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KDE 4 to Be Released on January 11th

Zonk posted more than 6 years ago | from the cogs-start-turning dept.

KDE 300

VincenzoRomano writes "It's official! KDE 4.0 will be released on January 11th of next year. The release itself doesn't sound very firm, as 'the developers are confident to be able to release a more polished and better working KDE' and not the long awaited prime-time release. At the very first Alpha release on march 11th, the release date had been forecasted to October 2007, and then shifted to the end of the year with the second Beta. Despite this, the promises for the fourth version are quite interesting and maybe deserve a 'stay tuned'."

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300 comments

Birthday for me? (0, Offtopic)

Asm-Coder (929671) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553495)

My birthday is the 11th, are they giving me a present?

Re:Birthday for me? (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553737)

I'm a GNOME user, so I didn't know much about KDE4. Here are some interesting links I just found while researching what KDE4 is going to include:

KDE 4 promises radical changes to the free desktop [linux.com]

KDE 4.0: Well worth the wait! [blogsavy.com]

KDE 4 is almost ready to go [desktoplinux.com]

KDE 4.0 Alpha 2 features new shell [desktoplinux.com]

KDE 4: some reasons for design decisions [wordpress.com]

I don't think I'll switch from GNOME, but KDE4 sounds like it will have some cool features.

Re:Birthday for me? (2, Informative)

rubycodez (864176) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554155)

the only reason I use KDE rather than GNOME is the memory footprint on my older gear. I've seen rumblings in the forums that KDE 4 can be set to have less footprint than 3 with compositing turned off, hope it's true.

Re:Birthday for me? (1)

HappySmileMan (1088123) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554607)

It's also supposed to be faster than KDE3 since QT4 will be a lot faster than 3. I can't say for certain whether it will be, but the LiveCD seemed faster than the Kubuntu LiveCD using 3.5 by a good margin so that's at least some confirmation. (But obviously ifferent LiveCDs will have different services running)

END MODERATOR ABUSE (-1, Offtopic)

Taco Meat (1104291) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553781)

I have again been the victim of moderator abuse http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=366293&cid=21424075 [slashdot.org] [slashdot.org] [slashdot.org] MOD me up to correct this injustice.

Too many moderators use Insightful as "I agree". Too many moderators fall for unoriginal groupthink and mod it up. People complain about trolls, but the REAL line noise on slashdot comes from the posts modded +4 or +5 that contribute NOTHING to an intelligent discussion. You can't filter that out, and even if you have your thresholds set high, you still see all the stupid stuff that you've already seen. That's why digg sucks and will never be anything but a place for 1338 high-skool haxx0rs. And it's happening here. So I used this account to call shenanigans on sucky posts. I getted modded into oblivion for pointing out truth. I guess that's how it goes. Most of you are a bunch of mindless sheeple.

One way to fix this: I think Slashdot should give IQ tests to all would-be moderators. That would ensure most of the ramshackle pseudo-intellectuals who get mod points would be replaced by people who can actually read the moderator guidelines and adhere to them.

Re:END MODERATOR ABUSE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554775)

I agree. "Funny" can never jump to +5.

Re:Birthday for me? (2, Funny)

antdude (79039) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554823)

Same here. I noticed many people have this day as their birthdays. Weird! :D

Sounds familiar (5, Funny)

TBerben (1061176) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553515)

Sounds like the Vista launch, pushed back a little further with each test version. Maybe its better for the KDE team to set a date like July 2008 and surprise everybody when they are ready to release it in January?

Re:Sounds familiar (4, Informative)

CarAnalogy (1191053) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553597)

That's not really correct, IMHO.

The difference with Vista is that the KDE team really has some major interesting new technologies now, though most of them are rather invisible from the common user's perspective. This will change over time. I assume KDE 4.1 will be more about applying/improving those underlying technologies, rather than introducing them.

Aside from the desktop itself, a large number of applications have also vastly improved.

Re:Sounds familiar (1)

Joe Jay Bee (1151309) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553739)

The difference with Vista is that the KDE team really has some major interesting new technologies now, though most of them are rather invisible from the common user's perspective.

