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Germany Says Copying of DVDs, CDs Is Verboten

Zonk posted more than 7 years ago | from the you-own-nothing-you-hear-me dept.

The Courts 230

Billosaur writes "In what can only be seen as the opening salvo in an attempt to control what users can do with content, the German parliament has approved a controversial copyright law which will make it illegal to make copies of CDs and DVDs, even for personal use. The Bundesrat, the upper part of the German parliament, approved the legislation over the objections of consumer protection groups. The law is set to take effect in 2008, and covers CDs, DVDs, recordings from IPTV, and TV recordings." A few folks have noted that this story is incorrect. The original link seems to be down now anyway. Sorry.

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In the words of a famous 'german'.. (3, Funny)

Czar the Bizarre (841811) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704133)

i see noooothing, i hear nooothing !!

Re:In the words of a famous 'german'.. (2, Funny)

ShatteredArm (1123533) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704801)

I think auf Deutsch it would be, "I see nussing, I hear nussing!"

Re:In the words of a famous 'german'.. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704951)

Loosely translated, nussing in Danish means something along the lines of stroking...

Re:In the words of a famous 'german'.. (0, Offtopic)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706029)

i see noooothing, i hear nooothing !!

dude, you're playing the label side.

oh wait, its safer that way. carry on, then!

Better hurry then (4, Funny)

jtroutman (121577) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704141)

That gives you three months to make all the copies you're going to need.

what about copying comments? (5, Insightful)

stoolpigeon (454276) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704161)

The author does not report the facts. The law does not prohibit the copying of DVDs or CDs; it disallows the circumvention of anti-copying technologies like Macrovision et al., something that has been illegal in the US for a decade. The law specifically allows users to make backups of DVD and CD movies, software and music and other digital content for their own archives and to use/play on alternate devices (i.e., ripping movies to your hard drive to watch on a DVR or other device, ripping music to play on an ipod or other device, etc.). These specifically-named consumer rights are actually broader than those granted by law to American consumers. I am not sure what the author relied upon for his translation of the law, but I can assure you that it does nothing like what he suggests.

Re:what about copying comments? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704257)

How fucking dare you suggest that Zonk or his ass-buddy K Dawson might possibly have no clue what they are "editing"? Do you work for Microsoft or something?

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

stoolpigeon (454276) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704427)

Actually - I wasn't suggesting that at all. This is a nice way to end the day - with a chuckle. I'm gonna go eat dinner and count the moments to tonight's Avatar episode.

Re:what about copying comments? (2, Informative)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704291)

The author does not report the facts. The law does not prohibit the copying of DVDs or CDs; it disallows the circumvention of anti-copying technologies like Macrovision et al., something that has been illegal in the US for a decade. The law specifically allows users to make backups of DVD and CD movies, software and music and other digital content for their own archives and to use/play on alternate devices (i.e., ripping movies to your hard drive to watch on a DVR or other device, ripping music to play on an ipod or other device, etc.). These specifically-named consumer rights are actually broader than those granted by law to American consumers. I am not sure what the author relied upon for his translation of the law, but I can assure you that it does nothing like what he suggests.

Different countries, different customs. The British Constitution allowes Parliament (not the funk group) to change laws as it sees fit. Not so rigid as the U.S. Constitution.

But by your subject I thought this post was going to be about "Copying Comments", which, oh hold on, someone at the door...

[NO CARRIER]

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

Mister_IQ (517505) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706383)

Thanks for a belly laugh. I read "(not the funk group)" and went off into my own little world of reverie, picturing a world where George Clinton made laws as he wanted...

Re:what about copying comments? (5, Informative)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704365)

"The law does not prohibit the copying of DVDs or CDs; it disallows the circumvention of anti-copying technologies like Macrovision et al.,"
So exactly how does one make a copy of a movie to their hard drive without circumventing De-CSS?
Seems like the DMCA to me.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

Sloppy (14984) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704963)

Copy the key along with the cyphertext.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

Hatta (162192) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704977)

You can copy the encrypted .vob to your hard disk without circumventing CSS. You just can't view it.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

0p7imu5_P2im3 (973979) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705069)

So that basically means that copying movies is legal in both countries (US and Germany). Of course this is assuming you are using media large enough to hold the original, which is not free, but cheap today.

