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Demonoid Torrent Tracker Shut Down by CRIA

CmdrTaco posted about 7 years ago | from the well-thats-a-big-surprise-now-isn't-it dept.

The Internet 222

An anonymous reader writes "As of Tuesday, 25th September 2007, Demonoid is currently down, with no prior warnings from any moderators of the site. Both the main torrent page and the forum (fora) are no longer accessible. It is still possible to ping and trace the IP address of the site and it locates itself as in Canada. As of 6:45pm EST on 9-25-07, SSH and SMTP services are no longer active. Torrentfreak.com has since reported this is due to legal actions from the CRIA (Canadian Recording Industry Association) who ordered Demonoid's ISP to shut down the site."

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CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754641)

That's right, we just went somewhere else.

Just to clarify (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754767)

TorrentFreak has speculated that they may have been shut down by the CRIA. At present there is absolutely no proof, aside from one article on a dutch blog (which is TF's one and only source).

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (5, Informative)

radiojock (542397) | about 7 years ago | (#20754897)

Moderators: PLEASE check the stories BEFORE you allow them to post. According to the folks on demonoid IRC, they were NOT shut down by the CRIA.

Geez slashdot is turning into DIGG where every moron can post "the truth"

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (1)

HardCase (14757) | about 7 years ago | (#20754945)

Nah, the big difference between /. and Digg is that on /., only a few morons control all the information.

Oh, and there's no self correction facility (Slash it?)

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (3, Funny)

happyemoticon (543015) | about 7 years ago | (#20755307)

And as far as comments and moderation go, Digg's level of discourse is about what you'd expect from an MMORPG.

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755041)

"...slashdot is turning into DIGG where every moron can post "the truth""
see above

Why I get my news from slashdot ... the comments (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755105)

This is truly why I still read slashdot ... Someone can post BS and that'll be refuted in the comments. (anonym because mod-pointed)

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (1, Funny)

Keebler71 (520908) | about 7 years ago | (#20755559)

Moderators: PLEASE check the stories BEFORE you allow them to post.

You must be new here...

Digg (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755639)

i always thought the name of digg was funny, in an ironic way. the verb you have to do in order to get anything useful from it.

Re:CRIA Sut Down by Pirates (2, Funny)

SQL Error (16383) | about 7 years ago | (#20755907)

Moderators: PLEASE check the stories BEFORE you allow them to post.
Yeah, whose bright idea was it to make this "CmdrTaco" guy a mod anyway?

It's called CYA. Face-saving. They WERE shut down. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20756057)

If they had some sort of alternative explanation, they would post it.

CRIA pwned Demonoid.

So I guess... (0, Offtopic)

Klaidas (981300) | about 7 years ago | (#20754651)

CRIA is the new RIAA?
Well, in a "public appearance" sense.

Re:So I guess... (2, Funny)

Constantine XVI (880691) | about 7 years ago | (#20754685)

No, just the RIAA, but in Canada, eh?

Re:So I guess... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755133)

-1, Stupid, done-to-death Canadian bashing.

Why? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755365)

After all...everyone Blames Canada... >:-)

Canada, CRIA, P2P, so I guess... (1)

srussia (884021) | about 7 years ago | (#20755843)

obligatory Blue Rodeo reference is in order:

Don't tell me I'm wrong,
'Cause I've been watching every move that you make.

Oh you got to CRIA, CRIA, CRIA.
Ah don't you know you've got to CRIA,
CRIA, CRIA. Oooh
Oh baby you CRIAAA..

Re:So I guess... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755921)

Y'all post that again now, ya hear?
 

Re:So I guess... (1)

mwvdlee (775178) | about 7 years ago | (#20754825)

Hooray for the MAFIAA!
I really appreciate how the MAFIAA is saving us all the costs on judges, juries and executioners.
Who needs an expensive legal system when the MAFIAA will find you guilty for free?

Re:So I guess... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755821)

What the heck since when can an "Association" order anything? Don't they have to file suit? They probably said take it down, or you'll be listed on the claim as well.

Legal? (0, Offtopic)

Aladrin (926209) | about 7 years ago | (#20754655)

Didn't we just decide that stea^W copyright infringement was legal in Canada since they pay all those taxes on everything that might be used for it?

Maybe it's still illegal to provide, if not infringe...

I dunno, maybe if the article had more words than the summary, I'd have some clue.

Re:Legal? (2, Insightful)

Aladrin (926209) | about 7 years ago | (#20754677)

Ah, my bad. The page only partially loaded the first time. There's more words there, but still no real information.

Re:Legal? (4, Informative)

Hemogoblin (982564) | about 7 years ago | (#20754711)

Coincidentally, the CRIA is now opposing the private copying levy. [michaelgeist.ca]

The Canadian Recording Industry Association this week quietly filed documents in the Federal Court of Appeal that will likely shock many in the industry. CRIA, which spent more than 15 years lobbying for the creation of the private copying levy, is now fighting to eliminate the application of the levy on the Apple iPod since it believes that the Copyright Board of Canada's recent decision to allow a proposed tariff on iPods to proceed "broadens the scope of the private copying exception to avoid making illegal file sharers liable for infringement."- Michael Geist

Re:Legal? (3, Informative)

speaker of the truth (1112181) | about 7 years ago | (#20754867)

Actually the blog has done CNN's trick (or is it Fox's trick?) in that they assert a fact that they cannot prove, and so had a question mark at the end. They haven't said the CRIA is responsible, they've ASKED if the CRIA is responsible.