So did Vista. And Leopard, for that matter.

Re:Sounds familiar (4, Insightful)

jotok (728554) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553809)

...most of them are rather invisible from the common user's perspective.

As a common user, I care about
1) eye candy
2) rendering times

The last time I tried to use SuperKaramba was a joke and most of the eye-candy features seem to be designed to crash KDE more than anything else. If it now "just works" then I'll be happy. Most of the real improvements are entirely Greek to me.

Re:Sounds familiar (4, Informative)

Verunks (1000826) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553693)

well i think that kde 4.1 would be more suitable for the end user because a lot of great kde applications like k3b aren't yet ported to qt4, but kde 4.0 should be released soon so developers could port and test their apps in a stable kde4 desktop

Re:Sounds familiar (4, Informative)

w000t (1141427) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554575)

Nope, KDE 4.1 would be more suitable for users because it will be a lot more polished and it will introduce features that couldn't be included in the 4.0 release. However, KDE3 apps would be able to run on KDE4, so you won't miss things like K3B.

No need for a hard KDE ship date (4, Insightful)

EmbeddedJanitor (597831) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553715)

KDE is already great. There is no burning business need to release an update. No shareholders to let down and start a class action.

For me, KDE is already good enough. I'd rather wait until KDE4 is really solid than ty get it out on some arbitrary ship date.

Re:No need for a hard KDE ship date (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554457)

Amen! Release it when it's done.

Re:Sounds familiar (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553839)

Close. KDE 4 was set to be the next Vista. What happened was that right when KDE 4 was first being planned, they hyped one particular aspect, Plasma, as being as revolutionary as icons were when they were first introduced, before any code was written. Unfortunately, this technology was MIA for a long time, and it was introduced at a very late stage. The real problem is that it replaced lots of stable code that is absolutely critical to the user experience - the panel, desktop, etc. This really shouldn't have happened, but it was a core developer's pet project. The result is that it's still unfinished, despite them already having released a "release candidate" (which everybody else expected to be basically finished). And anybody pointing out how screwed up the release schedule was got attacked by fanboys.

So it was set to be the next Vista. But thankfully they actually managed to keep their egos in check and put off the release until the code is in a better state. This is a positive thing. I was seriously considering switching to GNOME until I heard about this.

It gets worse (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554501)

There's been a particularly heated exchange going on in the developer's blogs which started with someone describing the new desktop/plasma as "useless crap [blogspot.com]." Aaron Seigo (the above mentioned core developer) then replies in the comments "i'm tired of this shit".

Now, one of the complaints leveraged was the lack of familiarity a KDE3 user would have with the alien and unfinished Plasma desktop due to a lack of migration path from the familiar kicker/kdesktop/kmenu. After a few [blogspot.com] more [blogspot.com] exchanges (which are displayed in all their sordid glory on Planet KDE [planetkde.org], Mr. Seigo then announces [blogspot.com] that he already had some code written to implement a more traditional menu system, but in light of being pissed off by people pointing out some pretty glaring flaws, he will not work on it anymore. Classy.

The whole thing is just childish and immature on both parts and doesn't really fill me with confidence, especially in light of the unfinished and buggy RC.

But again, the only problem with the KDE4 platform so far seems to be Plasma, and it's unfortunate since the project as a whole really seems ready to shake up the Linux desktop. Unfortunately the most visible part of it isn't up to snuff.

Re:Sounds familiar (1)

Skeith (931626) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554557)

I agree that Plasma should be a lot farther along than it is right now. But Plasma seems like a very necessary change even though it will cause a few headaches in the beginning.

Re:Sounds familiar (5, Informative)

lbbros (900904) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554705)

For heaven's sake, don't spread FUD! That "stable code base" you talk about was a mess to mantain (note that Aaron J. Seigo, the Plasma lead developer, was also kicker's mantainer) and to add new features you broke others etc. Plasma it is not by any means aseigo's pet project: there are quite a number of developers involved in developing and polishing it. It matures at an amazingly fast pace, even.