Re:what about copying comments? (0)

gnuman99 (746007) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704999)

Why not just copy the DVD bit-for-bit? That would not circumvent DeCSS and still in any player. You do not need to de-scramble to copy.

Re:what about copying comments? (3, Informative)

whoever57 (658626) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705071)

Why not just copy the DVD bit-for-bit? That would not circumvent DeCSS and still in any player. You do not need to de-scramble to copy.
DVD burners cannot presently copy the keys that are required for the players to decrypt the data. The keys are on a different part of the disk. I seem to recall a story about changes to the DVD licenses that would allow burners to be sold that are capable of copying the keys.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706159)

what crack are you smoking? i've been able to make a copy of my dvd's for atleast the last 5 years.

Re:what about copying comments? (1, Informative)

ceroklis (1083863) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706343)

This is wrong. What you describe is true for Blu -Ray and HD-DVD, not for DVD which could always be copied bit for bit (as long as you had a dual-layer burner if necessary).

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

dunkelfalke (91624) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705167)

not all dvds are encrypted.

Re:what about copying comments? (2, Insightful)

DaedalusHKX (660194) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706107)

I actually lost any desire to waste time on pirating or even really purchasing that much "dvd content" years back.

Last DVD I burned or even "decrypted" was Gentoo 7.0 DVD... I even used that verboten technology "bittorent" to download it... aren't I the evil sophtwarez pirat3, eh? (For those of you not in the know, bittorent copies of Gentoo Linux are actually the only way the Gentoo foundation distributes their Linux DVDs.)

The irony is that the government clamped down on any form of usage, preservation, backup or , so I went and bought the books instead, and stopped wasting time with their movies. (I'm in the USA... I think we're ahead on "clampdown", Germany and the UK are only now catching up with the USA in draconian software / copyright law.) All that posturing your parliaments and that European Union did, was only intended to make Americans look worse, but "ya'll" caught up real quick, eh?

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

Technician (215283) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705495)

So exactly how does one make a copy of a movie to their hard drive without circumventing De-CSS?

It is simple. Rip a track instead of copy the CD/DVD. Since you don't have the file structure and a bit for bit copy, you simply have a low quality facsimile. Last time I checked a low quality monochrome fax of a reduced size dollar bill (one sided) was not considered a counterfeit of the original. I would think this would apply to compressed reduced size rips for your iPod or Zen Video.

There is the possibility that an over ambitious law enforcement may try to get your low quality incomplete rip of the original to be classified as a counterfeit copy.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

jotok (728554) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705613)

When I converted my DVD collection to use with MythTV, I had to circumvent copy protection in numerous cases to get a final 2-hour high-quality (well, not too shabby) MPEG.

My other option was to simply make a 7-gig copy of the entire disc, which also preserves surround sound, menus, and so forth.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

normuser (1079315) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705643)

dd if=/dev/dvd of=/where-ever-you-want/movie-name.iso

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

Rutulian (171771) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706223)

You just copy it to the hard disk. It will still be encrypted, but you can copy it. That's the funny thing about CSS. It is claimed to be for the prevention of piracy, but in fact it does no such thing. I can rip a thousand copies to my hard disk and distribute them to all my friends. All I need is a licensed player, like PowerDVD, to decrypt the stream and play it for me.

Re:what about copying comments? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706239)

Well, this is probably the implementation of the EUCD directive in germany which was
inspired by the DMCA.

Re:what about copying comments? (2, Funny)

darkvizier (703808) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704475)

The law does not prohibit the copying of DVDs or CDs; it disallows the circumvention of anti-copying technologies like Macrovision et al., something that has been illegal in the US for a decade.
Ah well that's good, because as stated previously it would be completely unenforceable unless they outlaw the possession of recordable media/recording devices. But, wait - It's still nearly impossible to enforce due to privacy laws (police can't just walk into a house to check if people are circumventing copy protection) and P2P sharing over the internet, which makes it very difficult to stop the distribution of circumvention software. Oh well... time for more inefficient use of tax dollars.

