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PlayStation 3 'Hacker's Paradise', Sales Up

Zonk posted more than 6 years ago | from the probably-unrelated dept.

Security 101

Via Game|Life, a story on The Age site suggests that password crackers are really enjoying their PlayStation 3s ... and not because Ratchet is a great game. An NZ-based security researcher stated at a local security conference that the supercomputing power of the PS3 is being put to more nefarious uses than Folding@home. "Speed is important to "brute force" password cracking, which relies on guessing all possible combinations of the characters that make up the password. The accelerated technique means passwords protecting Office, PDF, ZIP and Lotus Notes ID files can be cracked with breathtaking speed. However, many other password types are handled more securely in software and remain unaffected by Breese's claimed speed increase." Sony does have some good news this week, though. Either the holiday season or a price drop here in the states has led to a massive sales increase.

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Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (5, Informative)

Serge_Tomiko (1178965) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505317)

I just got it yesterday, and I was blown away. It really does look like a Pixar movie. The background detail is just incredible. Hopefully, future PS3 games will show the system's potential as well as Ratchet and Clank.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

Neon Spiral Injector (21234) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505621)

Off topic, but I want to ask someone... I assume you own the release version of the game. I played the demo and just got pissed at the camera controls. They are mirrored from what I'm used. In the actual release, can the camera pan be configured to be inverted?

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

xero314 (722674) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505759)

Yes, you can reverse the camera controls (both axis) in the full release, much like any other sane game. Reversing the camera is usually the first thing I do (unless the game got it right the first time which is rare)

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

aichpvee (631243) | more than 6 years ago | (#21546387)

Ratchet & Clank is one of those rare games. Most games use the camera control to manipulate where the camera is looking (this started on Playstation in 1995 and just about everyone defaults to this now) rather than the position of the camera. I'm pretty sure this is why the GP didn't like it.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

xero314 (722674) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554181)

I was pretty sure that RC controls default to controlling where the camera is looking, but since I nearly always have to go in and reverse controls I may have confused it with all the other games. Why the change took place in 95 I have no idea, but personally I think it was a mistake. The camera controls should be similar to flight controls or controlling the characters head bad grabbing the hair on the scruff of their neck. Pull up to look down, pull down to look up etc.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

GundamFan (848341) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505855)

Without having played the demo and without any specific insight into how you expect a camera to behave, I can say that I had little if any issues with the camera in the retail version of Ratchet and Clank. I didn't see any options for adjusting the camera while I was playing but I admit that I didn't really look that hard.

R&C is actually one of the better platformers I have played in years, I would recommend it to any PS3 owner but I wouldn't necessarily recommend that someone buy a PS3 with just this game as justification.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506171)

Ratchet is the only thing that saddens me about my decision not to buy a PS3. All of my other favorite series (FF, MGS, and LoK, primarily) either jumped the shark or ended in the PS2 days, but Ratchet and Clank never disappointed...

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

loafula (1080631) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506491)

FFXIII and MGS4 are both set to be released as PS3 exclusives in 2008

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

RSquaredW (969317) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506679)

He said "jumped the shark", didn't he?

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509355)

Neither one interests me. Both series "Jumped the shark (FF X-2, MGS3)." Legacy of Kain ended with Defiance. R&C isn't compelling enough to buy a system for.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

Andrew Kismet (955764) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509615)

Metal Gear (Solid or not) is a professional shark-jumping series. I'll be surprised if we don't see an actual, physical shark to jump before the series ends.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (4, Insightful)

RogueyWon (735973) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505881)

Why was parent modded off-topic? The game is mentioned in the summary and is probably one of the factors behind the big increase in PS3 sales. I've not picked up my copy yet (too many other things to finish off first - Persona 3, Mass Effect and Crysis at the top of the list), but it does look astoundingly good.

I think, more than anything else, the factor behind the PS3's sales increase will be the fact that it is finally getting some games worth playing. For almost a year, Resistance: Fall of Man has been the only really top-notch title on the system, but this is definitely starting to change now.

Last time around, the PS2 won the sales war by on overwhelming margin despite being both the most expensive system and the least impressive technically. Why? The games. First of all, it had the key, core exclusive franchises that move systems like no other; Final Fantasy, Metal Gear Solid and Gran Turismo. However, this alone wouldn't have been enough. More important was the fact that the PS2 was effectively guaranteed to pick up any game that wasn't a 1-platform exclusive. Plenty of games didn't get an Xbox or a Cube release, despite appearing elsewhere, but despite the pain involved in the development, the PS2 got basically everything. If your family only plans to own one console and doesn't intend to change it for a good few years, this is a huge factor.

So far in this generation, no system has managed to establish a similar position on games. The PS3 is notoriously short of titles and most PS3s, my own included, are still mostly used as shiny and expensive PS2s. None of the franchises that helped Sony out so much last time have hit the machine yet. The Wii is an absolute desert for quality titles outside of a tiny number of Nintendo's own franchise games. In Japan, at least, its monthly sales lead has evaporated as the PS3 makes a fightback. The 360 is probably the best placed on games, due to its greater age, but it hardly has what I would call a commanding lead. MS have done a good job of attracting a more balanced line-up and, in Forza 2, have almost neutralised the advantage held by Sony with one of their "big" games (Gran Turismo), but they've still got a long way to go in some markets and in throwing off their image as the "fps" console.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

king-manic (409855) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506725)

Why was parent modded off-topic? The game is mentioned in the summary and is probably one of the factors behind the big increase in PS3 sales. I've not picked up my copy yet (too many other things to finish off first - Persona 3, Mass Effect and Crysis at the top of the list), but it does look astoundingly good.
Consoles like text editors, OS's, and flavors of linux are very very very contentious. People enjoy self organizing into little tribes and tossing mods around. The GP was sort of raving without much significant content. Thus people modded him down. It wasn't that off topic and it was un-deserved.