The "fanboys" you talked about were people rightfully ticked off by the constant, uncostructive and negative attitude on the part of the complainers, which did not bring any improvement and only demotivated the developers. Those people did not even bother testing later revisions (right now there's a daily VM image floating around), report bugs or even offer *constructive* criticism.

Re:Sounds familiar (2, Interesting)

w000t (1141427) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554727)

what a load of crap... the early release of KDE 4.0 was meant to provide a stable API for people to start porting their apps. it obviously had nothing to do with developer egos, which would be completely ridiculous (why the heck would they insist on releasing, according to your own view, a shitty product?).
i thought anonymous cowards trolling and talking from their asses weren't supposed to be moded +5 informative...

Re:Sounds familiar (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554821)

Please do move to Gnome so we don't have to read any more whining

Re:Sounds familiar (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553989)

Well, that might work, except that the KDE release date is set through open discussion on public mailing lists, so they wouldn't be fooling anyone. In fact, they would be as likely to fool their own developers as the media, which would make it hard to do the release on time...

Re:Sounds familiar (2, Insightful)

diegocgteleline.es (653730) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554519)

Well, yes. The difference is that Microsoft is a company that gets 50.000$ millions per year and shouldn't need to delay projects. If KDE 4 had the resources that Microsoft has, it would have been released before 2008.

So what makes this better than 3? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553517)

Anyone have a link handy to a list of new features?

Re:So what makes this better than 3? (5, Informative)

JamesTRexx (675890) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553557)

Here's [wordpress.com] a list of the major changes and the reasons behind them.

Re:So what makes this better than 3? (1)

X0563511 (793323) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553877)

My thanks! Seeing the (good) reasoning behind some of these changes really cooled off my steam. While things might be ugly/atrocious (my opinion anyways) NOW, doesn't mean they will on release, and further on the flexibility caused by these changes will outweigh it by orders of magnitude!

Re:So what makes this better than 3? (3, Informative)

pherthyl (445706) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554515)

Keep in mind these are only the controversial features that people have whined about the most. There are tons of new features in the individual KDE apps that aren't mentioned there.

What are the main differences between KDE & Gn (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553525)

I've used both, but I'm curious about what people think sets them apart in terms of design philosophy and usage.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (2, Insightful)

Joe Jay Bee (1151309) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553699)

As I see it:

KDE aims for a Windows-ish philosophy of "everything should be configurable". There are options for just about everything, so you can tweak your desktop to be just the way you want it. This can be intimidating for newbies, but then KDE can also be configured to be very newbie friendly, and indeed many distros already do configure it that way.

GNOME, on the other hand, aims for a Mac OS X philosophy of only presenting to the user what they really need to use to get the job done, with some options hidden and others nonexistant. This is designed to be easy for just about anyone to pick up easily (probably why the Ubuntu team chose it) but it absolutely sucks for configurability.

To summarise: KDE is for end users but can be for power users, GNOME is aimed specifically at end users and noone but.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0, Troll)

the_B0fh (208483) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553777)

You forgot the other thing. IANAP, but from all reports, KDE's internals is very clean and neat, and easy to get into.

GNOME, otoh, is freaking spagetti bullshit.

I remember trying to build gnome from source years ago - oops, this needs version 12beta2 of that. but that needs version 13beta3 of this. can you spell circular dependencies?

Never understood the attraction of that POS gnome.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (5, Informative)

gardyloo (512791) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553853)

KDE aims for a Windows-ish philosophy of "everything should be configurable". There are options for just about everything, so you can tweak your desktop to be just the way you want it.
I realize that you needed a good Windows/OS X dichotomy with which to compare KDE and Gnome, but you call Windows configurable?!? I've worked extensively on KDE, XFCE, and Enlightenment, and some with Gnome, and you're right: KDE is exremely configurable, far moreso than Gnome. But Gnome is on par with, if not considerably MORE configurable than Windows. Windows is essentially locked as it is, even with those "power users'" tools.

      I'm highly looking forward to being able to use KDE as a WM for Windows systems, without the added cruft of a Cygwin environment.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553963)

KWin is pretty well tied to X11. It is unlikely that it will be ported to Windows afaik.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554145)

KWin/Plasma are not going to be ported to windows. Only certain apps will be ported.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554151)

Gnome is way less configurable than anything else.

