without significant effort.

That's the free-as-in-freedom aspect of Open Source at work, and I guess it matters more to me than some, but it's nice to see it's getting easier for all computer users.

Re:Hopefully (2, Insightful)

Greg_D (138979) | about 7 years ago | (#20490533)

This seems to be an ongoing issue with Linux distros.

I started out with Slackware, moved on to Redhat, then Mandrake came along and made Redhat more usable.

I dipped out of Linux for a while, came back in, and moved right into Debian because I liked their package management better.

Then used Mepis for a while before settling on Ubuntu.

What seems to happen is that a new distro will come along and their user community will be galvanized into keeping the distro up to date with the features that the desktop user community really wants, then when they decide to try to grab a piece of the corporate market, their updates slow down and you end up having to hunt more and more through different webpages to try to figure out how to get component X and feature Y to work with the distro.

Right now, I'm really happy with the speed in which new Ubuntu versions are coming out and the focus they seem to give the desktop market. Additionally, software like Aptana and Eclipse are making it easier for web application developers to do their thing without having to worry about being tied to a specific OS.

The fun thing is that at the rate Ubuntu and some of the other distros are going, in 5 years or so when the desktop environments trully mature on a level with OSX and Windows, they really WILL have the superior OS from a technical AND usability standpoint. Not only that, but it'll give the average home user more choices as the abominable "software as service" trend becomes more mainstream.

Re:Hopefully (1)

rmessenger (1078643) | about 7 years ago | (#20490469)

My problem with it was package availability, especially when it's popularity began to slide.

I agree with GP that Ubuntu's usability, features, etc. aren't overly impressive compared to other distros like mandriva. However, Ubuntu's popularity attracts not only more users, but developers, driver support, millions of users testing Ubuntu on every kind of hardware, native linux installed on new hardware from major companies like dell, and vast, vast quantities of great free software that generally integrates perfectly into the desktop.

.Ubuntu's technical specifications themselves aren't responsible for this; it has simply reached a user critical mass of sorts. Windows operates on the same principle, and in theory, this principle can easily lead to a kind of de facto lockdown on inovation (just look at Windows).

HOWEVER, I think we need to put away our idealism here, and be pragmatic: the Ubuntu effect is the lesser of evils / means to an end that can bring a more modern, open, secure, and free operating system into the main stream. And this, I propose, is a very worthy goal.

Re:Hopefully (1)

Solokron (198043) | about 7 years ago | (#20488383)

I am going to have to disagree with this one. I enjoyed Mandriva myself but having others that were unfamiliar with any Linux desktop use it was not quite as easy as having them use Ubuntu. It's one thing to offer a clean desktop with plenty of features, it's another to keep it clean and simple.

Re:Hopefully (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20489903)

clean and simple is GNOME.
clean and plenty is KDE.
You have them both with any distro. This is not about mandriva/ubuntu.

mandriva/ubuntu is:
distro with front end users oriented tools/distro with front end users oriented millionair
You choose.

Re:Hopefully (1, Interesting)

Reziac (43301) | about 7 years ago | (#20488433)

Just curious as to what differences/lacks you've encountered?

No linux distro has ever entirely caught me, but to date my favourite was Mandrake v7.2.

Re:Hopefully (1)

$pace6host (865145) | about 7 years ago | (#20488637)

I used Mandriva (and Mandrake) for years, and really liked it, except for updates. I would ALWAYS eventually run into bad packages that wouldn't install for one reason or another, but were required for other packages, and I'd constantly have to update where I pulled packages from or I'd end up with bad signatures. My Xubuntu box never had any of those problems, so I finally gave up about 2 months ago, and switched the Mandriva box to Kubuntu. Those problems were likely with the mirror network (not Mandriva itself), but that's part of what you sign up for when you choose the distribution, so I don't know if I'll switch back. I don't like the desktop quite as much (it's not bad, though), but updates and package installs have been absolute simplicity. I also find it easier to get answers to questions with Ubuntu.

About to swap to Ubuntu myself (1)

funkdancer (582069) | about 7 years ago | (#20490559)

I'm about to swap to Ubuntu myself. I've been using Mandriva as a paying Silver member for years, but every time I want to go to the next major version [because I can't easily get updates for the old] I've pretty much had to start from scratch. The package / update management is just too hard; I'm running I think a Club/Xmas Edition Mandriva 2007 and whilst I was ok compiling e.g. KTorrent, getting something like Firefox 2.0 installed was a major PITA for my experience level. Everyone had moved up to the next point release and I couldn't find packages for the old.. they were supposed to be there, but the Mandriva Club website was just much work.

So just got a new Q6600 to become my main Vista workstation; my old SC AMD64 will thus have Ubuntu installed for the primary reason of the good stuff I've heard about package management. Also ability to update between major versions is a huge bonus.

Re:Hopefully (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488933)

Whilst still mainly an XP user at home I have dual booted a Red Hat based linux distro since RH 5.2 switching to the Mandrake distro and its successors at around MDK7. Last week after seeing yet more articles about how wonderful Ubuntu was I decided to install it on my second PC instead of upgrading the version of Mandriva on there. I wasn't impressed. For the first time in years I had to edit my xorg.conf just to get my old 19" CRT monitor to display at a resolution higher than 1024x768 at a headache inducing 60Hz. In recent years I only recall editing this when installing proprietary NVidia drivers or cutting edge packages like Beryl at the time on Mandrake/Mandriva.

I quickly swapped to Kubuntu as I remembered why I don't like Gnome but overall I found I was diving to the shell a lot more for trivial tasks than Mandriva which has nice easy to use apps to accomplish most things so i can't figure out why this is touted as good for beginners. I am a software developer on HP-UX systems and also administer about half a dozen HP-UX test workstations so I am quite familiar with using various *nix shells but i really don't see why I should have to use them for simple config tasks on a desktop orientated distro.