So far in this generation, no system has managed to establish a similar position on games. The PS3 is notoriously short of titles and most PS3s, my own included, are still mostly used as shiny and expensive PS2s. None of the franchises that helped Sony out so much last time have hit the machine yet. The Wii is an absolute desert for quality titles outside of a tiny number of Nintendo's own franchise games. In Japan, at least, its monthly sales lead has evaporated as the PS3 makes a fightback. The 360 is probably the best placed on games, due to its greater age, but it hardly has what I would call a commanding lead. MS have done a good job of attracting a more balanced line-up and, in Forza 2, have almost neutralised the advantage held by Sony with one of their "big" games (Gran Turismo), but they've still got a long way to go in some markets and in throwing off their image as the "fps" console.
I'm about 50/50. Half the time I'm playing R&T, COD 4, or even Dynasty warriors: Gundam. The other half of the time I'm working my way through the backlog of ps2 games I bought and didn't play. There were just so many gems I never got to( Odin's sphere, God of war 1 +2, Dragon Quest 8, etc..). I agree the Wii is as thin as the PS3, it takes a while to produce good games. The Wii is coasting on demoes at parties and semi-legitimate hype. I want to pick up fire emblem and maybe Metroid or Mario Galaxy. But so far I've been deeply disappointed in several facets of my Wii (VC games likened strictly to machine, clumsiness of pointer response in most games, tact on feel of controls in many games, poor graphics on HDTV's, first one was defective). I'm hoping it gets to be a 3 way race because I'm not really that into the wii control set up. Any multi platform will go to my ps3 and my wii is mostly just in case my favorite franchises go wii only and for some good party games. I'm also Thinking about picking up a 360 for mass effect.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

Serge_Tomiko (1178965) | more than 6 years ago | (#21508821)

The GP was sort of raving without much significant content.

I wouldn't quite say I was raving - more recounting an honest impression from the previous night that was still quite fresh in my memory :)

But so far I've been deeply disappointed in several facets of my Wii (VC games likened strictly to machine, clumsiness of pointer response in most games, tact on feel of controls in many games, poor graphics on HDTV's, first one was defective). I'm hoping it gets to be a 3 way race because I'm not really that into the wii control set up. Any multi platform will go to my ps3 and my wii is mostly just in case my favorite franchises go wii only and for some good party games. I'm also Thinking about picking up a 360 for mass effect.

I have the same feelings about the Wii. I got it to try and get my girlfriend into gaming, but it really does look pretty bad on my 46" LCD. The same girlfriend was equally amazed with R&T last night.

I have too much of a hatred for Microsoft to ever get an Xbox. I just can't do it.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (2, Informative)

vux984 (928602) | more than 6 years ago | (#21508723)


In Japan, at least, its monthly sales lead has evaporated as the PS3 makes a fightback.

You had me nodding until you got here.

Yeah, technically that's true. They went from ~65k+ per week, to ~35k+ per week. And the PS3 recently spiked up (from ~15k to ~55k) But its a very small myopic view of a much bigger picture.

To start, vgchartz.com (which you have to take with giant grain of salt mind you), is showing that the Wii sold some 640,000 units last week world wide. That, if true, is more than it acheived in a single week during its launch frenzy. And while I don't give too much credence to the exact numbers there, I'm sure there was a -massive- surge in the Wii over the last couple weeks. So in any case, Wii sales haven't evaporated in the big picture, not by a long shot.

Additionally, other less disputable facts include:

1) The wii is still largely supply constrained.

2) The wii is still setting sales records all over the place, in the UK, in Japan, in Australia...

3) Wii Fit launches in Japan next week, and I'll be stunned if it doesn't sell extremely well.

4) The Wii is sold at a profit, and hasn't had a price cut yet. Nintendo is doing extremely well and could easily afford a price cut to boost sales (if it actually had more units to sell - see #1 above) The PS3 has been through a couple rounds of price cuts and is sold at a loss. That says a lot. Sort of reminds me of the situation where someone observed that the brown zune at blowout pricing is outselling ipods on amazon.com. It just doesn't mean much.

 

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

Stanza (35421) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510883)


Because it is offtopic. Ratchet and Clank being a good game has nothing to do with the PlayStation being a "Hacker's Paradise", even if Ratchet and Clank were mentioned in the article.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (1)

ookaze (227977) | more than 6 years ago | (#21516105)

I've not picked up my copy yet (too many other things to finish off first - Persona 3, Mass Effect and Crysis at the top of the list), but it does look astoundingly good.
So you basically admit you're part of the problem : PS2 game, XBox 360 game and PC game at highest priority, but you still haven't bought this PS3 game that was released before 2 of the games you cited.
It's telling because of what you say after that ...

I think, more than anything else, the factor behind the PS3's sales increase will be the fact that it is finally getting some games worth playing.
Uh, no! If PS3 owners do like you, it won't change anything at all. And the lot of good games that were released with poor sales, lead to think that a lot of PS3 owners are like you.

For almost a year, Resistance: Fall of Man has been the only really top-notch title on the system, but this is definitely starting to change now.
What you say should induce fear to Sony. There was several good games for the PS3 this year, mostly japanese ones, but you managed to forget all of these to remember only a FPS. Man, if FPS is all you want, and most other PS3 owners are like you, SCEA is doomed.