Re:what about copying comments? (1)

HomelessInLaJolla (1026842) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704619)

because as stated previously it would be completely unenforceable unless they outlaw the possession of recordable media/recording devices
It took me about 1/60th of a second after reading the headline to think,"Wait, no, the headline is batied" but, in that jiffy, my thought was,"The possession of hacking software already is."

Re:what about copying comments? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704529)

The author does not report the facts. The law does not prohibit the copying of DVDs or CDs; it disallows the circumvention of anti-copying technologies

And if someone were to hold a plastic bag over your head, it is not killing you, it disallows fresh air from reaching your lungs.

If you make all possible ways of achieving a task illegal, then it is illegal to achieve that task, no matter how you wish to play with your words.

CDs (1)

Gr8Apes (679165) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706095)

But there's not a "CD" made that has DRM nor anti-copying technologies on it. They only have "flaws", like scratches, that need correction.

what about slash-pork? (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704751)

"I am not sure what the author relied upon for his translation of the law, but I can assure you that it does nothing like what he suggests."

It's called, pushing the hot buttons. And since few RTFA or anything deeper than that. It slips by easier and easier. Kind of the slashdot version of slipping an item into a bill just before voting and hoping no one will notice. And much like that the consequences are hard to get rid of.

Re:what about copying comments? (2, Insightful)

Hatta (162192) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704883)

These specifically-named consumer rights are actually broader than those granted by law to American consumers.

Just because it's not as harsh as the US's law doesn't mean it's not too harsh.

Not news. (-1, Flamebait)

Beardo the Bearded (321478) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704175)

We always knew the Germans were fascists. ;)

Now, does this law require a second or third reading or an announcement from a chancellor or something? In Canada, sometimes they'll let an lame issue get a reading just before the end of the session, or they'll send it to committee for "study".

Re:Not news. (1)

Fayn (1003629) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704337)

Fascism has nothing to do with an attempt to crack down on copyright violators. Although the methods that are being employed are, to say the least, draconian; it is not as if the act itself is being forbidden.

Re:Not news. (1)

Beardo the Bearded (321478) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704501)

I know, but there weren't any other comments yet and it was about Germany making draconian laws. I've been here for seven years and it's the closest I've come to the top... which used to be the bottom.

Oh well.

Re:Not news. (2, Informative)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704889)

Fascism has nothing to do with an attempt to crack down on copyright violators.

      No, but it does have a LOT to do with telling you what you can and can't do in the privacy of your own home.

Re:Not news. (1)

Maxo-Texas (864189) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705011)

Actually there is a pretty strong relation going back to WWII.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatism [wikipedia.org]

Historically, corporatism or corporativism (Italian: corporativismo) refers to a political or economic system in which power is given to civic assemblies that represent economic, industrial, agrarian, social, cultural, and professional groups. ...
Italian fascist corporativism
In Italian Fascism, this non-elected form of state "officializing" of every interest into the state was professed to better circumvent the marginalization of singular interests (as would allegedly happen by the unilateral end condition inherent in the democratic voting process). Corporativism would instead better recognize

Re:Not news. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706071)

hey I am german and not a fascist.

it is not funny :p

our government sucks
(I voted for the green party...)

Paging Trent Reznor (2, Funny)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704187)

You have a calling.

Let businesses fight it out (2, Interesting)

iamacat (583406) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704229)

When large companies find that their IT departments can not stage ISOs for enterprise-wide deployment, they are going to fight this law much more effectively than any music enthusiasts could.

Re:Let businesses fight it out (1)

Shados (741919) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704699)

Indeed. I can't beleive the people approving this have any experience in corporate environments... I mean, if you're really close minded and ONLY know about home use, it can semi sortoff make sense to say you HAVE to use the physical media and no copy... you're 1 person, 1 media...