Can you configure the screensaver in Windows? Can you add your own MIME-types (filetypes, associations, icons, etc)? Click, click and it's done! I guess that would be 'Klick, Klick" in KDE, heheheh!

Gnome can't do these things without resorting to hacking text files.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554357)

what the heck are you talking about? GNOME has gui for all those, you can use gconf-editor preferences not listed in preferences windows of applications. GNOME philosophy is to use best defaults and not to confuse users with every little option. Running gconf-editor and setting things are very easy to understand with schema descriptions.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554567)

Gnome can't do these things without resorting to hacking text files.

On the other hand, that makes you 1337 lol...

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0, Flamebait)

Carewolf (581105) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554663)

Maybe with configuration, but look at features in stead. Windows has way more features than GNOME. For instance just a basic thing like "Open with" in explorer. In GNOME you can not open files with applications isn't officially GNOME sanctioned to open those files, and there is no way to change that, even though the have an editor for changing fileformat bindings, it doesn't allow you to add new programs. It basically goes on like that in every GNOME application. Windows is simple much more powerfull and usefull than GNOME.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (5, Interesting)

stew77 (412272) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553893)

I still wonder who or what that mythical power-user is, because I don't think I ever met one in person. The skript kiddie that spends 6 hours per day hunting themes and posting screen shots to forums? Some of the most knowledgeable and experienced developers I know barely change anything in their computer's configuration, even keeping the default OS X desktop image.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (4, Insightful)

White Shade (57215) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554255)

If I had mod points, I'd definitely mod you up...

I agree completely; most people I know who are "hardcore" linux users spend time tweaking their systems, but it's usually just to the point of getting all their hardware working, and then maybe glitzing it up a little bit, usually by downloading a theme they think looks cool. The thousands of fancy customization options usually get left behind, and completely reconfiguring how applications look and run is totally beyond what they care to do. The linux users want to *USE* linux, not waste hours and hours digging into arcane details to reach some potential "perfect setup".

Windows can be tweaked too, but definitely much less-so, and there isn't much support about it either. I don't know anything about tweaking MacOS, other than the fact that i've never seen anyone using a recent version of MacOS that looked like it had been customized any significant extent.

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (3, Insightful)

jackuess (1121253) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553935)

I get the impression that the KDE devs are simply aiming at delivering the best DE possible, with no particular user group in mind. Besides, I think thats a common dominator for most FOSS, since market share is secondary to good design (maybe a bit exaggerated but still), at least when compared to the proprietary world. Further more I would like to believe that KDE resembles OSX more than Gnome, at least from a developers point of view, with it's rich and structured dev platform. KDE is more than just a DE, it's a platform!

Re:What are the main differences between KDE & (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553939)

The noobies of today are the end-users of tomorrow. The end-users of today are the power-users of tomorrow. KDE provides a path for this evolution. Gnome is a dead-end for users.

Sheshh, Gnome doesn't even let you adjust the screensaver because the Gnome developers seem to think that the average user is to stooopid to choose between 4 jumping cows and 5 jumping cows in the screensaver!

I'm really not a KDE fan either. I'm all for lots of configurability but I find having the configuration items presented two different ways (together in some tabbed thing and each one separate) with at least four different ways to get at them very confusing. Also, it is very confusing having user preferences mixed in with administrative settings mixed in with system settings. Plus all the KDE themes look like a Saturday morning anime cartoon. How about a theme that doesn't make me look like an otaku in the boardroom?

Sigh, maybe we need a third full-featured desktop environment?

A fixed release date is not a good idea (0, Redundant)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553581)

First, it can put undue pressure on the developers causing a release of faulty code. And missing it looks embarrassing. Plus it just provides vital information to the enemy.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (2, Insightful)

Professor_UNIX (867045) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553599)

First, it can put undue pressure on the developers causing a release of faulty code. And missing it looks embarrassing.
On the other hand, not having a release date can make your project into a massive vaporware joke... for example, Duke Nukem Forever.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (1)

CarAnalogy (1191053) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553645)

Last I heard was that DNF was to be released around 2010.