None of the franchises that helped Sony out so much last time have hit the machine yet
That's just not true, Musou games and Minna no Golf were released in Japan already. They are bigger movers there than Metal Gear Solid.
And if you think MS almost neutralised Sony's Gran Turismo advantage with Forza 2, I believe that's just wishful thinking.

Re:Ratchet and Clank really is an amazing game (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21523489)

Resistance: Fall of Man ... top-notch title


Haha, oh wow.

The game doesn't actually look that good.... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21505321)

Hackers Paradise. [google.com]

Useless (3, Insightful)

seebs (15766) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505475)

Tripling as opposed to last year's supply-constraints is hardly informative.

Note that Nintendo gave concrete numbers, not ratios as compared to unknowns...

Re:Useless (1)

vonPoonBurGer (680105) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506237)

Agreed, Sony's statement is incredibly vague. I don't know how much stock to put in vgchartz.com's numbers (they're mostly estimations, after all), but they're showing an 84% week-to-week increase in PS3 sales in North America for the week end 24 Nov. 07. PS3 sales in Europe increased only slightly compared to the previous week (~25%), because there's no Turkey Day-related shopping bonanza on that side of the pond. Japanese data for the same week isn't up yet, but I'd guess that if sales there are increasing at all, it would be more similar to Europe than North America. If these numbers are even close to accurate, then the only way PS3 sales could be said to have tripled is if Sony is comparing last week's sales to the same week last year, and lumping PS3 sales for all regions together. That would be pretty deceptive, since this time last year, the number of PS3's being sold in Europe was pretty close to zero. Oddly enough, if you go from "close to zero" to "roughly 100k," it looks like a pretty big jump. Even then, I don't think you could accurately say sales have tripled. Anyway, to put things in perspective, it looks like the Wii still outsold the PS3 by a 2-to-1 margin in North America last week, and the 360 outsold it by roughly 30%.

The actual good news I see for Sony is that they've finally started selling more systems than the Wii in Japan, on a week-to-week basis. For quite a while, they were lagging behind even in their own backyard. I think it was kind of inevitable that they'd start to move some systems over there though. The 360 isn't taken seriously in Japan, and has hardly moved any units compared to either the Wii or PS3. If you want to do high def console gaming in Japan, the PS3 is considered to be the only game in town. Popular Japanese series are finally starting to drop for the PS3 (e.g. Shin Sangoku Musuo 5 [vgchartz.com] , will be released in NA as Dynasty Warriors 6 in '08, quarter of a million copies sold in Japan in two weeks, according to vgchartz), and that's driving hardware sales I think. Now they need to get a title with similar system-selling potential out in North America. Ratchet & Clank is close I think, but not quite enough of a household name. Something like a Metal Gear Solid or GTA title exclusively for the PS3 is what they need if they want to have any hope of catching the 360 or Wii in North America, but I don't think they have any titles with that kind of must-have cachet on the near horizon.

Re:Useless (1)

seebs (15766) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506311)

They're doing well in Japan, finally, but I think the only reason they're outselling the Wii is that the latter is supply-constrained; next spring, when the US shopping rush is over, Nintendo will finally be able to saturate the Japanese market.

Then, presumably, they'll ramp up production again, and lower the price. :)

Re:Useless (1)

Bandman (86149) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506791)

That's what they said last year, but you still have to stand in line at 8 in the morning if you want a new Wii. I got a used one from Gamestop. It worked great, and they forgot to wipe the system. Bonus games.

Re:Useless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21506793)

The Wii is in a slump in Japan. From what I've heard, demand for the Wii has genuinely fallen in Japan. It's starting to recover now, but it still isn't back up to where it was up until September. Sales for Super Mario Galaxy were also disappointing there (under 500,000 so far).

Still, Nintendo is in no danger of losing its lead in Japan. The PS3's price cut has only recently brought it out of a slump even worse than the one the Wii was in and so far the PS3 hasn't even dented the Wii's 2.4m unit lead.

I imagine that Nintendo will cut the Wii's price in Japan this spring which should bring sales back up. Until then, I suppose that Nintendo fans can take solace in the fact that fewer Wii sales in Japan means more Wiis can be shipped to the US and Europe where Nintendo needs to gain a lead over the 360 in order to win over western developers.

Re:Useless (1)

samkass (174571) | more than 6 years ago | (#21508327)

I'm not sure I buy that argument. The PS3 parts are a lot rarer and more difficult to fab than the Wii parts. If the PS3 is actually numerically outselling the Wii because of supply constraints, then Nintendo has some real problems.

My theory had been that the PS3 would really take off as it got below $300, and that its PS2 compatibility (considering the huge volume of PS2's that are STILL being sold) would allow it to slingshot past the other consoles. Now that the geniuses at Sony are removing PS2 compatibility, I'm starting to think the PS3 is as dead a platform as the naysayers have been saying. (Of course, I love mine...)

Re:Useless (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509709)

The PS3 had enough time to build some stock up before then, the Wii has basically zero stock between shipments in areas where it's selling out.

Re:Useless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21512423)

The PS3 is only outselling the Wii in Japan and that's only by a small amount. The Wii is still vastly outselling the PS3 in the US and Europe.

Wii Production (1)

LKM (227954) | more than 6 years ago | (#21516889)

I'm not sure I buy that argument.

You don't need to buy it, you can verify it yourself.

The PS3 parts are a lot rarer and more difficult to fab than the Wii parts. If the PS3 is actually numerically outselling the Wii because of supply constraints, then Nintendo has some real problems.