But for a corporation? OH YES! I -REALLY- want the junior sysadmin running around with my multi-thousand dollar server software disks! YEEEEEEEEEES.

Re:Let businesses fight it out (2, Insightful)

raddan (519638) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706079)

No one is going to bother corporate IT people. They're not even on the RIAA/MPAA's radar, because they're copying software. And they're usually copying software that they explicitly have a license to copy for the entire organization, e.g., Windows. This is aimed directly at music and movie copying.

so what exactly are you getting ... (4, Insightful)

vlad_petric (94134) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704265)

with a CD/DVD purchase? It seems to me - a license to play the content, privately, for the lifetime of the physical medium.

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (4, Insightful)

Clay Pigeon -TPF-VS- (624050) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704465)

For that much money it better be for MY lifetime.

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (-1, Troll)

heinousjay (683506) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704591)

Why pay for it at all? Obviously, since you feel the price is too high, you should pirate it. It's your right to be entertained as you see fit, exercise it.

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704693)

Well I'll be! It's yet another heapin' helpin' of righteous indignation from heinousjay! Who would have guessed?

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (1)

idontgno (624372) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704665)

For that much money it better be for MY lifetime.

Oh my dear GOD! Don't say stuff like that! Do you really think the media pigopolists would have any qualms about making that part of the license terms finite as well?

*AA: "Yup, lifetime license."
You: "Great, decades of enjoyment."
*AA: "No, 2 years."
You: "But I'll live longer than that!"
*AA: "No, you won't. We'll see to that."

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (1)

Myopic (18616) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705889)

Mods, you got it wrong. Parent is not funny, it's insightful. Plus, the GP doesn't address the question of buying content with no physical medium.

Re:so what exactly are you getting ... (2, Insightful)

rastoboy29 (807168) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705133)

Seems to me, a physical recording.  That's it.

LICENSE MY ASS.  SHOW ME THE CONTRACT.

Grammar "Nazi" (0, Flamebait)

m1sha (1113269) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704317)

oh what a clever subject line ^

Anyway, if this couldn't have been titled "Germany Says Copying of DVDs, CDs Sind Verboten" it could have at least been "Germany Says Copying of DVDs, CDs Are Verboten". "CDs is..." just looks wrong! Bit of cross-language grammar here please?

Re:Grammar "Nazi" (1)

Zatacka (1136621) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704487)

Actually, it is correct. Just think about "Copying is Verboten" (ignoring mixing of languages), and add "of DVDs, CDs".

Re:Grammar "Nazi" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704507)

> "CDs is..." just looks wrong!

luckily it isn't "CDs is" but "copying [...] is"

correct: killing of cows and pigs is forbidden
incorrect: killing of cows and pigs are forbidden

p.s. it would be "copying [...] ist Verboten"

Re:Grammar "Nazi" (1)

jabberw0k (62554) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704523)

Headline is correct as-is. "...copying...is verboten" is correct. The prepositional phrase "of DVDs (and) CDs" does not change the singular subject ("copying") into a plural; the verb ("is") must match its subject ("copying").

Get a clue (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704581)

This would be wrong in both languages. Copying 10 million DVDs _IS_ verboten/not allowed/killing baby kittens (or in german, if you like: "DVDs zu kopieren _ist_ verboten").

Re:Grammar "Nazi" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706353)

There is a saying in german, which goes like this:
"Wenn man keine Ahnung hat, einfach mal Fresse halten."
Which means:
"If you don't have a clue, just shut your trap!"

Re:Grammar "Nazi" (1)

rection47 (1160129) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706461)

Try to know the grammar of your own language before blaming it on a translation, it is the copying that if is verboten not the CDs and DVDs that are. So you think that people should say "copying are illegal!!!!"? Try and read it a little more in depth before being a grammar nazi. no pun intended.

So sad. (5, Funny)

bi$hop (878253) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704391)

I remember the good ol' days when copying of DVDs and CDs was just farhfegnugen in Germany. Now it's verboten? Next thing you know it will be gesundheit!

Re:So sad. (1)

gardyloo (512791) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705293)

Yes, and it's making me all verklemmt. Discuss amongst yourselves.

