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Vista Sales Rate Fell Last Quarter

kdawson posted more than 6 years ago | from the peaked-too-early dept.

Windows 449

Microsoft is not directly mentioning Vista demand while they brag about how much money they made last quarter, because sales fell. "[Microsoft] shipped approximately 28 million copies of Vista in the latest quarter ended September, or 9.3 million copies per month. Though the Windows developer pointed to 27 percent growth in business licenses and noted that many home users were buying the more lucrative Vista Home Premium or Ultimate editions, the rate represents a decline from the 10 million per month reported early in summer."

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449 comments

Isn`t it strange? (3, Funny)

Joseph1337 (1146047) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148879)

That in the same time the BSDM fans number fell down also?

XP Sales? (5, Interesting)

reaktor (949798) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148881)

What about sales of Windows XP?

Re:XP Sales? (5, Insightful)

hackstraw (262471) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149303)

What about sales of Windows XP?

I don't understand the play by play of each sale of Vista. The above is a fairly relevant question. Along with the summary "they brag about how much money they made last quarter". That is the bottom line. Most computers come with Microsoft software, even if the user does not intend to use the software. At work, most of the desktop and laptops PCs come with windows preinstalled (~90+%), and we either put Linux on them or a site licensed version of Windows XP.

Where I work, like 70 or more percent of the users prefer Linux as the OS. So, today in 2007, regardless of whether we use Windows or Linux, Microsoft gets a cut. How does Vista even come into the picture?

Another thing is that desktop OSes have stagnated. AFAIK, there is nothing significantly different between Windows 2000 and Vista (I'm not a Windows person, so give me some leeway here). That is 7 years of supposed progress. Sure there may be driver updates, and I believe that directX for games is limited on 2k, but the core features are about the same.

My point is that MS has to keep doing _something_ to stay somewhat current, but when it comes down to it, they have established themselves almost like the government in that they simply get a cut of everything anyone does. So Vista might be like Bob or ME. They are still in business.

Re:XP Sales? (4, Insightful)

LurkerXXX (667952) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149349)

Actually there are significant differences between 2000 and Vista. There are many nice new features in XP.

The problem is for myself and many many others, the downsides of Vista (hardware requirements, bugs in a zero revision OS, etc, etc) outweigh the benefits.

As time goes on and new patches/service packs come out, and people move to new faster hardware, those downsides will become somewhat less, and more people will likely switch to Vista that currently wouldn't consider it.

Re:XP Sales? (2, Funny)

LurkerXXX (667952) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149363)

er, make that nice new features in Vista.

Re:XP Sales? (4, Informative)

realdodgeman (1113225) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149403)

You should reclaim money for every single licence you don't use.
1. To save money
2. Not to fund MS.

What about XP sales? (1, Insightful)

justthinkit (954982) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148887)

Did they increase?

I am beginning to think that Microsoft made Vista as crappy as possible so that whatever "new" version of Windows they come out with after Vista will look like...well, like something actually worth buying.

Re:What about XP sales? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148915)

Somewhat (can't go into details)

The general trend you see here is still going strong: http://www.bbj.hu/main/news_31746.html [www.bbj.hu]

Re:What about XP sales? (2, Funny)

justthinkit (954982) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149047)

Considering how hard to impossible it is to get XP on your favorite hardware, XP is going like gangbusters.

Vista is the new Coke few want. Ch^H^HRant with me now...
We want our old Coke back!
We want our old Coke back!

Buy any machine aimed at businesses (2, Funny)

Cafe Alpha (891670) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149371)

It will have XP as an option or just come with XP

I just bought a Dell. They sell the same laptops as "small business" machines that they sell for the consumer market, for about $200 less if you count the service contract - in basic black instead of shiny mac colors, and XP is one of the features they're pushing. They know businesses don't want Vista that will break their programs with those new security features.

You know, if you write an OS that refuses to run any programs at all, then you're perfectly secure.

Re:What about XP sales? (5, Interesting)

thrash242 (697169) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149095)

Disclaimer: I am not a fan of Microsoft in any way and prefer Linux as an OS. My below post is being unbiased and discussing Vista purely as a mainstream, consumer OS.

Ahem.

Except it's not crappy. It's a perfectly fine Windows OS. It's better than XP in every way I can think of.

The problem, I think, is that it doesn't really have anything to get people who are content with XP to upgrade. That combined with all the FUD about Vista makes for poor sales. I got it because I built a new machine, mainly for gaming. My old machine still had Win2000 on it as I wasn't a fan of XP. Now it has Slackware.

Re:What about XP sales? (1)

ferpadro (1173267) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149143)

Most mature review of Vista ever written in Slashdot :)

Re:What about XP sales? (1)

Beyond_GoodandEvil (769135) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149357)

It's better than XP in every way I can think of.
Then you probably aren't thinking very hard. Or you just happen to disagree with most people who come in contact with the UAC or run a foul of the drivers issues. Either way we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Re:What about XP sales? (1)

khuber (5664) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149431)

Of course you can turn off UAC, though it still nags when you restart. I like Vista better than XP also.