My only complaint with Mandriva is that it can take a while for some packages to be updated Firefox and Thunderbird instantly coming to mind but unless you use some of the cooker/backport packages updates are extremely easy and painless with little chance of dependency hell often associated with RPM based distros but urpmi (used through the standard package manager or command line) sorts out a lot of these problems.

With Ubuntu being pre-installed on big OEM boxes it will no doubt get a lot of support and hopefully mature quickly but at present for desktop use Mandriva wins hands down hell even my mother was able to use it without any hitches.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

the_womble (580291) | about 7 years ago | (#20490515)

I agree completely. I tried Kubuntu and went back to Mandriva.

There is one thing that is better in Ubuntu/Kubuntu. Package installation. The repo is a bit larger, Synaptic has a lot more in the way of search and filtering than RPMDrake, and apt has suggested and recommended package relationships as well a required.

Other than that, Mandriva is better in every way. Configuration, in particular, is way ahead of Ubuntu, and more ahead of Kubuntu.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

betterunixthanunix (980855) | about 7 years ago | (#20488077)

Too late for me. I used Mandrake for years, then the shift to Mandriva occurred, and then the problems started. The repositories got screwed up (I know, they were required to change the name, but they could have done it more smoothly), then packages became even more out of date (it was still running a 2.6.12 kernel for MDV2006 last time I checked), and finally I just got too fed up and switched to Fedora Core 5, and have been running Fedora ever since. I will probably upgrade an old file server that is still running Mandrake, just so I can get updates (right now, updates are not even possible).

Same boat... (2, Interesting)

msimm (580077) | about 7 years ago | (#20488559)

I'd almost like to give it another shot, but I'm happily running Kubuntu on my laptop and really can't justify pulling a solid system to scratch that itch. To date, personally, Kubuntu and the rest of the Ubuntu family have the most cohesive feel to a Linux based distro I've known. Mandriva's user tools used to shine, but unless they've done something remarkable I just don't see much advantage. And the breakage in the last version (specifically the x86_64) left a very sour taste in my mouth. Maybe on day at work I'll pluck about with a spare server, but if Ubuntu can continue on it's current path I'm probably hooked. It feels like a system.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

fyoder (857358) | about 7 years ago | (#20488575)

When the name change occurred my account with their Mickey Mouse... make that Mandrake... rather Mandriva Club broke. My emails went unanswered, in spite of the fact I'd shelled out money to them. Switched to Fedora and haven't looked back (though am looking forward to trying Kubuntu). Frankly, I'm surprised they still exist.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

ricegf (1059658) | about 7 years ago | (#20488735)

I too used Mandrake / Mandriva for years (it was my first full-time distro), but wandered away a few years back. I lost track of the company once Gaël Duval left. Partly, I was disappointed by the website, which I never quite understood (perhaps I should have studied harder in French :-). Partly, I kept falling into dependency hell - when I tried Ubuntu, installing new packages Just Worked, and I couldn't bring myself to return to my first love.

But I remember Mandriva fondly, and wish them all the best with 2008.

Re:Hopefully (1)

JayAEU (33022) | about 7 years ago | (#20489753)

Why not give PCLinuxOS 2007 a shot, instead? It's based on Mandriva, but much more polished and ironed out than the original.

You can get it from for free and it works like a charm. I just switched my wife from WXP over to it, which is something I never dreamt possible. No complaints, no nag, no malware, no viruses...

Amyway, I think that original Mandriva has become too commercial while they don't give you the impression that they really can deliver on support etc.

Re:Hopefully (4, Interesting)

N7DR (536428) | about 7 years ago | (#20488127)

I o not know why people always go for the less polished distros, like ubuntu, over something supported nad stable like mandriva.

I can tell you why I switched to Kubuntu after six years with Mandr[ake,iva]:

1. 64-bits was relegated to very-low-priority (an inordinate number of supposedly-supported 64-bit packages had dependency failures)
2. A large percentage of bug reports would lie untouched not just for months, but for years. I have within the past couple of months received acknowledgements for bugs that I filed nearly two years ago -- and those acknowledgements basically came down to "this bug report is filed against a version that is no longer supported".
3. When a bug report was acknowledged in a timely manner, it was almost always to the effect of "this bug does not exist in 32-bit version; unable to test 64-bit" (or the fact that it was filed against 64-bit was simply ignored)
4. Official update mirrors would disappear for weeks at a time
5. Security updates would be made available weeks after exploits became known.

My experience with Kubuntu has not been painless, but I have found none of the above to be true for Kubuntu. It was with considerable reluctance that I switched, but in any case those were my reasons.

YMMV, of course (and probably does).

Re:Hopefully (2, Informative)

flyingfsck (986395) | about 7 years ago | (#20488269)

Hmm, things got decidedly better since the 2006 version. If 2008 is anythink like the 2007 Spring edition, then it will be suuuuuuupuuuuuuuurrrrb...

Re:Hopefully (3, Interesting)

mahlerfan999 (1077021) | about 7 years ago | (#20488285)

I have to agree that Mandriva's team responds to bug reports too slowly, and do not do enough to fix them. I think that is simply due to lack of man power. But they are making better and better distros since they came into being (I mean Mandriva, not Mandrake). Perhaps if they pick up popularity, they will also make more money and then they can hire enough man power to do it right. Right now though they are far away from being there. I hope to see them improve to get to see better times though.