At this point the only thing we know is that demonoid was hosted in Canada, is currently down and the admins of the website haven't made any official comment.

It simply makes no sense that CRIA would be responsible for this. The Canadian MPAA would make more sense as I believe they haven't blundered into the situation the Canadian professional music industry has.

Re:Legal? (1)

camperdave (969942) | about 7 years ago | (#20755045)

Technically, it is the importers/manufacturers of blank media who pay the levy, but I'm sure they pass the cost onto the consumers. Torrenting a recording is a completely different animal than burning a copy of a friend's cd.

Re:Legal? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755633)

Torrenting a recording is a completely different animal than burning a copy of a friend's cd.

Not really. Either way you are copying the bits from one storage device to another.

Re:Legal? (2, Informative)

This_Is_My_Happening (1151393) | about 7 years ago | (#20755425)

Didn't we just decide that stea^W copyright infringement was legal in Canada...
Downloading is legal in Canada. Uploading is still a grey area.

Finger in the dyke... (5, Insightful)

downix (84795) | about 7 years ago | (#20754675)

This action is akin to putting a finger in the dyke, but there are thousands, if not millions of other holes. You will run out of fingers (read funding) long before you ever patch up the holes in the wall that is DRM. We are in an era where the old rules of rights management can not survive. Pandoras Box is open, the cat is out of the bag, you cannot go back without causing more damage, if you can go back at all. Adapt or die.

it had to be said (5, Funny)

the_fat_kid (1094399) | about 7 years ago | (#20754719)

I for one welcome our new dyke fingering overlords.

ouch. that hurt just to say.

Re:it had to be said (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754853)

I for one welcome our new dyke fingering overlords.
Well, they probably hate men, so I wouldn't be so happy about that...

Re:it had to be said (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755537)

It's not like you were getting any either way, what are you complaining about?

Re:it had to be said (2, Funny)

the_fat_kid (1094399) | about 7 years ago | (#20755985)

how do you know I'm a man, you insensitive clod?

Re:Finger in the dyke... (2, Funny)

LM741N (258038) | about 7 years ago | (#20754749)

I'm sure dykes are just as outraged about DRM as anyone else. But why pick them?

Re:Finger in the dyke... (2, Funny)

kaos07 (1113443) | about 7 years ago | (#20754753)

Fingering the dyke? The CRIA is more like a c*ck up the arse.

Re:Finger in the dyke... (0)

jollyreaper (513215) | about 7 years ago | (#20754881)

This action is akin to putting a finger in the dyke, but there are thousands, if not millions of other holes.
More importantly, if the little dutch boy was responsible for putting his finger there, could Slashdot now be held responsible for hosting child pornography?

Re:Finger in the dike... (5, Funny)

ElleyKitten (715519) | about 7 years ago | (#20754963)

This action is akin to putting a finger in the dyke, but there are thousands
A dyke is a lesbian. A dike is a dam. No one read the rest of your post because they were distracted by thoughts of lesbians.

Re:Finger in the dike... (1)

GrayCalx (597428) | about 7 years ago | (#20755557)

A dyke is a lesbian.

I was wondering why I got so aroused by his first sentence.

This action is akin to putting a finger in the dyke, but there are thousands, if not millions of other holes.

Re:Finger in the dyke... (1)

sjwaste (780063) | about 7 years ago | (#20755049)

Hey look, I found this book of cliches...

Re:Finger in the dyke... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755173)

If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards ... Checkmate.
- Zapp Brannigan

Re:Finger in the dyke... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755389)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

why is it news then?

accept it kiddie, taking others work for free was never right, and still isn't. hope you enjoy the day you get your legal summons.

Re:Finger in the dyke... (0)

The MAZZTer (911996) | about 7 years ago | (#20755935)

Don't forget TPB is a hole bigger than both their fists.

Canada (1)

Rhoads47 (1050834) | about 7 years ago | (#20754703)

Blame Canada ['s Recording Industry Association]!

Couldn't resist (5, Funny)

trrwilson (1096985) | about 7 years ago | (#20754709)

I feel a great disturbance in the Force. As if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced. I fear something terrible has happened.

Re:Couldn't resist (1)

T0wner (552792) | about 7 years ago | (#20754763)

You read the comments on torrentfreak then? Not so sure about the silence however...

there is some debate here on the demonoid shutdown (5, Informative)

bubblah (1095629) | about 7 years ago | (#20754731)

last night techwag was reporting the same thing based off the torrent freak article, but a commenter pointed to a discussion out on http://www.thecircuitbox.com/demonoid/ [thecircuitbox.com] which is basically an IRC chat that refutes the CRIA end of the story. The techwag article is here http://techwag.com/index.php/2007/09/25/bad-day-for-bittorrent-demonoid-shut-down/ [techwag.com] Yesterday was basically a bad day for Bittorrent, ISOHunt shut down trackers to american users, and demonoid out of service, for what ever reason, either because they were taken down by the ISP or they are having one of their outages that happens randomly, but every time they go down people think they got shut down because they were shut down almost a year ago by BRIEN. There really is no way to tell the truth in the story without getting someone from demonoid to talk about it, and so far, people from demonoid have been very hard to reach. Makes for an interesting story overall though.