Is this a sales/marketting website? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149251)

It's kind of amazing that Shitslot is interested in MS's quarterly sales figures. You would think they would be more focused on, say, why it is that Vista's sales was far higher than the entire installed base of Teh Lunix... forever. Or perhaps why it is that Windows 2000 has more users than Teh Lunix. Or why it is that Teh Lunix is only narrowly exceeding the installed base of Windows 98. Or why it is people have proven to prefer Windows, even if it means they have to use a crippled pirated copy, rather than getting a free copy of Teh Lunix.

Or, best of all, maybe they should just be asking themselves why it is the installed base of Teh Lunix has remained essentially flat for the past decade, and why Teh Lunix on teh desktop is such an abysmal failure.

Teh Lunix has been chasing Windows' tail lights for over a decade, and still haven't caught up to Windows 95. Could that possibly mean that chasing tail lights is not a strategy which is going to pay off for them? Move into mobile devices, move into phones, move into network appliances. Those are places Teh Lunix can succeed, and yet Teh Lunix is so focused on wannabe'ing Microsoft that they ignore areas they actually CAN succeed.

Re:What about XP sales? (5, Interesting)

Rascale (710336) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149291)

We run XP Pro Corporate edition at work, which allows distribution via disk imaging. When we needed 50 new XP licenses, our distributor told us XP Pro Corp. is no longer available, but we could buy Vista licenses, and "downgrade" to XP. We have absolutely no intention of running Vista.

I bet a large proportion of the increases in business licenses are companies like ours who need just need more XP licenses.

...What? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148891)

Who Cares? We all know what vista is and what it is not. Just purchase or use what meets your needs. Why is this article even posted?

Re:...What? (1)

El Lobo (994537) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149207)

Exatly. I wonder how many Ubuntu users have upgraded to the new one, or how many Read Had users are still using 6.0, or how many Mac Userswill upgrade to the new cat one year after today.

The days when a new release of an OS where a big evnet are back (only with Windows 95, actually, when peple where actually killing in some countries to get the damn thing). Today , having a new latest OS is not a big deal, and there are few people which would do that, just because.... I have upgraded to Vista because I am a geek, actually, nd love to test new things, but hell, my GF (yes I DO have one) is still running MacOS Panther, and gives a shit about new features).

Re:...What? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149279)

Just the daily Two Minute Hate.

Isn't this typically the slowest quarter? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148903)

For sales of anything?

Followed by a hockey stick type pattern towards the end of the year?

P.S. I'm no Vista user and find nothing compelling for me to upgrade from 2003.

Re:Isn't this typically the slowest quarter? (5, Informative)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149085)

No. There's a brief surge of 'back-to-school' sales in August, and then a small decline, with Christmas sales starting to pick up around Halloween. It's followed that pattern for a very long time.

Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1, Insightful)

tjstork (137384) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148907)

I would be willing to bet that over the counter sales of Vista, that is, upgrades and personal new system builders, exceeded that for those of any Linux by a fairly wide margin. Everyone cheers that Vista sales went down a bit, but honestly, I'd love to sell a few million units of just about anything.

Those companies that sell Linux's, such as Novell, are chump change compared to the Vista juggernaught. Novell did 21 million dollars of Linux for the 3rd quarter. Microsoft will blow through that in a couple of days of Vista sales... even excluding OEMS. Really, because Linux is open source, there's really no point to selling it at all.

One wonders, too, just how well Linux would survive an economic downturn. With mixed economic signs coming out of the west, one has to imagine that previously generous developers will descend on each other like wolves, when time comes to make mortgage payments.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148961)

One wonders, too, just how well Linux would survive an economic downturn.
Just fine. It's already survived more than one.

one has to imagine that previously generous developers will descend on each other like wolves, when time comes to make mortgage payments.
You seem to be assuming that everyone in the world is as fucking stupid as americans. This is not the case, some of us remember "neither or a borrower nor a lender be", and don't take stupidly large loans from unpleasant people like those running banks.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (5, Interesting)

Pedrito (94783) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148989)

I would be willing to bet that over the counter sales of Vista, that is, upgrades and personal new system builders, exceeded that for those of any Linux by a fairly wide margin.

Perhaps true, but as someone who writes software for Windows for a living, I managed for about 2 days with Vista before I was overcome by the overwhelming urge to replace it with XP. It is, by far, the suckiest POS OS I've ever uses and I will do everything I can to avoid ever having to use it. Most people I know have had a similar Vista experience. I don't know a single person who has said, "Wow, Vista has really made my computer so much better." On the other hand, a lot of people who upgrade from Windows 98 to XP did say that about XP.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (2, Interesting)

shaggy43 (21472) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149297)

The Vista Media Center experience is a *lot* better, but it's still the only part of Vista which got better. :)

For those of us with MCE's as our Tivo, and some specific problems with MCE2005, it's a good upgrade.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (2, Interesting)

symbolic (11752) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149025)

With all the nonsense that Microsoft pulls with its OEMs, one would also have to wonder what qualifies as a "sale". And, just because someone buys a box with Vista installed, doesn't mean that Vista stays installed. How many eventually choose to upgrade back to Windows XP?

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

Threni (635302) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149077)

> And, just because someone buys a box with Vista installed, doesn't mean that Vista stays installed. How many eventually choose to upgrade back to
> Windows XP?