Re:Hopefully (4, Insightful)

myowntrueself (607117) | about 7 years ago | (#20488587)

4. Official update mirrors would disappear for weeks at a time

What drove me away from Mandrake (as it was then) was that every time I wanted to install a new package I'd have to spend a couple of hours:

1. Searching for the new location for the repository. They seemed to constantly change the paths arbitrarily every few weeks or so, apparently because they 'decided' that the old path wasn't a good naming convention or something.

2. Downloading the updated package info.

In Debian/Ubuntu an apt-get update takes a little while, maybe a minute or so. In Mandrake the equivalent to apt-get update (using urpmi) would take an hour or so. On the same internet connection. Which was 100M.

I used the 'easy urpmi' site to keep track of the repositories but it was still very very slow and painful work.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

imr (106517) | about 7 years ago | (#20489733)

1. Searching for the new location for the repository. They seemed to constantly change the paths arbitrarily every few weeks or so, apparently because they 'decided' that the old path wasn't a good naming convention or something.
This is now done interactively from the package manager, you just click "add" and it gets a list of mirrors over the internet, you choose one, and your medias are automagically configured:
main + contrib + non-free which countain most of the stuff and their respective updates, backports, testing directories. (backports and testing being ignored by default without you having to configure anything).
So all this is transparent to the user now.

2. Downloading the updated package info.
there has been for years a synthesis version of this which is just a few Ko heavy.
With the procedure above, the synthesis version is chosen by defaut, you can choose by media to use or not the synthesis version. So info updates takes only a few seconds unless you really want the extra infos that are in the complete info file.

All this is of course possible from the command line too.

Re:Hopefully (2, Interesting)

flyingfsck (986395) | about 7 years ago | (#20491183)

An hour??? Obviously your setup was wrong. The Mandriva update mechanism is the same idea as the Ubuntu one - updates are done from world-wide mirrors, so if it is configured right then it cannot be any better or worse than Ubuntu.

Weeks after exploits available? I call BS (3, Informative)

vdanen (224322) | about 7 years ago | (#20489263)

5. Security updates would be made available weeks after exploits became known.

Care to provide some proof on that one? A general and very broad statement like that calls for some proof to back it up.

Unless you're referring to the kernel itself (which there were issues with, due to a certain kernel developer that's no longer with Mandriva), most (and I do say most... there are exceptions, just like any other distribution unless you're using Gentoo and can emerge the latest upstream version the moment it's released) updates were released in a very timely manner. Unless it was a "0-day" vulnerability, updates from Mandriva are more often than not released within ~24hrs of other major vendors if not earlier.

I'd love to get some proof on this one.

Re:Hopefully (2, Insightful)

quadfour (712978) | about 7 years ago | (#20489627)

You've described my experience with Mandriva exactly. Numerous bug reports just ignored. Being verbally belittled when trying to shed light on issues (even though I was a contributor).

It is far from a polished distro, and is leagues behind any other major distro due to the aforementioned issues IMO.

Re:Hopefully (1)

imr (106517) | about 7 years ago | (#20489853)

About the bug reporting problem, this problem has been adressed the last months by Adam who posted this news.
He has set up a team to go through all bugs and clean up the base, and they now follow all new bugs so that they don't leave reports unanswered, forgotten or unsolved. They also take care of the reporter side, whenever people need to be asked for details or tests.
There is also a new bugzilla, much quicker, setup by vdanen iirc.

So yes, there has been problems, but there is also a strong will to do what it's right to correct them, and there are some fine persons over there to do it. Don't take what you experienced then for granted.

Stay Away From My Bum, Mister... (-1, Troll)

MightyMartian (840721) | about 7 years ago | (#20487999)

It's still a gay-sounding name, the sort of operating system you expect to find in certain bath houses.

Re:Stay Away From My Bum, Mister... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488021)

ah a gay joke, didn't see that coming

Re:Stay Away From My Bum, Mister... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488035)

It's still a gay-sounding name, the sort of operating system you expect to find in certain bath houses.

Very funny. I got a good laugh out of that comparison today at school on the playground too.

Re:Stay Away From My Bum, Mister... (2, Funny)

MightyMartian (840721) | about 7 years ago | (#20488611)

At least you weren't modded a troll by the no-humor idiots who seem to get all the mod points these days.

My complaint still stands. It's a lousy name for a distro. Not that Ubuntu is much better.

Re:Stay Away From My Bum, Mister... (1)

larry bagina (561269) | about 7 years ago | (#20488177)

I guess that's why no one uses it ... gnu/hippies hate to take baths.

The popularity of NSA bathroom sex linux is surprising, though.

Mandriva (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488003)

"The Gay Linux"


Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488057)


so fuck*ng what... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488081)

Nobody cares about their release candidates. All six Mandriva users prefer "stable" releases.

RC is the new pre-alpha? (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488129)

major new features (some of which are not yet implemented in this release candidate)

How does that work?

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (3, Insightful)

man_of_mr_e (217855) | about 7 years ago | (#20488439)

Yeah, I don't get it either.

Release cycles have changed a lot in the last 10 years or so. With the advent of iterative software development cycles, you can often times get betas that are not feature complete (the idea is to test the iteration cycles that are complete) but a release candidate should be feature complete most definitely.

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (5, Informative)

pieleric (917714) | about 7 years ago | (#20488445)

I'm using this version right now and the only listed feature that seem missing is the hybrid suspend mode. IIRC, this feature is mostly implemented but there is still a little more work required. All the other features seem already here, excepted of course gnome 2.20 which is currently 2.19.92!