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (5, Funny)

Hemogoblin (982564) | about 7 years ago | (#20754847)

There really is no way to tell the truth in the story without getting someone from demonoid to talk about it...
...or you could tell me where the server is located. I live in central Canada, so I could just waltz over there and check it for you. It's not like Canada is very big and I can use my dogsled. Problem solved.

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (1)

future assassin (639396) | about 7 years ago | (#20754947)

Maybe the igloo melted and all the servers got wet.

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (1)

bubblah (1095629) | about 7 years ago | (#20755019)

ping traceroute to demonoid.com and it will respond to pings, if I was to diagnose it today, it looks like it is data layer on up, could be a database connectivity issue, but then we speculate. Which is fun.

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755111)

hey, do you know bob in vancouver?

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755535)

Yea, Bob here. What can I do you for? eh?

Re:there is some debate here on the demonoid shutd (1)

LuSiDe (755770) | about 7 years ago | (#20755889)

[...] but every time they go down people think they got shut down because they were shut down almost a year ago by BRIEN. [...]
BREIN [wikipedia.org] .

No details yet... (5, Insightful)

pathological liar (659969) | about 7 years ago | (#20754743)

This story is useless without details, and nobody has them yet.

Re:No details yet... (1)

bubblah (1095629) | about 7 years ago | (#20754803)

Exactly, thank you for being more succinct than me in your statement, grin.

IRC log of convo with seanap of Demonoid. (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754771)

http://www.thecircuitbox.com/demonoid/ [thecircuitbox.com]

For tl;dr types: Torrentfreak made it up, the box is down for unknown reasons. Nobody knows yet. Sorry.

Re:IRC log of convo with seanap of Demonoid. (4, Informative)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 7 years ago | (#20754903)

Nobody knows yet because Deimos hasn't said anything. But from what I see in an nmap scan:

Starting Nmap 4.20 ( http://insecure.org/ [insecure.org] ) at 2007-09-26 09:54 Eastern Daylight Time
Initiating Parallel DNS resolution of 1 host. at 09:54
Completed Parallel DNS resolution of 1 host. at 09:54, 0.00s elapsed
Initiating System CNAME DNS resolution of 1 host. at 09:54
Completed System CNAME DNS resolution of 1 host. at 09:54, 0.00s elapsed
Initiating SYN Stealth Scan at 09:54
Scanning demonoid.com (209.44.123.21) [1697 ports]
SYN Stealth Scan Timing: About 6.25% done; ETC: 10:03 (0:07:43 remaining)
Completed SYN Stealth Scan at 10:01, 401.57s elapsed (1697 total ports)
Warning: OS detection for 209.44.123.21 will be MUCH less reliable because we did not find at least 1 open and 1 closed TCP port
Initiating OS detection (try #1) against demonoid.com (209.44.123.21)
Host demonoid.com (209.44.123.21) appears to be up ... good.
Interesting ports on demonoid.com (209.44.123.21):
Not shown: 1690 filtered ports
PORT STATE SERVICE
21/tcp closed ftp
22/tcp closed ssh
80/tcp closed http
123/tcp closed ntp
443/tcp closed https
8000/tcp closed http-alt
8080/tcp closed http-proxy
Device type: general purpose
Running: Linux 2.6.X, OpenBSD 4.X, Sun Solaris 10|8|9
OS details: Linux 2.6.17.13 (Slackware 11.0, x86), OpenBSD 4.0 (CURRENT) macppc, OpenBSD 4.0 (sparc64), Sun Solaris 10 (SPARC), Sun Solaris 8 (SPARC), Sun Solaris 9 (SPARC), Sun Solaris 9 (x86), Sun Solaris 9 or 10

OS detection performed. Please report any incorrect results at http://insecure.org/nmap/submit/ [insecure.org] .
Nmap finished: 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 405.503 seconds
                              Raw packets sent: 5164 (229.400KB) | Rcvd: 76 (3496B)


It looks like all the ports are firewalled off by the ISP. So while it's not confirmed, it's pretty obvious to anyone knowledgeable in network admin that the ISP firewalled off all the ports at someone's behest. Perhaps the CRIA, perhaps even Deimos himself.

Re:IRC log of convo with seanap of Demonoid. (1)

19thNervousBreakdown (768619) | about 7 years ago | (#20755087)

What about that makes you think the ISP closed it off? I don't see a comparison of TTLs from when it worked to when it didn't, and 99% of the ISPs out there, if they're going to close something off, aren't going to send icmp-port-unreachable, they're just going to drop the packet. If I were the non-alarmist type that was also willing to make completely unfounded guesses, I'd say it looks like the box had some problems and came up in a single-user style mode with TCP connectivity.

Re:IRC log of convo with seanap of Demonoid. (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 7 years ago | (#20755741)

I don't think so -- the ports shouldn't show at all. But I don't have any TTL comparisons. This was the result of a SYN stealth scan, not a TCP connect scan, FWIW. It shouldn't show any ports at all if the box is hung or booted into single user mount.

Re:IRC log of convo with seanap of Demonoid. (2, Informative)

19thNervousBreakdown (768619) | about 7 years ago | (#20755891)

If you get a "closed" response, that means something is answering for that IP. The ISP is unlikely to do this in the event of a takedown, they'll just cut access. Even if they didn't completely cut access and only disallow inbound, they still would more than likely drop the packet instead of returning ICMP port unreachable responses. SYN scans these days are rarely any more penetrating than a regular TCP connect(). If I had a remote box, I'd do my best to make sure it had some kind of connectivity even in single-user mode.