Yet that is precisely what is happening. It's important to keep in mind that Nintendo is currently churning out 1.8 million Wiis per month. The PS2 might have sold more at its peak, but other than that, it's probably hard to find a console that sold similar quantities. It's also important to keep in mind that the Wii contains a custom slot-loading DVD drive, which can read Wii DVD games as well as the smaller Gamecube games; it contains an infrared camera, and two different motion sensors from different suppliers. It's not just the same old Gamecube.

My theory had been that the PS3 would really take off as it got below $300

Historically, 200 US$ is the mass-market barrier. First console below 200 US$ wins :-)

Re:Wii Production (1)

samkass (174571) | more than 6 years ago | (#21521319)

Historically, 200 US$ is the mass-market barrier. First console below 200 US$ wins :-)

That's, of course, debatable. In consumer electronics, $300 is generally the barrier between "boutique" products and "I'll get one for Christmas" products. $200 is more the line between "I'll get one for Christmas" and "I want one so I'll go buy one now". It's all on a curve, though, so I don't know where the "mass" market line really is.

Re:Wii Production (1)

LKM (227954) | more than 6 years ago | (#21529615)

In consumer electronics, $300 is generally the barrier between "boutique" products and "I'll get one for Christmas" products.

Yes, but Christmas sales alone are not enough for a console to win.

$200 is more the line between "I'll get one for Christmas" and "I want one so I'll go buy one now".

Yes, I think so, too.

It's all on a curve, though, so I don't know where the "mass" market line really is.

Well, in a perfect world, it would be a curve, but these are people making decisions. To most people, 200 US$ seems like a whole lot more than 199 US$, which is, I think, why consoles become mass-market items at 199 US$, but don't sell that great at or above 200 US$.

Re:Useless (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509599)

Pretty close to zero is good, some (all?) importers didn't offer PS3s out of fear of a lawsuit DDoS like Sony did to Lik-Sang.

Re:Useless (1)

DES (13846) | more than 6 years ago | (#21518121)

PS3 sales in Europe increased only slightly compared to the previous week (~25%), because there's no Turkey Day-related shopping bonanza on that side of the pond.
There is no Turkey Day-related shopping bonanza on your side of the pond either. It's a myth [snopes.com] .

Re:Useless (1)

Raenex (947668) | more than 6 years ago | (#21528059)

The Snopes article you link to puts the day after Thanksgiving in the top 4-8 days of the year. It also says "The consistent holiday shopping trend is that sales figures spike on the day after Thanksgiving, drop sharply immediately afterwards, then steadily increase throughout December, peaking on the four days comprising the two weekends before Christmas." So it's hard to say, based on the Snopes article, what the overall impact would be for the whole week, but I would expect more sales, not fewer.

The "myth" it is busting is that it is the biggest shopping day of the year. Maybe it's overhyped, but it's certainly big.

Re:Useless (1)

ad0gg (594412) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506411)

They gave numbers. Though its meaningless to compare the month of october to the month of november when it comes to product sales. People xmas shop in november, hell ps 2 sales tripled [betanews.com] this month.

Re:Useless (1)

seebs (15766) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506805)

Percentages aren't the same as numbers. Without a specific count of units sold somewhere in the picture, "tripling" tells us nothing. We don't know whether that's ten thousand units more than the 5k they sold before, or four hundred thousand more than the 200k they sold before.

Re:Useless (1)

ad0gg (594412) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507417)

Its in the article. :P They sold ~300k PS3 compared to ~100k in october.

Re:Useless (1)

seebs (15766) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507481)

You didn't read carefully enough.

Sony didn't give numbers; Sony gave percentages. The article guessed at what the numbers would probably be based on indirect sources like NPD.

Re:Useless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21506423)

Besides, Sony had a really low PS3 sale. The lower the numbers, the less units "tippling the sales" sells. Sony is just using that release as a ploy to re insure stock holders.

non-oblig FotC (1)

thegnu (557446) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506563)

I'm paraphrasing, but:
Murray: That show was great for us! Fan club membership has tripled.
Bret: So that makes...[stops, thinks]...three?

Re:Useless (1)

rbanffy (584143) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506991)

The article is not about videogame sales.

It is about using videogames for other things than playing games.

BTW, since you mention the Wii, I will feel free to point out it would never be used for anything other than playing games because it simply doesn't have the processing power to do anything else. It's still a lot of fun, but that's not the point.

The point is there is a readily available supply of supercomputing-class machines in stores all over the place. Now may be the right time to beef up your cryptography, because much better lock picking tools are flooding market.

Re:Useless (1)

Malgas (901411) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507859)

BTW, since you mention the Wii, I will feel free to point out it would never be used for anything other than playing games because it simply doesn't have the processing power to do anything else.

Oh? [wiili.org]
I agree it's hardly a powerhouse, but it's got a nice little form factor and draws only a tiny amount of electricity. Plus, with the Internet channel, I already use it for things other than playing games.

Re:Useless (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509817)

Also there's a silly amount of web applications meant for the Wii. No idea why but I guess if you want a web frontend for your PC's music player on your TV you can have that.

Re:Useless (1)

LKM (227954) | more than 6 years ago | (#21516923)

BTW, since you mention the Wii, I will feel free to point out it would never be used for anything other than playing games

Dunno, we also use it to watch youtube movies on the web, check out the weather, and sometimes read news.

Massive increase (4, Insightful)

hibiki_r (649814) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505669)

The massive increase they talk about is just in relative terms. Nintendo claims they sold 350k wiis last week:more than Gamespot claims the PS3 did all month, and that's because the Wii is still supply constrained. The 360 sold over 200k the same week too.