So, no this is not a pre-alpha version ;-)

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | about 7 years ago | (#20488453)

Simple, they integrate new features but they won't make it available. For example, Firefox 3.0alpha has the possibility of page zooming, the problem is that there is no interface to control it. -.-

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (1)

Goaway (82658) | about 7 years ago | (#20488465)

Well, since "alpha" turned into "beta" and "beta" turned into "release candidate", I guess it's only to be expected that the process would continue. I wonder what new category we will need to make up next.

I nominate "gold master" for the new "beta"!

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20489161)

The marketroid mindset is increasingly prevalent in the open-source world these days. Mozilla publishes misleading statistics in their press releases and drops features to meet deadlines. Slackware skips version numbers to "keep up" with the competition. And people abuse the terms "alpha", "beta" and "release candidate" to mean what they want them to mean [] rather than something sensible.

People who are thinking of labelling something a "release candidate", ask yourselves one question: if major new bugs aren't found with it, would you be comfortable simply renaming it to be the final version? No? Then it isn't a release candidate!

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (1)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489847)

As I mentioned, in our defense, we've been doing it this way for *years*. Mandriva - ahead of the curve as always! ;)

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20491099)

Slackware skips version numbers to "keep up" with the competition.

Yeah, but wasn't that done as a joke?

Re:RC is the new pre-alpha? (2, Informative)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489449)

Honestly, I've been copying and pasting the same release announcement since Beta 1 and I forgot to take that bit out. :)

Almost everything on that page is now included. However, it's true to say that Mandriva RCs are not really true release candidates - they're not builds that we honestly believe could be the final release unless someone finds a bug (well, the *last* one usually is, for 2007 Spring that was RC3, for instance). They should really be considered more as late betas. We didn't even hit version freeze yet (it's tomorrow). It's always been this way with MDV, it's a bit odd but we're used to it...:)

I tried Mandriva Linux 2008 RC 1, and it sucks (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488145)

Use this [] instead.

I just noticed something (1, Insightful)

FoolsGold (1139759) | about 7 years ago | (#20488167)

There's as much flaming for Mandriva as there is for Windows.

Not only do you HAVE to be a part of the Linux camp, but only for certain distros too it would seem. Slashdot really has gone backwards.

Re:I just noticed something (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488213)

WTF are you talking about? Where is the flaming for Mandriva?

Re:I just noticed something (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488379)

Selective perception. We remember negative posts more vividly, especially if they attack our positions.

Re:I just noticed something (2, Funny)

betterunixthanunix (980855) | about 7 years ago | (#20488221)

Welcome to UbuntuDot/SlashHat.

Re:I just noticed something (1)

Ironchew (1069966) | about 7 years ago | (#20488363)

More like iSlash/Googledot.

Re:I just noticed something (1)

baeksu (715271) | about 7 years ago | (#20490201)

That's GNU/UbuntuDot/SlashHat to you, mister!

Re:I just noticed something (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488371)

Welcome to group think. Also, if you don't toe the line, your opinion is inversely proportional to your user id.

Re:I just noticed something (1)

UncleTogie (1004853) | about 7 years ago | (#20489521)

...only if you believe in such...

Re:I just noticed something (1)

$pace6host (865145) | about 7 years ago | (#20488695)

I think you might be exaggerating a bit. /. hates Windows a whole lot more than it hates Mandriva. But it's not surprising that /. opinions reflect what [] says - Ubuntu is #1 and Mandriva is #9. I just switched myself - Mandriva has been good from a user perspective, but has had repository / update problems in recent years. Maybe this will signal a turn around, but I'm probably not going to switch back unless I hear the repository problems are gone.

Re:I just noticed something (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488923)

I think it's just that a lot of us were burned by mandrake, back in the day.

Re:I just noticed something (1)

Jah-Wren Ryel (80510) | about 7 years ago | (#20489417)

I think it's just that a lot of us were burned by mandrake, back in the day.
Indeed, burn me once, flame on you.
Burn me twice, I'm going ubuntu!

Re:I just noticed something (1)

TheVelvetFlamebait (986083) | about 7 years ago | (#20489901)

I've just noticed something myself. Your account number is in the 1000000+ range, and you've made only 8 comments (at the time of my reading). Exactly what time period are you referring to when you say "Slashdot has really gone backwards"?

Crikey (5, Funny)

werdz (1150775) | about 7 years ago | (#20488417)

I read the headline first as "Microsoft Linux 2008 RC 1 Released" and nearly spat my tea out at my screen...

Re:Crikey (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488639)

Well, you obviously need to see an eye doctor ASAP!

Re:Crikey (1)

rts008 (812749) | about 7 years ago | (#20490765)


Now I have to go scrub my brain with bleach!

I hope this don't cause The Nightmares again. *pictures Bill Gates in a Tux, handing Penguin chairs (yes, also in Tuxes) to Steve Ballmer, who was....NOOOO!! Make It Stop!!!*

Yeah, maybe if I dilute the bleach with lye...that'll work!

We use it for a reason (0, Flamebait)

mackermacker (250587) | about 7 years ago | (#20488499)

Some of us have been using Mandriva since back in the day when the conversion happened (think Mandrake, not like any noobs remember that ol' thing). Mandrake was always Redhat on steroids. Mandriva followed the same path. It had so many apps that could be configured, easily, via [] . I run 4 linux distros, and I still like Mandriva. Debian and Suse fanboys, what's your rational? Some people like rpm package management, others apt-get. Fine, fair enough, to each his own. NO, I don't like the French either. And yes, mandriva has some serios issues when it comes to wireless cards (ndiswrappwer DOES NOT work unless you compile from source with almost any car other than a BCM4xxx chipset). Overall though, they do a decent job, unlike debian, which doesnt have all the apts available, and its a bitch to get the network set up on an alienware SLI graphics card setup. I won't defend the French, but fanboys piss me off.