Too bad... (1)

dalmiroy2k (768278) | about 7 years ago | (#20754777)

While there are tons of trackers like TPB or Mininova, Demonoid was the best comic book's scans source.
Let's hope they manage to get back online.

Re:Too bad... (1)

Maxo-Texas (864189) | about 7 years ago | (#20755187)

Aye.
Probably 99% of the site benefit to me.
I was so glad to find a source for the comics I grew up with (Adam Strange and others)... most of which either are or should be out of copyright after 45 to 50 years. The only way to get them hard copy would have been prohibitively expensive if even possible since many issues are not for sale often.

that's what makes it absurd (5, Insightful)

gambolt (1146363) | about 7 years ago | (#20755443)

People don't go to demonoid for Britteny Spears. They go for Jazz and Classical recordings that have not been available for purchase in the US for 20 years. They go for medical textbooks. I got a full Principa Mathmatica there for cripe's sake. It's where Americans get 30 year old BBC productions. I'd been wanting to see The Sweeny for years. I'd have paid for it given the chance.

The copyright Nazis don't give a shit about 90% of what's there and 90% of the people using Demonoid don't give a shit about any of the stuff the copyright Nazis give a shit about.

Re:Too bad... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755863)

Was that as a registered user or something? Because I hit their old torrent policy and search restrictions all the time, and their registration is never open.

Speculation (4, Informative)

Ilex (261136) | about 7 years ago | (#20754781)

The latest speculation I heard on Torrentfreak 5 hours ago was that Demoniod was down due to a hardware failure and not a MAFIAA Hit squad. I haven't seen any statements from CRIA crowing about their victory which you would expect if they were really responsible.

Re:Speculation (1)

Stu101 (1031686) | about 7 years ago | (#20755303)

A singular server for a site that big (and I assume cash positive) is a bit silly. Although I guess it could be other stuff too.

hmm (0)

thatskinnyguy (1129515) | about 7 years ago | (#20754787)

Sounds like the Pirate Bay's legal troubles a while back. Only this time the whiners got their way. There's more than just music on those sites you know. CRIA idiots...

Re:hmm (1)

speaker of the truth (1112181) | about 7 years ago | (#20754919)

There's more than just music on those sites you know.
That's neither here nor there as its legal to download and upload music thanks to the CD tax. It can't be the CRIA unless they're simply abusing their power with bogus claims in which case they should be brought to justice.

Re:hmm (1)

thatskinnyguy (1129515) | about 7 years ago | (#20755063)

Ahh I'm sorry for the ill-informed post my Canadian friend. Perhaps their servers just crapped-out and the CRIA is a scapegoat.

personal update (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754791)

Some friends and I heard from demonoid's IRC channel chatter that it wasnt a takedown but rather some hdd's that died - have not seen independent confirmation yet to that effect, other than bubblah's reply post above...

More Information (1)

Drakin020 (980931) | about 7 years ago | (#20754811)

Something came through the IRC Channel. This was posted on Digg so I can't vouch that it is 100%

Link to Source: http://diggdl.googlepages.com/demonoid [googlepages.com]

  http://torrentfreak.com/demonoid-shut-down-by-cria-070925/ [torrentfreak.com] we DO NOT know what actually happened. the CRIA is just a SPECULATION. the site is TEMPORAROLY OFFLINE

  Yes the tracker is down, they are going through heavy maintenance, please wait patiently for it to come back up.

  Jumba; that torrent freak article is completely false
  there is NO evidence

  and NO word from site staff, and i'm in contact with the TF dude right now

  we're still waiting for the name of a CRIA rep for confirmation.

I hate Torrents (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754831)

This message will likely be moderated as flamebait but I want to say it anyway.

But: I just want to say that I really hate torrents and torrent users. It is because of you that there are GB caps and severe upload restrictions on my internet access. There are many, many other ways you can get your pirated files. You people literally took up almost all the network bandwidth at one point for what is, in actuality, a very inefficient distribution mechanisim. Now people who need this bandwidth for legitimate purposes don't have it, and it is highly unlikely that the ISPs will ever become more generous in what they give the consumer.

Re:I hate Torrents (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754895)

what about pay for your bandwith like torrent users do?.

Re:I hate Torrents (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755025)

Fuck you. Mysterious download caps and slow upload speeds are the fault of scumbag ISPs massively over selling their lines. If you're going to bitch, then bitch about the ISPs, and not about people trying to use what they've legitimately paid for.

If you "need" the bandwidth, pay for a small business package from your ISP. They'll tell you exactly what you're getting, and won't be so restrictive on uploading.

Re:I hate Torrents (4, Insightful)

Applekid (993327) | about 7 years ago | (#20755033)

It is because of you that there are GB caps and severe upload restrictions on my internet access.
As I recall, upload restrictions and bandwidth caps predate Bittorrent by at least 5 years, if not more. Maybe you just need a better ISP: one that will maintain and upgrade their infrastructure as traffic grows instead of just blaming their customers.

Re:I hate Torrents (1)

Hatta (162192) | about 7 years ago | (#20755073)

You people literally took up almost all the network bandwidth at one point for what is, in actuality, a very inefficient distribution mechanisim.

Find us a more efficient distribution mechanism and we'll use it.