Why should Microsoft care what you do with it once you've bought it? "Oh, please don't uninstall it! Boo hoo - they're not running our new software - they prefer the old one!"

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

perlchild (582235) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149121)

They care, because if you uninstall vista, and someone tries to seel you something that requires vista, you have to say no deal, or go back to vista(and if you used the new oem program to get xp back from vista, your license to vista got expired)

Windows STILL got a monopoly people, they will until some alternative to office starts seeing numbers like office, AND people who try to send you office documents get "could you send me that in this other format? Office's standard format is so bad, I can't work with it" for a response.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (4, Funny)

LingNoi (1066278) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149313)

All this political in-fighting between the XP and Vista communities just proves that Windows is not ready for desktop.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (2, Insightful)

Tango42 (662363) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149063)

Sales of Linux is a meaningless number. If you look at total installs, it's much better. I expect it's still less than Vista, and will continue to be until it works properly out the box (which hopefully won't be long, it's getting much better, but it still requires quite complicated configuration with certain, not that uncommon, hardware).

As for an economic downturn... something tells me the free OS will do better than the expensive one when everyone suddenly runs out of money...

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

the eric conspiracy (20178) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149071)

Yes, Vista sells a lot more over the counter than Linux does. But Linux is not about traditional economic models or sales channels. Such comparisons are like saying that falcons fly much faster than pine trees.

Linux has already been through several economic downturns. The dot com crash was particularly hard on developers, but there were no signs of any issues in the open source community,

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

canuck57 (662392) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149089)

One wonders, too, just how well Linux would survive an economic downturn. With mixed economic signs coming out of the west, one has to imagine that previously generous developers will descend on each other like wolves, when time comes to make mortgage payments.

Linux always makes it's best gains when Microsoft changes their OS. And with an economic downturn, companies will be looking to tighten up the budgets, this will include the cost of the OS. And the TCO of well run Linux can go up against MS-Windows anytime.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149105)

>I would be willing to bet that over the counter sales of Vista,
>that is, upgrades and personal new system builders, exceeded
>that for those of any Linux by a fairly wide margin.

So what? I mean, people who use Linux at home tend
to download it for *free*, don't they? I would think that it should be
obvious by now, but Linux is *not* windows! Linux is *not*
a clone of windows, or a rebranded windows, or ... anything
windows. With 356+ Linux distros and growing, Linux
isn't about marketing or hype, it's about answering customers'
needs for an affordable OS that provides the tools they need
to get their work done.

-- Johnny doesn't see why it's so hard for people to understand
what Libre software is about.

Nice troll (5, Insightful)

SmallFurryCreature (593017) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149109)

What happens to linux during an economic downturn, what you mean like the one we had when the bubble burst? People all of sudden realized that no, you do NOT require expensive systems to run servers, you can do it with a whiteboxes running linux. You pick up sun gear for a song as all the dotcoms who had splurged on unneeded equipment went bust, while the likes of google (linux) continued on, because they kept their costs under control.

Your troll sounds reasonable, until you remember linux has been around long enough to have seen what you predict, and came out stronger then ever.

As for MS making lots more money, that is true enough (it is also spending a lot more) but if what you say then MS shouldn't feel at all threatned, so why is it acting like it is? You are sayinga mighty lion is not going to be scared by a little dog, while behind you that lion is trying to climb a tree to get away from it.

Most opensource developers already got good jobs, they do this on the side, because they want too. You are predicting that people will stop their hobby when the economy goes bad? A hobby that doesn't really cost anything except time? You got a weird view of human nature.

I got a next troll for you, linux will die when the developers discover girls.

Re:Nice troll (2, Funny)

tjstork (137384) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149179)

I got a next troll for you, linux will die when the developers discover girls.

no, it would get more crazy, because every vi nut will find himself married to a girl who extolls the virtues of emacs.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (2, Insightful)

His Shadow (689816) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149117)

"One wonders, too, just how well Linux would survive an economic downturn." Yes. How could an essentially free OS possibly survive when people have less money? I imagine the idiotic price structure for Vista would become a little more apparent in such a case.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149155)

What kind of fucking retarded moderator tagged this insightful?

First, it's a troll.
Second, Linux is difficult to sell. Can you guess why? Yes, you can download the goddamn OS free, legit.

If everyone could download Vista for free and legit, it wouldn't touch Linux "sales".

Let's compare apples to apples.

Fucking worthless troll.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149205)

Inaccurate. People did not buy Vista, they were forced to have it on new hardware, it's a monopoly market.
Even if they did sell the software box over the counter, Linux isn't sold like that. Better to compare software box sales of Vista vs. XP or Leopard. I bet Leopard outsells it that way 10 to 1.

Vista is an ugly looking flop, get over it.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149353)

You got it. I have an HP laptop that has Vista. It sucks. I can't run quite a few applications. HP does not provide XP video drivers (although they exist, they just removed them from their website). Of course, there are no Linux drivers either.

I have tried to return the laptop to HP since it doesn't run some "Vista Ready" applications and I am totally frustrated. They are ignoring me now.

I am advising all my friends and relatives to make do with their current computer. I don't think that SP1 is going to fix Vista either. It's a piece of shit.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

EvilRyry (1025309) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149271)

Its funny how you can make money with a new OS, no matter what everyone thinks about it, when you are have a monopoly on the Operating System and Office Suite markets.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (1)

FranTaylor (164577) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149289)

In other news, Milli Vanilli sold one album last week, outselling all the freely downloadable music by an infinite margin.