They're not yet sure what they'll do with it though. Maybe it's hypervisors, maybe a new user interface paradigm for consumers, but it will certainly be more user-centric.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (-1, Offtopic)

the_B0fh (208483) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553617)

Unfortunately, with friends like redcrap, do we need enemies? I haven't followed the redcrap company's shenanigans - have they stopped trying to screw KDE over?

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (1)

LighterShadeOfBlack (1011407) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554249)

Calling it "redcrap" really makes your point seem considered and well thought out. And who's this "we" you're referring to?

Then again I don't know who the enemy in the GP's post is supposed to be. I guess I'm one of those ignorant fools who thinks that open source software development isn't a war to be won, but rather about providing the best possible software for users.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (1)

cygtoad (619016) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553667)

Ever hear the old adage: "Work expands to fill the time alloted." I suppose you could also say work compresses to fill the time allotted and that could lead to poor quality. I believe this is your point. However, if you have no deadline at all, development tends to languish and that negatively impacts quality as well.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (1)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553835)

I agree. Deadlines are okay. I just don't think we need big, hairy public pronouncements with the trumpets blaring, lights flashing, etc. It sounds too much like a Microsoft campaign. These aren't the things we should emulate. I take Linus's attitude. It will be ready when it's ready. I don't want to see another repeat of Vista, like what's happening with Leopard.

Re:A fixed release date is not a good idea (0, Redundant)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554185)

(Score:0, Redundant)

Hmmmm Maybe I should quit posting until the freaks use up their mod points. Maybe somebody can point out where it's been said before? Under this article?

But does it run Windows? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553607)

In all seriousness, is this the version of KDE that's meant to bring the K desktop a K apps to Windows?

Re:But does it run Windows? (4, Insightful)

Phyrexicaid (1176935) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553627)

Yes, with Qt4 we should see KDE apps on all, Mac, Windows, and obviously, Linux. It will be nice to see some of the apps I use on a day to day basis (like Kile) ported to Windows. If someone starts using KDE apps, it'll ease the transition should they ever choose to switch to Linux.

Re:But does it run Windows? (1)

abigor (540274) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553709)

I've actually run early versions of certain apps on OS X natively. Strange to see my old favourites like Kate, for example, with the Mac UI. Once KDE4 is released, I'll hopefully be using these apps regularly again.

I find the introduction of Dolphin interesting. (1)

PaulGaskin (913658) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553767)

It seems Konqueror is losing position in favor of a more simple, lighter file manager. Myself, I'm pretty happy with Gnome on my GNU Linux machine. I don't feel restricted by Gnome. Much of the extra functionality of a more configurable desktop can be achieved through a text-based interface, if one is so inclined.

Re:I find the introduction of Dolphin interesting. (1)

Phyrexicaid (1176935) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553833)

Well, Dolphin is nice for first-timers. My girlfriend uses it, and can't really tell the difference between Konqueror and Dolphin. She doesn't use the extra features of Konqueror. Myself? Maybe I'm stuck in my ways but I had to change back to Konqueror. Split pane is not a replacement for tabs, for me at least.

Linus Torvalds on Gnome vs KDE (1)

PaulGaskin (913658) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554431)

https://lists.linux-foundation.org/pipermail/desktop_architects/2007-February/001127.html [linux-foundation.org]

"I did something better than any Gnome user has apparently ever done: I actually wrote the code to fix the thing." - LT

Does he really think he's that much smarter than every Gnome user and developer?

"I want something very simple: I want to configure my mouse button window events. That doesn't sound so bad, does it? Everybody else can do it, gnome does not." - LT

You already have that with KDE. Gnome developers can do what they want. It's really a design choice. "And I find it *offensive* how Gnome people can never just admit that they can't do something." - LT

How absurd. Sounds like a really simple UI feature. Does Linus really think Gnome developers are incapable or is he just trying to taunt them?

Torvalds posted on the GNOME-usability list that "I personally just encourage people to switch to KDE."

http://mail.gnome.org/archives/usability/2005-December/msg00021.html [gnome.org]

This, I find kind of odd. If he feels so strongly that KDE is the best, why attack Gnome incessantly?