Re:We use it for a reason (1)

jstomel (985001) | about 7 years ago | (#20488925)

Gods, I've been with Mandriva since it was Mandrake 8.0. It's still the best distro out there, with the possible exception of ubuntu. Mandriva makes linux painless. It is the anti-slackware.

Re:We use it for a reason (1)

AJWM (19027) | about 7 years ago | (#20489007)

Mandrake was always Redhat on steroids.

Yeah, with some of the analogous stability issues. That said, though, it was Mandrake that I recommended to a client when we were building some DV applications for them; Mandrake was the first distro to include the IEEE 1394 (Firewire) drivers, so at least I didn't have to walk them through rebuilding a kernel.

Re:We use it for a reason (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20489115)

We used to use Mandrake at our small business. About a dozen or so systems between servers and desktops. Once we saw Kubuntu Edgy (now Feisty) and how well it worked on the desktop, we switched and haven't looked back. Mandrake is a very good distribution, but there are some hassles. Kde updates were slow to appear, online repositories were questionably reliable (we had to switch them occasionally as they became overloaded or quit updating), and other things. Finally, the merger of Mandrake and Connectiva seemed to slow them down even further, in terms of updates. I do hope Mandriva gets back in the saddle, so to speak. They remain one of the few distros that do a half-decent job of supporting KDE.

Re:We use it for a reason (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20489165)

NO, I don't like the French either.

  It's a good thing you didn't disavow racial hatred, otherwise we'd think you weren't cool.

Re:We use it for a reason (5, Insightful)

ladislavb (551945) | about 7 years ago | (#20489345)

NO, I don't like the French either.

This one sentence made your entire post utterly infantile. You don't like an entire nation??? Has every single person out of 60 million Frenchmen done something nasty to you so that you dislike them all?

Sorry for being off-topic, but I'll just never be able to understand how a rational, intelligent and Linux-using human being can make such statements of hatred on a public blog, which proudly displays his/her nickname and web site. Crazy...

Re:We use it for a reason (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20490825)

To be fair, he could be posting his disagreement with the French government, rather than the French people.

After all, when people make the same generalizations about "Americans", that's the only way it makes any sense, and I don't see people getting modded up acting indignant about it. And I KNOW there would never be a double standard on Slashdot...

Re:We use it for a reason (1)

flyingfsck (986395) | about 7 years ago | (#20491227)

Half of Mandriva is based in Brazil, so you don't like the Porras either?

wouldn't load for me (1)

BigGuy (8256) | about 7 years ago | (#20488523)

Mandriva wasn't able to deal with my setup of a dual boot with Vista, Mepis and Kubuntu. It wanted to format the hard drive. Obviously this wont work. I had tryed the previous live version and was hoping this would work with wifi enabled on my laptop (hpPavilion dv9500) no luck with any of the distro's so far. Intel 4965 chipset.

Re:wouldn't load for me (1)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489491)

2008 should work with that chipset (we have the iwl4965 driver included in the kernel). I *think* it ought to work in RC1, but I'm not entirely sure. Give the live version a shot when it comes out.

Re:wouldn't load for me (1)

Zero__Kelvin (151819) | about 7 years ago | (#20489649)

"Mandriva wasn't able to deal with my setup of a dual boot with Vista, Mepis and Kubuntu. It wanted to format the hard drive."
Mandriva 2008, like every version of Mandriva*, offers the option to format the drive, use an existing Windows partition, or partition the drive yourself, including on the fly NTFS (et. Al.) partition resizing. * The caveat is that you should only do it this way if you are a skilled Linux person, and you should not use the "Install from Live CD" option. It is known to work poorly. Download the 4 CD set or the single DVD .iso and install from that. On older Laptops you may need to pass "acpi=off noapic" to the kernel at boot time during the install if it hangs without them. And by the way, what you described is a TRIPLE-boot

Less advanced users should purchase one of the Powerpack or similar versions.

When I install Mandriva on a persons computer, they invariably are the happiest computer owners I have ever met, laptop or desktop. When someone who doesn't know the ins and outs of setting up the wireless card, how to install the dvdcss and win32 codecs (or indeed even that they need to), and graphics card issues with NVIDIA and ATI proprietary drivers tries to do it on the cheap, they get what they paid for, then they complain about Mandriva instead of citing their inexperience. Again, because it bears repeating, if you are not a highly skilled Linux person, buy the correct Mandriva version for your needs. If you try to do it on the cheap, make sure that you blame *yourself* rather than Mandriva when you cannot play FLASH, use Java, or connect with a wireless card, etc.

Finally for advanced Linux users new to Mandriva you need to know about the alt.os.linux.mandriva newsgroup and the Penguin Liberation Front repository [] which makes it easy to add the plf-free and plf-non-free repositories to your URPMI tools config file, etc.

Try it. You will like it. Either that or you ignored my advice, or you misclassified yourself as advanced when you really need to shell out the Cashish.

The truth hurts (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20488545)

1999 called, they want their distro back.

Also the 1980s called, they want their joke templates back.

Also 1978 called, my mother is considering not getting pregnant after this disappointed display of tact. Sorry Mum, I would normally write more about how no one uses Mandrake anymore and reference distro statistics and the ugly desktop and how they don't involve the community like ubuntu or fedora but I can't be bothered with that and a dumb joke will have to do.

Truth is Stability works for most people (1)

Simple-Simmian (710342) | about 7 years ago | (#20488929)

Mandriva is stable, if stability is a 1999 concept then I am all for it. I want an OS that just works. Mandriva satisfies that requirement for me.