Re:Still outsold all Linuxes combined (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149415)

I love it; Halo III has reached over 300MM in sales. AT this rate, by December it will exceed all of Red Hat's 2006 Revenue. Linux retail and support is just not the business I want to be in.

Btw: why are they even publishing this source article? What, was VISTA sales supposed to go up for ever? A lousy attempt at a spoiler. We'll be having these, "why MS' number really arent any good" conversations in 2015 no doubt.

With Server set to hit the shelves for 2008, next year should pretty hot as well. I'm psyched; Aside for being happy with my Vista/Aero experience, I bought a truckload of MSFT and ORACLE when the price was low a few years back...

percent? (1)

JeffSh (71237) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148909)

27 percent growth in business licenses? It's real easy to have a 27% growth on near-zero. I hate statistics.

Re:percent? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149241)

27 percent growth in business licenses? It's real easy to have a 27% growth on near-zero. I hate statistics.

there are lies, damned lies and statistics.

Secret plan (1)

edwardpickman (965122) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148917)

Actually Vista was a secret plan to increase the value of Apple stock he quietly bought several years ago. He's wringing his hands at the thought of all the money he's going to make off the next service pack, cue evil laugh.

Re:Secret plan (2, Funny)

MightyYar (622222) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149087)

That stock was apparently sold off before 2002. The shame of it is, that $150 million investment would be worth about $6.5 billion today!

As much as I would love for this to be true... (1)

Sergeant Pepper (1098225) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148923)

I have to ask: is that much of a difference statistically significant? 700,000 on 10 million?

Re:As much as I would love for this to be true... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148945)

7%

Re:As much as I would love for this to be true... (1)

Sergeant Pepper (1098225) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149007)

I got that, thanks. But that says nothing about whether it is statistically significant. I'd check myself but I remember far too little of my Statistics class. :/

Re:As much as I would love for this to be true... (1)

Tango42 (662363) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149161)

You would need to establish a null hypothesis first, ie. what distribution you expect the figures to follow if there hasn't been a real decrease. Perhaps a normal distribution centred around the previous figures? Then you have to determine a standard deviation, and I have no idea what to pick there. Perhaps a statistics expert can help. I'm an undergrad maths student, but avoid stats where possible, so can't help much.

Nevertheless, I'd expect a 7% drop to be statistically significant given any reasonable assumptions. It's not, however, very surprising.

Need to seasonaly adjust numbers (1)

AHumbleOpinion (546848) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149445)

You would need to establish a null hypothesis first, ie. what distribution you expect the figures to follow if there hasn't been a real decrease. Perhaps a normal distribution centred around the previous figures? Then you have to determine a standard deviation, and I have no idea what to pick there. Perhaps a statistics expert can help. I'm an undergrad maths student, but avoid stats where possible, so can't help much.

Nevertheless, I'd expect a 7% drop to be statistically significant given any reasonable assumptions. It's not, however, very surprising.


Your methodology is half way there, don't avoid stats. ;-) Unexpectedly, the stats class I had in business school was better than the stats class I had from the math department as a CS undergraduate.

You don't know if the drop is really 7%. Raw month to month or quarter to quarter data can be misleading. At a minimum you need to seasonally adjust the numbers. You may also want to compare the adoption rate of Vista to XP.

Also worth noting (5, Funny)

thanksforthecrabs (1037698) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148925)

Ubuntu sales remained flat...

Vista Sales Numbers (1)

leoxx (992) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148929)

I assume those numbers also include the copy I received (and promptly wiped) when I bought my new Thinkpad.

Re:Vista Sales Numbers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21148981)

Why wipe it did you??

Re:Vista Sales Numbers (2, Interesting)

canuck57 (662392) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149171)

I assume those numbers also include the copy I received (and promptly wiped) when I bought my new Thinkpad.

Yes, you know it does. You also know it includes those that got wiped for XP or Linux. What would be a good indicator is how many have shipped versus how many "called home" last week for updates. The actual numbers of running Vista instances is greatly exaggerated.

My guess is Microsoft will keep that number very very quiet. If Vista was a car, it would be known as an Edsel.

Re:Vista Sales Numbers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149419)

If Vista was a car, it would be known as an Edsel.


No, it would be known as gasoline you put in a car. Hard to find an automobile analogy because those people have to make reasonably good products to sell a lot of them. Microsoft simply needs to strangle any possible threat. If you morons think that it's been threatened, take a look at its market capitalization compared to anything that threatens it. It can just buy any company that dares to threaten Vista's eventual ubiquity and Monkey boy has just announced plans to buy something like one company per month. You douchebags pay for Vista whether you use it or not. Microsoft remains the world's third-largest corporation (market capitalization) no matter what you do in your parent's basement.

Eventually, when you get a job, Microsoft will require you to actually use Vista. Unless you're willing to work in some marginal little place that Microsoft doesn't care about enough to strangle, or someplace far enough off the grid that no electronic commerce lockin matters.

Further down the line, you will also be required to use Vista at home. Unless you're willing to forego any popular entertainment delivered electronically.