Even with the price drop, they are still third in the US week to week. The fact that Uncharted, the PS3s best reviewed exclusive this year, is doing poorly just makes it more painful: It seems that people aren't even buying the good games. Not even 300k so far in the US for Ratchet & Clank?

I wish the best to Sony, but I don't think they have a prayer until their biggest names come out. Maybe Final Fantasy, Metal Gear and Gran Turismo can stop the bleeding.

Re:Massive increase (1)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505985)

Out of curiosity, why do you wish the best to Sony?

Re:Massive increase (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21506085)

Why would anyone want Microsoft to win outright? That is baffling. They could all use some good competition, but Microsoft especially cannot win this, or we all lose.

Wish the best to Sony, because if Microsoft owns HD gaming, we're fucked.

Re:Massive increase (1)

rbanffy (584143) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506895)

Because:

- The PS3 is a real nice console
- The PS3 runs Linux
- The Cell processor inside the PS3 is way cool
- We prefer to see Sony hurting Microsoft than the other way around

Re:Massive increase (1)

nuzak (959558) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507601)

> The Cell processor inside the PS3 is way cool

Arguably, so is the Xenon. The Cell is perhaps better in some ways, but I don't think anything on the 360 has really yet taken advantage of all 6 cores either.

I really really really don't want to see anyone "win", because if they do, we lose. But Sony does need to do better. Given the media companies they own, not having movie download services from day 1 was just inexcusable. Do they even have it now?

I'll get a PS3 for the linux system when the framebuffer is even capable of playing HD video smoothly. The way it is now, even XBMC runs circles around it.

Re:Massive increase (1)

rbanffy (584143) | more than 6 years ago | (#21524941)

"Arguably, so is the Xenon. The Cell is perhaps better in some ways, but I don't think anything on the 360 has really yet taken advantage of all 6 cores either."

That's the problem with the symmetric multi-core processors: they excel for server loads, but not so for gaming. The explicit asymmetric design of the Cell has processors tailored for game play (the Power units) and über-DSPs (the SPUs) for massively parallel logic. It also has an outstanding floating-point throughput no other processor in its class (and many above it) can match.

Not to say I wouldn't love a desktop computer with a Xenon, but, unfortunately, if Microsoft ever releases such an animal, it will run Windows and only Windows.

I don't know why there is nobody trying to make a non-x86 desktop processor. In the 90s the issue of porting Windows to it could be a show stopper, but now any longer. We have several full software stacks ported for every binary architecture imaginable, from ARM to zSeries. There are very interesting processors on the market. It's easy to build a multi-core ARM11 thing. It's about time we saw something like it.

It's a shame Sun has no Niagara-based workstations.

Re:Massive increase (1)

jamie(really) (678877) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509209)

Why is the Cell cool? Its just 8 processors cores with no direct memory access, and a large amount of unshared L1 cache each. Which is just a bigger version of what the RSP was on the N64. Its not innovative. I've programmed assembly since 6502, so its certainly fun, but when it comes to putting fun in a game, you'll get better, more productive end results using an interpreted scripting language (Quake, Gears, Bioshock...)

Why Sony shouldn't die (1)

LKM (227954) | more than 6 years ago | (#21516949)

Out of curiosity, why do you wish the best to Sony?

Because they did a few things right, such as making the PS3 code-free, and because they might be just as evil as Microsoft, but they're at least incompetent and thus a smaller threat.

Re:Massive increase (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21506727)

They already have a Final Fantasy for the DS, but not for their own console? Does anyone else find this bizarre?

Re:Massive increase (1)

Gideon Fubar (833343) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509541)

No, because sony and SquareEnix are two totally different companies.

Re:Massive increase (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510029)

Who is "they"? Square-Enix doesn't have a console.

PS3 outsells xBox in EU (1)

Nursie (632944) | more than 6 years ago | (#21515417)

Sorry to piss on your "Sony and the PS3 are dying" rant, but in the EU the PS3 has been outselling the xBox for some time now.

So maybe they won't "win", whatever that means, in the US, but they certainly aren't doing that badly elsewhere.

Bah, "Hacker" meaning "cracker" (2, Insightful)

TeknoHog (164938) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505739)

I was expecting something about Linux/OSS development on the PS3 :-P~

Re:Bah, "Hacker" meaning "cracker" (1)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506937)

Especially in this case where the idea seems to be to crack the encryption by bruteforce methods.

Re:Bah, "Hacker" meaning "cracker" (1)

Ant P. (974313) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509039)

I was hoping the same thing, like a story about them releasing video card drivers for it or something else positive...

Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1, Interesting)

powerlord (28156) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505831)

Okay, so basically this article says that the PS3 is the most powerful and open console of this generation and people keep digging at Sony?

At this point its mostly meme. I tried the Wii again last Thanksgiving. Yeah both my nephews have one, but they also had a Gamecube so to them it was the logical extension, but I just don't see what all the hype was about.

The controls were sloppy and trying to use the Wii-mote as a pointer was painful as heck.

So basically this article says people are evil? (1)

wattrlz (1162603) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505993)

Being such a great company Sony has given us this powerful and open console and what do we do with it? We crack passwords.

Re:So basically this article says people are evil? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21511447)

Being such a great company Sony has given us this powerful and open console and what do we do with it? We crack passwords.
yeah, I guess we're a bit misdirected. we should be using it to fully and properly crack DRM schemes, now that'd be ironic :P

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (4, Funny)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506031)

Sucks for you. I have been logging several hours with mine. Luckily, you not enjoying it has no effect on the rest of us.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506391)

Okay, so basically this article says that the PS3 is the most powerful and open console of this generation and people keep digging at Sony?
Sony fanboys claim this is simple anti-sony persecution.