Actually (2, Insightful)

obeythefist (719316) | about 7 years ago | (#20488547)

I like that they've called the product "2008"... in the larger OS world, where Linux is still a little fringey compared to Windows, anchoring the product to a time instead of a more abstract version number will make less savvy end users more comfortable with their understanding of the product.

This is a good move! More FOSS products aiming at the mass market should consider adopting a similar approach!

Re:Actually (2, Funny)

MightyMartian (840721) | about 7 years ago | (#20488655)

I like that they've called the product "2008"... in the larger OS world, where Linux is still a little fringey compared to Windows, anchoring the product to a time instead of a more abstract version number will make less savvy end users more comfortable with their understanding of the product.

This is a good move! More FOSS products aiming at the mass market should consider adopting a similar approach!

Agreed. We should put chrome condoms on and run around declaring "I'm the Big Meat 2008!"

Fuck, but I hate marketers.

Re:Actually (1)

jombeewoof (1107009) | about 7 years ago | (#20488975)

Agreed that marketing people need to be shot. But maybe only in the leg. They do serve some purpose, even if they are total scum.

Think about it, if it weren't for some kind of marketing how would anyone know about anything?

Word of mouth? I don't think so. you can only get so many people talking about something they have never heard of, and you still have to get them to use it before they'll talk about it.

Taking only a non marketed approach would certainly get you a much smaller more community oriented group, but you would not have the full spectrum of users. You would have power users, and only power users.
If things were that way, we'd still be in 1998 and then where would we (the linux community) be?

Re:Actually (1)

obeythefist (719316) | about 7 years ago | (#20489079)

Hate them all you like, put them on the "B" Ark, whatever, but marketing makes or breaks a product and we all know it.

Look at Linux, it's free, it's competitive, but it's not marketed and it's not marketing driven, and you can tell by looking at it. It's starting to change, but the fact of the matter remains.

People do not want unmarketable products.

Re:Actually (0, Flamebait)

MightyMartian (840721) | about 7 years ago | (#20489135)

People do not want unmarketable products.

People are retarded rubes. That's why they deserved poisoned toys and toothpaste from China. Perhaps someday they'll throw all the marketers in the world in a boat and send them off to some far off land where evil liars are loved.

Re:Actually (2, Informative)

setagllib (753300) | about 7 years ago | (#20489317)

Ubuntu does this too, where 7.04 means "month 4 of year 2007". It's not very obvious.

Re:Actually (1)

garett_spencley (193892) | about 7 years ago | (#20489765)

Ubuntu does this too, where 7.04 means "month 4 of year 2007". It's not very obvious.

You're right it's not obvious. I'm an old time Linux nerd who has worked as a *nix admin and reads /. on a daily basis etc. I know way more about Linux and *nix than most 'average users' would ever care to. I've been running Ubuntu for a few months now as all the hype got me really curious and I wanted to see just what kind of "inroads" they had been making on the desktop that has everyone talking.

Your post is what informed me that their version numbers were done this way.

Whether you agree with the parent or not regarding naming versions after dates aside, the fact that 7.04 translates to "April 2007" does not have a remotely similar effect and is absolutely no different, to end users, than any other major.minor versioning scheme.

I pretend mod your post +1 Informative and, at the same time, -1 Irrelevant.

Re:Actually (1)

rubycodez (864176) | about 7 years ago | (#20490117)

that's really going to get confusing when the year 3000 hits. like, do they go 1000.04, or do they suddenly kick in the millenium number like 999.10 -> 3000.04 Hope they get the patches for dist-update for this out in time

Re:Actually (1)

rubycodez (864176) | about 7 years ago | (#20490147)

and more importantly, what adjective and animal will that release be?

Re:Actually (3, Informative)

imr (106517) | about 7 years ago | (#20489619)

anchoring the product to a time
You are so right. And it was really thought as a representation of the technical reality and timeline of the distro, not for pure marketing reasons.
Here is the complete story that is behind this names, if that interrests you...

The naming convention came from the switch to a one year release cycle for the 2006.
Since the distro was going to be there for one year, and since most of this year was going to be 2006, it made more sense to call it 2006 and have it called 2006 for 3 months in 2005 than the other way around.
The decision to switch to a one year cycle came from users requests for more stability.

Unfortunatly, this move, despite having been made at the users requests, wasnt a popular success. Just read the comments on this page and you will see that a lot of people want the last version of many apps as soon as possible. Which has some sense in the free software world where some apps just move so fast and sometimes a newer version means more stability.
So with the 2007.0 the distro came back to a 6 months cycle.

But some aspects of the one year cycle remained in order to have the best of both world and again, it had to be reflected in the naming convention.

So, 6 months later the 2007.1 was built from the 2007.0 with no revolutionnary change to its foundations (like kernel, glib, gcc) but instead with many improvements and polishings in the desktops, fixing all those little bugs that were so irritating with every mandrake/mandriva release up to now, and a lot of work has been put into improving the existing mandriva tools, like the package manager and now the connexion manager.
So the 2007.1 was a really stable yet up to date distro.

Another nice aspect of the distro since that time is the backporting infrastructure.
Since the distro was going to stay for one year, in 2006 a lot of work has been put into making the softwares from the development version available easily to the previous version of the distro through a process that should not be a burden for the contributors. So the distro was back to a 6 months cycle, but this infrastructure was and is still there, and now important fast evolving apps like firefox can be backported quicker, which was one of the complaints made often to the distro. (You can see the importance of backporting in MEPIS recent swith to debian).

So all this led to chosing a name that would convey the fact that the 2007.1 was very close to the 2007.0, an evolution in time: "2007 spring".

Take all that with a grain of salt, I'm managing the Mandriva french forums for Mandriva, but I'm coming from the mandriva community and it really is my distro of choice.