Why should he try to make Gnome into KDE when KDE already exists? I guess this is a turf battle and he's pissed that Gnome has more market-share. He seems kind of ambitious beyond the scope of merely making his Kernel the best it can be.

Re:But does it run Windows? (5, Informative)

lord_rob the only on (859100) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553681)

Yes, just google for kde 4 windows. You'll see that a Windows port of KDE 4 is ongoing. See this Wiki [kde.org].

But for the moment it's just a project so if you are really interested in seeing KDE 4 ported to Windows, jump on the boat and help !

KDE File Manager (4, Interesting)

Drasil (580067) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553707)

Konq was the killer app for me, I have to confess I'm a little worried about Dolphin becoming the default file manager. I've not used Dolphin much yet, but it will have to be pretty damn good to match what Konq could do. Will I still be able to have terminal, web and file panes all within the same tab? How about dragging images from a website to my /home within a single window, or middle clicking a file or link to open it in a viewer in a new tab? Konq allowed me to keep the amount of open windows to a minimum. I guess time will tell and I should start playing with Dolphin.

I should note that I bloody hate Dolphins (my ex loved the damn things). They aren't as cute as you think, they smell of fish and have attempted genocide [wheelock.edu] on porpoises and even attack humans [scotsman.com]. Why is it that every crystal swinging hippie who lives 1000 miles from the sea wants to be a marine biologist? Dolphins!

Re:KDE File Manager (4, Informative)

abigor (540274) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553741)

Konqueror isn't going anywhere, and it will still be the preferred file manager/etc. for power users. Dolphin is included as a simpler file manager with a different design philosophy, that's all. But you don't have to use it if you don't want to, as the same old Konq (KDE4'ified, of course) will still be a click away.

Re:KDE File Manager (1)

Seumas (6865) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553865)

I'm not a konqueror fan, because it doesn't feel right, to me. I'm a fan of one excellent tool to do one thing extremely well. Not one giant kitchen sink of a tool that does a thousand things.

Of course, I also don't prefer Konqueror as a web browser, so it could be that I'd appreciate it all much more if I weren't fused to firefox.

Of course, I use krusader anyway, so it doesn't much matter to me. Dolphin presents some things in a bit of a krusader style, but with far less functionality.

By the way, anyone who remembers that one Appl II game from grade school will remember that Dolphins will some day rule the country as our president.

Then again, monkeys already do, so that's not a leap of imagination.

Actually, it IS 1 tool, concept (2, Informative)

WindBourne (631190) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553953)

Konqi is pretty much one tool that does 2 things. Its job is to work with filestreams OR allow plug-ins. Of course, the filestreams utilize a plug-in approach approach as well(KIOs). Think of the KIOs as being similar to unix FS drivers in Unix's VFS. All of our common unix tools use a filesystem, but of course, the FS could come from a number of places (100's of different filesystems mapped onto either blocks or streams). Likewise, the plugins for Konqi are varied. In particular, Konqi includes by default the KHTML Library for a HTML handler.

Re: Dolphin Attacks (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554479)

Do the researchers believe the attacks were porpoiseful?

Re:KDE File Manager (1)

pherthyl (445706) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554481)

Will I still be able to have terminal, web and file panes all within the same tab?

Terminal, yes. Web, no.

How about dragging images from a website to my /home within a single window, or middle clicking a file or link to open it in a viewer in a new tab?

Dragging images will still work (AFAIK). Dolphin does not have multiple tabs. Of course Konq still does.

Re:KDE File Manager (1)

Jambon (880922) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554615)

I should note that I bloody hate Dolphins

Come now. You're just jealous because they're smarter than us.

Sweet! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21553819)

On my birthday!

who might slip the release date? (4, Insightful)

icepick72 (834363) | more than 6 years ago | (#21553973)

the release itself doesn't sound very firm, as 'the developers are confident to be able to release a more polished and better working KDE' and not the long awaited prime-time release.


One simple question: Why can Microsoft not slip release dates without getting flack, but it's okay for open source projects? Both are slipping for the same reasons.