The more rational, logical conclusion is that, contrary to the marketing drivel, "most powerful" means fuckall in terms of actual gaming enjoyment.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

rbanffy (584143) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507047)

"The more rational, logical conclusion is that, contrary to the marketing drivel, "most powerful" means fuckall in terms of actual gaming enjoyment."

Yes, but as the article points out, processing power is everything for cracking passwords.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Gravatron (716477) | more than 6 years ago | (#21524887)

While the fanboys are usualy idiots, there is quite a bit of Anti-Sony bias going around. Take, for example, when sony revised the specs and didn't put out new numbers. People screamed about this for months. Yet Nintendo never released specs for the wii, but no one seemed to care. People constaintly complain sony has no games, and the wii has tons, but when you look at metacritic, sony's got like 37 games rated higher than 80 compaired to nintendo's 14. To be fair, MS seems to be holding pretty well, despite their massive hardware issue. Games and feature wise they are delivoring pretty well so far.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1, Troll)

Ang31us (1132361) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506899)

Sure, the PS3 is the most powerful console of this generation, but it is also the most expensive. The gripe with Sony is about cost and arrogance [slashdot.org] . Sony thought that gamers would buy the PS3 at whatever price they set -- they were wrong.

Speaking from experience, the controls on Wii Sports Tennis, Mario Strikers Charged, Zelda, Madden, Resident Evil, and Metroid Prime 3 are actually very tight (i.e. not sloppy at all). Using the pointer to shoot in Resident Evil, Metroid Prime 3, and to stop Mega Strikes in Mario Strikers Charged is also very accurate and great fun.

I do want Sony to succeed (but not win) in this generation's console war, but they will need to drop the price of the PS3 to $200-250 with a hard disk to get my $$$. With $200 HD-DVD players being sold, it's also starting to look like this Christmas season will leave blu-ray as the loser in the HD format war as well. I sincerely hope that Sony learns from their PS3 mistakes before they end up in 3rd place in the current home game console generation.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Marcos Eliziario (969923) | more than 6 years ago | (#21513783)

Man, they are selling it at a loss... The price is not high because they are arrogant greedy bastards, it's high because it's a fucking expensive machine to build.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Ang31us (1132361) | more than 6 years ago | (#21520093)

Selling video game consoles at a loss is nothing new. What is new is that one of the console manufacturers is actually making a profit from each console sold. Historically, most video game consoles have been sold at a loss. It's the old "give away the razor to sell the blades" (i.e. give away the system to sell the games) strategy.

You're right that selling a system that includes high-end technologies like Blu-Ray and the Cell processor does not make Sony arrogant, but it does make the PS3 expensive [slashdot.org] . It's the things that Sony's CEO, Howard Stringer says that makes Sony look arrogant. Specifically, Sony's CEO said "The price of the PS3 is high but you're paying for potential" and "obviously, it's a higher-risk strategy - as all new inventions are - but if the PS3 lives up to its total potential, then I don't think anyone will be worried about Nintendo or Xbox's cheaper price." Here's the source. [bbc.co.uk] Is it not arrogant to assume that gamers, one of the most informed consumer groups, will pay $600 for a game console for its "potential?"

The PS3 has to compete on price or they will not succeed [vgchartz.com] in this generation of the console war. This competition/console war is good for all gamers because it forces the console manufacturers and game developers to innovate AND keep their prices down.

Take a look at what Toshiba's HD-DVD players are going for this Christmas [cnet.com] . Now, look at the statements [slashdot.org] from Sony's CEO, Howard Stringer about how the high-defintion format war is a "stalemate." Don't you think that low-cost players, high-definition movies, and cheap porn will lead to HD-DVD's victory over Blu-Ray this Christmas? Is it not arrogant to call the format war a "stalemate" when your format is on the verge of collapse due to its cost?

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

ravenshrike (808508) | more than 6 years ago | (#21514225)

Unless the Wii stops selling right now, I doubt the PS3 will pull ahead in the Wii's lifespan.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Ang31us (1132361) | more than 6 years ago | (#21520505)

This is Nintendo's console generation, just as it was 20 years ago. The only question is whether or not the PS3 can catch up to the 360 over time, but I think it's just too expensive.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

abigor (540274) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506921)

My problem with the Wii is simply that it looks bad on HD sets. I'm one of these people who never bought a regular TV, simply because I couldn't take the blurry resolution and lack of definition, so I suppose I'm in a minority.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Emetophobe (878584) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507381)

My problem with the Wii is simply that it looks bad on HD sets.

I have my Wii set to 480p and it looks great on my 42" plasma. Are you using the standard composite cables or did you buy the neccessary component cables?

The TV also makes a big difference. My friend and I both have a PS3 and we both have 42" plasmas, he bought an LG for $1500 and I bought a Pioneer for $3000, and the difference in picture quality is night and day.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Total_Wimp (564548) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507619)

My friend has a nice 42" LCD. Movies are great and the clarity, sharpness and color from his Wii are all top notch. But many of his games look as if they took a Hannah-Barbara cartoon and adapted it for the movie theater without redrawing any of the animation. In other words, it looks like crap because the developers were lazy about making a polished product.

You would absolutely not accept this level of animation on an Xbox or PS3 title, not because they're so much more powerful, but because your expectations are much higher. I think a lot of developers, especially of the mini-game variety, saw the Mii and decided, "that's our target. We'll never have to do anything better than that."