Re:I hate Torrents (1)

tepples (727027) | about 7 years ago | (#20755675)

Find us a more efficient distribution mechanism and we'll use it.
Mailing recorded DVD-R discs, perhaps?

Re:I hate Torrents (1)

apt142 (574425) | about 7 years ago | (#20755981)

That would only be more efficient in the following conditions:

Postage + Disk_Cost
and

average_postal_transit_time
The above conditions would only really be efficient for large amounts of data. Where large amounts of data is relative to your bandwidth and other fellow sharers.

* I omitted the sender's bandwidth on the the extremely far reaching assumption that the file sharer uploads enough back to the network as he downloads.
* This is a gross exaggeration and meant more for humor than real world modeling. That's right, laugh it's meant to be funny and geeky.

Re:I hate Torrents (1)

apt142 (574425) | about 7 years ago | (#20756015)

The equations messed up, sorry. Here they are:

Postage + Disk_Cost < ISP_Monthly_Fee/Seconds(current_month) * download_time_in_seconds

and

average_postal_transit_time < download_time_in_days

I just got my key for it too (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754863)

the irony makes me laugh, the lack of downloads make me cry, sense the lobotomy i cant really feel anger anymore.....

DESU DESU DESU (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754869)

oh god no!
glad i grabbed the desu while i still had the chance!

CRIA orders ISP to disconnect? Or a judge? (0, Flamebait)

Morgaine (4316) | about 7 years ago | (#20754885)

> "this is due to legal actions from the CRIA (Canadian Recording Industry Association) who ordered Demonoid's ISP to shut down the site."

I assume it was a judge who ordered Demonoid's ISP to disconnect Demonoid. If a trade organization like CRIA can order an ISP to disconnect a customer directly, then things are extremely bad in Canada.

But even a judge ordering that seems highly wrong. For example, a judge would not ordinarily order a person's electricity supply to be cut off (unless they're in default of paying their electricity bill of course). Surely here a judge would order Demonoid to immediately drop its site instead, and not order a service supplier to disconnect them upstream. After all, the same Internet feed could be serving many other businesses or private customers perfectly legally.

Something seems wrong with this (or maybe it's just bad reporting). Otherwise, Canada is in dire straights.

Re:CRIA orders ISP to disconnect? Or a judge? (3, Insightful)

Egonis (155154) | about 7 years ago | (#20754969)

Action like this is highly unlikely, because within our legal system they cannot (rather, should not) take action with the assumption that you are guilty without first having a full judgement.

If there were in fact a judgement, given the speed of our legal system, it would be shut down three years from now.

Re:CRIA orders ISP to disconnect? Or a judge? (1)

tlhIngan (30335) | about 7 years ago | (#20755531)

Action like this is highly unlikely, because within our legal system they cannot (rather, should not) take action with the assumption that you are guilty without first having a full judgement.

If there were in fact a judgement, given the speed of our legal system, it would be shut down three years from now.


Actually, if the infringed party feels that the infringing party is unduly harming them, they can ask the judge to issue a temporary injunction from operations. However, in that case, the site can remain operational to explain the situation. Of course, the legality of providing links to files, and not files themselves has yet to be tested in Canadian courts.

It more likely is a hardware failure than anything. When I first tried Demonoid on Monday, the site was returning no data (it was responding to HTTP, however). Tuesday, it was returning connection resets. Blocked for firewalled sites time out, not return no data or connection resets. Heck, if you had torrents running, the torrent tracker server is contactable at the announce URL. If they shut it ALL down, the tracker servers will also be dead, but they're still being scraped normally. (Heck, it appears a few clients with cached torrent files are still connecting...).

It's not like it hasn't happened before - Demonoid has suffered a hardware failure earlier this year (in June, I believe) - took them 3 or 4 days to get the server to the point of "We had a hardware failure". being posted on the main page. Speculation ran that it was a shutdown, as well.

(I didn't know Demonoid was Canadian, honestly... either. That's news to me). As for torrents sapping bandwidth - most good clients have bandwidth throttles you can use to prevent you going over your gig limit. Shaw's "draconian" gig limits (30 for "lite", 60 for "regular", 100 for "regular plus", and 160 for "extreme" or so) aren't that bad, really. And Shaw's are known to be draconian. You can calculate the maximum upload rates if you want to not exceed these, but they're still quite reasonable (I believe 10kB/sec (bytes) will get you at most half way through the 60GB limit a month, roughly, if you uploaded 24/7 continually). If it's a private tracker, well, just keep it running and eventually you'll hit 1:1 ratio. May take a few days compared to the 3 hours to download, but oh well.

Ratio problem? (1)

tepples (727027) | about 7 years ago | (#20755717)

If it's a private tracker, well, just keep it running and eventually you'll hit 1:1 ratio. May take a few days compared to the 3 hours to download, but oh well.
So what do you do when you are on the tail end of a torrent's popularity, you leave your client running for a week, and you still can't get up to 100% because there aren't enough other people who want to download the work? There might be a dozen seeders and 0 downloaders.

Re:Ratio problem? (2, Informative)

tlhIngan (30335) | about 7 years ago | (#20755855)

So what do you do when you are on the tail end of a torrent's popularity, you leave your client running for a week, and you still can't get up to 100% because there aren't enough other people who want to download the work? There might be a dozen seeders and 0 downloaders.


You rely on the fact that it's a private tracker, and most (>99%) don't expect you to seed 1:1 for every torrent.