Achtung Juden! Arbeit Macht Frei! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704535)

Heil Hitler!

Sieg Heil!

I guess I was wrong! (1)

bogaboga (793279) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704541)

You see, I thought my German friends were more pragmatic than we Americans, but this law is making me review my attitude towards them. I personally doubt it will have any effect.

That's REALLY impressive! (4, Funny)

erroneus (253617) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704607)

Clearly German legislators are less expensive than those of many other nations! I'll keep that in mind when I need to buy a new law! :)

Re:That's REALLY impressive! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705095)

Clearly German legislators are less expensive than those of many other nations! I'll keep that in mind when I need to buy a new law! :)

Please remember though that American-style "campaign contributions" won't work. Instead, promise them a cushy job on the board of one of your major corporations and you are set. It's great, you don't even have to pay right away, you can pay later when their political career is over.

Re:That's REALLY impressive! (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705839)

The campaign contributions is just PART of the deal... the cushy jobs is American fare as well. Just look at how many times Dick Cheney has worked for Haliburton and Monsanto and back to the government again... back and fourth. And he's not the only one who has been playing those rotations either.

Yes, they can CLAIM that since they are not employed by those companies that there is no conflict of interest or any such incentive, but the practice of hiring career politicians immediately after their term is up or are otherwise compelled to leave their post [scandal? impeachment?] seems to happen a LOT more than anyone notices... it should DEFINITELY be brought up as a form of corruption though no one seems to identify it as such.

Re:That's REALLY impressive! (1)

Tribbin (565963) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705131)

Thanks for the tip.

Cheers,

Murphy

better get started (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704623)

backing up those Hasselhoff albums, knight rider, and baywatch dvds while you still can Germany.

author is retarded (0, Troll)

deftones_325 (1159693) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704685)

nothing against retards. but thats what that law is. it doesn't mean exactly what the story says. it won't stop anything. besides, we dont need to copy dvd's or cd's... just download it from limewire.

Good job (1)

OrangeTide (124937) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704735)

Nice way to subvert the will of the majority and cater to a minority. Seems pretty obvious that the will of the German people was not served here.

Re:Good job (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705235)

meanwhile the infestation of Corporate Criminality,Banksters and other Wallstreet type gangsterism is spreading rapidly across the Globe.It's high time to reverse this trend and return all the "privatised"Property to the lawful owners,the People.

is this a Variety magazine story? (1)

davek (18465) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704787)

variety.com is supposed to be the site for the magazine of the same name, but the site looks strictly amature. The entire article was also about 3 paragraphs long. Half the links on the page were broken, and now the article won't even come up anymore (18:12:48 ERROR 500: Internal Server Error.).

Germany enacts a law that turns a huge portion of their population into state criminals, and this is all we see? Did anyone check to make sure this is a real article?

Better Headline (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704803)

Verbatim Verboten

Das Euro Uber Alles! (1)

zgregoryg (1061612) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704829)

Achtung! Achtung! Das Euro Macht Frei!

Hey! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704863)

Don't copy that floppy!

Surprise! I support this law (2, Funny)

dada21 (163177) | more than 7 years ago | (#20704871)

Yes, your loving anarcho-capitalist, me, loudly pronounces his support of this great law.

It is my belief that the best way to get rid of government is to let it collapse on itself. We need more taxes, more laws, more regulations and more actions to be considered crimes -- at all levels of government. Not only would all this new legislation and income create a more massive bureaucracy that will just stifle its ability to do anything right, but it will help open the eyes of every being in seeing what a waste government is.

I love adding new non-violent action laws to the books: all it does is make the black market that much more fruitful for those willing to take the risk. Why just stop at copying the CD and DVD to another CD or DVD? Let's make it illegal to copy ANY information off of a CD or DVD into any other form, including RAM, so that just playing it is wrong.

"Did you see that new movie? It's gorgeous, bright and shiny, and the case is really nice!"

"What's the plot?"

"I don't know, I didn't want to risk playing it. But the DVD is nice!!!"