Many of the Wii titles look great even though they're cartoony, like Mario Galaxy. But there are a lot of bad apples out there that seem to think the Wii is an N64 with a pointer stick, and that simply doesn't look good in HD.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

macshit (157376) | more than 6 years ago | (#21507963)

You would absolutely not accept this level of animation on an Xbox or PS3 title, not because they're so much more powerful, but because your expectations are much higher.

The thing is, developers (especially 3rd-party developers) will find ways to turn out crap no matter what the "expectations". This applies even to graphics -- the PS3 is powerful, but certainly not powerful enough to deliver jaw-dropping results without a lot of work from the developers.

From what I've seen of the demo games on the PS3, this is already the case: many have high-res graphics, but awkward loose controls, horrid character animation and physics, crap framerates (like 5FPS), stupidly long and frequent loading periods, and boring gameplay.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Total_Wimp (564548) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509573)

I've experienced frame rate issues, then after a reboot they go away. It's not ideal, but it isn't the developer's fault either and it's definately not a persistent problem. I've yet to see an accusation of 5fps or "slide show" frame rates with any kind of widespread reports of the issue or an instructions on how to duplicate it. Yes, there can be frame rate issues due to lazy development or a bogged down system, but no, it really isn't as bad as all that.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

adamstew (909658) | more than 6 years ago | (#21526165)

Did he set his Wii to output in widescreen format? You must do this as, by default, it is set to 4:3. All of my graphics on my Wii are excellent on my 37" HDTV. I have to component cables and everything is output in widescreen format.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Gideon Fubar (833343) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509671)

This was also my biggest problem with the wii. The resolution is fine for most games, and a lot of wii games look really great.. But the console has Opera onboard, and native wireless.. ever tried browsing the web on a 50" plasma in 576x720?

it doesn't cripple the console, but it would have been nice..

PS3 == Good Linux Box (1)

PhoenixOne (674466) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506979)

I think most people expected that Sony was going to release a game console, not a platform for Bluray movies that doubles as a Linux box.

Sony made some critical mistakes when they rushed the PS3 to market. It looks like they tried to jam too much stuff into it and couldn't work out all the issues before release.

Re:Most Powerful and Open Console yet? (1)

Stefanwulf (1032430) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509533)

I totally agree about the power of the PS3. Thanks to Sony's use of open standards, I now have a ps3 in my room running neural networks far faster than any of my desktop boxes. They built an impressive machine (except for the fact that I can't expand the RAM). It makes me happy and I will love them for it while it sits in my bedroom crunching numbers.

That said, when I'm stumped while coding and want to take a break, I'll be in the living room with the Wii.

"Sony does have some good news this week" (4, Funny)

RHSC (1019802) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505833)

they just saved money by switching to geico?

Re:"Sony does have some good news this week" (1)

jdgeorge (18767) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506383)

they just saved money by switching to geico?

No.... and while they may not be marketing geniuses either they did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Botnets for Cracking Maybe? (1)

blueZhift (652272) | more than 6 years ago | (#21505851)

This is certainly interesting, but I wonder if there are already botnets out there cracking passwords. Things would become really interesting if there were a way to get compromised software on the PS3 network that could then be used to harness thousands of PS3s in the way that folding@home does. Still, using PCs in a botnet would probably be easier, just make up for lower average CPU capability with greater numbers.

Re:Botnets for Cracking Maybe? (1)

fistfullast33l (819270) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506543)

However, the PS3 does allow you to install linux (in a hypervisor of course) and program a few of the SPUs individually, which means for $600 bucks you get a nice multi-core machine that you can program. IBM's distributed framework for CELL also works with the PS3 as well.

Of course, those who have botnets usually don't pay for their CPU resources...

Re:Botnets for Cracking Maybe? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21510375)

the PS3 does allow you to install linux (in a hypervisor of course) and program a few of the SPUs individually, which means for $600 bucks you get a nice multi-core machine that you can program.
Well, yeah, but I could get two nice multi-core machines I can program for $600 by going for standard PC hardware...

Re:Botnets for Cracking Maybe? (3, Interesting)

tmasky (862064) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509779)

Heya, Nick B here..

The above author made a very valid point =)

However, in the initial "grand scheme of things", Sony wanted Cell processors in every piece of consumer electronics to create a sort-of distributed computing model within your home. More processors and more potential entry points. Who knows if that'll still happen.

In any case, the point I've been trying to make is that vector processors can do crypto very well. The Cell's SPUs are just a very good example of that. Who knows what other vector processors could be used..

I want to apologise for the lack of technical detail available. I absolutely hate it when I read a news piece and can't find further info. The media piece came out of a pre-release talk I did at the Kiwicon security conference.

The full presentation will (hopefully) be done at some international security conference. All technical information and source code will be made available then. No software patents are involved ;)

Nick Breese's Presentation (2, Interesting)

this great guy (922511) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506027)

I haven't been able to find the presentation that Nick Breese gave at Kiwicon. It's not on kiwicon.org, it's not on the websites with which he is associated. However I found a 10 min of audio recording excerpt of his presentation on this podcast [itradio.com.au] (between 9:38 and 21:06).

Price cut?! (1)

8tim8 (623968) | more than 6 years ago | (#21506329)

From TFA:
Sony asserts that the surge in sales is largely due to the price cut...

Price cut? But that's why I got my second job!