Get in on one earlier and seed it 2:1 or more. You don't have to stop at 1:1, you know. I've done torrents where I only seeded 0.5 because, like you said, it was all seeders and no leechers. (Rare for Demonoid due to the sheer number of users. I had year-old+ torrents where I still ended up seeding 2:1). Just remember to make it up. Even as a new user the first GB is often "free". Just if you want to download more than that...

Or, another trick - go the front page and pick a popular torrent you don't care about. Use it to get your ratio above 1:1. Then stop it and delete the file. (Just be mindful about your limit, though - don't go all crazy and download 4GB torrents planning to seed to 2:1!).

Heck, that's why I liked Demonoid - even the lowest popularity torrent still gets a good bunch of leechers for unknown reasons. But if it wasn't overly large (maybe under 100MB), even at 10kB/s, I'd still have 2.5+:1 over the course of a day. All the little ones add up. Last I checked, I had maybe a 100GB differential over the course of 3 years or so (100GB more upload than downloaded).

It's the total of upload:download that matters to most private sites, not whether you downloaded 4GB and only uploaded 10MB on one torrent after a week (as long as your ratio can absorb that 4GB without dipping below 1:1).

Re:CRIA orders ISP to disconnect? Or a judge? (1)

apt142 (574425) | about 7 years ago | (#20755723)

I assume it was a judge who ordered Demonoid's ISP to disconnect Demonoid. If a trade organization like CRIA can order an ISP to disconnect a customer directly, then things are extremely bad in Canada.
The details are scarce here. We only have the word of one source that the CRIA is involved at all. Given the state of such shaky evidence, wouldn't the next hypothesis be that it is not legal troubles at all?

I mean, backhoes have been attempting the take down of the internet for quite some time. (Those big one armed bastards!)

My point being, what's the use of discussing this without any further information? We're just speculating until we have it.

Are You Sure? (4, Informative)

fringd (120235) | about 7 years ago | (#20754933)

As far as I know there is not any strong evidence that CRIA has done anything yet. The server is down, true, but I heard it's just a hard drive failure. Some demonoid people were complaining about the bad journalism reporting that the CRIA shut down demonoid, without anybody from demonoid saying this. Who is the source on this? Some nu.nl article? How do they know anything? Here [thecircuitbox.com] is an IRC log where demonoid staff give the torrentfreak admin a hard time for reprinting the nu.nl story about the CRIA without having confirmed it in any way. To be fair, at this point in time, the torrentfreak article [torrentfreak.com] uses the word "allegedly." maybe they changed it.

Must be a hardware glitch (5, Interesting)

Coraon (1080675) | about 7 years ago | (#20754935)

The CRIA couldnt have shut them down here, I work for one of the few ISP's that could have handled their traffic, and the rules here state that if another company (read *IAA) wants to shut someone down/off the proper responce is to ask them for the MAC address, if they provide it then we shut *IAA off for illigaly obtaining information from our network, if they dont we say get it and call us back.... The big ISP's in Canada LOVE torrent sites, Trackers bring in ALOT of cash to the ISP's that shelter them.

Was it the CRIA or RIAA guy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754939)

Was it the CRIA or RIAA guy who was shagging the Canadian government official woman?

Interesting. I just checked this morning... (1)

erroneus (253617) | about 7 years ago | (#20754955)

I know... it's "wikipedia" but still...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demonoid_(BitTorrent) [wikipedia.org]

That's the word I'm seeing. And according to the article, this is essentially speculation.

Hurts, but there are other trackers. (1)

gravis777 (123605) | about 7 years ago | (#20754971)

Oh no, Demonoid is shut down! But we still have TPB, Suprnova, and mininova

Re:Hurts, but there are other trackers. (2, Insightful)

sYkSh0n3 (722238) | about 7 years ago | (#20755165)

Well, lets just list all our favorite trackers so the MAFIAA can shut them down too! :)

Actually, I would believe this is hardware failure before them being shutdown. Demonoid is always goin down for something.

Loss of a Great Obscure Music Source! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20754981)

Damnation. They had one of the best selections of out-of-print and rare reggae that I knew of. Whatever the reason, I sure hope they get back online. It's real hard to find quality reggae in the middle of the High Plains...

What's really going on... (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755011)

Don't jump the gun, I've talked to #demonoid ops and they say nothing has been confirmed. Goto:

irc://irc.p2p-network.net/demonoid

#demonoid

Without torrent is there a need for high speed? (1)

Maxo-Texas (864189) | about 7 years ago | (#20755239)

I pondered this last night.

For my needs (EQ, email, occasional funny video) a $17 AT&T DSL account would be fine. It's okay because of occasional torrent related surges that I keep my $55 cable line.

You got it all wrong - It's all because of Heroes (1)

Mortimer82 (746766) | about 7 years ago | (#20755455)

Seriously folks, *obviously* all the people wanting Heroes resulted in a sort of Denial of Service effect!

the REAL answer (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20755713)

Someone from the CRIA found where demonoid was hosting their server, got into the server room all ninja stealth style; and then proceeded to violate the server in an unspeakable fashion.

SEE? THE CRIA IS RESPONSIBLE!