Happy Mandriva Desktop user here. (1)

Simple-Simmian (710342) | about 7 years ago | (#20488917)

I have been using Mandrake now Mandriva since way back in the day (before 7.2) and I value stability, I have run plenty of other distros but my Main desktop machine has been a Mandriva Box. 2007.1 is a great release, as good as my bench mark 9.2 was. 2008 may be as good. Since I use KDE and value stability I will stick with 2007.1 for a while on my main desktop. 2008 will go on an older machine. If it works well it will go on my Wife machine which is running Mahdriva 2006 and my secondary computer. IF you want bleeding edge you can get that from the cooker if you want stability you can get that from the Main distribution. Mandriva has improved a lot in the last two years. They are still French and all that entails but they have got much better and are almost back up to the level they were at in the Mandrake haydays. Mandriva just works for me.

Re:Happy Mandriva Desktop user here. (1)

flyingfsck (986395) | about 7 years ago | (#20491211)

France/Brazil actually, but Adam lives in Vancouver, eh!

Got Torrents?? (1)

RobertLTux (260313) | about 7 years ago | (#20489011)

Or a mirror with some bandwidth (distrib-coffee is downish)

Re:Got Torrents?? (2, Informative)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489673)

Where are you?

In North America, I'd recommend mandrivalinux/devel/iso/2008.0/ [] . In South America, 8.0/ [] . In Europe, drivaLinux/devel/iso/2008.0/ [] , or x/devel/iso/2008.0/ [] if that one's slow.

We don't do torrents for beta releases as the demand is not usually high enough to warrant it - the FTP mirrors usually cope with the demand easily.

Not trying to bash mandriva here (1)

Orthuberra (1145497) | about 7 years ago | (#20489097)

But why is this on here, stuff like this is meant for distrowatch and linux.orgs news. If we had a news bulletin for every rc, beta, and official release, we'd be drowning in news items. already has 1-3 new release bulletins a day, and with 3-400 Linux distros out there, on top of the OS releases, we'd be drowning in threads.
I can only troll so much.

Re:Not trying to bash mandriva here (1)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489513)

They don't print a story for every rc, beta and official release. I should know, I've submitted a story for every 2008 beta / RC and this is the first one that got accepted. :D I think it depends on which editor reviews the story...and how nice they're feeling. It generally works out that I get a story printed for one pre-release and the final release for each cycle, which I think is about right in terms of not over-flooding. Of course, Ubuntu get a story posted every time they sneeze. Sigh.

Re:Not trying to bash mandriva here (1)

rubycodez (864176) | about 7 years ago | (#20489921)

mandrake -> mandriva is trying to come back after years of problems, so maybe this is a little more newsworthy than every point version increment of other distros. Mandrake was good awhile back, then with the problems I've since gone elsewhere (Debian for servers and Ubuntu for my desktop & laptop). Hope they come back to their former glory

For all those who haven't tried Mandriva lately (4, Informative)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20489645)

For all those who haven't tried Mandriva in a while, quite a lot has changed. It'd be great if you could try Mandriva again before posting comments. For instance, managing remote repositories is far easier than it used to be: you can configure a full set of official repositories from within the Mandriva package management tools. Instructions are at lling_and_removing_software#Making_more_applicatio ns_available [] .

We've made big improvements in overall polish and stability since the releases that many people remember badly (2005, 2006). 2007 Spring looks much better, has far fewer package quality problems and runs more stably than those releases on most systems. 2008 will be better again, there's been a lot of work done on improving overall package quality, and it includes a very good and recent kernel build with very good hardware support. For instance, we have probably the best graphics card detection and configuration system in a major distro. I'm pretty sure that 99% of cards from major manufacturers (Intel, NVIDIA, ATI) will be correctly detected and configured in 2008. Our support for VIA / S3 (Uni)chrome chips (which are used on VIA's popular mini-ITx motherboards, for e.g.) is better than any other major distro to my knowledge.

Since 2007 Spring, we have a public non-free repository (that is configured when you set up repositories following the instructions above), so it's easy for anyone to get stuff like the NVIDIA and ATI proprietary drivers, Intel wireless firmware, Sun Java and so on. For instance, for the NVIDIA / ATI drivers, just enable the repository and then re-run the graphics card configuration tool, and it will give you the option of using the proprietary driver.

Since 2007, we have official /backports repositories (in 2007 Spring and later, these are configured when you set up repositories, but not enabled by default for stability; you can enable them with a single click in the repository configuration tool). These contain up-to-date versions of popular applications. For instance, the 2007 Spring /backports repositories have amaroK 1.4.7, Compiz Fusion (0.5.2), VirtualBox 1.5.0, k3b 1.0.3, pidgin 2.0.1 (will update to 2.1 soon), avant-window-navigator latest SVN, brasero 0.6.0, deluge, gimmie 0.2.7, jokosher 0.9, mediatomb 0.10.0, miro, ntfs-3g 1.516, powertop 1.3, seamonkey 1.1.4, smplayer 0.5.21, tovid 0.30, transmission 0.72 and a *huge* amount of other updated packages (these are just some examples I picked). These are not officially supported, but they *are* built in a clean environment on the official Mandriva buildsystem and all built against each other, so they represent a contiguous set of packages that you will never have trouble using together, which is far better than the case on many other distributions where you have to use dozens of single-purpose or tiny third party repositories that are unofficial, not necessarily cleanly built, and often conflict with each other. There's a couple of other distros with /backports repositories to my knowledge, including Ubuntu, but Mandriva's are far bigger than any other distro and include far more useful packages.

so, yes, Mandriva is changing, quite a lot in fact. It'd be great if you'd give us another chance with 2008, read up on the forums - [] - and the Wiki - [] - and see if your issues aren't improved.