Essentially, you idiots are like people who cheered everytime the British Empire or the Roman Empire or whatever empire ran into some trouble. Step back and you will see that for every little victory over evil empires commemorated in song, there are countless defeats.

Vista Ultimate (2, Insightful)

paulhar (652995) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148937)

I'm running Ultimate on a few computers and can't for the life of me think what features are worth paying the extra for.
Bitlocker - would love to use it but my laptop has a RAID-0 set of drives so bitlocker just hangs.
Dreamscene - movie instead of wallpaper. Shame I have to open windows that then obscure it *cough*
Texas Holdem - rarely play it
Language packs - yeah - dead useful

err... that's it.

Looking towards the ultimate site - nothing happening of note: http://windowsultimate.com/Default.aspx [windowsultimate.com]

Yawn.

Re:Vista Ultimate (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149067)

Um, your LAPTOP has a Raid0 set of drives?

What laptops house multiple hard drives let alone a raid controller?

Unless of course you are using software raid with multiple partitions of a single physical drive, which I hope you aren't because it would make you an ignorant moron.

Re:Vista Ultimate (2, Informative)

SEMW (967629) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149131)

I'm running Ultimate on a few computers and can't for the life of me think what features are worth paying the extra for.
Presuming you're comparing with Home Premium rather than Business, the most obvious things which come to mind are dual processor support (*cough*Artifical-Market-Segmentation*/cough*), and Volume Shadow Copy (i.e. Windows' version of Leopard's Time Machine, sans fancy interface). VSC can actually be pretty damn useful even if you have a proper backup system, if only for its ability to be used as an ad-hoc file versioning system.

Then there's the enterprise & semi-server stuff like ability to join a domain and IIS, but if you're considering Ultimate against HP, that's probably not relevent to you.

Re:Vista Ultimate (1)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149167)

They actually make you buy the ultimate version to get multiple languages!? Thats INSANE! Especially in this world of increased globalization. I have used 4 different languages on my mac in the past month, and it's so easy and above all free. I haven't really messed around much with multiple languages on Linux, but from what I understand its not all that hard and of course free. Languages aren't the only thing thats free in the rest of the world but not windows. Other examples include ssh clients and compilers to name but a few.

Microsoft must be really living in the past where they could actually get away with this stuff, but their competition has improved IMMENSELY in the past 6 years. It seems like Microsoft just doesn't want to acknowledge that, and is trying to get away with stuff they could(and did!) get away with 10 years ago, such as nickel and diming people on these little things that should be a part of every mainstream PC OS.....

Users going for home premium? (2)

onefriedrice (1171917) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148941)

> many home users were buying the more lucrative Vista Home Premium or
> Ultimate editions...

Obviously. The "Basic" version (which is still considerably more expensive than Mac OS X Leopard or certainly Linux) is crippled to the point of ridiculous. It doesn't even come with the ability to play DVD's; instead it will take you to a Microsoft page where you can buy the necessary plug-ins.

This is the way it should be:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RsOIdF_DdY [youtube.com]

Re:Users going for home premium? (1)

SEMW (967629) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149217)

Obviously. The "Basic" version ... is crippled to the point of ridiculous. It doesn't even come with the ability to play DVD's...
No version of Windows XP came with the ability (i.e. a codec) to play DVDs. Nor does any version of Linux that remains simultaneously free and legal. That doesn't mean Windows XP & Linux are "crippled to the point of ridiculous", it's just a licensing issue.

BTW, I don't know what strange maths you use to reach the conclusion that "The "Basic" version ... is still considerably more expensive than Mac OS X Leopard":

Vista Home Basic upgrade: List Price - $100; Amazon.com price - $59.
Leopard upgrade: List price - $130; Amazon.com price: $110.

I make that as Leopard being just under double Vista Basic's price from Amazon.

Re:Users going for home premium? (1)

0123456789 (467085) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149333)

BTW, I don't know what strange maths you use to reach the conclusion that "The "Basic" version ... is still considerably more expensive than Mac OS X Leopard":

Vista Home Basic upgrade: List Price - $100; Amazon.com price - $59.
Leopard upgrade: List price - $130; Amazon.com price: $110.

I make that as Leopard being just under double Vista Basic's price from Amazon.

How about if you ignore upgrade versions and go for full versions: Vista Home Basic: List Price - $200; Amazon.com: $180 Leopard: List Price - $130; Amazon.com: $110.

Hmm, which one is 'considerably more expensive'?

Re:Users going for home premium? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149485)

No version of Windows XP came with the ability (i.e. a codec) to play DVDs. Nor does any version of Linux that remains simultaneously free and legal.

Linux Mint and Vector Linux both come with the ability to play DVDs on free versions. Both are legal where I live. I've tried both and settled on Linux Mint which I am posting from. Too bad that the U.S. still hasn't fixed the deranged patent system that blocks Americans from legally using them.

Not news. (3, Insightful)

W2k (540424) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148949)

Vista is no longer "new", so obviously there is less demand. Those who want it already own it, those who don't aren't going to buy it, but it's still being shipped on millions of new PC's. This goes for pretty much any product, sales are strong at the beginning then gradually fade. I would expect Vista sales to continue dropping, with another spike after SP1 is released and more people feel like trying it out.