/. is now digg? (1)

TheSpengo (1148351) | about 7 years ago | (#20755749)

Alright, here's an example of when you should check your sources before posting a news article. I thought this level of stupidity was reserved for Digg.com, but I guess I was mistaken. The site is temporarily offline due to hardware maintenance in their servers. It will probably be back up in a day or two.

what a joke (2, Informative)

HipPriest93 (1158313) | about 7 years ago | (#20755753)

"Without torrent is there a need for high speed?"

Are you dumb? P2P services like Soulseek and E-Mule are showing no signs of being even remotely effected by all this bullshit, and as long as P2P exists and the popularity of video hosting sites like YouTube and Google Video remains unchallenged, there will be a need for high speed.

This whole article is poorly researched in any case:
http://www.thecircuitbox.com/demonoid/ [thecircuitbox.com]

Demonoid shit: (5, Informative)

Kildjean (871084) | about 7 years ago | (#20755997)

Demonoid shit:

Ok folks, here it is. Demonoid is down. It has been for around 1 day 2 hours. The reason is down is unkown. It hasnt been RAIDed, shutdown, terminated, deleted, burned, mamed, or thrown under a bridge. There have been speculation as demonoid.com whereabouts. Well the rurmors are false. A no name site in Netherlands has a blog about Demonoid.com being down. As I don't speak douche, I can not translate. However TorrentFreak Decided upon there own free will to further spread this and rumors. Torrent freak has known to be a sleazy site they post false rumors and hope they turn out true. They do this in order for money and popularity. Quite sad isn't it. To prove this is quite easy:

[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] ((
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] .. Query with (ernesto)/(~info@P2PNET-41E95253.groni1.gr.home.nl) opened on (Tuesday, September 25th 2007, 18:00:54).
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] .. Total queries: (40)/(~0.7 per day)
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] .. Queries today: (1)
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] .. Common channels: (+#demonoid)
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] ((
[05:26] *seanap*
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:00.54] (ernesto) hi
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:01.01] (ernesto) it's ernesto from TF
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:01.05] (seanap) hello
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:01.27] (ernesto) brb 1 min
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:01.28] (seanap) are you part of the staff there?
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.01] (ernesto) I'm the staff
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.03] (ernesto) hehe
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.32] (seanap) that article is completely false.
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.39] (ernesto) well, I based my story on a respectable source
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.47] (ernesto) but I doubted it
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:02.55] (ernesto) so what's going on then?
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:03.05] (seanap) there hasn't been word yet
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:03.44] (seanap) the 2 IRC ops that are usually in contact with Deimos haven't been around
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:03.45] (ernesto) last time demonoid staff said it were hw problems you relocated to CAN
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:04.11] (ernesto) they said my story was false then too
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:04.20] (ernesto) but it turned out not to be
[05:26] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:04.46] (seanap) well i'm saying we as site and IRC staff haven't heard anything.. and we'd be the first people to hear
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:05.18] (ernesto) perhaps Deimos doesn't know it?
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:05.21] (ernesto) yet
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:05.28] (seanap) so i don't think you should be reporting unconfirmed things, the IRC is going insane.. almost double the amount of users in a day
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:05.32] (ernesto) that was exactly how it happened last time
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.04] (ernesto) nu.nl is the biggest news source in NL
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.12] (ernesto) they might have inside info
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.21] (seanap) form who?! we are the inside
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.22] (ernesto) from the isp or the CRIA
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.41] (ernesto) the ISP probably firewalled the servers
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:06.52] (ernesto) after some seriuos legal threats
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:07.04] (ernesto) it's not unlikely
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:07.16] (seanap) no its not, but it's not.. confirmed
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:07.31] (ernesto) as long as you can't explain what's happening this is all I have
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:07.16] (seanap) no its not, but it's not.. confirmed
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:07.31] (ernesto) as long as you can't explain what's happening this is all I have
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:08.25] (ernesto) everybody complained about me spreading false in fo about brein
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:08.33] (ernesto) but that turned out to be true
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:08.44] (ernesto) no idea if that will happen this time
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:08.56] (ernesto) but in could be
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:09.31] (seanap) h/o real quick, afk for a bit
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:09.38] (ernesto) kk
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:11.21] (seanap) ok
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:12.29] (seanap) well, the point i'm trying to make is that Demonoid can't confirm this info... and that article has 1150+ diggs iirc and it's abesolutely overwhelming the staff with floods of people thinking the site was taken down, when we're not sure if it is.. and it puts us as staff in a bad place
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:13.05] (ernesto) I wrote that demonoid staff didn't confirm it
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:13.25] (ernesto) personally I believe it could be true
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:16.03] (seanap) and for the record, there is only ONE admin on Demonoid, and that's Deimos, so until we hear from him, we cannot confirm anything.
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:16.32] (seanap) everyone else is just staff to help out
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:16.41] (ernesto) true, but this is the ONLY explanation right now
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:16.49] (ernesto) and it's very plausible
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.25] (ernesto) last time I got the EXACT same response
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.29] (seanap) but it's not confirmed therefore its not an explanation!
[05:27] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.33] (seanap) it's a possiblyity!
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.34] (ernesto) people didn't believe it
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.58] (ernesto) last time people didn't even believe it when BREIN issues a press release
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:17.59] (ernesto) lol
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:18.43] (seanap) who did you talk to at CRIA (or where ever you go your information)?
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:18.54] (seanap) how about you take it down, until there is more news
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:18.59] (ernesto) no
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:19.06] (ernesto) out of the question
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:19.27] (ernesto) I talked to a professional journalist
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:19.44] (ernesto) so that's my source
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:19.52] (seanap) sources usually have names
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.02] (ernesto) no need to doubt that if you guys don't have a clue
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.14] (seanap) yes there is! if we don't have a clue, how does he?
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.16] (ernesto) check the link in the article
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.37] (ernesto) who knows
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.47] (ernesto) maybe Deimos doesn't even know
[05:28] *seanap* [09/25/07 - 18:20.58] (ernesto) looks like an action from the ISP to me

[05:26] The journolist that wrote the torrentfreak article is a member of Ruzsters forum - ernesto99 - http://demonoid.kicks-as/ [demonoid.kicks-as]

He failed to give any name for the source and failed to give us contact to the source. The only source is the netherland website. Same thing happened last time Demonoid.com was down.