Re:Surprise! I support this law (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705285)

"Did you see that new movie? It's gorgeous, bright and shiny, and the case is really nice!"
Don't knock it; I remember when CDs first became popular, that shiny, rainbow-refractive surface looked really cool to me. :-/

Re:Surprise! I support this law (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705705)

It is my belief that the best way to get rid of government is to let it collapse on itself.

That would be funny were it not for the fact that governments do not collapse on themselves; they collapse on the people.

Re:Surprise! I support this law (1)

raddan (519638) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706143)

Anarcho-capitalism really is a central piece of your identity isn't it? Reminds me of that Python skit... oh yeah, this one [youtube.com] !

Wrong wrong wrong (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20704921)

The article is outright wrong. The law does NOT make it illegal to make copies for personal use. It only outlaws copies made from illegal sources (e.g. P2P).

Another completely misleading article (2, Informative)

gnasher719 (869701) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705027)

For some more serious information check out this article:

http://www.goethe.de/wis/buv/thm/urh/en2550214.htm [goethe.de]

Very quick summary: Yes, you can make copies of your CDs for private use. There are things that you are not allowed to copy, but they are not CDs.

Obviously it is now up to consumers not to buy music in a format that doesn't allow copying.

Re:Another completely misleading article (3, Informative)

wol (10606) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705383)

Critical bit from that article:

To be sure, copying for private use is still permitted - which is, after all, the reason for the flat-rate levy payable on certain devices. However, if special anti-copying technology has been employed to protect the medium, e.g. a music CD, such protection may not be circumvented by any means. The Ministry of Justice has given clear expression to this prohibition: "There is no 'right of private copying' at the expense of rights holders". This also means that consumers who download a file from the Internet must first check whether the offer is legal. How users are supposed to do so remains unclear, says the National Federation of Consumer Organisations.

Re:Another completely misleading article (1)

Randseed (132501) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706373)

The Ministry of Justice has given clear expression to this prohibition: "There is no 'right of private copying' at the expense of rights holders".

In other news, the Ministry of Truth has declared that Ignorance Is Strength. An announcement is expected from the Ministry of Love tomorrow explaining the penalties for those who copy. The Junior Anti-Sex League has, meanwhile, expressed concern that this act may decrease dissemination of pornography, thus leading to more actual sex.

Democracy (2, Interesting)

Tribbin (565963) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705163)

In a democracy, shouldn't we, the people, be deciding if we are allowed to copy anything we want?

Re:Democracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705355)

what is this democracy you speak of? it sounds very interesting.
are there any HOWTOs on implementing this?

the current situation where people elect the lesser evil party with lobbyists and corrupt as well as constition-hostile politician that are allowed to roam freely differs from that.

Yes - just vote on it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705493)

Oh, that's right, there are no direct democracies, most modern democracies are representative.

So you can't vote on it.

No problem - just vote your representative out of office if they don't vote the way you like.

In the USA, congress members are retained with 90%+ rates, so it they must be giving folks what they want.

Re:We can vote - with our money. (1)

allcar (1111567) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706019)

We simply have to stop buying anything with copy protection. DRM is not immoral, it's just aimed at stupid people. If people stop being stupid by buying DRM content it will go away.

Re:Democracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705685)

You (the German people) are deciding, just like we Americans did. We voted in favor of people who would pass laws that would fuck us over, and we voted against the people who said they'd rather not fuck us over. Then, after they carried out their threat, we rewarded them by re-electing them.

Face it, democracy has spoken: we like it up the ass, hard, and with no lube.

Re:Democracy (2, Insightful)

wytcld (179112) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706249)

shouldn't we, the people, be deciding if we are allowed to copy anything we want?
Surely private enterprise can invent chip implants that scramble experience if you don't have the keys. The same sort of noise-cancellation currently used for headphones, why not tie it directly into the nerves from the ears, or the optics? There's something quite wonderful about the notion of being surrounded by an invisible reality only those with the special keys can see. That's the premise of just about every religion and mystic cult. Now the wonders of technology can make this real for us, soon.