Apart from not being new, this also says nothing about the relative merits of Vista as an OS. In fact, if Vista sales had continued to increase right when people are saving up for the holidays, that would be extremely impressive, and quite unexpected.

Re:Not news. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149451)

I would expect Vista sales to continue dropping, with another spike after SP1 is released and more people feel like trying it out.
 
Probably SP1 will also help tremendously with Vista uptake in businesses. However, does this mean that there is an incentive for Microsoft to rush out SP1 as fast as possible, and will SP2 now be the one to wait for? You can't deny that MS is aware that many wait for SP1 to be released in order to consider using their new OS for production.

Sales rate of product falls after peak at intro! (1)

reidconti (219106) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148951)

... film at 11.

Not very surprising (5, Insightful)

norbac (1113477) | more than 6 years ago | (#21148979)

Why is it not surprising that this is how the quarterly earnings report makes it onto Slashdot? The title could have read "Microsoft Reports 27% Revenue Growth; Fastest First Quarter Since 1999", or that Microsoft stock has reached its highest point it over 5 years. It might be notable that the Entertainment division was this quarter profitable, or that income in the client division still grew 25% (claims of slowing Vista sales notwithstanding).

As much as folks here love to think that MSFT is a sinking ship, it's having its healthiest growth in years.

Re:Not very surprising (1)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149165)

You know, you're not going to get very many mod points thinking like that. Try working on your delivery a bit.

Re:Not very surprising (1)

canuck57 (662392) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149197)

As much as folks here love to think that MSFT is a sinking ship, it's having its healthiest growth in years.

It will be short lived. People are running out and buying XP to replace Vista, and many are not happy about it. Am I glad I bought my last PC just before Vista came out.

Re:Not very surprising (1)

tjstork (137384) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149285)

It will be short lived. People are running out and buying XP to replace Vista, and many are not happy about it. Am I glad I bought my last PC just before Vista came out.

No, its because X-Box is kicking ass.

Fact: *BSD is dying (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149001)

"It's dead, Jim."

R.I.P.

Anyone have a torrent? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149009)

Seriously, I am looking for the RTM ISO that is on MSDN. Filename is "en_windows_vista_x86_dvd_X12-34293.iso". I found a few relatively ancient torrents that have only one or two seeders and I only get about 10 kb/s. The only recent and well seeded torrents I can find are these hacked ISOs with all the updates and cracks built in; I am looking for an untouched ISO.

product reputation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149015)

Sure, you sold them the stuff, but you can fool most people only once. As they say, you can sell bad milk at the normal price without a problem. But if you do that, *next week* you won't sell any milk, however good your quality is.

9.3 million is bad? (1)

yayotters (833158) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149017)

Maybe it fell a bit, but I would still consider selling 9.3 million copies a month pretty damn good. Say each sold for ~$100, since it doesn't state if they were OEM or Retail copies, that's still 930 million dollars a month in sales in just Microsoft's Operating System division.

How could Microsoft screw up so bad? (3, Informative)

MichaelCrawford (610140) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149031)

Even the Windows driver guy where I work says Vista is awful. I haven't heard one good thing about it since it shipped, and I've heard a lot of bad things. I've never tried it, but I understand that it breaks a great deal of software.

Now, some of that breakage is the result of improved security, but our Windows driver guy tells me that the disruption caused by the security causes a lot of users to just disable the security.

Also, I understand that MS provided a version to a few top-tier OEMs that didn't require product activation by end users, so as not to annoy them. This resulted in a crack being written by the w4r3z community that doesn't require activation at all! (look for it on a p2p network near you.) The product activation is very sensitive to hardware changes, more so than XP, so that legitimate users get no end of hassle from Vista, while pirates aren't inconvenienced at all.

Surely Microsoft must have had some regular people beta test Vista. And surely some - maybe all - of these people must have told MS that Vista shouldn't ship in the state it's in.

My wife is thinking about getting a new laptop. I said to her "Make sure you don't get Vista, it's really screwed up" and you know what she said? "Oh, yeah I know. Apple runs these TV ads with a young guy who's supposed to be a Mac, and a guy who looks like Bill Gates who's supposed to be a PC. And whenever they try to talk to each other, this Secret Service agent interrupts them to make sure it's OK."

Remember the Twiggy drive? Apple tried to manufacture their own floppy disk drive for the Apple II. They were never able to get it to work. There was a big shareholder lawsuit. I could really see a shareholder lawsuit coming from Vista. Corporate officers have a fiduciary duty - that means they're legally obligated - to look after shareholder interests. And Billy and Steve Balmer really screwed up.

Re:How could Microsoft screw up so bad? (1)

SEMW (967629) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149245)

My wife is thinking about getting a new laptop. I said to her "Make sure you don't get Vista, it's really screwed up" and you know what she said? "Oh, yeah I know. Apple runs these TV ads with a young guy who's supposed to be a Mac, and a guy who looks like Bill Gates who's supposed to be a PC. And whenever they try to talk to each other, this Secret Service agent interrupts them to make sure it's OK."
You mean that Apple advertisments claim Vista is bad? Really? Say it isn't so! Ah well, that settles the issue then: everyone knows that marketing and advertisments never lie.