On the Bugzilla situation - N7DR is not at all wrong in his criticism as it relates to earlier times. During the 2008 release cycle, we created a Bug Squad and I was appointed Bugmaster. The Bug Squad now triages all bugs reported, which has helped immensely with the response rate and time for newer issues. There have also been some maintainership changes which have meant that certain major distro components (KDE and the kernel, for instance) are now more responsive to bug reports.

Re:For all those who haven't tried Mandriva lately (1)

mgkimsal2 (200677) | about 7 years ago | (#20490097)

We've made big improvements in overall polish and stability since the releases that many people remember badly (2005, 2006). 2007 Spring looks much better, has far fewer package quality problems and runs more stably than those releases on most systems.

A problem with this is, and you probably are already aware, is that the 2005 release was touted as 'polished' and 'stable' and 'greatly improved' at the time as well. We've heard the spin before, and it'll probably take another couple releases before you win people back from Ubuntu and Fedora and whatever else people migrated to. Mandrake/Mandriva lost me in '05 (and I tried the '06 and '07 as well) for a few reasons.

1. Cutting edge packages were more readily available on other distros (php5, etc.).
2. To rectify #1, I tried to join the "club" on multiple occasions, and they could never process my US-based credit card. :(
3. Flaky admin tools. Every release we get more perl and python based GTK crap that is just broken out of the box. The *feel* of those tools was/is just horrid. Very nice to look at, but painful once you use them in the real world.

I've got a family member who's still with mandriva, and based on his view of '08, I might give it another shot, but there's little incentive to switch from kubuntu these days. The admin interfaces don't suck, I don't have to join a club, and the bulk of the current/new software I want is packaged for that distro.

Good luck with the Mandriva stuff though!

Re:For all those who haven't tried Mandriva lately (2, Informative)

AdamWill (604569) | about 7 years ago | (#20490329)

Well, let me give you more concrete examples, then - during the 2008 development cycle, I personally have gone through and rebuilt almost every package (there's a few which simply can't be built any more, but over 95%) in the main repository with a mdk* release tag (indicating that it hasn't been built since Mandriva 2006 or earlier) or a 2007.0* release tag (indicating it hasn't been built since Mandriva 2007), making sure they build, run, and are compliant with our current packaging policies. This has never been done for any previous release. I'm hoping to get quite a lot of the 2007.1* packages (those that haven't been built since 2007 Spring) before we ship, too.

As I wrote in the post to which you're replying, we provide up-to-date packages in the /backports repositories. These aren't part of the Club, they're alongside all the other public repositories on the official mirror sites. The Club is not really used for providing packages any more, except for a very few packages that are non-free and that we cannot legally redistribute to the general public for license reasons (the most significant here are Flash and Acrobat Reader). You absolutely don't have to join the Club to use Mandriva: apart from that small group of packages, everything is available to non-Club members.

The admin tools are written in perl for a couple of reasons: it's what our coders know, it works, and we have a rather neat system which lets us write the tools once and have them work in both graphical and console (curses-based) mode. Rewriting them all in some other language and toolkit would be a lot of work for no real return.

I find they generally work pretty well. If you find problems in them, please do file bug reports. We do fix the bugs, honest. :)

Thanks for the good luck wishes.

Re:For all those who haven't tried Mandriva lately (1)

Growlor (772763) | about 7 years ago | (#20490291)

I've been a Madrake/Madriva user off and on since version 6.0. Its the only commercial Linux distro I've used and most of the time I've been happy with it. When I went to select a Linux distro for my wife's notebook, I tried Ubuntu, Fedora and Suse's open release, but ended-up with Mandriva open (since I couldn't get any of the others to work with the wireless in it.) She has been pretty happy with it overall (the one issue was the lack of a power down option in the shutdown menu on the 64 bit version of 2007 open.) I liked it well enough to buy a full copy of 2007 for my PC (its what I am using now) and will likely get a copy of 2008 when it comes out. If I have one thing I'd ask you guys to look at it's your support and reference options on your web site. I don't know if its just me, but I have always struggled with finding things on your web site - something about the way things are organized just seems different than other web sites (maybe its a French language thing that doesn't translate well?)

Hold the Front Page (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20489713)

A second tier linux distribution have announced a release candidate! The final version could be out in a couple of months!

Stop the fucking presses!

Re:Hold the Front Page (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20491257)

Sorry but it will be out no later than October. Mandriva is pretty damn slick truth be told.

Are these guys still in business ??? (1)

HW_Hack (1031622) | about 7 years ago | (#20490001)

I guess at least they haven't capitulated to Bill the Beast Master

Mandriva is the best yet (1)

MichailS (923773) | about 7 years ago | (#20491003)

I'm not an expert, but I have tried a dozen different distros in many version numbers over the last 9 years, and I keep coming back to Mandrake/iva (and Windows 2000). All end up broken within a week. Last time I tried, ubuntu kept throwing out my nvidia drivers between reboots, and I could not get it to record sound through the TV card from a VHS player.

Mandriva is the most polished and user friendly of all I have seen. It is not perfect, sometimes apps crash and I keep finding coredumps in strange places, but Drakxconf makes me forgive a lot. It's what Windows Control Panel should have been.

Some complain about package repositories. They do tend to disappear and you will have to check the box for another instead. Big deal. also, I have yet to encounter a generic RPM or tarball that has not worked well enough on Mandriva. If there were no Mandriva version of a software, any Red Hat or Fedora usually did the trick. I have had more problems with .deb than with .rpm over the years.
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