Just for the record, the CRIA (despite the name) does NOT represent Canadian artists and the Canadian music industry. It is an AMERICAN association based in Canada to represent the RIAA here.

More proof?

www.demonoid.com = 209.44.123.21

root@thecircuitbox# ping 209.44.123.21
PING 209.44.123.21 (209.44.123.21): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=0 ttl=45 time=69.706 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=1 ttl=45 time=67.624 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=2 ttl=45 time=66.469 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=3 ttl=45 time=56.049 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=4 ttl=45 time=58.325 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=5 ttl=45 time=56.964 ms
64 bytes from 209.44.123.21: icmp_seq=6 ttl=45 time=57.181 ms
^C
--- 209.44.123.21 ping statistics ---
7 packets transmitted, 7 packets received, 0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 56.049/61.760/69.706/5.452 ms

[whois.rrpproxy.net]
; This data is provided by demonoid
; for information purposes, and to assist persons obtaining information
; about or related to domain name registration records.
; demonoid does not guarantee its accuracy.
; By submitting a WHOIS query, you agree that you will use this data
; only for lawful purposes and that, under no circumstances, you will
; use this data to
; 1) allow, enable, or otherwise support the transmission of mass
; unsolicited, commercial advertising or solicitations via E-mail
; (spam); or
; 2) enable high volume, automated, electronic processes that apply
; to this WHOIS server.
; These terms may be changed without prior notice.
; By submitting this query, you agree to abide by this policy.

DOMAIN: DEMONOID.COM

RSP: demonoid
URL: http://www.demonoid.com/ [demonoid.com]

created-date: 2002-10-16
updated-date: 2007-07-01
registration-expiration-date: 2016-10-16

owner-contact: P-DGA374
owner-fname: Demka
owner-lname: Adrik
owner-street: Kutuzowsky prospekt
owner-city: Moscow
owner-zip: 121172
owner-country: RU
owner-phone: +3727121239
owner-email: admin@subdemon.com

admin-contact: P-DGA374
admin-fname: Demka
admin-lname: Adrik
admin-street: Kutuzowsky prospekt
admin-city: Moscow
admin-zip: 121172
admin-country: RU
admin-phone: +3727121239
admin-email: admin@subdemon.com

tech-contact: P-DGA374
tech-fname: Demka
tech-lname: Adrik
tech-street: Kutuzowsky prospekt
tech-city: Moscow
tech-zip: 121172
tech-country: RU
tech-phone: +3727121239
tech-email: admin@subdemon.com

billing-contact: P-DGA374
billing-fname: Demka
billing-lname: Adrik
billing-street: Kutuzowsky prospekt
billing-city: Moscow
billing-zip: 121172
billing-country: RU
billing-phone: +3727121239
billing-email: admin@subdemon.com

nameserver: ns1.demonoid.com 209.44.123.21
nameserver: ns2.demonoid.com 209.44.123.22
nameserver: ns3.demonoid.com 209.44.123.23

; For abuse reports please send mail to
; abuse -a.t.- demonoid.com

Verio Inc. - Growing Your Business, One Click At A Time

http://diggdl.googlepages.com/demonoid [googlepages.com]

Sleaze and slander: http://torrentfreak.com/demonoid-shut-down-by-cria-070925/ [torrentfreak.com]

Douche Blog: http://www.nu.nl/news/1249300/50/rss/Torrentsite_Demonoid_opnieuw_offline.html [www.nu.nl]

So again the site is down and still slightly functional. All the current rumors are false until we can confirm wihtout a doubt what is going on. The only person who knows is Deimos. Deimos has a life and intends to live it which means Demonoid.com will be down until spare time is made and Deimos fixes it. If you need other sites check out the others: Mininova, ISOhunt, ThePirateBay, Suprnova, Eztvefnet, PureTnA, PussyTorrents. Good Night and Enjoy!

I knew it! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 7 years ago | (#20756039)

Last night I tried to track down some software I wanted to try out and I wanted to see if Demonoid had it. To my surprise the site wouldn come up. I thought it might have been a DNS issue or some site maintenance. Anyways it got me thinking that perhaps I should sign up with them during their start of the month registration process. Looks like that won't be happening. This site has to be a goldmine for the "authorities". Demonoids databases track information their subscribers download history such as whose a more of a leecher than others and RATES THEM on it! I guess it's their way enforcing good behavior. Hopefully this "feature" won't hurt those that did sign up and are now having their data combed through by the resident evil investigator whose only doing her/his job.

Oh Lord! I hope Isohunt doesn't get bitch slapped again with this shit! I love that site despite it being heavily policed by MediaJackoff!
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