Slippage (3, Informative)

Tony (765) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554041)

Simple: because most open source release schedules slip by weeks. Microsoft often slips by years [wikipedia.org].

Re:Slippage (2, Funny)

zlogic (892404) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554285)

I remember that in early 2006 KDE 4 was promised to be released about the same time as Vista, or even earlier. But at least the KDE team didn't spend three years writing stuff and then completely dumping it and starting from scratch!

Re:who might slip the release date? (0, Flamebait)

miscz (888242) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554163)

Because those people would be marked as Gnome trolls. PS I hate KDE as a DE with a burning passion.

Re:who might slip the release date? (2, Interesting)

jackuess (1121253) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554387)

Because people at /. are simply much more enthusiastic about KDE4 than Vista. Hell I even bother to compile KDE4, and Vista: well I'm not even prepared to pirate it! That's by the way another explanation for peoples forgivingness: you can at any time check out the svn and try it (discovering that it's not ready for release yet). People who are enthusiastic about KDE get full insight, Vista enthusiast get/got mostly nothing.

Re:who might slip the release date? (0, Troll)

chromatic (9471) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554581)

Why can Microsoft not slip release dates without getting flack, but it's okay for open source projects?

Microsoft developers waste more paid development time checking e-mail and chatting around the water cooler in a week than most F/OSS projects ever have.

Re:who might slip the release date? (1)

R15I23D05D14Y (1127061) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554593)

What says KDE isn't catching flax off this? I haven't heard many people being happy about the first 'release candidate' for KDE4 being closer to a beta than a release.

They look to me like they are eating into their karma of being a big open source project - not that the eventual release won't be good, but there will be more grumbling and complaints than usual.

Time well spent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554089)

I guess they spent the last year thinking up cool names [wikipedia.org] for all the changes. Now they've got six weeks to code them.

Why bother? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554211)

Seemingly like everything Linux and "Open Source", this stuff is just a pale shadow of the best OS ever written: OS X Panther. It is many orders of magnitude better than anything with "Linux" in its name and proves once again, as usual, closed source wins out over open source.

Re:Why bother? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554563)

Gotta love how anyone who dares speak the truth is downmodded into oblivion for speaking it on slashdot. Well have fun struggling to get any work done with KDE you losers, while the rest of us professional computer users will be far far ahead of you.

Choices... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554225)

Apparently the developers needed extra time to adds a few million more options...cuz, as we all know, linux is about choices...And since it is about choices, KDE devs should make damn sure that all 3.7 million choices for how to close a window are available to the users.

Still slooooooow...? (1)

flyingfsck (986395) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554333)

I don't use either KDE or Gnome (if I can help it), since they are both so damn slow. My systems mostly run IceWM with Rox Panel and Konqueror as the file browser and of course Firefox as the web browser.

KDE can do whatever they like to their system, but if they don't improve the window manager, then it is all still a waste of time.

Re:Still slooooooow...? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554415)

KDE runs better than fine on any modern computer, you should really upgrade your machine if icewm and such is the only thing usable, hardware is cheap.

Re:Still slooooooow...? (1)

FudRucker (866063) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554463)

do you really mean that rox draws the desktop (icons & background and/or wallpaper)? why have rox panel too when ICEwm has a panel? unless you need/want two panels. i use ICEwm & rox to draw the desktop too as they make a great combination...

i do keep KDE installed to for friends & family to use, the KDE-Games package is a favorite of mine...

Re:Still slooooooow...? (1)

BrentH (1154987) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554509)

What do youy mean by damn slow? I can work pretty fast in Gnome I think, and KDE4 is also said to be the fastest KDE yet. What am I supposedly missing out on?

Re:Still slooooooow...? (1)

SCHecklerX (229973) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554627)

I love rox. I wish it were the default FM for all of the environments. Why KDE and GNOME require so much crap running in the background is beyond me. Rox is elegant, and does all the GUI stuff you'd like a file manager to do (XDND, XDS), while giving you flexibility to interact with pretty much any program, even those that don't use any special communications pipes (ie, your selected files all go into the cut buffer automatically). The really nice thing is that you can very easily script the thing (for example, it's very easy to write a mail checking type script that can change a rox icon for a biff type program), and the fact that it adheres to the 'everything is a file' *nix philosophy. The mini buffer is great, as is the ability to do 'command line' type selections and filtering.