The current rights industry is focused all on the wrong place. It's not about the copies; it's about the original experiences. Let them copy anything they've the keys to experience, nothing more and nothing less. That they have to pay something for the original, well, nobody lives for free. That they can't share freely with their friends, well, that's what subjective experience has always been all about. That makes us special, individuals.

OK, so what's the *best* country? (1)

DoofusOfDeath (636671) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705307)

We know that America is probably the worst country for digital freedoms, and it sounds like Germany is in the running for second-worst.

Which countries are the *most* permissive in terms of fair use, lack of software patents, etc.?

(And I don't mean which countries don't enforce their laws. I mean which countries actually have laws offer the most freedom for citizens.)

Re:OK, so what's the *best* country? (2, Interesting)

BlueParrot (965239) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705803)

(And I don't mean which countries don't enforce their laws. I mean which countries actually have laws offer the most freedom for citizens.)


By that metric the US would be very permissive given the constitution. You can't just look at the letter of the law, at the end of the day the courts will have to interpret it, so it is really a matter of how things actually work out in practice. In principle US citizens have more legally recognised rights than we have in Sweden, in practice you have to consider how authorities actually operate. All kinds of things play into that, including things like who can afford a lawyer. Also, two laws with the exact same wording could have very different meanings in different countries, because things like "proven", "liable" and "forbidden" mean different things in different contexts.

ExactAudioCopy (1)

jgarra23 (1109651) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705433)

Please correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the creator of EAC from Germany? I remember when he removed the native TOC read functionality from EAC due to some weirdo law along these lines. I wonder if he'll continue development since he seems to err on the side of legal-safety in these matters.

Enforcement? (1)

mark-t (151149) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705663)

If its for personal use, how are they ever going to even know that it happened?

Re:Enforcement? (1)

knewter (62953) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706129)

Pulled over in a car while playing a burned music CD? That took a lot of thought, thanks.

Re:Enforcement? (1)

Zorque (894011) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706587)

"License and registration and the CD in your dash, please" doesn't sound all that plausible to me for some reason.

What does it mean to "own" media? (5, Interesting)

posterlogo (943853) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705719)

Do we license it?


Do we own the physical CD/DVD, but not what's on it?

If we own the right to use the media for personal use, then we should get additional copies of the physical media at no (or very little) charge if it becomes damaged.

But if we own that CD/DVD, then we should be able to make our own backups, at the least.

The content producers want it both ways. They say that we don't really "own" the content, just the right to access it, but what if you can't access that content? For example, no more working record players or tape decks in the world. Then we should get the updated version for free right? If we bought the right to access that content. If not, then they should just fuck off and let us acquire or reacquire content we already paid for.

Re:What does it mean to "own" media? (1)

BlueStrat (756137) | more than 7 years ago | (#20705909)

"The content producers want it both ways."

Of course they do, silly! Call girls, cocaine, Ferraris, yachts, mansions, and politicians haven't gotten any cheaper, you know!

Strat

Re:What does it mean to "own" media? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706267)

This just means you must read the fine print before buying something. We are far too ignorant of such contracts as it is so this will help increase consumer awareness and, in the end, will punish those who choose copy protection!

You Win the Prize! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20705963)

Germany says... verboten.

How long did it take to come up with that one? That's even worse than the regular puns. Seriously, how lame must a joke be to not get used in a headline?

Where are all the Europe defenders? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706157)

You know, all those Slashdot posters who, over the years, anytime there was a story about a dumb US law would gloat about how Europe is so much more enlightened?

Speak up! Or have your governments across the pond made it illegal to do so?

Re:Where are all the Europe defenders? (1)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706189)

TFA is nothing but a troll like your post. misleading headline.

Quick .... (1)

xednieht (1117791) | more than 7 years ago | (#20706391)

name the first great German movie that comes to mind....

Das ist vat eye thought... what are they going to copy hehe.

Hitler would be proud (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#20706431)

Hitler would be proud. Sorry to say, this move is not surprising given Germany's history.

Freedom didn't last long there, did it?
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