Re:How could Microsoft screw up so bad? (1)

nwoolls (520606) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149365)

Thanks for such a long post on what you "understand", though you haven't even tried the OS.

Re:How could Microsoft screw up so bad? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149427)

Now, some of that breakage is the result of improved security, but our Windows driver guy tells me that the disruption caused by the security causes a lot of users to just disable the security.

This is of course still true in XP work environments. I started new job recently and when they finished setting up my network account so I could log in, one of the first things our department IT person told me was to make sure to disable the phishing protection on IE 7 simply because it slows everything down so much. I had never used IE 7 before, and sure enough, after it was disabled the system (the whole system, not just IE) was *considerably* faster.

It is frightening how blase people are about computer security. In my last job the computers would go to a locked screen after something like 3 minutes of inactivity. It was horribly annoying and most people would have disabled it if IT hadn't restricted access to the screen saver. (Honestly, I would have changed it to 8 or 10 minutes, but I really don't think most people there would have thought to change the timeout instead of disabling it.) This was an environment where unfamiliar faces were almost always stopped before they made it very far down a hallway, much less into a location where computers were. At my new job the computers *never* go to a locked screen, and I'm sure that I'm the only person in the department who locks their screen when leaving for lunch. The only real security for the office computers is the locks on the door, and sometimes they don't latch properly. This is an office that is off a hallway that likely sees thousands of people walk through in the course of any given weekday.

Note: Posting AC just in case. I don't want anyone to get taken advantage of because I posted about my employer's poor security.

The lack of "buzz" is noteworthy (4, Interesting)

dpbsmith (263124) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149069)

Something really does feel different from previous Windows OS introductions.

My nontechnical friends and acquaintance do make light conversation about things they've heard of in the news, and will ask me, as a "computer genius," what I'm using at work. Previous Windows upgrades got mentioned in casual talk. Usually there are a least a few people who want to be the first kid on the block with it.

Not this time.

People talk about the iPhone, they talk about their newly-installed Verizon FiOS, their iPods, what brands of Wintel computers I trust, whether they can run Windows on the Intel Macs.

I don't detect any consumer excitement about Vista. Nobody has asked me if they should upgrade. And a couple of people have asked me whether I agree with friends of their who told them to avoid it.

Unscientific sample? You bet.

Re:The lack of "buzz" is noteworthy (5, Interesting)

moosesocks (264553) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149359)

I would peg this on a few different things:

1) Vista was late. Really late. Many of the 'killer' features were torn out, leaving an OS that had very little new to offer. Apple's list of improvements between OS versions is very specific and tangible, addressing individual concerns. Time Machine sticks out as being a good example of this.
2) Unlike Windows XP, which was a significant upgrade, and replaced an OS (98/Me!) that many consumers were unhappy with, people are generally still happy with XP. For the most part, all of the complaints people had with 98/Me were solved by XP.
3) It was marketed poorly, and as I've already mentioned, it didn't have all that many tangible selling points. They could have put a huge emphasis on its supposedly improved resistance to viruses and spyware, but this would be admitting that XP was deeply and fundamentally flawed, which probably wouldn't sit too well with consumers either. This was a lot more noticeable against the backdrop of Apple's marketing campaigns. Apple's had arguably the most successful marketing campaign of any company in any industry over the past few years.
4) Many consumers felt abandoned by Microsoft, after they stopped improving IE, and did virtually nothing to stop the pandemic proliferation of viruses and spyware until it was far too late. The fact that they strongly urge customers to purchase a 3rd-party AntiVirus reeks of incompetence, even to ordinary consumers.

Come to think of it, Vista is probably the best thing that's ever happened to Apple.

Re:The lack of "buzz" is noteworthy (2, Insightful)

Shados (741919) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149423)

point 1) also has a twist to it. When XP came out, a lot of businesses (and even some home users) were still -considering- or planning switching to Windows 2000. XP came quite early, so people were not ready to switch.

Thus, even though XP was uther garbage when it came out, no one noticed, no one really cared, and by the time anyone was really considering switching, SP1 was out, and -then- XP was good.

With Vista, people were ready a LONG time ago and were WAITING. So the usual trick that Microsoft pulls off (come out with crap, and patch it LONG before anyone even was ready to upgrade) didn't work. People WERE ready to upgrade the day Vista came out... they didn't want to wait for SP1 like they did for XP. Things will be a bit more interesting when SP1 come out (I mean come on, Windows NT was garbage until at LEAST SP5...and didn't stop bluescreening all over until SP6...)

Re:The lack of "buzz" is noteworthy (1)

Cafe Alpha (891670) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149413)

I wonder how many people remember that MS is cooperating so that SD DVD's and Blue-Rays will play in low res or not at all.

That sure must have taken the wind out of "media edition" sales. And made everyone hate Microsoft.

Cool, my new OS will refuse to play movies for me, and won't let me copy DRMed mp3s. I'm feeling the love.

Slashdot: Boring TidBits of Nothing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149091)


Is Slashdot now trying to compete with the Wall Street Urinal for reporting trifling trivial statistics?

Try some NEWS: ie. Bush Planning To Bomb Any Country With A Democracy.

Thanks for nothing.