Hahaha! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21510125)

(nt)

Five Words: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21507681)

price decrease and "Rock Band"

New PS3 Commericials (1)

Cornflake917 (515940) | more than 6 years ago | (#21508653)

I think the new set of commercials for the PS3 really kick ass, and I think it may be convincing impulsive people to buy it. I'm just speculating, but I think the commercials could be significant reason why PS3 is seeing increased sales. The CGI of the PS3 morphing into guns, spaceships, etc was really well done. I have no idea what good exclusive games are out yet for the PS3 (if there is any), but the commercial made me want to buy a PS3 anyways (even though I won't, because I know better).

Re:New PS3 Commericials (3, Funny)

scot4875 (542869) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509675)

I disagree with this statement 100%. The commercials are stupid -- but then, I like to be informed by commercials, not entertained or given "warm fuzzy" feelings about the advertised product.

I have no idea what good exclusive games are out yet for the PS3 (if there is any)

And this is exactly why the commercials were stupid. I think I saw a couple flashes of Ratchet & Clank in the spots, but honestly I have no clue what games they were even trying to advertise to me. Basically the ad said to me, as a gamer who loosely follows the releases on platforms I don't own, "We don't have any specific games worth showing to you, but the PS3 sure is awesome. You should get one." To which I say, "Screw that."

--Jeremy

Re:New PS3 Commericials (1)

Cornflake917 (515940) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510107)

"We don't have any specific games worth showing to you, but the PS3 sure is awesome."
I would argue that's why the commercials are good. They make the system seem really cool even though there aren't really any interesting games out for it yet. I think you confuse me for a PS3 shill or something. I'm obviously not interested in the console, but you have to admit it was really cool-looking commercial. The special effects, the choice of music, and the transitions between game footage and the PS3 CGI was really well done. Maybe it's just because I'm a graphics programmer and I'm really into computer generated graphics, but whatever. For those who don't know what I'm talking about check out the commercial. Trust me, I would only recommend the PS3 to my worst enemy, you don't have to watch if you don't want to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irPVI0jTij0 [youtube.com]

For the record, I think it's funny that you got modded insightful. I could easily say the same thing about some wii commercials where they show a couple of japanese guys soliciting a family's house and them watching making retarded movements with the wiimote, but that would get modded to hell. Although, it's no less true. I'll probably get modded down for just saying that.

Re:New PS3 Commericials (1)

Chris Burke (6130) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510445)

I agree with you that the PS3 commercials were well done ("slick" I thought the first time I saw one) and for their target markets probably effective. They're certainly vastly better than the launch commercials, which did little more than give me the impression that the PS3 was vaguely supernatural and possibly evil. What the GP failed to realize is that people like him who "like to be informed" aren't the target of these ads. Sony expects people like him to read gaming mags or websites to form opinions, not be swayed by TV spots. It's the impulsive people you mentioned who could see these ads, be impressed, and decide they want a PS3.

On the other hand, I disagree that the Wii adds are similarly uninformative. Showing families and friends waving the wiimote around like retards, rather than focusing on the on-screen action, is actually conveying the most important information about what the Wii is about to the target audience of non-gamers.

Re:New PS3 Commericials (1)

Cornflake917 (515940) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510183)

Btw, the aim of a commercial is to sell a product and get name recognition. Some do it by entertaining, some do it by informing. Which method is better at selling stuff, I don't know. But just because it doesn't inform doesn't make it a bad commercial.

Re:New PS3 Commericials (1)

Raenex (947668) | more than 6 years ago | (#21528371)

I think the most persuasive thing in those commercials was the $399 price. $600 and $500 were just too much. A $400 price just in time for Christmas just might save their console.

I sense a theme.. (1)

Gideon Fubar (833343) | more than 6 years ago | (#21509981)

The journalist is Patrick Gray, whose work can be found here [itradio.com.au] . He also interviewed Dan Egerstad a few weeks ago, just before his activities with TOR were reported here.

PS3 beat 360 this week (1)

hchaput (544841) | more than 6 years ago | (#21510309)

By a mere 416 units, the PS3 outsold the 360 worldwide this week [vgchartz.com] . While 360 continues to be strong in North America, PS3 is dominating everywhere else.

In light of all the past comments which ask, "Why does Japan love the PS3 do much?" I have to ask: "Why does America love the 360 so much?" :-)

Re:PS3 beat 360 this week (2, Insightful)

nitro316 (1179211) | more than 6 years ago | (#21512889)

The reason that the Japanese loves the PS3 so much is the same reason that they loved the ps2 so much when it first launched. The PS2 was the cheapest dvd player on the market for quite sometime, which a dvd player at the time averaged about 800 to 900 bucks. Same stands for the PS3.

No (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21515729)

The PS3 is in no way whatsoever dominating Europe, it's a flop here too. Using VGChartz is also about as useful as just pulling numbers out your arse too because they've always used different metrics for the Wii and PS3 to the 360. Their 360 sales figures were always based on educated guesses and ancient announcements from MS whereas the Wii and PS3 figures have been based on over the counter sales. I'm not sure why they use a different metric, it could be any number of reasons but it totally invalidates their stats as any suitable measure of actual console sales for the 360. Halo 3 helped shift over half a million consoles in it's first couple of weeks yet if you check VGChartz stats this is simply not reflected there.

It's only strength is in Japan. To answer your question, the reason Europe/US prefer the 360 is because it's the better system in terms of quality and quantity of games, the reason Japan likes the PS3 is because they're patriots to the extreme and historically never have and likely never will buy foreign electronics.

Brute Force... ATTACK!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21512435)

Using a quicker CPU to process a count from 0 to 99999999 results in a quicker processing time! Yippee-kay-yay! Wake me up when people are using the PS3 for complex, yet purposeful medical research (oh wait...)
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