Rox + windowmaker makes a nice environment for me.

decent control panels? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554335)

will there be (or is there already) some sort of control panel to view installed media codecs, and add/remove/test them?

Is there and 'add new hardware' control panel. I recently bought a TV card that was supposed to 'work out of the box' on linux. But as usual I had to fuck around with config files telling kernel modules to load.

Re:decent control panels? (1)

arcade (16638) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554433)

will there be (or is there already) some sort of control panel to view installed media codecs, and add/remove/test them?

No. Linux isn't unified in this sense. Each program determines what format it wants its codecs in (of course). Thus, each program has to come up with its own way. It's the same way in windows, really, except that you've got some 'standard' codecs.

It's a matter of taste, really. Personally I don't want a control panel for it, I just want to drop the codecs in a specific directory and then I want it to be used. Others want it differently, of course.

KDE vs. Xlib/Unix (1)

BritneySP2 (870776) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554373)

What, as a programmer, can I do with KDE/Qt that I can't do with, say, Xlib and Unix APIs? I mean, why do we need all this bloat, all this added complexity, all this cruft? I understand that Qt is portable, but so are Xlib and POSIX, that, too, have been ported to (for example) Windows. How much better off we programmers have become now that we have access to the multitude of non-standard development environments, libraries and tools?

As sort of a disclaimer, I can say that do not find the desktop metaphor useful; an environment consisting of openbox/xterm and a text editor is all that I need most of the time.

Re:KDE vs. Xlib/Unix (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554473)

What, as a programmer, can I do with KDE/Qt that I can't do with, say, Xlib and Unix APIs?
Make it look tolerably good? Your app may be the greatest in the world but if it looks like crap very few people will use it.

Re:KDE vs. Xlib/Unix (2, Insightful)

conares (1045290) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554677)

"As sort of a disclaimer, I can say that do not find the desktop metaphor useful; an environment consisting of openbox/xterm and a text editor is all that I need most of the time."

Well then it would seem you are NOT the target audience for KDE, just STFU and move on...

Re:KDE vs. Xlib/Unix (1)

niteice (793961) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554681)

Qt is portable in the sense that ideally, the application developer will simply recompile for each target platform. Of course there will probably be some API differences that need to be rewritten, but for the most part you can simply ignore cross-platform issues. It's possible with Xlib and POSIX standards, yes, but would you rather ship with your application a complete X server or a few DLLs?

had been forecasted to October 2007 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#21554503)

putted, tooked

try "had been forecast for"

Past tense doesn't mean nail 'ed' to everything.

Excellent news for old-farts. (3, Interesting)

B5_geek (638928) | more than 6 years ago | (#21554571)

I love the KDE backend (dcop, kio-slaves, et al.); {I am a little worried that it might provide an avenue for malware in the future a-la Windows}.

Good news: the memory footprint of 'Strigi' is supposed to be lower then Beagle
Great news: You can install/use KDE4 without 'Plasma' (KDE 4 eyecandy)
Awesome news: KDE-based apps should work on Mac & Windows (properly ported)

Firefox has done an awesome job of weening people off Internet Explorer as "The Internet", as more killer-apps (Amarok I am looking at you) become available on Windows it will be easier to get folks to switch.

I use Fluxbox as my WM with KDE-base and KDElibs for my backend. Conky is as fancy as it gets for my eyecandy. I look forward to KDE4 because of all the good stuff that I can make use of. I just hope to $deity that they keep the eye-candy as optional. I am not looking forward to their whole concept of active-desktop/"its where you work dude"/make it an experience that people can interact with.

Rule #1) The DE/WM is HOW you access your programs, and should be invisible to the process.
Rule #2) Just because the median processor/ram is 42-times more powerfull then it was x-years ago does not mean that your programs can be 42-times more bloated.
Rule #3) Keep everything optional. Just because you think that everybody on the planet is stupid for not wanting something, does not mean everybody actually does want it.
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