Cheers,
K. Trout

P.S.: Fuck Bush [whitehouse.org]

But really... (1)

His Shadow (689816) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149169)

In a world where the Microsoft hegemony determines the OS on your sub 800 dollar PC and the vasy majority have no choice but to accept the Windows tax (absolutely none of the desk jockeys sitting at any major company have a choice when the Mouse Clicking Solutions Experts continue buy nothing but Windows), I can't imagine anything more useless than touting Window's "sales". They have an illegal monopoly which they continue to squeeze for cash. The ridiculous prices and 7 version shell game that MS is playing with Vista is certainly enough evidence of Microsoft's greed, arrogance and marketing stupidity.

Re:But really... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149219)

> and marketing stupidity.

Seeing as how they are probably reaching their goals as an organization, this would indicate the opposite: good marketing.

Leopard sales vs XP vs Vista (1)

failedlogic (627314) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149187)

For lack of space in the title, I should also add illegal downloads of (Windows and Leopard).

I think a fair assumption to make is that a large majority of Vista sales are on new computers. I think the interesting 'statistic' will be the number of Leopard sales in coming months as compared to Windows purchases (and downloads!). These purchases will likely be a part of a new PC purchase (or with some MS products) the purchase of hardware + OEM license .... who'd pay full retail for the OS?

Anyways, with the new Leopard features, it will be interesting to see whose marketing non-geek consumers believe come time of a new computer purchase. And, whether some people choose the extra expense of buying new apps for a new Mac or choose to continue using XP for fear apps won't work with Vista. Or those that choose no OS on thier PC.

In the end, I think Vista's image is a bit tarnished in the media and word-of-mouth. I have used it. I'm keeping XP on my computer. I think a Service pack and a media campaign is what MS needs, to recover the public image, regardless of whether technically or not Vista needs it.

Yet more TwitterShit (tm) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149189)

Now please wash your hands.

The only reason Vista is selling (4, Insightful)

QuietLagoon (813062) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149215)

is the home market, where there is little choice. If you buy a PC, you pretty much get Vista installed.

The business market has a little more choice available (XP is still being sold to businesses), and Windows XP is still the big seller.

So what does this tell us? When there is a choice, XP is purchased instead of Vista. Microsoft tis so desperate to make it appear as if Vista is selling, that they are counting the Vista->XP "downgrade" as a Vista license in use.

Re:The only reason Vista is selling (1)

Shados (741919) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149385)

While still fairly far from Windows' market share, Mac OSX is now a solid competitor in the home market, so there definately is a choice, and people are now well aware of Macs and that they are alternatives. In business, MacOSX is harder to get through, but in home market, there's no issues. People are just afraid of change, or (more rarely) don't want it.

I'm in the later, I really dislike Apple, so its not like I'm a fanboy trying to push his favored OS... but this isn't 10 years ago... There IS a choice, and a lot of customers know it (well, Apple stores ARE hard to miss).

Why downgrade on a new high end pc? (1)

shlepp (796599) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149321)

Who in their right mind would downgrade to XP on a brand new high end machine with a 6400+ x2 and a Geforce 8800? That would be retarded because you wouldn't get anything out of it, instead you would be shooting yourself in the foot with a downgrade to XP instead of running Vista Enterprise/Ultimate x64.

Re:Why downgrade on a new high end pc? (4, Insightful)

Donniedarkness (895066) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149395)

There are reasons to not use Vista beyond speed.

Compatibility, for example. Or maybe most people just don't like the interface? How about the fact that it wants me to reactivate my product every few weeks?

Regardless of how high-end my computer is, I do not want Windows Vista. XP handles my printing. For everything else, there's Ubuntu.

Re:Why downgrade on a new high end pc? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149409)

Who in their right mind would not upgrade from vista to a linux distro?

ONLY 9.3 per month? (1)

rattlesoft (1086131) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149329)

I'm shocked, you're saying, in a sense, a copy of Vista to every citizen in Michigan each month (Appox 10 million people in Michigan). How many copies of Ubuntu are downloaded each month? Even if sales dropped to 1 million per month thats like selling a copy of Vista to each citizen in New Mexico each month.

You got to be kidding me.. (5, Insightful)

LingNoi (1066278) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149331)

Journal written by twitter (104583)
Twitter the troll [slashdot.org] made slashdot main page? WTF?!

and posted by kdawson
Oh right, nm.

That's so anti-MS (1)

caywen (942955) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149343)

Sigh. Vista sales only went down because it's buggy, slow, and upstaged by Leopard. I mean, for an OS that drains battery life 50% faster, what could you possibly expect?? Stop bashing Microsoft all the time!

Re:That's so anti-MS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21149389)

Upstaged by Leopard? You're kidding, right?

You probably think everyone uses Ubuntu since Dell started selling it, too.

Actually, Vista's done quite well (2)

Toreo asesino (951231) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149447)

Vista helped Microsoft, yet again, beat wall-street expectations (the people that are paid to know about these things) - http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2007/10/26/microsoft-q1-profits [theinquirer.net] ...and it's sold 88 million copies so far. Not bad for an operating system that "doesn't work".

And? (1)

pdusen (1146399) | more than 6 years ago | (#21149467)

All sales go down over time, of everything. Slashdot, please report real news.
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